Here is the Canon Cinema EOS C70

Rocksthaman

Eos R , R6 , R5
Jul 9, 2020
139
174
I find these types to be the ones that want something for nothing. What I mean by that is they want RED/ARRI specs in a sub $2K MILC body with a full bevy of lenses and peripherals at Chinese knockoff prices. All you have to do is read other forums like DPReview or Sony Rumors and you'll find them all over. There are so many that think the A7SIII is overpriced and cannot believe it doesn't have at least 30 megapixels. If you want RED/ARRI performance then buy one of those cameras.

This is so lazy and such an over simplification if anyone that would want more of their camera and still be on the same system.

I would literally pay more to have the same camera body for both video and photo And it have some of the basic features of competitors. Clog 2/3, no 29:59 record limit, unlimited 4K mode (even if cropped) on R6 , at least mini HDMI (we’ve always had it).Very basic specs, but limiting to not have them.... but to want them , “go buy a cinema camera”.

Thats a very valid conversation point. It’s not really so much that you always use all of the features all the time but creativity is based on pushing your boundaries, if the boundaries are preset your creativity is also limited. Again, no big deal but it matters to think what you can do vs what you can’t. On the other hand using the my R6’s for about a week now the photography experience is so much better than my A7RIV(likely selling). It’s a much more confident camera than the R. And don’t get me started on the Sony app.
 
D

Deleted member 384473

Guest
And here's something else I find funny/weird/whatever about these supposed "artists" claiming they never seem to be able to find the right tool to do their jobs. They will list all these specs that already exist in a higher priced camera (ARRI/RED/whatever) but NEVER purchase said camera. I just don't understand.
You find it funny/weird/whatever that people don't want to shed out $40K - $80K on a ARRI/RED/whatever? A lot more goes into owning a cinema camera like that. The team loves working with the Mini LF. Doesn't mean its not nice to have a small hybrid to pick up in a random burst of inspiration when we want to film something that isn't on set.... When there is no team... To question someone's profession, whether artist, filmmaker, photographer is a bad look . We use an array of cameras to achieve what we want to create. Interested to know what specs are getting listed?

Yeah, well they may be unhousetrained, but they're going to go ahead and make a thousand bucks flipping the camera they call useless.

Who called the camera useless? This guy throws insults in almost every thread. If someone has decided that at its current state, the R5 is not for them, why care? Because they criticized something that is a deal breaker on a specific camera body that another camera body does better?

Err, evil competitor brand boys infiltrating our forums to sabotage the precious... We swears to serve the master of the precious... We swear on the precious....

Look - there will always be selling points to each camera body that buyers will value differently. Maybe it'll be different in 6 months as Canon pushes more R5 firmware updates, but until then, I suspect there will be returns with valid reasons just as there will be valid purchases. No reason to be rude to those that vocalize they've decided to return it. The a7SIII is going to be better for some while the R5 will be better for others, and get this... Some will buy both while others pass on them entirely. What!? I know... Crazy to think about. Some will wait for this C70. Can't wait forever. Honestly... We could make an entertaining film with a 60D. Luckily, 10 years later, we have many camera bodies and tools to choose from for our specific use cases.

So many read through these threads with this protective, paranoid mindset... Not everyone is trying to bash Canon... Many want the exact opposite for the brand. Many are fans of all the brands because they really just love cameras.
 

Darecinema

Addicted to lenses.
CR Pro
Sep 8, 2018
53
67
This is so lazy and such an over simplification if anyone that would want more of their camera and still be on the same system.

I would literally pay more to have the same camera body for both video and photo And it have some of the basic features of competitors. Clog 2/3, no 29:59 record limit, unlimited 4K mode (even if cropped) on R6 , at least mini HDMI (we’ve always had it).Very basic specs, but limiting to not have them.... but to want them , “go buy a cinema camera”.

