DPReview reviews the A7R3

Neutral

EOS RP
Oct 19, 2012
342
17
Also I would like to see firmware upgrade from Canon for my 1DXm2 with some additional features to make it more competitive with my Sony a9.
Possible feature additions coul be:
1. Provide HDR mode using dual pixel technology or dual shots with different ISO settings . 3d parties did that for 5Dm III long time back , why Canon refuses to do it directly for their customers?
2. Provide function for reducing image noise using multiexposure functionslity. Something that I described here many years back for 1DX , but done with a single button press insteead of doing some manual manipulations.
3. Internal lens AFMA calibration - to make getting full lens resolution as user friendly as on mirrorles cameras. Even using automated FoCal for that is kind of headache.
4. Improve video functionality - better codecs, 10bit 4:2:2 internal recording at least for HD and 4k 10bit 4:2:2 for external HDMI recorder.
Not too much.
To continue to be loyal to Canon need to see that they provide what customers need and be highly competitive.
Now with Sony a9 I get much more from it for much less money than what I get from Canon 1DXm2.
Though there is no doubt that I still have much more confidence in using 1DXm2 and Canon L lens in harsh conditions than for any of the Sony camera.
So I still need my 1DXm2 , just want featurs update to be more happy with that.
So that regardless of which brand I use I can get maximum from any of them and do not need to use two cameras at the same time to complement missing functionality.
 

3kramd5

EOS R6
Mar 2, 2012
3,084
405
I think the holy grail might be global shutter without a negative impact on DR. Stacked sensor tech may eventually facilitate that advance.

Additionally, perhaps some sort of counting camera which drains when saturation is reached and starts over (mathematically working around physical well capacity) for practically limitless dynamic range.
 

bwud

EOS RP
Sep 3, 2014
305
10
ahsanford said:
I don't get the 'grip has gotten deeper' statement. It looks just like an A9 to me (see pic vs. A7R2), which seems to be more of a thicker body than a bigger/deeper grip. Am I missing something?

Proximity to lens barrel can be a problem. I have actually gotten a finger stuck once. It was both hilarious and annoying.

That being said the A7R iii grip seems far more comfortable. And when I say grip, I mean grip. I don't have the camera yet. But if it's like the V-grip, it's way more comfortable. I basically have to squeeze the R2 like a raptor on its prey. The V-grip (yes, unweighted as of yet so it's not a true comparison) fills my hands better. It's night and day.
 

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ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
8,617
1,642
bwud said:
Proximity to lens barrel can be a problem. I have actually gotten a finger stuck once. It was both hilarious and annoying.

That being said the A7R iii grip seems far more comfortable. And when I say grip, I mean grip. I don't have the camera yet. But if it's like the V-grip, it's way more comfortable. I basically have to squeeze the R2 like a raptor on its prey. The V-grip (yes, unweighted as of yet so it's not a true comparison) fills my hands better. It's night and day.

Thanks for posting! Those are... A7R2 shots then?

Nope, I'm not referring to the vertical grip, I'm talking about your first picture in your post -- which describes how I'm holding things almost all the time (I rarely use my vertical grip). In that pic, your hand is turned clockwise too much for me -- it's reminiscent of how I had to hold my heavier L lenses on my old T1i (which has grip not far off from the A7 bodies). I'm not saying you're holding it wrong, I'm saying that's how the camera is making you hold it.

When I got my 5D3, it was night and day different for the better. I could fully open my hand, and the middle of my hand became a participant in the gripping process -- I wasn't just iron-claw holding it between the butt of my thumb and my fingertips. So my comfort was much higher and I could stably hold heavier things longer with it.

As for lens mount to grip spacing, I think Sony values small much more than Canon, and they wanted to use as much common body componentry as possible between generations. I just can't believe they thought they could step up to huge GM lenses with the same spacing as a super-tiny enthusiast camera. But the A9 and 'III' gen have no excuse for this to still be so close, IMHO.

- A

P.S. Pinky under the bottom is a (small) 5D3 problem as well, I have slightly small to average hand size I'd say but I like a wide spread of fingers and I've actually considered building a Sugru little pinky extension for it.
 

bwud

EOS RP
Sep 3, 2014
305
10
^^ correct, I’m holding an A7R ii in the first few (with an L-bracket which adds a bit of depth even), while the v-grip is for A9 / A7R iii. My hope is that the grip is representative of the feel of A7R iii, but I haven’t taken delivery of the camera yet and have not had hands on an A9.
 

