Great Video Explanation of 7Dii low DXO scores

[Aglet]

Hmm I don't see that at all. The 7D2 plot for SNR is above the OM-10 the entire length ISO100 to the very top. are you sure you plugged in the correct cameras?

I'm seeing the 7d2's DR chart exceeding the EM10's above base ISO.

But I'm seeing the EM10's SNR plots exceeding the 7D2's for all ISOs (ani-gif below)

So I'm expecting the APS-C sensor to have a bit more DR than the MFT one, just based on size-physics, but I'm puzzled why it's not reflected in the SNR chart when the 18% gray points on the plot all have the Oly slightly superior.

EDIT - depending on how your browser's set, you may have to click the gif link below to open it in a new window for the animation to compare.

 

[3kramd5]

It's shocking, IHMO, that the new 7DII has lower scores than cameras with even smaller sensors.

That's been the problem all along with DXO. While their three individual metrics are very insightful, how DXO weighs these metrics against each other to arrive at a single score is one giant mystery. And people are willing to riot over that single overall sensor score

The Zeiss 24-70 f4 just bested the Canon and Nikon versions, despite the fact that the Nikon outscored the Zeiss in each metric the Zeiss still got an overall score one more than the Nikon.

Lest we forget, DXO mark includes sensor performance in lens scores. If you use the A3000 rather than the A7R, the Zeiss turns to crap.

So not only are there some bizarre undisclosed weightings involved, but DXO isn't even testing bare optics.

 

[preppyak]

So not only are there some bizarre undisclosed weightings involved, but DXO isn't even testing bare optics.

To be fair, that is actually useful to know. For example, if I can see than on my camera there is no difference in sharpness between Canons 17-40 f/4 and the new 16-35, well, then I just saved myself $700 if I dont need IS. Whereas if it'll make a noticeable difference, I probably need to start saving up. Last I checked, nobody uses a lens without it being attached to a sensor.

Now, they way they embarrass themselves is by taking 3 fairly useful numbers and combining them into some nonsense number/grade. They should at least be able to explain why one is ranked higher (like Snapsort at least shows how it weights its comparisons and what it considers important).

 

[sanj]

I won't be watching this video. This guy discredited himself terribly with his video titled, "Crop Factor with ISO & Aperture: How Sony, Olympus, Panasonic, Canon, Nikon & Fuji Cheat You".

I missed that particular fiasco. I clicked the link when the thread was new, saw it was Northrup, and closed the window. My first and last Northrup infomercial was when he said the 5DIII might be ok for non-pros posting pics on Facebook.

He actually said that? Grrrrr.

 

[LSV]

I won't be watching this video. This guy discredited himself terribly with his video titled, "Crop Factor with ISO & Aperture: How Sony, Olympus, Panasonic, Canon, Nikon & Fuji Cheat You".

I missed that particular fiasco. I clicked the link when the thread was new, saw it was Northrup, and closed the window. My first and last Northrup infomercial was when he said the 5DIII might be ok for non-pros posting pics on Facebook.

He actually said that? Grrrrr.

If anyone cares, Northrup defended himself against the alleged quote here: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3709126?page=2

 

[Loswr]

I won't be watching this video. This guy discredited himself terribly with his video titled, "Crop Factor with ISO & Aperture: How Sony, Olympus, Panasonic, Canon, Nikon & Fuji Cheat You".

I missed that particular fiasco. I clicked the link when the thread was new, saw it was Northrup, and closed the window. My first and last Northrup infomercial was when he said the 5DIII might be ok for non-pros posting pics on Facebook.

He actually said that? Grrrrr.

If anyone cares, Northrup defended himself against the alleged quote here: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3709126?page=2

Actually, he didn't. He was called out on it, and he chose to respond to the first reference to FB in his infomercial, not the second and far more idiotic one. Another DPR member made that point, quoting from Northrup's concluding remarks in the vid...and Northrup did not respond.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54158478

I'm sure Northrup would be pleased to see people defending him for his asinine remark, though.

 

[DominoDude]

I think it's the closest thing to "doing a Poodle" (Swedish way of speaking, meaning that one flops publicly to the ground, bares the belly and attempts to look humble and beg for forgiveness for earlier idiotic behaviour) that we will ever see from T.N.

 

[cpsico]

The 7d II specs out as well as canons 1 d mark III on IQ, Dynamic range, & low ISO IQ with twice the resolution, superior autofocus and metering. I would call it a home run aps-c camera.

 

[LSV]

I won't be watching this video. This guy discredited himself terribly with his video titled, "Crop Factor with ISO & Aperture: How Sony, Olympus, Panasonic, Canon, Nikon & Fuji Cheat You".

I missed that particular fiasco. I clicked the link when the thread was new, saw it was Northrup, and closed the window. My first and last Northrup infomercial was when he said the 5DIII might be ok for non-pros posting pics on Facebook.

He actually said that? Grrrrr.