Thats a very valid conversation point. It’s not really so much that you always use all of the features all the time but creativity is based on pushing your boundaries, if the boundaries are preset your creativity is also limited. Again, no big deal but it matters to think what you can do vs what you can’t. On the other hand using the my R6’s for about a week now the photography experience is so much better than my A7RIV(likely selling). It’s a much more confident camera than the R. And don’t get me started on the Sony app.
Hey RTM. You know I used to feel the same way when I was using the 5D Mark 2 about having one camera to do both but in the end after doing this for so long I really found that if I am going to shoot a pro video or short film or tv series that I prefer the ergonomics of a dedicated cinema camera. Completely setting aside the sensor, etc... just pure human ergonomics and then when doing a photo shoot that the Cinema Camera body just isn't comfortable for taking photos with regardless of technical capability.

For all my personal projects I find that the hybrid specs in either camp work just great at the higher end but I want my DSLRs or Mirrorless to stronger on the photo side than video. But that's my personal preference. In the end, they are all tools and whichever will get the job done best should be used.
 

SteveC

R5
CR Pro
Sep 3, 2019
2,481
2,346
You find it funny/weird/whatever that people don't want to shed out $40K - $80K on a ARRI/RED/whatever? A lot more goes into owning a cinema camera like that. The team loves working with the Mini LF. Doesn't mean its not nice to have a small hybrid to pick up in a random burst of inspiration when we want to film something that isn't on set.... When there is no team... To question someone's profession, whether artist, filmmaker, photographer is a bad look . We use an array of cameras to achieve what we want to create. Interested to know what specs are getting listed?



Who called the camera useless? This guy throws insults in almost every thread. If someone has decided that at its current state, the R5 is not for them, why care? Because they criticized something that is a deal breaker on a specific camera body that another camera body does better?

Err, evil competitor brand boys infiltrating our forums to sabotage the precious... We swears to serve the master of the precious... We swear on the precious....

Look - there will always be selling points to each camera body that buyers will value differently. Maybe it'll be different in 6 months as Canon pushes more R5 firmware updates, but until then, I suspect there will be returns with valid reasons just as there will be valid purchases. No reason to be rude to those that vocalize they've decided to return it. The a7SIII is going to be better for some while the R5 will be better for others, and get this... Some will buy both while others pass on them entirely. What!? I know... Crazy to think about. Some will wait for this C70. Can't wait forever. Honestly... We could make an entertaining film with a 60D. Luckily, 10 years later, we have many camera bodies and tools to choose from for our specific use cases.

So many read through these threads with this protective, paranoid mindset... Not everyone is trying to bash Canon... Many want the exact opposite for the brand. Many are fans of all the brands because they really just love cameras.

The fundamental problem with their behavior is/was NOT criticising the "precious" but rather invading every single thread on this forum for two weeks to do so, whether or not it had anything whatsoever to do with the R5 OR video. (OK, they DID spare the threads that are people showing off their pictures--thankfully.)

In fact we're having this conversation on a C70 thread simply because somebody had to bring up his R5 overheating complaints on it. That's why I've been calling them "unhousetrained" because they don't know where to defecate.
 

stevensteven

EOS M6 Mark II
Jun 24, 2020
81
57
Are you returning it (as you stated) or selling it on eBay (as you now state)?

My god, you’re so anal! Why do you even care? I’m returning it TO THE WORLD. My point is that I am getting rid of it.


I wish I could just walk into the store and return, but I cant ! Its not America here. We’re not free like you guy are.


Once you bought it, its too late. You cant return it and get your money back, even if it’s a minute later and you havent opened the box.
So when I said I return it, it means im getting rid of it on eBay, to buy something else with the money. Why do I even have to justify myself to you.


This is pathetic.
 

stevensteven

EOS M6 Mark II
Jun 24, 2020
81
57
Thanks for a calmer answer. For me what would make this conversation end in a beneficial/constructive manner would be if you would be willing to actually post a photo (or a video) you took with the R5 that demonstrates "the real issues of the camera" that made you return it. That way I, and others here could see if these problems are actual problems for us, or are problems for your specific use-case scenario. It would also help us see if these will be problems that will follow into the C70 if it ends up having the same sensor as the R5.

So: Do you have a photo or video you took with the R5 that you could share with the community that could demonstrate the issues you have a problem with? I'm not saying you have to share it, but it sure would add credibility to your argument. And yes, I did actually take the time to check your Instagram and I think you have some beautiful work, so I really WOULD be interested in seeing an example of why the R5 didn't work for your needs.

