More Canon EOS 6D Mark II Talk [CR1]

[K]

Sounds like you need to switch to Nikon!
I have a 7D and would like to jump up to full frame but the 6D is too slow and the AF is poor.
If I don't want the 6D, it's not Canon's fault. It is a free market so I can switch to Nikon or I can fork over more money for the 5D MK III which has dropped significantly. It is MY choice, not Canon's.

Jarrod

Well, I'd like to think that Canon's shareholders disagree, and instead believe that Canon corporate should want me to buy another Canon body and stay within their system. I also think that there are many others out there like myself.

Normally, an objective of any business to try and appeal and cater to their customer's needs and wants as much as possible to increase sales.

Certainly, Canon cannot please everyone as that would be impossible in a camera. But I'm not asking for much. I'm asking that they include an inexpensive, easy to implement 2nd SD card slot on what will surely be a $2,000+ camera.


Nikon D610.

Full Frame, 2 Slots, $1,500.


All the cost-savings arguments are invalidated by a simple reminder that the D610 exists.

 

[Orangutan]

Normally, an objective of any business to try and appeal and cater to their customer's needs and wants as much as possible to increase sales.

Not quite: the goal is to increase profits.

Certainly, Canon cannot please everyone as that would be impossible in a camera. But I'm not asking for much. I'm asking that they include an inexpensive, easy to implement 2nd SD card slot on what will surely be a $2,000+ camera.

That could cut into profits and interfere with market segmentation.

All the cost-savings arguments are invalidated by a simple reminder that the D610 exists.

Does it sell as well as the 6D?

We all want maximum value, but that's not the way markets work. We have limited choices. Until there's a universal lens mount for crop and FF we're stuck with those limited choices.

 

[Zv]

Sounds like you need to switch to Nikon!
I have a 7D and would like to jump up to full frame but the 6D is too slow and the AF is poor.
If I don't want the 6D, it's not Canon's fault. It is a free market so I can switch to Nikon or I can fork over more money for the 5D MK III which has dropped significantly. It is MY choice, not Canon's.

Jarrod

Well, I'd like to think that Canon's shareholders disagree, and instead believe that Canon corporate should want me to buy another Canon body and stay within their system. I also think that there are many others out there like myself.

Normally, an objective of any business to try and appeal and cater to their customer's needs and wants as much as possible to increase sales.

Certainly, Canon cannot please everyone as that would be impossible in a camera. But I'm not asking for much. I'm asking that they include an inexpensive, easy to implement 2nd SD card slot on what will surely be a $2,000+ camera.


Nikon D610.

Full Frame, 2 Slots, $1,500.


All the cost-savings arguments are invalidated by a simple reminder that the D610 exists.

Canon 6D.

Full Frame, Wifi and GPS $1500

Why can Nikon not include these features that I want in their camera? Hmmmm? (Do you see how this line of argument makes no sense now?)

 

[Loswr]

Certainly, Canon cannot please everyone as that would be impossible in a camera. But I'm not asking for much. I'm asking that they include an inexpensive, easy to implement 2nd SD card slot on what will surely be a $2,000+ camera.
Nikon D610.
Full Frame, 2 Slots, $1,500.
All the cost-savings arguments are invalidated by a simple reminder that the D610 exists.

D610 current Amazon.com sales rank: #29; Amazon.de sales rank: #38
EOS 6D current Amazon.com sales rank: #11; Amazon.de sales rank: #10

EOS 6D Amazon.com Top 100 Rated (customer satisfaction): #1
D610 Amazon.com Top 100 Rated (customer satisfaction): not in Top 100

It seems your arguments in favor of a second card slot are invalidated by the simple fact that the 6D is spanking the D610 in terms of both sales and customer satisfaction.