Hflm

Gear: 5div, A7riii, A9 ...
Jan 10, 2017
88
0
Woody said:
Neutral said:
Woody said:
IMHO, the withdrawal of support for PlayMemories in the latest Sony releases (A9, A7RIII etc) is a lousy decision. They've just lost another positive to counter the weaknesses (poor ergonomics, hopeless menu organization etc) of the system.
Seems like a list picked from internet by someone who never used that cameras - usual story.
Otherwise one would know that a7r2 and especially a9 are much more customizable cameras even than 1dxm2.

My company owns 3 copies of A7S, 1 copy of A7SII, 1 copy of A7R and 1 copy of A9 with Sony FE 24-70 f/4 and multiple copies of FE 70-200 f/2.8 GM OSS.

I have used them all. I know what I am talking about.

The A9 is an improvement, but the ergonomics still s***s.
I use the A9 with grip at weddings and find it very comfortable to use for long stretches of time. I have large hands and don't have any problems. The grip extension is nice, too. Without grip it is too small for me personally. I like the 5div ergonomics best in that case. My wife, however, doesn't mind.

In the meanwhile there is no issue with the menu either, from my side. Lots of customisable buttons and a quick access menu via button press rarely make the need to open the menu at all. And having a personalised menu item now, too, makes every complaint about the menu moot, in my opinion.
 

bwud

EOS RP
Sep 3, 2014
305
10
Some bad news, I can’t feel any difference between the grips of the a7r II and A7r III.

And the good news:

It’s more customizable than I expected. If there is a function you can’t map somewhere I haven’t found it and probably wouldn’t want to map it. The controls feel good, not gimmicky.

It’s responsive. It doesn’t turn on right quick, but once it’s on it goes.

The EVF is beautiful.

I initially intended to have AF-ON stay default and AEL be for EyeAF. However I discovered that you can map the center press of the joystick (what resets the AF point to center on canons), so I instead put the AF-ON function there (meaning I need not move my thumb after selecting an AF point), and put the EyeAF function on the AF-ON button as well as lens button.

That freed up AEL, which I have toggling between exposure preview and not, a function I had to tediously find in the A7R II menus. Combined with the custom menu, I can’t think of any reason I’d have to navigate the main menu with any regularity.
 

Dylan777

EOS-1D X Mark III
Nov 17, 2011
5,514
8
bwud said:
Some bad news, I can’t feel any difference between the grips of the a7r II and A7r III.

And the good news:

It’s more customizable than I expected. If there is a function you can’t map somewhere I haven’t found it and probably wouldn’t want to map it. The controls feel good, not gimmicky.

It’s responsive. It doesn’t turn on right quick, but once it’s on it goes.

The EVF is beautiful.

I initially intended to have AF-ON stay default and AEL be for EyeAF. However I discovered that you can map the center press of the joystick (what resets the AF point to center on canons), so I instead put the AF-ON function there (meaning I need not move my thumb after selecting an AF point), and put the EyeAF function on the AF-ON button as well as lens button.

That freed up AEL, which I have toggling between exposure preview and not, a function I had to tediously find in the A7R II menus. Combined with the custom menu, I can’t think of any reason I’d have to navigate the main menu with any regularity.

Congrats!!! :)

Compared to mrk II, how is 6400ISO & 12800ISO? Thanks in advance.

A9 is the only body I have as FF. I'm kinda want 2nd FF body, too lazy swapping 2470 &70200 ;D , but want to see what a7s III has to offer. The a7r III looks very good.
 

bwud

EOS RP
Sep 3, 2014
305
10
Dylan777 said:
bwud said:
Some bad news, I can’t feel any difference between the grips of the a7r II and A7r III.

And the good news:

It’s more customizable than I expected. If there is a function you can’t map somewhere I haven’t found it and probably wouldn’t want to map it. The controls feel good, not gimmicky.

It’s responsive. It doesn’t turn on right quick, but once it’s on it goes.

The EVF is beautiful.

I initially intended to have AF-ON stay default and AEL be for EyeAF. However I discovered that you can map the center press of the joystick (what resets the AF point to center on canons), so I instead put the AF-ON function there (meaning I need not move my thumb after selecting an AF point), and put the EyeAF function on the AF-ON button as well as lens button.

That freed up AEL, which I have toggling between exposure preview and not, a function I had to tediously find in the A7R II menus. Combined with the custom menu, I can’t think of any reason I’d have to navigate the main menu with any regularity.

Congrats!!! :)

Compared to mrk II, how is 6400ISO & 12800ISO? Thanks in advance.

A9 is the only body I have as FF. I'm kinda want 2nd FF body, too lazy swapping 2470 &70200 ;D , but want to see what a7s III has to offer. The a7r III looks very good.

I haven’t done much yet beyond set it up and tweak the controls. I’ll shoot some stuff at those ISOs this weekend and shoot you the ARWs
 

jolyonralph

EOS R5 Mark II
CR Pro
Aug 25, 2015
1,410
889
London, UK
www.everyothershot.com
I use both the A7RII and the 5DSR almost equally now. Some comments:

I never have a problem adapting to the grip on either camera.