Otherwise, I have no context to your argument that I can see with my own eyes and then either agree or disagree with you based on my opinion if it is an issue for my use.

So help us out here: Please post a photo or a video so we can see it for ourselves and see what the real issue was.


Ok… let’s see.


If that’s ok with you, yes, I ask permission, I will give you the answer that comes from my heart, hoping it will mean something. If it doesn’t, I promise to answer more technically and with proofs.





Let me clarify a couple things first:


  • When I complained about the DR, it was in video, not stills. As a matter of fact, the R5 is probably the most capable stills camera I have ever used. It is a MASTERPIECE FOR STILLS.
  • I am not a technical guy. I don’t pixel peep. I’m not sure I could tell the difference between the 4KHQ and the 4K line skipped. And I don’t care for it either. When I complain about DR, its not in a technical way. I am not Gerald Undone.




As a matter of fact, a camera is a tool for me, to express myself. I do everything with it (except work). It’s my passion. I film my kids, I shoot short films, I shoot feature films.
I am on this forum, because I also turn out to be a gear geek. I love trying new stuff. I have tried every camera system you can imagine (with a dominance for Canon).


There is a point when I stop thinking about specs. About DR stops, about overheating, about codecs… There is a point where I pick up my camera, I literally smell it, I kiss it, and I go out to shoot. When I come home, I don’t watch the footage first. I just wait and feel grateful for what just happened.





Then, I look at what I produced. And it procures a feeling, a mood to me. I either like, or I don’t. For ever, I tried every camera, and always went back to canon, because canon gave me the feeling of loving what I did. What I tried to say this time, is that for the first time, Sony has surpassed canon. There is something in the Sony image that I finally find mesmerising. Cinematic to my eye. And its not just the image itself, its the experience of using the camera. The ergonomics, the reliablilty, its effortless.





One of the reason why I mentioned it on this thread is because I reacted to a guy who said he was switching. Same for me. And its so goddamn hard. I want to cry. I feel like im betraying the brand I’ve been loyal to for years. Im afraid even. But this time it feels right. In I find some confort in documenting (out loud) that experience.





The other reason why I spoke about this here is because the last thing that could have stopped me from not going to Sony just yet was the C70 itself !!!!!


I thought for a while that it could be the companion to the R5 for real filmmaking, because even if I love photos, I am a FILMMAKER above all. Thats why I got into a comparison discussion between the c70 and the a7siii. People compare the c70 to the c300ii, Gerald Undone said he cancelled his c300ii for an a7siii. So it seemed relevant to me to ask the question:





IS THE A7SIII better than the c70 (or the c300mkii). I still want opinions on this….





But to conclude, my happiness will eventually not come from specs. It will come from a feeling I get, using and producing with a camera. I just cant tell myself that a camera will get in the way of what I want to produce… Does it make any sense?





I will finish my telling you that on my shelf tonight I have an R5 and an A7Riv. Two of the best worlds camera, by spec. Guess which one is systemically pick up every time I want to go out to shoot?


No, not systematically. Instinctively. I instinctively, passionately pick up the …. Leica M10P. The worst specs I own. The best rendered image I have seen in a camera.

Do you understand me?





Much love,


Stev
 
Last edited:

stevensteven

EOS M6 Mark II
Jun 24, 2020
81
57
I should add for the stubborn ones that my problem with the r5 in video is mainly the Dr. which means to me that when I shoot, unless the conditions are perfect, I can’t manage to have a well exposed face and a well expose sky. The sky looses color way to fast and becomes blown out.

excuse also my bad English. I make Efforts. I’m French.
 

dba101

EOS M6 Mark II
Sep 11, 2018
74
88
I should add for the stubborn ones that my problem with the r5 in video is mainly the Dr. which means to me that when I shoot, unless the conditions are perfect, I can’t manage to have a well exposed face and a well expose sky. The sky looses color way to fast and becomes blown out.

excuse also my bad English. I make Efforts. I’m French.
I think everyone fell asleep.
 