 

[Aglet]

6D's a decent dollar-value Rebel-like FF option.
An improvement in a few features and FPN reduction, a'la 7d2, would make it even better, as long as they hold the price in line vs the competition. Nikon's offerings are no slouch and Pentax will enter the fray by early 2016 and, if you pay any attention to them, they usually produce some pretty impressively spec'd and well-featured products.
Fuji's APSC x-trans products have IQ that can be compared to FF Canons, in most cases quite favorably at reasonable ISO ranges so pro/consumers are spoiled for choices.

If I ever have a hankering to get a Canon TS lens, I'd consider a 6D-series product to go with it.
Right after I consider a TS-adapter for any-lens attached to my Fuji.

 

[The Flasher]

K, why is "single slot" such a big issue? As far as I'm concerned, dual card slots are a throwback to the days of unreliable, low capacity memory cards. Some professionals might want dual slots when covering "no reshoot" events, but I'm OK with skipping that feature on Canon's low-cost full frame camera.

Exactly. Dunno what all this hoo ha is about dual slots on the 6D. It's a low end FF for hobbyists and enthusiasts. If you're a pro who relies on paid work then you really ought to have a 5D MkIII. Otherwise you're clearly just being a cheap-o and then complaining about lack of features. Buy the right gear for the job.

Same debate as last week's post, boils down to the fact that no other Canon camera in the full frame range has wifi built in, a feature us 'pros' crave, plus the small form factor, low light performance and low ev focus ability - that one cross type is just one, but so accurate.. Controlling the camera remotely via tablet over wifi while camera mounted in tight or precarious position, or simply letting clients view image near real time as you shoot is the next level of usability of this tool.

Second card slot is a must to limit liability of failing cards, dropped and stepped-on cards, lost cards etc. Data redundancy starts in camera.

ps. Cards still fail, that's not even a debate.

 

[Lee Jay]

Ok, but will they put a Sony Exmor in it?

Or persist with Canon's current lacking designs?

Be careful what you ask for. Having recently bought (and returned) the Sony A7 II with the vaunted Exmor sensor, I would have to express my disappointment with it. I spent a week taking the same shots with the Sony and my Canon 6D, and as I mentioned, returned the Sony. I normally shoot landscapes and in comparing the shots, the Sony and Canon pics were either essentially the same, or I preferred the Canon pics. I realize that the opinions when looking at actual pics is subjective as opposed to looking at test shots on the internet. I preferred the color of the Canon, but mostly the contrast and tone curve. The Sony pics were noticeably more "washed out."

Sounds like a post processing problem to me.

I just sat my totally unbiased daughter down in front of the computer to look at some test shots from different cameras. All of them are shot in raw, all have the same processing in the same tool using the same profile and are all displayed at the same size. I just asked her which she liked best and worst. In a few seconds she picked the worst. It took her longer to pick the best.

These were ISO 200 and ISO 6400 shots, all pushed about 2 stops in the shadows.

The best was a Canon, the worst was a Sony.

I've shown the same set to several others. 80% have picked the same best one, and 100% have picked the same worst one. Everyone picked the Sony as the worst of the bunch.

 

[K]

Certainly, Canon cannot please everyone as that would be impossible in a camera. But I'm not asking for much. I'm asking that they include an inexpensive, easy to implement 2nd SD card slot on what will surely be a $2,000+ camera.
Nikon D610.
Full Frame, 2 Slots, $1,500.
All the cost-savings arguments are invalidated by a simple reminder that the D610 exists.

D610 current Amazon.com sales rank: #29; Amazon.de sales rank: #38
EOS 6D current Amazon.com sales rank: #11; Amazon.de sales rank: #10

EOS 6D Amazon.com Top 100 Rated (customer satisfaction): #1
D610 Amazon.com Top 100 Rated (customer satisfaction): not in Top 100

It seems your arguments in favor of a second card slot are invalidated by the simple fact that the 6D is spanking the D610 in terms of both sales and customer satisfaction.

Illogical arguments. Non-sequitur.

It is well known fact that Canon has larger market share; thus, this factoid of yours is completely irrelevant and makes no point whatsoever.