If anyone cares, Northrup defended himself against the alleged quote here: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3709126?page=2

Actually, he didn't. He was called out on it, and he chose to respond to the first reference to FB in his infomercial, not the second and far more idiotic one. Another DPR member made that point, quoting from Northrup's concluding remarks in the vid...and Northrup did not respond.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54158478

I'm sure Northrup would be pleased to see people defending him for his asinine remark, though.

I'm nobody and I'm sure Northrup does not care if I defend him or not. You have helpfully
added the link of that debate. But, in the interest of fairness, I hope others will see there's plenty of room for interpretation in that exchange and then make up their own minds without just accepting your conclusion.

 

[Marauder]

It's shocking, IHMO, that the new 7DII has lower scores than cameras with even smaller sensors.

That's been the problem all along with DXO. While their three individual metrics are very insightful, how DXO weighs these metrics against each other to arrive at a single score is one giant mystery. And people are willing to riot over that single overall sensor score

YEP!!!! x1000

 

[ahsanford]

I won't be watching this video. This guy discredited himself terribly with his video titled, "Crop Factor with ISO & Aperture: How Sony, Olympus, Panasonic, Canon, Nikon & Fuji Cheat You".

I missed that particular fiasco. I clicked the link when the thread was new, saw it was Northrup, and closed the window. My first and last Northrup infomercial was when he said the 5DIII might be ok for non-pros posting pics on Facebook.

He actually said that? Grrrrr.

Northrup's videos are like the Arias video about sensor size not being important. They just wind people up.

What gets me with the 7D2 is how the boat is so comprehensively missed by gear enthusiasts and camera reviewers. If I'm an action/sports/wildlife/birding shooter, I'd rather nail the shot with a 7D2 and possibly have 10% less DR or color depth than miss the shot altogether due to poor AF, smaller buffer size or limited burst rate.

Put another way, if Canon gave the world's 7D1 owners a choice of what do with the 7D2 of:

Get one more stop of cleaner high ISO (i.e. a 7D2 shot at 3200 would resemble a 7D1 shot at 1600) and everything else is the same,

OR

Get +2 fps, a bigger buffer, DPAF, and a 1DX-like AF system

I'm guessing those folks would choose the latter. That's why I think the 7D2 is going to be quite successful despite what testers and enthusiasts are heckling the sensor for.

- A

 

[tayassu]

I won't be watching this video. This guy discredited himself terribly with his video titled, "Crop Factor with ISO & Aperture: How Sony, Olympus, Panasonic, Canon, Nikon & Fuji Cheat You".

I missed that particular fiasco. I clicked the link when the thread was new, saw it was Northrup, and closed the window. My first and last Northrup infomercial was when he said the 5DIII might be ok for non-pros posting pics on Facebook.

He actually said that? Grrrrr.

Northrup's videos are like the Arias video about sensor size not being important. They just wind people up.

What gets me with the 7D2 is how the boat is so comprehensively missed by gear enthusiasts and camera reviewers. If I'm an action/sports/wildlife/birding shooter, I'd rather nail the shot with a 7D2 and possibly have 10% less DR or color depth than miss the shot altogether due to poor AF, smaller buffer size or limited burst rate.

Put another way, if Canon gave the world's 7D1 owners a choice of what do with the 7D2 of:

Get one more stop of cleaner high ISO (i.e. a 7D2 shot at 3200 would resemble a 7D1 shot at 1600) and everything else is the same,

OR

Get +2 fps, a bigger buffer, DPAF, and a 1DX-like AF system

I'm guessing those folks would choose the latter. That's why I think the 7D2 is going to be quite successful despite what testers and enthusiasts are heckling the sensor for.

- A

+1, although the Arias video was meant to get people to shoot with what they have and think about it, whilst Tony only wanted to brag about his not really existent technical knowledge.

I watch his videos, partly for fun, if he says something stupid, partly because from time to time he says something right... And I'm glad he sees the positive points in the camera and doesn't complain about the "lack" of DR, despite being a handicapped Nikon user (the bodies are soooooo much better, but the lenses can't keep up ;D ).

 

[KacperP]

Put another way, if Canon gave the world's 7D1 owners a choice of what do with the 7D2 of:

Get one more stop of cleaner high ISO (i.e. a 7D2 shot at 3200 would resemble a 7D1 shot at 1600) and everything else is the same,

OR

Get +2 fps, a bigger buffer, DPAF, and a 1DX-like AF system

I'm guessing those folks would choose the latter. That's why I think the 7D2 is going to be quite successful despite what testers and enthusiasts are heckling the sensor for.

- A

+1
AF performance indeed.
Recently I was invited to a birthday party, that was in fact a surprise wedding party.
Had 60D + Sigma 18-35 1.8 and while I was worried about ISO performance, it was AF in low light that let me down in about 90% of shots When looking at 7D2 specs and tracking, I suspect the score would be other way around.