D

Deleted member 384473

Guest
I thought for a while that it could be the companion to the R5 for real filmmaking, because even if I love photos, I am a FILMMAKER above all. Thats why I got into a comparison discussion between the c70 and the a7siii. People compare the c70 to the c300ii, Gerald Undone said he cancelled his c300ii for an a7siii. So it seemed relevant to me to ask the question:


IS THE A7SIII better than the c70 (or the c300mkii). I still want opinions on this….

Many are in the same boat - that is waiting on these releases and cameras to become available to test and decide which to purchase. The best advice I can give is to be patient. Wait for the cameras to become available so you can either rent them or experiment with them during the return window. Rent the lens you'll use with the camera ( If you don't already own it) and make a short film over a weekend. Play with the footage. See what results you're able to get. Focus on the feeling you have when using them. It is hard to wait... I've grown impatient, myself... But it is not like your quality of work is dropping because you are not getting a new generation camera right from the start. A new camera won't improve an untrained operator... Or something like that.

The DR on the A7SIII & C300III are similar at ~13 stops clean / usable, but other factors are at play, right?
  • FF vs S35 ( if it matters to you).
  • Form Factor
  • DCI aspect ratios (C300III)
  • Shutter Angle (C300III)
  • Tally light (C300III)
  • XLR inputs (C300III)
  • Lens selection ( And your current lens library)
  • Built in NDs (C300III)
  • Canon Cinema Raw ( C300III)
  • 16-bit linear RAW to 12-bit ProRes RAW up to 4Kp60 using Ninja V ( A7SIII)
  • Frame rates
  • AF
  • Ease of use
  • Storage options
  • *price
I've seen beautiful and atrocious footage from both cameras on YT/Vimeo. I think that is why its important to know how/what you shoot and to actually get your hands on one before making a decision. We can watch reviews all day long, but you won't know for sure until you smell it yourself, right? You could download clips people have uploaded too... Play with them in Resolve / Adobe.

We need more info on the C70 and need one in hand before making assumptions on it. I like the versatility of the RF mount for sure.

I thought I would be getting a new camera in 2020... But its looking more and more like 2021 as its already September o_O No worries tho!
 

Darecinema

Addicted to lenses.
CR Pro
Sep 8, 2018
53
67
Ok… let’s see.


If that’s ok with you, yes, I ask permission, I will give you the answer that comes from my heart, hoping it will mean something. If it doesn’t, I promise to answer more technically and with proofs.





Let me clarify a couple things first:


  • When I complained about the DR, it was in video, not stills. As a matter of fact, the R5 is probably the most capable stills camera I have ever used. It is a MASTERPIECE FOR STILLS.
  • I am not a technical guy. I don’t pixel peep. I’m not sure I could tell the difference between the 4KHQ and the 4K line skipped. And I don’t care for it either. When I complain about DR, its not in a technical way. I am not Gerald Undone.




As a matter of fact, a camera is a tool for me, to express myself. I do everything with it (except work). It’s my passion. I film my kids, I shoot short films, I shoot feature films.
I am on this forum, because I also turn out to be a gear geek. I love trying new stuff. I have tried every camera system you can imagine (with a dominance for Canon).


There is a point when I stop thinking about specs. About DR stops, about overheating, about codecs… There is a point where I pick up my camera, I literally smell it, I kiss it, and I go out to shoot. When I come home, I don’t watch the footage first. I just wait and feel grateful for what just happened.





Then, I look at what I produced. And it procures a feeling, a mood to me. I either like, or I don’t. For ever, I tried every camera, and always went back to canon, because canon gave me the feeling of loving what I did. What I tried to say this time, is that for the first time, Sony has surpassed canon. There is something in the Sony image that I finally find mesmerising. Cinematic to my eye. And its not just the image itself, its the experience of using the camera. The ergonomics, the reliablilty, its effortless.





One of the reason why I mentioned it on this thread is because I reacted to a guy who said he was switching. Same for me. And its so goddamn hard. I want to cry. I feel like im betraying the brand I’ve been loyal to for years. Im afraid even. But this time it feels right. In I find some confort in documenting (out loud) that experience.





The other reason why I spoke about this here is because the last thing that could have stopped me from not going to Sony just yet was the C70 itself !!!!!