$2,100 for a single slot camera in 2016.


$2,100 for a single slot camera in 2016.


$2,100 for a single slot camera in 2016.


Had to repeat it a few times so maybe people can come to their senses.


That's a lot of money for a one-slot camera in this era.



This is quite a basic feature. Inexpensive. Simple. Very useful. It isn't a specialty feature. It isn't only for pros working the utmost in mission-critical photography. It isn't a niche feature.

It's a dual card slot. You all know, the same kind of dual card capability available in the 5D3 and 7D2. All my arguments in favor of dual slot are not incompatible or inconsistent with anything. Whereas, those arguing against the dual slot, or diminishing them are in total contradiction with what Canon does with the 7D2 and 5D3 (and the 1DX). The anti-dual card crowd makes no sense whatsoever.

The anti-dual card slot Canon apologists ought to be demanding that Canon removes the second slot from ALL Canon cameras, as to lower the price of all bodies for this allegedly "unnecessary" feature and to bring their arguments into some kind of consistency.

1 card slot for the 5D4!

1 card slot for the 1DX2!

Let's hear it!

Let's review the reasons presented in this thread as to why Canon should never offer a 2nd card slot in a FF camera for less than $3,500 (or at all for that matter).


1. You don't need it.
2. Memory cards are extremely reliable these days and failure is almost unheard of.
3. It just adds unnecessary costs
4. Canon sells a bajillion more cameras than Nikon, so they don't have to give you a 2nd slot.
5. Adding the 2nd slot might cause people to think Canon has bad hardware.
6. If you want 2 slots, buy a pro camera - except that not even pros really need it (see reasons 1 - 5)
7. DSLR's started off with 1 slot. It was good enough in the olden days.
8. Oppose progress at all costs; be grateful for only 1 slot, for we used to have to shoot 35mm film.
9. 2 slots is for the paranoid.
10. Card failures are so rare, just reshoot when it does happen.
11. Your car could break down or a meteor hits the Earth, and you never get to the photoshoot - thus since anything in the universe could cause the photos to not happen, don't sweat missing a 2nd card slot.



LOL!

 

[Spokagrapher]

Exactly. Dunno what all this hoo ha is about dual slots on the 6D. It's a low end FF for hobbyists and enthusiasts. If you're a pro who relies on paid work then you really ought to have a 5D MkIII. Otherwise you're clearly just being a cheap-o and then complaining about lack of features. Buy the right gear for the job.

Hello Zv:

My name is Scott, and I thought I’d begin my participation in this forum by replying to your comments here.

I recently started a head shot and portrait business, though mostly on paper at the moment. Still need to do some things before I put my name out there for people to see. One of the things I did as I prepare to do business was select a camera. As a Canon shooter, I own a 60D and a 70D, neither of which I consider suitable for what I want to do. I bought a 6D … not because I’m cheap but because it’s what my budget allowed, and it works with the equipment I already own. My choices were the 7D2 or the 6D. 6D won because it’s full-frame.

I don’t look at the 6D as a hobbyist or enthusiast camera. It can very well serve professional needs. I come by this opinion by way of my experience as a news and portrait photographer in the past. I’ve used DSLRs of professional caliber, and I can say that the 6D is at least as good as, if not better, than any DSLR I used in the studio or on location. Granted, my last professional experience was in 2004, where I used the Fuji Finepix S2 Pro in the studio. That camera produced excellent results, but in some important respects it’s way behind what the 6D is today.

While the 6D may seem an unlikely choice for a pro, it offers everything I need to shoot portraits and head shots. It has great low-light capability, excellent image quality, the ergonomics I’ve come to appreciate in Canon cameras, and it’s affordable. The Sigma 24-105 Art lens I primarily use seems to work well with the 6D, and I have no problems using studio flashes with my Phottix trigger installed. My whole set up, which includes, among other things, Alien Bees flashes and PLM umbrellas, seems a nice fit with the 6D.