The menus on the Sony are different, not worse, not better, but different. If you've been using Canon all your life of course you'll hate it the first moment you use it. But if you use the camera for a short period of time everything makes sense.

The ergonomics for the buttons on the A7RII are better than those on the Canon mirrorless offerings (and I use the M5/M6 extensively too)

I generally don't use long lenses with the Sony, mostly it's the 35mm and 55mm sony-zeiss primes. But when I have (Canon 70-200 IS II and metabones adaptor) it didn't feel a problem. The center of gravity is below the lens, not the camera, so the grip size is really inconsequential as long as you're comfortable and can keep the camera steady, which is easy with the A7RII.

The A7RII isn't perfect, neither is the 5DSR. The great thing about having both is being able to use the right tool for the right job.


Having a chunkier body means it won't fit in my coat pocket with the 35mm f/2.8 Zeiss lens.
 

bwud

EOS RP
Sep 3, 2014
305
10
jolyonralph said:
The A7RII isn't perfect, neither is the 5DSR.

I’d note that perfection is an inappropriate yardstick.

I still largely use my 5Diii for long lenses 200+, though have started shooting 70-200 adapted on my A7Rii (such as below). A lot of what I struggled with using A7Rii has been addressed with the new model. I have yet to see whether with sync port will indeed allow me to drive HSS from my elinchrome monolights. If it does not I may send it back as that was my top priority for an update. I *wish* they would consider making the body 1/2” taller. That would substantially improve handling, IMO.
 

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ecqns

EOS M6 Mark II
Feb 4, 2015
98
0
For those in this thread that do have both the a7r3 and a7r2, I'd love to see a comparison at ISO 100 between the two. Curious to see the DR improvement in real world images.
 

privatebydesign

EOS-1D X Mark III
CR Pro
Jan 29, 2011
9,796
4,412
ecqns said:
For those in this thread that do have both the a7r3 and a7r2, I'd love to see a comparison at ISO 100 between the two. Curious to see the DR improvement in real world images.

Non existent.

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=sony_a7rii&attr13_1=sony_a7riii&attr13_2=canon_eos5d&attr13_3=canon_eos5d&attr15_0=raw&attr15_1=raw&attr15_2=raw&attr15_3=raw&attr16_0=100&attr16_1=100&attr16_2=100&attr16_3=100&attr126_1=1&attr171_0=1&normalization=full&widget=1&x=0.7079806529625151&y=-0.5336778954484002
 

ecqns

EOS M6 Mark II
Feb 4, 2015
98
0
privatebydesign said:
ecqns said:
For those in this thread that do have both the a7r3 and a7r2, I'd love to see a comparison at ISO 100 between the two. Curious to see the DR improvement in real world images.

Non existent.

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=sony_a7rii&attr13_1=sony_a7riii&attr13_2=canon_eos5d&attr13_3=canon_eos5d&attr15_0=raw&attr15_1=raw&attr15_2=raw&attr15_3=raw&attr16_0=100&attr16_1=100&attr16_2=100&attr16_3=100&attr126_1=1&attr171_0=1&normalization=full&widget=1&x=0.7079806529625151&y=-0.5336778954484002

I asked for people with both cameras and real world images. I find these jumbled setups distracting to look at.
But last time I checked these studio scenes the new Sony looked comparable to the new Nikon. I'd say that's pretty good then but I'd like to see something like a slightly underexposed quarter tone.
 

bwud

EOS RP
Sep 3, 2014
305
10
ecqns said:
privatebydesign said:
ecqns said:
For those in this thread that do have both the a7r3 and a7r2, I'd love to see a comparison at ISO 100 between the two. Curious to see the DR improvement in real world images.

Non existent.

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=sony_a7rii&attr13_1=sony_a7riii&attr13_2=canon_eos5d&attr13_3=canon_eos5d&attr15_0=raw&attr15_1=raw&attr15_2=raw&attr15_3=raw&attr16_0=100&attr16_1=100&attr16_2=100&attr16_3=100&attr126_1=1&attr171_0=1&normalization=full&widget=1&x=0.7079806529625151&y=-0.5336778954484002

I asked for people with both cameras and real world images. I find these jumbled setups distracting to look at.
But last time I checked these studio scenes the new Sony looked comparable to the new Nikon. I'd say that's pretty good then but I'd like to see something like a slightly underexposed quarter tone.

Comparing dynamic range is challenging to do visually since on all recent cameras it exceeds virtually all displays, meaning you must tone map to see it. If we had 15-stops of capability in the display you might see the differences.

