set your contacts to Nikon: 100-400 OK, 500PF great, 400/560 great, 800 great. What else do you need for wildlife?
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Nikon Releases Z 800mm at 1/3 Cost of Canon’s
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Unless people actually vote with their wallets and not just ‘on paper’, Canon won’t care. Nor should they.
My guess is that most people who post something like this:
…are irrelevant because they don’t have even the price of the Nikon 800/6.3, much less the price of the RF 800/5.6, to spend on camera gear.
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I not missing any shots with the Z9. It’s AF is rather spot on and we are only on its first firmware. Though there is no reason to switch in my mind, if you have existing investment just get the Nikon Z9 and Nikon lenses you need to complement your Canon stuff. Though I should add that the gold VCR side has a upcoming 200-600 and 400 f/4.0 or f/4.5 PF lens coming up.
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There will most definitely be folks voting with their wallets. We saw this with the previous 500PF and the wildlife community. This is magnified by the massive gap in pricing and the stellar specs on this lens. I’ve been ready to pull the trigger on a new RF supertele and was hoping those 400 and 600s were one-offs, but then they released similar 800 and 1200s. I don’t care if folks call me “not pro enough” because I’m complaining about pricing and lack of effort, you don’t just go rationally drop $20k on a lens just because it says Canon on it when there are better options and pricing out there. Nikon is making a fool of them right now. My $12,000 budgeted for a big white this year will be going to a Z9 and an 800PF, so that’s what voting looks like. I won’t be alone. Sad that some folks seem to think companies like Canon are too big to care and that leading the market means you don’t actually need to give a damn about your customers. That’s fine short-term, but catches up to you.
BTW, it’s frustrating not because we’re pearl clutching, but that you put so much time and energy into a system, learning it, perfecting it, and want it to succeed, but the company winds up taking advantage of the fact that you’re buying a system and they can sucker you out of more money with a lesser product because they’re betting you won’t leave. You wind up having to invest in several, which is a lot of work and money. Alas, some companies never change and that might be the lesson here.
BTW, it’s frustrating not because we’re pearl clutching, but that you put so much time and energy into a system, learning it, perfecting it, and want it to succeed, but the company winds up taking advantage of the fact that you’re buying a system and they can sucker you out of more money with a lesser product because they’re betting you won’t leave. You wind up having to invest in several, which is a lot of work and money. Alas, some companies never change and that might be the lesson here.
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If people do vote with their wallets, Canon MUST care because they'll be/ are in trouble. There are so many people thinking about getting the Z9 (or Z7) and the 800mm lense. And this will only be a starting point into the Z-mount for some of them. German camera forums are full of people (Sony and Canon) pushing the preorder button on this one...
I honestly disagree. Income for pro sports photographers (and wild-life so I hear) have gone done tremendously. This is based on statements of pro photographers at Bundesliga soccer games in my region, so it's definitely not a joke.
They have to calculate their budget more cautiously and a 10.000 $ PLUS difference you don't even have to do the math...
Oh, a lot of these people do fill the comment sections of camera forums, so I don't your statement is correct.
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Of course there will. I should’ve stated, unless enough people vote with their wallets. The ‘wildlife community’ doesn’t seem to be a large market, especially the subsegment of it that will spend >$6K on a lens.
One could similarly argue that the paparazzi community will vote with their wallets for the 1200/8.
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If the wildlife community was not such a large market, we wouldn’t see the big three scrambling to acquire them. Canon put out these supertele lenses so quickly because they know wildlife shooters, while only a subset of the market, spend a TON of money. And we don’t usually just shoot wildlife, BTW. Then you have Nikon who undercut with pricing on their Z9 and scrambled to release the 400 2.8 and this 800PF. They’re also releasing rumors of other PFs to lure wildlife shooters. Sony released their superteles early, as well, and built up a huge strategic advantage with birders and wildlife. Lump us in with the sports and paparazzi shooters if that makes you feel better, but we buy a lot of the same expensive goods and are not a small market or you wouldn’t see these companies making lenses like this and scrambling for market share with us.
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I think everyone that owns Canon and is excited about this announcement should immediately sell all their Canon gear on ebay and never look back. I'm confident there are plenty of people that would enjoy your used Canon stuff.
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Just curious, what do you currently own from Canon? Did you invest in RF like buying an R6 or R5?
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Sounds more like a cult to me. If you own one brand you can’t be excited for another brand’s product announcement, otherwise you should sell all your gear? “Loyalty at all costs,” they chanted.
Love my R5 and 100-500. I will continue getting my money’s worth from that setup. Sadly even if I wanted to buy any of the RF superteles I’m complaining about, they likely wouldn’t be in my possession yet to sell on eBay. And at that point I’m already overpriced by $4,000-$8,000 with the longer options so I’d take another big hit on the used market. I’m guessing that’s the strategy—not a lot of folks will do that so you’re just kind of screwed and stay with the system.
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You are absolutely a "grass is greener on the other side" kind of personality. Good for you. The RF system is only a couple years old and people are already complaining about their major investments. I'm tickled that you're so fickle.
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There’s zero evidence Canon is in any sort of trouble. They currently dominate the ILC market, Sony is second, Nikon is well back in third.
How many people is ‘so many’? Also, ‘thinking about getting’ something is meaningless. Car forums are full of people ‘thinking about getting’ Ferraris and Porsches. Mostly, they dream and specurbate and if they buy anything, it’s a Toyota or a Ford.
Do you think a lot of sports photographers, like those shooting soccer games, are using 800mm lenses?
Regardless, thanks for supporting my point, even though I know that wasn’t your intent. Budgets are tight and the professional photography market is suffering. That means current pro photographers, who already have gear they’re using, are much less likely to buy any expensive new lenses, whether they cost $6K or $16K. New photographers, those who would need to buy expensive lenses, are less likely to jump into a shrinking profession that’s rapidly becoming less lucrative.
Overall, that means fewer lens sales, not more.
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I guess we can’t all be as wealthy and successful as you. I’ve spent about $35k on the RF system thus far and that’s a lot of money for me. I’m self-employed in the middle of a global pandemic and make my entire living off of wildlife photography. So yeah, if you’re asking me if $13,500 extra in my pocket is greener grass, going with Nikon’s 800 over Canon’s, I’d say yes…call me crazy. I’d argue the blind loyalty is more expensive.
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That's a very good point. It really depends on how deeply someone is tied to a system, and on how high a percentage of their shots would benefit from the "latest" lens or body from an alternative brand. It also depends a great deal on how wealthy the photographer is, and on whether or not they are happy to relearn muscle memory. Another consideration is how urgent is the need/desire for better gear.
In 18 months time, it's *possible* that Canon might have a similar (or better) lens, and it's *possible* but highly unlikely IMO that they'd match the Nikon for price, especially as the price of the Nikon will have dropped considerably by then. Also, while the Z 800/6.3 will have limited ability for a while, the same is also likely to be true if/when Canon launch a similar lens.
What I'll say is this: If the bulk of my photography was birds, I'd definitely get a Z9 and the Nikon 800/6.3, in fact I'd put in a pre-order instantly.
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