I thought for a while that it could be the companion to the R5 for real filmmaking, because even if I love photos, I am a FILMMAKER above all. Thats why I got into a comparison discussion between the c70 and the a7siii. People compare the c70 to the c300ii, Gerald Undone said he cancelled his c300ii for an a7siii. So it seemed relevant to me to ask the question:





IS THE A7SIII better than the c70 (or the c300mkii). I still want opinions on this….





But to conclude, my happiness will eventually not come from specs. It will come from a feeling I get, using and producing with a camera. I just cant tell myself that a camera will get in the way of what I want to produce… Does it make any sense?





I will finish my telling you that on my shelf tonight I have an R5 and an A7Riv. Two of the best worlds camera, by spec. Guess which one is systemically pick up every time I want to go out to shoot?


No, not systematically. Instinctively. I instinctively, passionately pick up the …. Leica M10P. The worst specs I own. The best rendered image I have seen in a camera.

Do you understand me?





Much love,


Stev
Hi Stev, I completely understand and what you are describing to me on the experience above the specs is of course a huge factor in any buying decision I make on gear.

For me beyond anything, beyond specs, beyond ergonomics, sensors, etc, etc, is the final image and does the camera + lens enable me to realize what my artistic skill can accomplish and not detract from it. As JIM JIM correctly said, I've also seen the world's best cameras make some pretty glorious trash.

But I believe we've reached a point where pretty much any camera you have these days is technically capable of meeting the skill level of any photographer and so one must fall back on the overall experience and enjoyment to judge where to invest oneself in. A good camera system should last a lifetime. Camera bodies will come and go. Lenses are forever. And we have the luxury in stills photography of being able to afford some pretty incredible lenses. (Cinema lenses...ouch...Arri Master Primes...I don't have enough kidneys).

I have had my C300 II since it first launched, I actually got to use a pre-production model for my first feature which was fun. I also shot it seamlessly as a B-Cam to an Arri Alexa for Netflix series and no one noticed the difference. That has a lot to do with accurate lighting and preparations, but still I was proud of the camera. I shot a documentary shoot in the pouring rain at sunset which bricked my A7S2 immediately, but my Canon C300II kept shooting despite being drenched with water and the lens never failed either.

I have been desperately waiting for an RF version of either the C300 or the C500 so that as a businessman I can afford to make the investment and recoup the costs. I just make way more money from my cinema work than my photographic work. But the photographer in me has been dying to get the new RF lenses since I first played with them.

So I check CR about 5 times a day waiting for news on the RF cinema camera. And I know if it is going to have the same specs as the C300 III or C500 II in an RF format I will be it the instant it is available. My C300 II was my first "huge" camera purchase. But it paid for itself in 6 weeks, and if I hadn't had it, I wouldn't have gotten the job that paid for it, they didn't want a DSLR on that shoot, they wanted to see a PRO camera, even if I could as good shots with a smaller camera.

On the Leica, I understand. As I said, it is the final image that counts. Whatever gear gets you that result for your personal satisfaction or your client to pay you is simply the shoes you wore to make the journey. That you got there is more important than the brand on the shoes. (That's a terrible analogy).

Anyways. I really really hope that one of the new RF Cinema Camera is basically the C500 II with RF mount. Sure 120 fps at 4K would be nice for some specific shooting, but 95% of what I do is 24fps anyways.
 

Darecinema

Addicted to lenses.
CR Pro
Sep 8, 2018
53
67
Many are in the same boat - that is waiting on these releases and cameras to become available to test and decide which to purchase. The best advice I can give is to be patient. Wait for the cameras to become available so you can either rent them or experiment with them during the return window. Rent the lens you'll use with the camera ( If you don't already own it) and make a short film over a weekend. Play with the footage. See what results you're able to get. Focus on the feeling you have when using them. It is hard to wait... I've grown impatient, myself... But it is not like your quality of work is dropping because you are not getting a new generation camera right from the start. A new camera won't improve an untrained operator... Or something like that.

