Focus problems with the Canon 7DII?

JRPhotos said:
I'll try the MA.

I looked at the 6D but don't like the 11 focal points, 19 was nice for certain situations where I didn't want to recompose but put the dot right where I wanted it.

I'd have to sell my EF-S 17-55 and EF-S 10-22 and get their equivalent lenses at a much higher price.

That sounds like a issue for you. I went to FF when the 5D MK II came out, but before that, I had bought a few selected FF lenses that could be used either way. I sold my remaining 17-55 after I sold my 7D. Upgrading to "L" lenses was expensive, but I watched Craigslist and sometimes bought a photographers entire inventory at fire sale prices. Then I sold all but the ones I wanted, and basically got free equipment. I did that multiple times.

I still have a 15-85mm just in case I buy another crop body. That seems unlikely, but possible. I'm still watching 7D reviews and expecting to pay a lot less for either a refurb, or when prices drop. I'm also considering buying the 100-400 MK II or one of the other 150-600mm lenses from Sigma or Tamron.
 
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JRPhotos said:
I'll try the MA.

I looked at the 6D but don't like the 11 focal points, 19 was nice for certain situations where I didn't want to recompose but put the dot right where I wanted it.

I'd have to sell my EF-S 17-55 and EF-S 10-22 and get their equivalent lenses at a much higher price.

IF its any consolation, i have had to AFMA all of my bodies to my lenses. Not one matched up perfectly. I havent had time to afma my 7dii but will be doing it first thing this weekend. Use a tripod and a full sheet of newspaper taped to a wall. shoot 5 shots (one shot AF mode, center point AF) at each major afma index (-20,-15,-10,-5,0,5,10,15,20) then evaluate on a computer, not the lcd screen, which is sharpest. then go back and shoot 5 more at each minor index around that one. You should be able to determine easily which provides the best image for that lens/focal length.

Once you get the hang of it you can do it with less shots but I always recommend 5
 
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JRPhotos said:
Woody said:
JRPhotos said:
I don't shoot sports, portraits, wildlife and landscapes.

Since you managed to achieve consistent AF using live view and have no need to photograph moving subjects or landscape, I suggest you move to a contrast based AF camera. The A6000 or XT1 or EM1 or GH4 beckons... ;D
That was a typo, I meant that I shoot only portraits, wildlife and landscapes. I'm not switching brands, I have a big investment in Canon gear.

One other thing. Many people had simiar issues wwhen the 5diii came out. Most of the AF issues where due to a lack of understanding how the new advaned AF system works. Many assumed settings in the older or consumer models are now manual settings in the new models and require one to visit all of the settings to ensure they are set up properly for the task at hand. Thank god for custom modes on the top dial. On my 5DIII I have one for birds in flight, one mode for static subjects, and one mode for sports action. I will likely set up the same for the 7dii once I can get out to do some shooting.

If the complexity of these models is too much then iit may be too much camera for your needs. I use an EOS-M for shots of my kids as it's quick and easy and does a pretty good job. No one camera will suit every need until you have mastered all of the settings and fully understand the implications of changing them.

Good luck. Based on the image posts it looks like AFMA is required.
 
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I hate to stoke the fire, but I think recommending a 6D or 5D3 to the OP, or telling him to photograph a "moving" subject instead, is a terrible idea. Trying to argue that the 7D2 can only photograph sports/action, and is not suited for still subjects, is just, well, silly. It's a camera. Granted, it's a camera with a certain design intent, but it's not like we're comparing a Chevy Nova to a track-ready F1 race car.

The 7D2 is a mid-level pro-sumer body, designed to handle a wide array of subject matter and shooting conditions. It should certainly be able to focus on a child in a kitchen in relatively medium/low lighting conditions. Now, that said, low-light conditions are certainly where AF systems struggle the most.

I will finish this post off by saying this to the OP: After thinking about your posts/story more, the more I think your 7DI (which, based on your accounts, focused more accurately and repeatedly in all lighting conditions) is the likely outlier here than your 7D2. I use a 6D and 5D3 in my event work, and I constantly find myself in demanding situations where there is very little available light. I usually start events at ISO 3,200 and often push to 8,000 as required. Missed focus comes with the territory, and getting those tack sharp results in such conditions is a real chore. So, the fact that you think your 7DI is spot on, time after time in every single scenario, tells me you may have gotten incredibly lucky with that body. All photographers struggle with adapting/modifying their AF techniques as lighting conditions change. To expect repeatable/consistent AF in low-light is simply not realistic, and is not what you should expect with current technology. It's a sensor; it can only do so much.
 