The lower noise of the Riii relative to Rii *should* be advantageous if you desire to push shadows up. That’s rarely my cup of tea, though, and I therefore expect no practical differences with my displays.

http://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/RN_ADU.htm#Sony%20ILCE-7RM2_14,Sony%20ILCE-7RM3_14
 

privatebydesign

EOS-1D X Mark III
CR Pro
Jan 29, 2011
9,796
4,412
ecqns said:
privatebydesign said:
ecqns said:
For those in this thread that do have both the a7r3 and a7r2, I'd love to see a comparison at ISO 100 between the two. Curious to see the DR improvement in real world images.

Non existent.

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=sony_a7rii&attr13_1=sony_a7riii&attr13_2=canon_eos5d&attr13_3=canon_eos5d&attr15_0=raw&attr15_1=raw&attr15_2=raw&attr15_3=raw&attr16_0=100&attr16_1=100&attr16_2=100&attr16_3=100&attr126_1=1&attr171_0=1&normalization=full&widget=1&x=0.7079806529625151&y=-0.5336778954484002

I asked for people with both cameras and real world images. I find these jumbled setups distracting to look at.
But last time I checked these studio scenes the new Sony looked comparable to the new Nikon. I'd say that's pretty good then but I'd like to see something like a slightly underexposed quarter tone.

I pointed you to controlled comparisons from somebody with both cameras. No 'real world' images can compare to studio setups when looking for tiny differences in small tonal ranges, that is just a fact, so these kinds of results are the very best (most accurate/illustrative) you are going to get. 'Real world' comparisons invariably include a lot of variables and the results are normally subjective rather than measurable and objective.

Download the samples as RAW files and present them any way you find easiest to digest. The bottles give nice and comparable tonality.

I agree the output looks very good, I also believe anybody that thinks there are useful differences in output now is barking up the wrong tree. An appropriate specialist lens is going to make more impact on final output IQ than a virtually unmeasurable difference in sensor output across brands.

In practical terms, as an example, if you own an A7R MkII and shoot architecture (I know you do) I'd expect using one of the new TS-E's is going to make a larger IQ difference in your deliverables than moving to an A7R MkIII. However if you own a 5D MkII/III are looking to up your game and shoot the same, I'd think an A7R MkIII would be a better investment than a lens. However, when all is said and done now output IQ differences are so small between the D850, 5D MkIV and A7R MkIII, other factors really should be bigger deciding factors.

http://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Sony%20ILCE-7RM2,Sony%20ILCE-7RM3
 

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bwud

EOS RP
Sep 3, 2014
305
10
[quote author=privatebydesign]

In practical terms, as an example, if you own an A7R MkII and shoot architecture (I know you do) I'd expect using one of the new TS-E's is going to make a larger IQ difference in your deliverables than moving to an A7R MkIII. However if you own a 5D MkII/III are looking to up your game and shoot the same, I'd think an A7R MkIII would be a better investment than a lens. However, when all is said and done now output IQ differences are so small between the D850, 5D MkIV and A7R MkIII, other factors really should be bigger deciding factors.
[/quote]

In general I agree with your assessment. In the particular case one could argue the pixel shift brings value to architectural photography. TS-E would *probably* sway me, but it’s a trade between optical distortion and detail/DR/moire-avoidance.
 

bwud

EOS RP
Sep 3, 2014
305
10
Dylan777 said:
bwud said:
Some bad news, I can’t feel any difference between the grips of the a7r II and A7r III.

And the good news:

It’s more customizable than I expected. If there is a function you can’t map somewhere I haven’t found it and probably wouldn’t want to map it. The controls feel good, not gimmicky.

It’s responsive. It doesn’t turn on right quick, but once it’s on it goes.

The EVF is beautiful.

I initially intended to have AF-ON stay default and AEL be for EyeAF. However I discovered that you can map the center press of the joystick (what resets the AF point to center on canons), so I instead put the AF-ON function there (meaning I need not move my thumb after selecting an AF point), and put the EyeAF function on the AF-ON button as well as lens button.

That freed up AEL, which I have toggling between exposure preview and not, a function I had to tediously find in the A7R II menus. Combined with the custom menu, I can’t think of any reason I’d have to navigate the main menu with any regularity.

Congrats!!! :)

Compared to mrk II, how is 6400ISO & 12800ISO? Thanks in advance.

A9 is the only body I have as FF. I'm kinda want 2nd FF body, too lazy swapping 2470 &70200 ;D , but want to see what a7s III has to offer. The a7r III looks very good.

So I shot a couple hundred family photos today, and lo and behold CameraRAW doesn’t support the files yet. There were a few at 6400 which look good in the EVF, but I’ll be in a holding pattern (not a fan of captureone, which does support it).
 
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