The DR on the A7SIII & C300III are similar at ~13 stops clean / usable, but other factors are at play, right?
  • FF vs S35 ( if it matters to you).
  • Form Factor
  • DCI aspect ratios (C300III)
  • Shutter Angle (C300III)
  • Tally light (C300III)
  • XLR inputs (C300III)
  • Lens selection ( And your current lens library)
  • Built in NDs (C300III)
  • Canon Cinema Raw ( C300III)
  • 16-bit linear RAW to 12-bit ProRes RAW up to 4Kp60 using Ninja V ( A7SIII)
  • Frame rates
  • AF
  • Ease of use
  • Storage options
  • *price
I've seen beautiful and atrocious footage from both cameras on YT/Vimeo. I think that is why its important to know how/what you shoot and to actually get your hands on one before making a decision. We can watch reviews all day long, but you won't know for sure until you smell it yourself, right? You could download clips people have uploaded too... Play with them in Resolve / Adobe.

We need more info on the C70 and need one in hand before making assumptions on it. I like the versatility of the RF mount for sure.

I thought I would be getting a new camera in 2020... But its looking more and more like 2021 as its already September o_O No worries tho!

Excellent analysis. And while I don't have either the A7S3 or the C300 III yet, I did have the A7S2 and the C300 II and still do and still film and make money with both. I really don't want to buy the C300 Mark III or C500 Mark II unless it comes with an RF Mount. I'd rather hold out a bit longer because as you said, it's not like not having them is affecting my ability to get work or continue to make money. But I really want to have a two camera set-up that isn't C300 Mark II and Sony A7S II or 5D Mark IV. I'd much rather have two cinema cameras as my A-Cam and B-Cam.

At the end of the day, for me, there are four major deciding factors (because let's face it, the technology is so good, that's not getting in the way of shooting a great story at this point):

1. Price difference.
2. Ergonomic difference
3. Ease of experience.
4. Client Perception.

1. Price difference is far less on A7S3 and C300 III than previous iterations. I paid $17K with tax for C300 II and I think $2799 for A7S2. Now after you add all the accessories you will need to the A7S3 to make it set-up and reliable enough for continual shooting day by day weeks on end, the cost difference between C300 III and A7S3 with all support gear will likely be less than $3,000 (SWAG). And stills are miserable on the A7S2 so I don't expect much of an improvement on the A7S3. After trying to use the A7S2 as my "sometimes" photo camera, the experience was so bad I went and bought a 5D IV to upgrade my old 5D II and have used it since with amazing results.

2. Ergonomic Difference. Carrying around a fully rigged A7S2 with Inferno and all other accessories so it's Cine ready just gets tiring and inconvenient after a while. It's okay for a bit. But as the days turn into weeks and weeks turn into months, it loses its appeal. It's a lot of extra work continuously and time is money, when I'd rather have the right body out of the bag. I'm video-centric though, but I promise you for photo-centric shooters the A7S line is not a rewarding photo/video experience. That's either the Sony A92 or A7RIV or the Canon 1DX Mark III or 5D IV or R5.

3. Ease of experience. My greatest frustration with Sony video other than color has always been autofocus. Filming a fast-moving horse competition at 200mm - 400mm inside a poorly lit stadium or incredibly brightly backlit arena and trying to nail focus can be unbelievably frustrating whether pulling by myself or with an a/cam. But the C300 II nailed it with autofocus every damn time. It's sorcery level good. Plus I don't have to change cards in long interviews. Plus no record limits. Plus ridiculously tough weather sealing that has gone through storms, snow, desert, etc....The Canon DPAF autofocus allows you to get impossible shots that only the top focus pullers in the world would be able to nail so repeatedly. I was always curious why Sony never put the A7SII/III sensor in a pro-cinema body such as the FX7 or FX9.

4. Client perception. Unfortunately in the very real world of charging a lot of money, you need to look the part. And when an ad agency art director sees you step onto the set with a DSLR body as your A-Cam, they automatically form opinions on your qualifications and capabilities. Clients are the same. You show up with a cinema camera and they just feel "they are getting their money's worth." It's worse than this though, many clients these days aren't willing to pay good rates for good artists, but will pay good rates for good gear that they can google and see is high-level. So the life of the owner-operator is tied to the quality and sellability of the gear just as much as his work.
 