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To me it sounds like a few hours of doing AFMA on all your lenses could solve your issues. The worst outcome you can have from that is that it will turn out that you need to get a new camera - but at least you can be confident that you know that it's not you, or your lenses, or odd circumstances that created the problem.
I've done AFMA with all lenses on both my bodies, and the amount that I need to nudge them is not the same on those two bodies. And I think there is only one of my lenses that haven't needed any AFMA at all on my 7D.

Good luck, and I hope it will turn out to be an easy fix for you!

Update: In case you haven't read it, here's a short Canon article about AFMA. -> http://www.learn.usa.canon.com/resources/articles/2011/af_microadjustment_article.shtml
 
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I think most has been posted, but I would have shot single focus point on this type of shot, especially so close at f/2.8

Your lens may have some AFMA needed which can contribute slightly, but the biggest is your AF mode.

I have shot some fashion where I was using all point on my 5D MK III and one series I was disappointed with the face. I was shooting natural light in so so light so was shooting f/2.8 - F/4 and higher ISO. When looking at the photos and focus points, the dress she was wearing was a little poofy, part of that was closed to the camera and when I zoomed in, those sections were sharp.

As someone pointed out, in your photo, if you are shooting f/2.8 close up and you have a face and a fork as focus points and the fork is inches forward, face will be soft unless you use a longer lens to get deeper DOF.
 
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Speaking as someone who works in a research lab and surrounded by lots of very expensive test equipment, the first thing you do when you get in a new piece of gear is to test it. First you check for functionality, and then you calibrate it. The same holds true for a new camera..... First you try it out and get familiar with the basic functionality, then you calibrate it, which means to AFMA your lenses.

When I got my 7D2, the first few pictures were of the cat. I would focus on the eyes and only the tip of the nose was in focus. A quick adjustment on the AFMA and the problem was solved. This weekend I plan to do a more detailed AFMA of all the lenses.

I really suggest yo try to AFMA your body/lens. It will most likely solve your problem, and even if it does not, you will learn how to do it so that even if you do end up exchanging bodies, you will be ready to AFMA the new one.
 
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JRPhotos said:
I just want to be sure I understand everyone, if a camera takes good and bad photos of a subject with not setting changes it's a AFMA problem? I would think that it would be consistent.

In a testing or configuration changing environment, you would have the camera in One Shot mode, and Single Focus Point -> You are in control of where focus lands (or should land).
If you're in any of the Zone modes or full automatic area selection -> You are not in control.

Usually it's best to have maximum control when trying to figure out a problem or erratic behaviour.
 
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JRPhotos said:
I just want to be sure I understand everyone, if a camera takes good and bad photos of a subject with not setting changes it's a AFMA problem? I would think that it would be consistent.

If the camera is working correctly and you have decent contrast on the subject, the camera should consistently focus +/- one "tick" from the true focus point.

There are several things that can throw that off. The first is that you are using multiple AF points and the camera is not focusing where you think it should be focusing. This would get you the kind of random focusing problems that you seem to have. The solution would be to go to fewer (best is spot) focus points.

The next think is poor contrast. This would also give you the random focusing performance. If the camera is hunting for focus, this may be the problem.... if it locks on quickly, it isn't.

If the problem is AFMA, then the camera should be consistently off focus by the same (or very close) amount. With your random in-focus pattern, it is probably not the root cause, but it may be a contributing factor.


hope this helps.
 
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JRPhotos said:
I just want to be sure I understand everyone, if a camera takes good and bad photos of a subject with not setting changes it's a AFMA problem? I would think that it would be consistent.

Depends on the settings. If you're getting inconsistent results when letting the camera pick your AF point for you, then auto selection is most likely your problem.

It may be that you have a defective camera, but your tests haven't shown that conclusively.
 
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I know that there's a lot of posts here, but I am trying to make this clear, I _am_ shooting in one shot mode, one focal point, the example I posted originally was just one example. I could post more of just one focal point but didn't have time. Despite all of that, even shooting with one or small cluster of focal points on the 7DI, I never had this problem, with the 7DII with one focal point or even a cluster 1-2 out of 3 photos are out of focus and I am not new to this as I've said, I don't believe that it's user error.

I am just going to contact B&H and ask for an exchange and if it still happens I'll invest into FoCal or manual MA.
 
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JRPhotos said:
I know that there's a lot of posts here, but I am trying to make this clear, I _am_ shooting in one shot mode, one focal point, the example I posted originally was just one example. I could post more of just one focal point but didn't have time. Despite all of that, even shooting with one or small cluster of focal points on the 7DI, I never had this problem, with the 7DII with one focal point or even a cluster 1-2 out of 3 photos are out of focus and I am not new to this as I've said, I don't believe that it's user error.

