Canon EOS 7D Firmware Version 2 Coming Soon
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Ew said:
I supposed my wishful thinking FF/Crop 1.6 7DX to be a fine replacement of the 5D2. And of course you are right, it wouldn't be a 5D3 killer at all. But an affordable body for many purposes. Tag it US $ 2400 and you get a nice gap between APS-C and the next level FF body, the current 5D3. Any other comments welcome.
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Well, let's wirte to canon then...if the other label did something thing similar, this would be revolutionary as it builds on the well respected specs of the original 7D. Don't have it, but what I've read here and there, is more than enough. It has a high reputation. A colleague of mine has one and he loves it!
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pedro said:
Given the apparent (lack of) Canon's sensor building capability, it wouldn't be a fine 5d2 replacement, it wouldn't be a replacement at all. And I still think there's a larger market for a $2000-$2500 full frame body than for a high-end aps-c, if Canon should choose to only produce one body in this price range.
First off, this enthusiast's forum isn't a market representation, here are more people around that would pay anything for a high-end aps-c birding body. And since this can replace much more expensive action bodies, too, while taking cheaper lenses because of the 1.6x crop factor - what would Canon's interest in this be?
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L
lonebear
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A rumor stated 7D may not have a direct successor. A FF/1.6 crop is not a direct successor, as it will not be compatible with the beloved 10-22mm and 17-55mm. Neither will an APS-H model. So, both could echo to that rumor.
My guess is more inclining towards APS-H. My reasoning is as follow: the extra reach provided by crop model is the major preference of the 7D camp. The 1.6 crop mode in a FF/1.6 crop model will be lower either in pixel resolution (if MP is less than 45) or lower IQ (if MP is higher), neither will be preferable to a potential 7DX buyer. However, a 1.3 crop model is a different story. Basically, you are giving up some extra reach for some better IQ (FF is an extreme case of this kind trade-off). In reality, 1D4 had been viewed as the upgrade of current 7D. If a 7DX comes with an APS-H sensor, Canon can pack more pixels (than current 7D) in it while at the same time providing bigger sensels (which implies better IQ) if MP is controlled below 27MP.
Besides, APS-H format provides an excellent test field for Canon. 7DX is viewed lower than 1D4, thus a minor failure in IQ can be tolerable which is good for experiment. A 21 MP in a 7DX (36MP in FF), if successful, will demonstrate Canon's ability in high MP models. A 24 MP APS-H will give a higher MP while still providing noticeable larger sensel size if other technology factors are same (to the current 7D sensor).
A 21-24MP APS-H 7DX would mean, 1D4's reach at about half price, more pixels for the heavy cropping, IQ in between 5DIII and 7D, possibly match 1D4's IQ if Canon could put any sensor improvement in it. Will it not be enticing to any current 7D user?
"Big splash"? In Photokina?
My guess is more inclining towards APS-H. My reasoning is as follow: the extra reach provided by crop model is the major preference of the 7D camp. The 1.6 crop mode in a FF/1.6 crop model will be lower either in pixel resolution (if MP is less than 45) or lower IQ (if MP is higher), neither will be preferable to a potential 7DX buyer. However, a 1.3 crop model is a different story. Basically, you are giving up some extra reach for some better IQ (FF is an extreme case of this kind trade-off). In reality, 1D4 had been viewed as the upgrade of current 7D. If a 7DX comes with an APS-H sensor, Canon can pack more pixels (than current 7D) in it while at the same time providing bigger sensels (which implies better IQ) if MP is controlled below 27MP.
Besides, APS-H format provides an excellent test field for Canon. 7DX is viewed lower than 1D4, thus a minor failure in IQ can be tolerable which is good for experiment. A 21 MP in a 7DX (36MP in FF), if successful, will demonstrate Canon's ability in high MP models. A 24 MP APS-H will give a higher MP while still providing noticeable larger sensel size if other technology factors are same (to the current 7D sensor).
A 21-24MP APS-H 7DX would mean, 1D4's reach at about half price, more pixels for the heavy cropping, IQ in between 5DIII and 7D, possibly match 1D4's IQ if Canon could put any sensor improvement in it. Will it not be enticing to any current 7D user?
"Big splash"? In Photokina?
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Now that the Rebels have a sensor at least as good as my 2+ yr old 7D, my upgrade needs are met: I do solar system SLR photography so want as many pixels as possible. APSH would not be an advantage as my telescope's iamage circle isn't big enough to cover the entire sensor.
I admit that this is something of a niche use case!
I admit that this is something of a niche use case!
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Gcon said:
I would agree with you except one thing. I do not see the 7DII getting a FF sensor. Why? If you want a 7D with a FF sensor, buy the 5DIII.
As long as the 7D is still in production we will NOT see a high performance (which is where it would have to be placed given the features found in the new T4i) 70D that will directly compete with the 7D line. It doesn't make any sense to discontinue a line (7D) to make room for a new 70D and then down the road, re-release the 7D line. Given the feature downgrade of the last XXD camera, the feature upgrade of the new Rebel (and the existence of the entry level "T" line) I would say Canon will drop the XXD line and keep the 7D line the flagship of the APS-C DSLR.
My best guess is that the "T" line with be the "new" entry level DSLR and the Rebel will "replace" the XXD line. (Otherwise why would have Canon made the new Rebel so impressive?) I bet the sales of the XXD line have dropped with the existance of the 7D and feature downgrade of the 60D. I know when it came time to buy a new camera, I didn't even look at the 60D, (even though I own the 40D and 50D and love the XXD line) I forked out the extra $$$ and went straight for the 7D.
