Do I need a better camera or a better pair of hands?

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I like your pictures!

#1 I like the natural framing and the reds mixed with the white.

#2 the colours are so rich and vibrant, with the window light and the bride looking off. If the photo was mine I'd consider cropping the image off on the left at the window frame, as I don't think the image loses anything and it draws more attention to the bride.

#3 I like it and the DOF, there could be a little more breathing room in the image, but whatever each to their own, I'd be more than happy as is.

#4 Yes it's over saturated, but that works well with the playfulness of the image. Obviously, not all your pictures are going to look like that, but for a fun shot, that looks great. Only one small critique of #4, be wary of trees and poles growing out of heads, unless done intentionally for artistic or humour effect.

Having said that there is certainly nothing wrong with the other guy's pictures, just a slightly different style, although I agree they may be a little too blue.

As for getting a full frame, I hear you. I'm presently saving my pennies to buy a FF for the improved DOF, ISO, and tonal range it offers over my crop sensor. Not to mention my 70-200 2.8 at the 70 end is sometimes just a little too tight on my crop sensor when I shoot hockey and having the larger FF sensor would eliminate 99% of this problem.
 
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Gumbum said:
torger said:
What exactly makes up this 3D'ish effect you speak of?

I don't know...you are the engineer, you tell me ;)
But I'm sure the thinner dof plays a major part...it's not the only thing though.
The only time I have been able to get a similar effect on a crop (I own both a 550D and a 5D2) has been out to sea...something about the light and contrast perhaps?

But please tell me you see it? It's like objects size relation to each other gets distorted and a 3D effect occurs.

Yes, I'd think that short DoF is the main aspect of it, Brenizer is all about that, and I also think vignetting can give a bit of the same too, you get drawn into the picture, and the main subject pops out of the picture. Contrast helps surely too but I don't think that is a full-frame specific property. However there's not only vignetting, wide open there is typically a larger quality difference between the edges and the center, which may further enhance the pop effect.

In the very nice Brenizer example you show, it seems like focus is closer on the side, like a strong field curvature effect, but perhaps only an illusion.
 
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Yep!! Big applause for SB. Great analysis and information -- and perspective!

Thanks.


unfocused said:
nightbreath said:
sb said:
nightbreath, I've spent a lot of time trying to reverse engineer other people's pictures, and a lot of time photographing weddings and developing my own style, I've learned quite a few things in the process, so here are my 2 cents...

The best post in this thread, thank you for sharing your thoughts and your help :)

+1 Absolutely!

sb gets some good Karma. Although, I wish he'd share his web URL so we can see some of his work...hint...hint.

Plus...I still miss Ukraine. Had the opportunity to go there several times in the 90s and would go back in a minute. Government is a total disaster, but the people...especially the younger ones...terrific!
 
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How great would it be for some of us North American wedding photographers to shoot a wedding as he described, Govt building, cafe, rundown streets etc. as opposed to the same settings that we shoot? Bride may not like it, but it sure would be cool!
 
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briansquibb said:
Watch out for too shallow DOF ( #3 )

Give them space ( #3)

Avoid taking pictures up the nose ( #2, #5 )

Avoid taking wa pictures - unless they are very wa when it is obvious that is what you are aiming for

The 7D is nore than good enough for weddings but you will have to work on the pp to get the best images

5DII, 1Ds3, 1D4 are the only other options and they will introduce new issues, including a big cost.

Just remember that a wedding albumn is reportage, 90% 'standard' images, 10% 'artistic' images. Keep focussed on the standard images as they wont forgive you if the picture of mum and pop look bad.

I actually like the shallow DOF on #3...
 
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AprilForever said:
briansquibb said:
Watch out for too shallow DOF ( #3 )

I actually like the shallow DOF on #3...

I think the keyword here is "too"--the shallow DoF is nice, but a half inch to an inch so deeper might be a little better effect, IMHO. Hard to say for sure without comparing directly. When I'm uncertain with this kind of shot, I'll just shoot 2 frames with the second one stopped down a bit and then I can decide which is better after the fact. Of course this could just be do to my lack of experience.
 
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thepancakeman said:
AprilForever said:
briansquibb said:
Watch out for too shallow DOF ( #3 )

I actually like the shallow DOF on #3...

I think the keyword here is "too"--the shallow DoF is nice, but a half inch to an inch so deeper might be a little better effect, IMHO. Hard to say for sure without comparing directly. When I'm uncertain with this kind of shot, I'll just shoot 2 frames with the second one stopped down a bit and then I can decide which is better after the fact. Of course this could just be do to my lack of experience.

An eye is in focus, what more do you need? ;D

Anyway, as Henri Cartier-Bresson said, "Sharpness is a Bourgeois concept." 8)
 
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An eye is in focus, what more do you need? ;D

Anyway, as Henri Cartier-Bresson said, "Sharpness is a Bourgeois concept." 8)
[/quote]

Two eyes is normal :D

H C-B didn't believe in a really shallow DOF. As H C-B was a rich man for him to speak of Bourgeois concepts is rather amusing
 
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I'm a fan of shallow depth of field too, but there are certain images where it works and some it doesn't, it's all down to overall style. Personally, I like the idea of a single eye in focus. A different angle and it might not work, but I think it works in #3, based on the overall processing and style. It's very easy to have all wedding photos looking the same, but it's good to see a little more creativity. In fact someone recently asked if I did weddings, as they didn't like traditional wedding photos, but I usually run away from people if I can get away with it :P. If anything, I find that the colours in #1 are a little oversaturated, based on the green in particular, as it draws the eye too much. However, the skin tones are a little washed out, but that is down to the harsh lighting rather than any deficiency in technique or equipment and you can't exactly postpone the wedding until a day when there are overcast conditions. While in some ways a full frame is a better choice for weddings, I don't think it makes a huge difference, you simply frame differently or make a different lens choice. Of course, the best of both worlds would be to have both full frame and crop.
 
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