Canon Can't Even Make a Billion Dollars Anymore

[infared]

These price drops may not be good for early adopters. That's why patience is always a virtue. But you had enjoyed your camera 4 months earlier than the rest of us. Right?
[/quote]

I expect the price to come down $200-$300...but no $700. My 5DII really held its value....This is just absurd.

 

[infared]

New canon products are overrated. Not affordable, i'm very glad they fell out of their goal making money.
Canon should open eyes and see the world economic crisis.
where the hell are you going selling 5D 3 3.000 $
are you expecting to sell like 5D 2 back in her age while the worlds economic pulse isn't good?

Products i WOULD buy to upgrade my work:
5D 3
70-200 2.8 IS II
24-70 2.8 II

but the prices of those products are EXTREMELY high with no reason. Its like canon saying, DON'T BUY IT.. and i'm curious, why the hell are you constructing such monsters if you don't want to sell them!

I agree with you completely! Although...my 70-200 (which I paid $2500 for when it was released) is sooooooo sharp sometimes I actually think it was worth the money. LOL. Not so for the new 24-70mm tho...mixed reviews does not garner a $2300 price tag....Waaaaay overpriced...what is Canon thinking?

 

[AG]

The way i see this whole thing. (your opinion may vary)

Yes, Canon are pricing themselves out of the market by trying to cover the losses of their other less successful areas of business, such as say the printer department etc.

They have relied on P&S cameras for way too long.

They need to realise that mobile phones are going to replace point and shoots for a majority of the market. The way to rectify this problem is not to flood the marked with cheap nasty point and shoots but provide a few models for those few that still want them.

Similar can be said about the Digital Compacts.

They need to work out where they are going with this line? The G1X, G15, G12, SX40HS?
These are cameras that need to be a single line, not multiple versions of the same thing but this one has less blue tint or this ones flash is 10% brighter. Stuff the average consumer wont really care about.

EOS M range.

A step in the right direction but is it too little too late?
Why couldn't they have taken the G1X line and this line and made a single all round great Digital Mirrorless Compact?

Then there is the EOS range of DSLRs.

They need to make a decision where they are planning on going with this range.
As the way it stands at the moment there is way too many models to choose from and none of them really satisfy what the customers really want.
1DX is a great Journalistic camera but where is the 1Ds high MP replacement?
5D3 is a great Landscape/Low Light camera so why do we really need a 6D? why couldnt they have just dropped the price of the 5D3 and sold a hell of a lot more cameras?

How many models of the rebels do we really need?

...and while we are at it, what is the point of the 60D? why wasn't the 6D turned into the new 70D?(same plastic body etc not a 5D2 replacement that isn't quite as good) especially if the XXXD models are basically the same sensor/tech as the 60D is.

Then this rolls into the EOS Cinema.

Why is the 1DC so freaking expensive for firmware tweaks (and i know they claim it was completely new blah blah blah, but lets be honest if you are going to try and sell a $15K camera would you admit that its basically the same as its $7k twin brother?)
The C100 is overpriced for the market they are aiming at. at the same time the C300 is crippled for the market they are aiming at. (at least add 60p frame rates)

They need to have someone come in and decide lets cut the bulk and streamline this product line up.

 

[RS2021]

I think the 6D is targeted at xxxD/60D owners, not 7D/5DII owners, in terms of an upgrade.

Exactly and that is why it should have a xxD name instead of a xD. Canon wasted the 6D slot IMO.

While this may be Canon's effort to get the xxxD and 60D crowd to move up to full frame bodies, the pricing is rather clumsy or overly optimistic. The initial pricing of 6D at ~$2099 is somewhat of a reach for this sub-$1000 crowd. I see T4i is going for around $750 and 60D is going for about $850 (cpw). So they are looking at a significant leap in $$$ here even with the added "features". Unless Canon is trying to milk the 6D "pre-order" crowd (surprise, surprise) at high prices and then drop 6D prices to somewhere around ~ $1600 in the few months after release and perhaps even to around $1400 in a year, the current pricing is neither competitive nor sustainable. But if the recent 5D3 price trajectory is anything to go by, then the ~$1400 to 1600 may not be such a bad target price for the 6D in a year or so after all.

 

[heron88]

Yip, I'll order a 5D3 when it drops below 3k

Though this particular one has ended, the deals are out there. Keep an eye out and you can get pretty decent prices.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Canon-EOS-5D-Mark-III-Digital-Camera-Digital-SLR-Body-/180998819475?afepn=5335869999&campid=5335869999&PID=1225267&forcev4exp=true&forceRpt=true#ht_3479wt_1397

 

[Dylan777]

Some of Canon's problem is the world economy...but much of it has to do with the RIDICULOUS prices that Canon is attaching to MANY of their products. WAY out of line with their competitors. I feel some massive rebates coming on sometime soon...I for one am buying NOTHING Canon until the company gets real...I bought a 5DIii 4 months ago...and now see it online for $700 less than I paid for it? Canon....that is insulting to your customers. I expect the price to drop...but nothing like this. Also delivering products that are far below their hardware capabilities and having hackers embarrassingly shoewng your own firmware ????
Everyone...let's do a Canon boycott for 6 months...right thru the holidays and bring this arrogant behaving company to its knees!