All in all, my early assessment of this camera is that it’s a fine camera for how I intend to use it. Because I’m an experienced photographer, I know what I need in a camera, and the 6D delivers. I’m not concerned about dual card slots, lack of an articulating touch screen, anything to do with video, and most of the other bells and whistles people complain about that the 6D doesn’t have. As DSLRs go, the 6D is a basic camera that allows me to shoot the way I’m accustomed to shooting, and it seems to be accurate and reliable. What more do I really need? That’s an important question, as my budget is very tight and will be for at least 12 to 18 months.

Even if I could afford the 5DIII, I probably wouldn’t buy one; I’d rather wait for the 5D4. The 5DS is interesting, but I’ll wait for the field and DXO reviews to come in before I decide whether I want one. If the rumored specs for the 6D2 are accurate, and if it doesn’t lose any important (for me) features that the 6D now has, I may well jump in line for one of those, rather than a 5Dxxx. I’d rather save money on a good body that does what I need it to do and have more money for lenses or other necessary equipment. That’s the advice I gave my photography students a decade ago, and it’s still good advice today.

Cheers

Scott

 

[Lee Jay]

This is quite a basic feature. Inexpensive. Simple. Very useful. It isn't a specialty feature. It isn't only for pros working the utmost in mission-critical photography. It isn't a niche feature.

I think it's all of those, and I have it in my 7DII.

It's a little less useful and a lot harder to use than you make it seem.

First, if you have images going to both cards, videos do not - they only go to one card.
Second, if you delete an image in-camera, it's only deleted from one card.
There are other problems if you remove one card from the camera and then close the door (it might change card modes), and if you run out of space on one card and not the other.

In short, it's a pretty complex thing to use and it can be used in multiple ways (raw on one, JPEG on the other, auto-switch, manual switch, simultaneous but not for videos, etc.). It's definitely not a main-stream feature for the average Rebel owner, and the 6D is more-or-less the Rebel of the full-frame camera line.

 

[Vivid Color]

K, why is "single slot" such a big issue? As far as I'm concerned, dual card slots are a throwback to the days of unreliable, low capacity memory cards. Some professionals might want dual slots when covering "no reshoot" events, but I'm OK with skipping that feature on Canon's low-cost full frame camera.

+1

 

[wsmith96]

A specification list for the EOS 6D Mark II has come about. It’s pretty much the <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/2015/04/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-cr1/" target="_blank">complete opposite of what we posted a week or so ago</a>.</p>
<ul>
<li>28MP</li>
<li>6 fps</li>
<li>ISO 100 – 102400 (expandable to 204800)</li>
<li>new AF system (but not the same as on 5DS)</li>
<li>98% viewfinder coverage</li>
<li>Single SD card slot</li>
<li>WiFi, NFC, and GPS</li>
<li>small improvements for video features</li>
</ul>

If they add the 19 point AF like that found in the 7D and an articulated screen, I'd be very interested in this camera. Add DPAF and this would be an excellent camera for the enthusiast market.

 

[lilmsmaggie]

I see nothing compelling to want to upgrade from my current 6D. I just attended a workshop in Yosemite this past weekend and of the 11 people there, only two of us were Canon shooters and both shooting the 6D. The other 6D shooter is seriously considering selling his 6D and moving to the Nikon D810.

I think canon's practice of intentionally crippling a camera is insulting to consumers but we've come to accept the incremental crumbs we're fed.

I don't need or want video capability, Wi-fi or GPS. Nice have's for those that really need and utilize those features but for some of us, just unnecessary baggage.

Give me a camera that's designed to do one thing well. Give me improved AF not necessarily as many focus points as the 5D MK III or 7D MK II but more cross-type focus points. Better weather sealing -- better DR and high ISO performance wouldn't hurt. Unlike the other 6D shooter in this weekends workshop; I don't think jumping ship and going to Nikon is the answer either.