I am just going to contact B&H and ask for an exchange and if it still happens I'll invest into FoCal or manual MA.
You are shooting in one shot mode
you are using one focal point
you have a random number of shots in focus...
it happens with multiple lenses which all worked fine on the old camera....

Given that, I really doubt it is AFMA...

If it were me, I would send it back for exchange....
 
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JRPhotos said:
I know that there's a lot of posts here, but I am trying to make this clear, I _am_ shooting in one shot mode, one focal point, the example I posted originally was just one example. I could post more of just one focal point but didn't have time. Despite all of that, even shooting with one or small cluster of focal points on the 7DI, I never had this problem, with the 7DII with one focal point or even a cluster 1-2 out of 3 photos are out of focus and I am not new to this as I've said, I don't believe that it's user error.

I am just going to contact B&H and ask for an exchange and if it still happens I'll invest into FoCal or manual MA.

Ok, I agree now. The lack of consistency in the amount of missed shots points to a lemon best suited for a return.
 
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The camera is going back to B&H on Monday and Adorama is shipping me a new one over night on Monday and if UPS delivers on Tuesday (Veterans day) then I'll have it then and I have that day off as our baby sitter can't watch our daughter that day so hopefully I do get it then!

I'll keep you updated. I'll also mess with the MA this weekend just to learn and see if it really does help but I doubt that it will.
 
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JRPhotos said:
The camera is going back to B&H on Monday and Adorama is shipping me a new one over night on Monday and if UPS delivers on Tuesday (Veterans day) then I'll have it then and I have that day off as our baby sitter can't watch our daughter that day so hopefully I do get it then!

I'll keep you updated. I'll also mess with the MA this weekend just to learn and see if it really does help but I doubt that it will.

Also - shoot in different conditions... get out and shoot in the day, see what the 7D2 does. It seems like your samples are all shot in low-light which, again, is where AF notoriously struggles.
 
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Draw an X on a wall, select center AF point and put the camera on a tripod, take a shot and post here. It's easy.

If you find consistent front or back mis-focus then you need MFA.

Without a simple test to know if the camera is focusing correctly on a chosen subject we can't help.
 
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justsomedude said:
JRPhotos said:
The camera is going back to B&H on Monday and Adorama is shipping me a new one over night on Monday and if UPS delivers on Tuesday (Veterans day) then I'll have it then and I have that day off as our baby sitter can't watch our daughter that day so hopefully I do get it then!

I'll keep you updated. I'll also mess with the MA this weekend just to learn and see if it really does help but I doubt that it will.

Also - shoot in different conditions... get out and shoot in the day, see what the 7D2 does. It seems like your samples are all shot in low-light which, again, is where AF notoriously struggles.

I agree but in the same setting with the 7DI it worked fine... I did take some photos last weekend outside and the same problem happened, 1 out of 3 were out of focus.

When I do get out and shoot wildlife, depending on the animal I do take rapid bursts of photos and that is critical- I don't want to worry about that with this model that I have so let's hope the new one works better.

I know that moving to a new camera takes a lot of time, at first I really did not like the 7DI coming from a 40D but once I got to understand the system it worked very well. I didn't have the focal problems that I'm experiencing, it was more of the newer features the 40D did not have and lack of understanding.
 
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JRPhotos said:
justsomedude said:
JRPhotos said:
The camera is going back to B&H on Monday and Adorama is shipping me a new one over night on Monday and if UPS delivers on Tuesday (Veterans day) then I'll have it then and I have that day off as our baby sitter can't watch our daughter that day so hopefully I do get it then!

I'll keep you updated. I'll also mess with the MA this weekend just to learn and see if it really does help but I doubt that it will.

Also - shoot in different conditions... get out and shoot in the day, see what the 7D2 does. It seems like your samples are all shot in low-light which, again, is where AF notoriously struggles.

I agree but in the same setting with the 7DI it worked fine... I did take some photos last weekend outside and the same problem happened, 1 out of 3 were out of focus.

I know you don't want to hear it again, but I don't think you should be using the 7DI as your point of comparison. Cameras are different and vary from system to system - especially models that are removed by 5 years. That said, you may still have an issue with yours, and an exchange will demonstrate whether or not that is the case.

Moving forward, I do not think you should be afraid/concerned with MF adjustments. I've never had a camera body that worked consistently with 100% of my lenses until MFA was performed. It's a painstaking/tedious process, but necessary for those among us who want repeatable/tack-sharp photos. Here is a good cut-out target you can make... https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/29571216/MicroFocus%20Adjustment.v2.pdf

You need an angled and labeled target so you can determine if your MFA is in front of, or behind, your base condition. It's worth playing with/learning, so you can get better at it in the future. FYI - aim for the zero marker!
 
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