+1....a lot of poeple said that wasn't an office price drop from Canon. To me...it's Bssssssssss.

 

[Dylan777]

Some of Canon's problem is the world economy...but much of it has to do with the RIDICULOUS prices that Canon is attaching to MANY of their products. WAY out of line with their competitors. I feel some massive rebates coming on sometime soon...I for one am buying NOTHING Canon until the company gets real...I bought a 5DIii 4 months ago...and now see it online for $700 less than I paid for it? Canon....that is insulting to your customers. I expect the price to drop...but nothing like this. Also delivering products that are far below their hardware capabilities and having hackers embarrassingly shoewng your own firmware ????
Everyone...let's do a Canon boycott for 6 months...right thru the holidays and bring this arrogant behaving company to its knees!

These price drops may not be good for early adopters. That's why patience is always a virtue. But you had enjoyed your camera 4 months earlier than the rest of us. Right?

To me...it should be 1st come 1st serve, regardless when you placed your order.

 

[sanj]

The lack of funds could perhaps be the main reason why it takes so long to replenish stock and release announced products on time.

 

[crasher8]

Price drop starting NOW until Dec 1

 

[UrbanVoyeur]

I agree with many posters here. I think 3 things happened: (among other things)
- Canon's camera manufacturing cost structure is out of line with what the retail market can support. This could be due to too many last minute design changes, not enough emphasis simplicity and design reuse or a host of other reasons. The solution is a manufacturing manager who will demand - a get - less expensive, higher quality results from the engineers. It can be done.

- Canon seems to think that no one will notice when they intentionally cripple their bodies. They've been doing since the film camera days, but now that the firmware is easily accessible, they look like scam artists. Solution: make all the features a body is capable of available. Rather than hurt, it will probably help their sales because consumers will feel that they are being dealt with honestly. Further locking down or stripping the firmware will on result in an arms race with the hackers, or people gradually migrating to more hackable cameras.

- Canon has cluttered their product line with marginal tweaks and conflicting price points, while failing to deliver basic features across the board - like built-in GPS and wireless. The solution is to simplify the pricing and reduce the number of models while guaranteeing certain low/no cost options across the entire product line. That way the value proposition of the higher end cameras will be clearer.

 

[Simba]

I think this year's tsunami crisis in Japan and the fact it heavily impacted r&d and production might have helped with these companies' losses...

You realize the tsunami (earthwuake + nuclear disaster) was well over a year ago right? It did do harm but when so much is made in China/Taiwan no real hits were taken.

Nikon's loss was due to Thailand floods.
http://www.engadget.com/2012/02/03/nikon-posts-q3-2011-earnings-sees-extraordinary-losses-due-to/

 

[verysimplejason]

Some of Canon's problem is the world economy...but much of it has to do with the RIDICULOUS prices that Canon is attaching to MANY of their products. WAY out of line with their competitors. I feel some massive rebates coming on sometime soon...I for one am buying NOTHING Canon until the company gets real...I bought a 5DIii 4 months ago...and now see it online for $700 less than I paid for it? Canon....that is insulting to your customers. I expect the price to drop...but nothing like this. Also delivering products that are far below their hardware capabilities and having hackers embarrassingly shoewng your own firmware ????
Everyone...let's do a Canon boycott for 6 months...right thru the holidays and bring this arrogant behaving company to its knees!

These price drops may not be good for early adopters. That's why patience is always a virtue. But you had enjoyed your camera 4 months earlier than the rest of us. Right?

To me...it should be 1st come 1st serve, regardless when you placed your order.

But that's not how the law of supply and demand works. During introduction, there will be a lot more buyers so demand will be high and supply will be low. After initial spike in sales, it will go down and the manufacturing speed (supply) will be able to recover. I think this is very normal even for non-photography market sales.

 

[dave]

Some of Canon's problem is the world economy...but much of it has to do with the RIDICULOUS prices that Canon is attaching to MANY of their products. WAY out of line with their competitors. I feel some massive rebates coming on sometime soon...I for one am buying NOTHING Canon until the company gets real...I bought a 5DIii 4 months ago...and now see it online for $700 less than I paid for it? Canon....that is insulting to your customers. I expect the price to drop...but nothing like this. Also delivering products that are far below their hardware capabilities and having hackers embarrassingly shoewng your own firmware ????
Everyone...let's do a Canon boycott for 6 months...right thru the holidays and bring this arrogant behaving company to its knees!