 

[Matthew Saville]

Regarding the whole Wifi vs GPS vs dual card slots thing:

If you haven't figured it out yet, here's the cold truth...

Canon's corporate philosophy is more inclined to "the upsell" than most others. They have a long history of crippling and gimping cameras in very tactful ways. They did this with the 5D and 5D mk2 AF. Now the 5D mk3 has pro AF, but the dual card slots are gimped. (The SD card speed only, to be fair) Par for their course, they left the party-like-its-2004 diamond pattern AF configuration in the 6D.

In short, the 6D was given GPS and Wifi because that's what Canon thought *consumers* wanted. They omitted dual card slots because, like it or not, it's what Canon thought would incline *pros* to buy a more expensive camera. If you think I'm wrong that's okay, we're just speculating here, however I'd ask you this: wouldn't it have actually cost them LESS to lose the Wifi / GPS and do dual card slots instead? I suspect so.

Having said all this, most ruckus is always blown out of proportion. The 6D mk2 stands to be a pretty capable camera. It will offer some features that Nikon and other DSLRs do not, and it will lack some features that Canon thinks it can afford to do without. It will be pretty affordable, especially after it's been out for 12+ months...

=Matt=

 

[Cariboucoach]

With all these differing opinions, it seems like the only way to satisfy everyone, is to make an a la carte camera. You choose the body type, weather sealing, Mega pixels, fps, etc. The click the order button. Almost like ordering a car used to be.

Of course in the end nobody would be satisfied because the cost would be enormous. It just seems people always want more for less.

If you don't like the country you live in, move, or the car you drive, sell it and buy something else, etc.

 

[dsut4392]

If they add the 19 point AF like that found in the 7D and an articulated screen, I'd be very interested in this camera. Add DPAF and this would be an excellent camera for the enthusiast market.

I'd change the order around (articulated screen, DPAF, AF from the 7DII) but otherwise +1.

 

[Harry68]

For me the 20MP of the current 6D are ok, I don't need more, because at the and of the day, I have to store this amount to my SSD, which is not increasing that much.
6FPS is ok, but if it will be only 5FPS, it is ok for me, too.
Iso up to 100k and expandable to 200k is great. This is the feature I want to have (but only if the noise is good, too).
AF: well I'm ok with the current one, but if the new one is better, I won't say no.
98% viewfinder is one percent more than the curren one, which is ok for me.
Single SD-Card is ok, but Dual SD would be better.
Wifi and GPS is for me a needed feature, NFC is nice to have.

I hope the Mark II will be able to shoot at 1/8000s

 

[Zv]

Exactly. Dunno what all this hoo ha is about dual slots on the 6D. It's a low end FF for hobbyists and enthusiasts. If you're a pro who relies on paid work then you really ought to have a 5D MkIII. Otherwise you're clearly just being a cheap-o and then complaining about lack of features. Buy the right gear for the job.

Hello Zv:

My name is Scott, and I thought I’d begin my participation in this forum by replying to your comments here.

I recently started a head shot and portrait business, though mostly on paper at the moment. Still need to do some things before I put my name out there for people to see. One of the things I did as I prepare to do business was select a camera. As a Canon shooter, I own a 60D and a 70D, neither of which I consider suitable for what I want to do. I bought a 6D … not because I’m cheap but because it’s what my budget allowed, and it works with the equipment I already own. My choices were the 7D2 or the 6D. 6D won because it’s full-frame.

I don’t look at the 6D as a hobbyist or enthusiast camera. It can very well serve professional needs. I come by this opinion by way of my experience as a news and portrait photographer in the past. I’ve used DSLRs of professional caliber, and I can say that the 6D is at least as good as, if not better, than any DSLR I used in the studio or on location. Granted, my last professional experience was in 2004, where I used the Fuji Finepix S2 Pro in the studio. That camera produced excellent results, but in some important respects it’s way behind what the 6D is today.