MaxDiesel

EOS M6 Mark II
Sep 23, 2015
59
11
I should add for the stubborn ones that my problem with the r5 in video is mainly the Dr. which means to me that when I shoot, unless the conditions are perfect, I can’t manage to have a well exposed face and a well expose sky. The sky looses color way to fast and becomes blown out.

excuse also my bad English. I make Efforts. I’m French.

Thats not the cameras fault, thats technique, even with 14+ Dynamic Range you’d still have blown out skies trying to expose an underexposed face. Filming in RAW can help.

- Get a reflector, change angles or composition to add exposure to your models face.
- Get a graduated ND filter
- Sometimes a Polarizer can work but only if you angle yourself properly with the sun to get the polarizing effect.
(I’m sure you know all of these techniques, also I dont believe the R5 has Clog 2 or 3, which must crush the DR)

To your previous message about hoping for C500 RF, that wont happen just yet. Rumors show a C200 - and C300 equivalent and even there they seem to have omitted CineRaw, I’m hoping the audio preamps are just as good.
I’m looking at the C50 and not C70 to compliment my C200.
 

stevensteven

EOS M6 Mark II
Jun 24, 2020
81
57
Thats not the cameras fault, thats technique, even with 14+ Dynamic Range you’d still have blown out skies trying to expose an underexposed face. Filming in RAW can help.

- Get a reflector, change angles or composition to add exposure to your models face.
- Get a graduated ND filter
- Sometimes a Polarizer can work but only if you angle yourself properly with the sun to get the polarizing effect.
(I’m sure you know all of these techniques, also I dont believe the R5 has Clog 2 or 3, which must crush the DR)

To your previous message about hoping for C500 RF, that wont happen just yet. Rumors show a C200 - and C300 equivalent and even there they seem to have omitted CineRaw, I’m hoping the audio preamps are just as good.
I’m looking at the C50 and not C70 to compliment my C200.

You say, it's not the camera's fault, it's technique. In other words, it's not the tool, it's the operator of the tool. In other words, it's my fault? In other words, I don't know how to use my camera ? In other words, my claim of the DR gap being too big between the R5 and the C300iii/A7SIII is wrong ?
It's ok, you assume I am a beginner. I guess it's normal. You don't know me. You don't know what type of filmmaker. You don't know what I've achieved before, what I've achieved this year.
So I'll answer in the most simple way.
On a bright day, in harsh light, it's complicated to get a well exposed face and sky (no one talked about an under exposed face, only you did) the DR is just not there. The highlights blow out too quickly. With an A7III, it just works. Even if you're a beginner. The DR is better in video on the a7iii than on the R5. Imagine the a7siii.
I am looking forward to clog 3, but the truth is I don't think the sensor has it. I think the difference will be minor. It will never reach the level of the c300iii. That's all I am saying.
I also don't think it's surprising. The R5 has other things to offer to compensate for that.

Regarding the C500RF, it wasn't my comment, but I agree that it's not coming just yet.
 
D

Deleted member 384473

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You say, it's not the camera's fault, it's technique. In other words, it's not the tool, it's the operator of the tool. In other words, it's my fault? In other words, I don't know how to use my camera ? In other words, my claim of the DR gap being too big between the R5 and the C300iii/A7SIII is wrong ?
It's ok, you assume I am a beginner. I guess it's normal. You don't know me. You don't know what type of filmmaker. You don't know what I've achieved before, what I've achieved this year.
So I'll answer in the most simple way.
On a bright day, in harsh light, it's complicated to get a well exposed face and sky (no one talked about an under exposed face, only you did) the DR is just not there. The highlights blow out too quickly. With an A7III, it just works. Even if you're a beginner. The DR is better in video on the a7iii than on the R5. Imagine the a7siii.
I am looking forward to clog 3, but the truth is I don't think the sensor has it. I think the difference will be minor. It will never reach the level of the c300iii. That's all I am saying.
I also don't think it's surprising. The R5 has other things to offer to compensate for that.

Regarding the C500RF, it wasn't my comment, but I agree that it's not coming just yet.
Dude was just trying to say that it is challenging to expose for both face & sky but that there are ways to supplement it. No one is attacking you, calling you a beginner, or saying you’re wrong. They mentioned they didn’t know your level and then offered some supplements. We got it, you have an issue with DR on the R5. Rightfully so. You obviously have a high opinion of your work - thats great. Not sure why you’re getting defensive then. Sony claims same amount of stops of DR on both A7iii & A7Siii. Hated the 8-bit on the A7III.