These price drops may not be good for early adopters. That's why patience is always a virtue. But you had enjoyed your camera 4 months earlier than the rest of us. Right?

To me...it should be 1st come 1st serve, regardless when you placed your order.

But that's not how the law of supply and demand works. During introduction, there will be a lot more buyers so demand will be high and supply will be low. After initial spike in sales, it will go down and the manufacturing speed (supply) will be able to recover. I think this is very normal even for non-photography market sales.

+1

Ummm. Computers, Televisions and most electronics are similar - prices drop. Clothes go on sale all the time - even from high status brands.Nobody actually forced you to pay the asking price. I shelled out $2300 for the supposedly ridiculous 24-70 ii and love it and if other people are able to get one for $1500 in a couple of months I'd be happy for them. Canon are a business and will behave in a way that suits them. You need to make your purchase decisions based on your own evaluation of your needs/wants. Once you purchase and choose not to return it after testing you've made the decision. Presumably you aren't buying a body as a capital producing investment so you may as well be happy.

 

[RuneL]

The cause? A series Underwhelming products, Inflated Pricing, And a series of restrictions based on profit rather than R&D. IE: 1Dx F/8 focusing.

I doubt the 1D sales have ever had a large impact on canons revenue. They are like halo products.

 

[RLPhoto]

The cause? A series Underwhelming products, Inflated Pricing, And a series of restrictions based on profit rather than R&D. IE: 1Dx F/8 focusing.

I doubt the 1D sales have ever had a large impact on canons revenue. They are like halo products.

In example or IE. The hardware of the 61-pt system is capable of f/8 focusing. The 1Dx and 5D3 were restricted in an attempt to force users into larger more expensive glass.

The 6D's attempt to stretch the 5D's AF system to another generation is a pure profit based venture instead of R&D.

The EOS M with the recycled 4 year old sensor being priced at 599$ body only is another example.

There are many more, but I'll let you fill those in.

 

[PackLight]

A quote from Canon's press release;

"Demand for interchangeable-lens digital cameras continued to realize
robust growth in all regions while the market for compact digital cameras shrunk due to the stagnation of the global economy."

It is obvious that Canon realizes that the 6D release, the 5D III pricing and other DSLR issues are the primary cause for this quarters downturn. Obviously "Robust Growth" has a meaning I am not familure with.

http://www.canon.com/ir/results/2012/rslt2012q3e.pdf

 

[wwnwong4829]

I am living in Hong Kong. The 1Dx shows up in a lot of the camera shops now, like other luxurious items - watches, jewelry, French and Italian handbags, Apple items, expensive camera gear, ... etc, waiting for the rich Chinese to buy. 8)
In the past few years, this drive of luxurious items have pushed the local shop rent and residence prices sky high.
This might sound exaggerated, but cinema closed down to become Luxury Item Shop(s?), a section of the most popular shopping area is now filled with expensive watch shops, and can you image a whole street of camera store chains - you can spot 3 stores from the same chain within 100 meters and they are not small!
As the economic growth in China slows down, this bubble will burst soon.
Canon's marketing dept will have a hard time forecasting the demand and pricing their products.

 

[marekjoz]

I am living in Hong Kong. The 1Dx shows up in a lot of the camera shops now, like other luxurious items - watches, jewelry, French and Italian handbags, Apple items, expensive camera gear, ... etc, waiting for the rich Chinese to buy. 8)
In the past few years, this drive of luxurious items have pushed the local shop rent and residence prices sky high.
This might sound exaggerated, but cinema closed down to become Luxury Item Shop(s?), a section of the most popular shopping area is now filled with expensive watch shops, and can you image a whole street of camera store chains - you can spot 3 stores from the same chain within 100 meters and they are not small!
As the economic growth in China slows down, this bubble will burst soon.
Canon's marketing dept will have a hard time forecasting the demand and pricing their products.

They can always make a Lunar version of 1dx

 

[caruser]

A quote from Canon's press release;

"Demand for interchangeable-lens digital cameras continued to realize
robust growth in all regions while the market for compact digital cameras shrunk due to the stagnation of the global economy."

http://www.canon.com/ir/results/2012/rslt2012q3e.pdf

Aren't compacts going away because phones are now good enough to replace a compact for most people?

 

[AmbientLight]

I believe you are quite correct, but in a press statement we are not likely to find this.

If Canon would indeed state something like that, it would sound as if they admit an error of judgement regarding the compact camera sector, where, if I am not mistaken, Canon was and still is the market leader.

It appears to me that Canon tried and still tries to reap profits from that market, but realizes that it will dwindle away. Stating the stagnating global economy as a source for that downturn in income points to a cause Canon is unable to effect, so the company doesn't blame itself for what is happening, which I reckon is the exact reason they phrased it like this.