While the 6D may seem an unlikely choice for a pro, it offers everything I need to shoot portraits and head shots. It has great low-light capability, excellent image quality, the ergonomics I’ve come to appreciate in Canon cameras, and it’s affordable. The Sigma 24-105 Art lens I primarily use seems to work well with the 6D, and I have no problems using studio flashes with my Phottix trigger installed. My whole set up, which includes, among other things, Alien Bees flashes and PLM umbrellas, seems a nice fit with the 6D.

All in all, my early assessment of this camera is that it’s a fine camera for how I intend to use it. Because I’m an experienced photographer, I know what I need in a camera, and the 6D delivers. I’m not concerned about dual card slots, lack of an articulating touch screen, anything to do with video, and most of the other bells and whistles people complain about that the 6D doesn’t have. As DSLRs go, the 6D is a basic camera that allows me to shoot the way I’m accustomed to shooting, and it seems to be accurate and reliable. What more do I really need? That’s an important question, as my budget is very tight and will be for at least 12 to 18 months.

Even if I could afford the 5DIII, I probably wouldn’t buy one; I’d rather wait for the 5D4. The 5DS is interesting, but I’ll wait for the field and DXO reviews to come in before I decide whether I want one. If the rumored specs for the 6D2 are accurate, and if it doesn’t lose any important (for me) features that the 6D now has, I may well jump in line for one of those, rather than a 5Dxxx. I’d rather save money on a good body that does what I need it to do and have more money for lenses or other necessary equipment. That’s the advice I gave my photography students a decade ago, and it’s still good advice today.

Cheers

Scott

Thanks for the comments I appreciate your thoughts.

You obviously enjoy using the 6D, as do I and have no complaints about it. I actually also use it for paid jobs and it has worked flawlessly. I wasn't bashing the 6D. Far from it. I was highlighting those who on the one hand want to save a few bucks yet complain non stop about a lack of features in their choice when they could (and perhaps should buy the model of camera that suits their needs better). Again not talking about you. My EOS M can take be used to take pro photos but it also only has one card slot. So what? What does that prove? It wasn't designed as a high end pro camera, neither was the 6D but some use it that way and that's great.

This K fella doesn't seem to get the point that just because the features he needs are not present in the 6D or 6DII it means Canon are somehow ripping us off. Yet we have other features like wifi and gps that the Nikon equivalent lacks. Does that then mean that Nikon is ripping of their customers too?

No, these are simply features that are or are not included. Like extra cup holders. If you don't like it buy the thing that you do like and move on.

Now let's drop this already and speculate on the 6DII's OTHER features!

Edit - Good luck to you in your new venture!

 

[Zv]

For me the 20MP of the current 6D are ok, I don't need more, because at the and of the day, I have to store this amount to my SSD, which is not increasing that much.
6FPS is ok, but if it will be only 5FPS, it is ok for me, too.
Iso up to 100k and expandable to 200k is great. This is the feature I want to have (but only if the noise is good, too).
AF: well I'm ok with the current one, but if the new one is better, I won't say no.
98% viewfinder is one percent more than the curren one, which is ok for me.
Single SD-Card is ok, but Dual SD would be better.
Wifi and GPS is for me a needed feature, NFC is nice to have.

I hope the Mark II will be able to shoot at 1/8000s

Sounds like a solid wish list. 20MP or there abouts is the sweet spot IMO. Deffo needs better AF with more cross points. I would take something similar to the 70D. 6fps would be sweet too. And bring that X-sync up to 1/200 at least.

I actually would like a tilt and swivel screen for those wierd angles and less neck pains.

I wonder if they can make it lighter? I don't need smaller though, it's already at the limit for comfortable hand holding.

Please please please can we not have to press playback button to scroll through images when in preview! Or give us a C-fn for it!

 

[Tugela]

Looks like Canon are setting up for another fail. Perhaps on the assumption if they fail often enough it will be perceived as normal and everyone will be happy with their shortchanged camera.