Rent the cameras you’re interested in and experiment when they are available.
 

stevensteven

EOS M6 Mark II
Jun 24, 2020
81
57
Dude was just trying to say that it is challenging to expose for both face & sky but that there are ways to supplement it. No one is attacking you, calling you a beginner, or saying you’re wrong. They mentioned they didn’t know your level and then offered some supplements. We got it, you have an issue with DR on the R5. Rightfully so. You obviously have a high opinion of your work - thats great. Not sure why you’re getting defensive then. Sony claims same amount of stops of DR on both A7iii & A7Siii. Hated the 8-bit on the A7III.

Rent the cameras you’re interested in and experiment when they are available.

I'm defensive because I've been attacked for no reason here for the past 24 hrs.
I probably became a little bit sensitive now.
I may have a high opinion of my work, but I try to measure this as objectively as possible. I also know how hard I worked to get where I am today. I am proud.
 
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Rocksthaman

Eos R , R6 , R5
Jul 9, 2020
139
174
I'm defensive because I've been attacked for no reason here for the past 24 hrs.
I probably became a little bit sensitive now.
I may have a high opinion of my work, but I try to measure this as objectively as possible. I also know how hard I worked to get where I am today. I am proud.
All good. Much Respect to the passion. Tone it down a bit though. If you get that upset on even unfair (If it is) opinions, you won’t make it long. The internet and customers are full of opinions and don’t care how you feel.
 

MaxDiesel

EOS M6 Mark II
Sep 23, 2015
59
11
You say, it's not the camera's fault, it's technique. In other words, it's not the tool, it's the operator of the tool. In other words, it's my fault? In other words, I don't know how to use my camera ? In other words, my claim of the DR gap being too big between the R5 and the C300iii/A7SIII is wrong ?
It's ok, you assume I am a beginner. I guess it's normal. You don't know me. You don't know what type of filmmaker. You don't know what I've achieved before, what I've achieved this year.
So I'll answer in the most simple way.
On a bright day, in harsh light, it's complicated to get a well exposed face and sky (no one talked about an under exposed face, only you did) the DR is just not there. The highlights blow out too quickly. With an A7III, it just works. Even if you're a beginner. The DR is better in video on the a7iii than on the R5. Imagine the a7siii.
I am looking forward to clog 3, but the truth is I don't think the sensor has it. I think the difference will be minor. It will never reach the level of the c300iii. That's all I am saying.
I also don't think it's surprising. The R5 has other things to offer to compensate for that.

Regarding the C500RF, it wasn't my comment, but I agree that it's not coming just yet.
Hey buddy, Sorry you took my message as an attack tho you can clearly see I said “You probably know all of these tricks anyways”
Not doubting your talents or knowledge only addressing your issue... are you not here for advice to help out or just to speak you grief, it could be settings and usage. I know for a fact if your using a canon profile other then C-Log you’ll severally blowout highlights even on my C200 its C-Log 2/3 or bust. You might also be overexposing C-Log. I think the IRE need to be at 36-40 for neutral gray.

Google this video on YouTube: Canon EOS R5 - How Bad Is The Dynamic Range On The Canon R5
You’ll see Blue Skies, Clouds and a properly exposed face. Lots of DR!
 

telemaque

Before Sunset
CR Pro
Nov 30, 2019
121
77
Waov, I came here to see if specs of C70 had been released and I discovered this conversation thread has changed direction.
The temperature moved up here quite a bit since my last post...

Not unusual in forums... In fact there is a reason for that.

As a sales person I learnt for my job that 70% of the message a person is sending comes from his body language. 15% from the tone you use and
ONLY 15% from the words or the real content.

In a forum, as only words are visible, it is easy to misunderstand a post, because in reality 85% of a normal message is missing !

I am sure, if you would have had the same exchanges in a bar, and you could have seen your respective body languagues and tones, this conversation would have gone another direction. I am convinced, only people with passion and good intentions are here.

It would be great to learn a bit more about the C70 specs !

Thanks