When the 7D was first released many thought it was going to replace the XXD line then. I would have to say that with Canon's choices of new cameras/features, it seems logical that is where they are going.
They could place the new 7D in the $1400-$1800 price range and give lots of room for a budget minded 5DII replacement. The 5DII still has a strong place in the market but now needs some upgrades. This is the camera I foresee being placed in the $1800-$2200 price range. Canon has never placed two cameras in the same pricing range. If Canon DOES release a budget-minded APS-C "1D" replacement, it won't be the 7DII, it will likely be the 3D (with pricing of $2600-$3000) or similar.
D
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jouster said:
No. A firmware update is very simple. Go to Canon's website and download the new firmware to your computer, unzip the file and then copy the unzipped firmware patch to your SD/CF card and load it into your camera. The Canon website will give you detailed instructions on how to do this.
D
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The 7D II will be APS-C without anyquestion. How good it will be depends mainly on Nikon: whether they bring a strong D400 (APS-C) or not.
Without Nikon D300 all we would have ever gotten from Canon after the 50D would have been the lacklustre 60D followed by an incrementally improved lacklustre 70D ...
I see no need whatsoever for a 70D. Either go cheap, but good enough = Rebel/650D or go more expensive and get a faster, better APS-C cam in a wheathersealed, robust body. No need to artificially put something in between.
For the 7D II ... just take the 650D sensor (let's hope it's a major improvement over the current 18 MP sensor!) and its Hybrid FPPD-AF (in lievveiw/video mode), take the articulated touchscreen + improved user interface, take the pop-upflash and replace it with a wireless radio-flash controller for 600EX-RTs, take a few more goodies (fully-fledged Auto ISO, uder-selectable 2 to 99 shot AEB, etc.) and then ...
most importantly: sell it for € 1800 [like the 7D when it came out] and everything will be fine.
Without Nikon D300 all we would have ever gotten from Canon after the 50D would have been the lacklustre 60D followed by an incrementally improved lacklustre 70D ...
I see no need whatsoever for a 70D. Either go cheap, but good enough = Rebel/650D or go more expensive and get a faster, better APS-C cam in a wheathersealed, robust body. No need to artificially put something in between.
For the 7D II ... just take the 650D sensor (let's hope it's a major improvement over the current 18 MP sensor!) and its Hybrid FPPD-AF (in lievveiw/video mode), take the articulated touchscreen + improved user interface, take the pop-upflash and replace it with a wireless radio-flash controller for 600EX-RTs, take a few more goodies (fully-fledged Auto ISO, uder-selectable 2 to 99 shot AEB, etc.) and then ...
most importantly: sell it for € 1800 [like the 7D when it came out] and everything will be fine.
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S
surfing_geek
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Richard8971 said:
<rant>
This isn't aimed at anyone in particular, more at a viewpoint that I disagree with. The quote just illustrates my argument.
Why must less megapixels always mean that a camera is "inferior"? The 1Ds and 1D were both professional cameras, aimed at different markets and, therefore, designed with different specs. That Canon are now able to combine these due to advances in manufacturing processes does not make the 1D any more inferior or any less the professional camera. I cannot understand this mentality that a camera must be crammed with megapixels and be FF to be the professional. I'm sure that there are many wildlife and sports photgraphers out there who would take exception to being called less professional because they aren't shooting FF at 30MP.
It's just about having the best tool for the job in hand.
</rant>
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AvTvM said:
Putting a product between $600 and $1600 isn't artificial, it's essential in this price range. And it makes sense too, because many people who bought a 60d seem to want better ergonomics (top lcd, back dial) without premium "flagship" features and price tag.
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DB
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Jack said:
That's a very good question. Who knows. One can speculate that many of the new improved features such as full manual audio control during video are 100% software based changes, in response to so many Canon owners complaining about the lack of this feature, or worse, installing non-approved software such as Magic Lantern (by booting off a memory card). Clearly this add-on is an after thought by Canon.
Other features such as higher RAW burst mode were probably limited by the speed of CF memory cards back in 2009 when the 7D was first launched, but as others have suggested here, this feature too is largely software based (or controlled). I think Canon engages in 'satisficing' (means sub-optimal) intentionally to preserve features across its product line e.g. 7D has dual-Digic 4 processors, same as 1DIV, which is why it can shoot at 8fps, but the presence of both those chips probably means that it could do a whole lot more - so how do Canon Inc. monetize that (they don't get paid for giving away freebie features).
In answer to your question, more than likely a bit of both, some they knew they could do but didn't on purpose, other features were demanded by users after the fact.
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[quote author=Canon's Marketing Team]
"Oh crap, we've got all these old 7D bodies lying around that aren't selling (because of the 5D2 getting cheaper, or the D3200, K5, NEX-7, or whatever), and we need to get rid of them before the 7D mk 2 is announced in a few months".
"I know, let's take the firmware from the new 7D2, it won't cost us anything much to port it to the 7D, demand for the 7D will pick back up again and help us clear stocks before we drop the 7D2."
[/quote]
Or am I too cynical?
"Oh crap, we've got all these old 7D bodies lying around that aren't selling (because of the 5D2 getting cheaper, or the D3200, K5, NEX-7, or whatever), and we need to get rid of them before the 7D mk 2 is announced in a few months".
"I know, let's take the firmware from the new 7D2, it won't cost us anything much to port it to the 7D, demand for the 7D will pick back up again and help us clear stocks before we drop the 7D2."
[/quote]
Or am I too cynical?
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