now this is what Canon should have started ten years ago

[zim]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYXwCGWb7Yg&spfreload=10

This BH photo/video is about the Sony a6000.
It is scary.
Sony is going to eat up the Canonists who have not been brainwashed as such as yet.
When I was talking about the UI (user interface) this is what I meant.
Sony is almost there but not quite yet. Close enough, though. I will shoot with the EF lenses with an adapter.
AF, AE with adapters...or...maybe I just get rid of the heavy glass.

An eye-opening video.

Congrats on your new purchase
Have fun and enjoy

Regards

 

[martti]

Thank you, Zim.
I'll be posting about my experience once the thing arrives.
Happy New Year!

 

[Eldar]

I think the current development within mirror-less cameras is very interesting and I´m sure we will see great innovative products coming in the near future. At the moment though, I am not tempted.

I think mirror-less is a good idea and I can see many conceptual benefits of using one. But when this mirror-less system sits in a body which feels like a total misfit in my hands, such as the A6000 and A7/7r/7s, with controls that has immense improvement potential and with an electronic viewfinder at least one generation away from being an alternative to an optical viewfinder, I am less tempted. Add lack of available lenses and poor battery life, it ends up in the not-interested-basket with me.

I do however see that, with a bit more work on the EVF, improved power consumption (or better batteries) and improved ergonomics, we should see very exciting products being released in the future.

 

[Keith_Reeder]

I'll be posting about my experience once the thing arrives.

And we'll be pointing out that everything about the images you end up with could have been achieved just as easily with any of the current crop of Canons...

 

[Keith_Reeder]

Please, people, ignore these constant threads advertising other camera makers. Yes, Sony, Nikon, Samsung _____ (fill in the blank), all make very good cameras. We know already.

I have no problem at all with the idea of people posting about third party cameras in the relevant section of the site.

It's this ridiculous "Canon is doomed!" hyperbole, whenever a given third party body has some particular characteristic that happens to appeal to the author, and which might be lacking from Canon's offerings, which is just so bloody tedious...

 

[Keith_Reeder]

this is turning into a religious kind of an argument so I leave it here.

Which would have been entirely avoided if you hadn't come out with histrionic flamebait like:

Sony is going to eat up the Canonists who have not been brainwashed as such as yet.

 

[meywd]

this is turning into a religious kind of an argument so I leave it here.

Which would have been entirely avoided if you hadn't come out with histrionic flamebait like:

Sony is going to eat up the Canonists who have not been brainwashed as such as yet.

+1

 

[martti]

;D 'histrionic flamebait'

 

[Sabaki]

When is the best time to plant a tree?

Twenty years ago. The second best time is now.

When is the best time to plant a tree?

PrivateByDesign has the answer to this in his signature

lol Was told this yeeeeeears ago by mi familia

 

[EchoLocation]

I'm a big music fan and archived a bunch of concerts on the highest quality cd's I could buy about ten years ago...sony
I made double copies and kept the second copies in jewel cases in a box in a cool, dry closet. I never played them, or touched them.
ten years later, almost half of them have lost their sony paint on the top side and are now basically clear, and totally unplayable.
don't believe that cd's, dvd's or blu ray will last 100 years. that is 100% BS.
I now have triple backups of everything on different portable hard drives.

 

[weixing]

"He seemed to make a big deal about face tracking and a $7k camera not having that, but if you use a face tracking feature for your autofocus you probably are not skilled enough to be using a $7k camera in the first place."

Of course all the skills you have thus far acquired are instantly forgotten the moment you use face tracking or eye focusing of this devilish new technology. You should not ever even try them. You might have to change your opinions and Serious Photographers do not do that...this is turning into a religious kind of an argument so I leave it here.

Hi,
Hmm... I thought face tracking is very common is compact camera, so just wonder why it become so "exciting and wonderful" when it implement in a Sony camera?? By the way, that's a very long video, so I just browse through, but I did saw the face tracking start to track the picture on someone shirts instead on the subject face. So I think I rather manually point my "old tech" AF points on my subject face... at least I'm quite sure it'll focus on my subject face instead on the picture on someone shirts.

Have a nice day, happy shooting and Happy New Year to ALL!!.

 

[AshtonNekolah]

"He seemed to make a big deal about face tracking and a $7k camera not having that, but if you use a face tracking feature for your autofocus you probably are not skilled enough to be using a $7k camera in the first place."

Of course all the skills you have thus far acquired are instantly forgotten the moment you use face tracking or eye focusing of this devilish new technology. You should not ever even try them. You might have to change your opinions and Serious Photographers do not do that...this is turning into a religious kind of an argument so I leave it here.

haha right on. ;D

 

[dgatwood]

What part of it was so amazing? Most of these innovations seem to apply to entry level consumers and those not knowledgable about cameras. He seemed to make a big deal about face tracking and a $7k camera not having that, but if you use a face tracking feature for your autofocus you probably are not skilled enough to be using a $7k camera in the first place.

Nonsense. That's a non sequitur. It's like saying that for people who use automatic transmissions are not skilled enough to drive stick, or saying that people who use automatic focus or any of the semi-automatic Av/Tv/* modes are incapable of using a manual iris or manual focus lens.

People use different tools under different circumstances and for different reasons. Face detection AF is great in live view modes, because manual focusing is harder on an LCD screen. It's also great for video, assuming you're using AF at all, because it makes AF a lot more usable.

For example, I have a 44M that I use for portraits on occasion, and I often end up in full manual mode when shooting anything on a black stage (concerts, plays, etc.) to avoid blown-out faces. But when I'm walking around with a tour group, dealing with wildly alternating amounts of light, I'd miss a lot of great shots if I were trying to manage all of those extra variables. In those situations, I'd estimate that 99% of my shots are done in P mode, with autofocus, and with automatic ISO. The nearly fully automatic setting does a good enough job in most typical circumstances (sometimes a little overexposed or underexposed, but not enough to ruin the shot), freeing me to focus on more important things, like choosing a good shot angle, nailing the timing of the shot to get good facial expressions, and all the other myriad things I'm thinking about in the background. And this is how I come home from a two-week trip with 6,000 photos, with only a single-digit number of shots that are bad enough to throw away.

Would I use face detection? Maybe sometimes, so long as it is a quick knob twist between that and traditional focusing modes, and so long as they also add an in-viewfinder indicator to tell me what shooting mode I'm in. Then again, I guess it would be obvious, because that mode would switch over to an EVF, and none of the other modes would, so....

A trained experienced cameraman will put an evf to his eye and his fingers will turns the lens the right way enough automatically.

Or, if he or she is used to that other camera system, an experienced cameraperson will automatically turn it the right amount in the wrong direction every time....

 

[Tinky]

A trained experienced cameraman will put an evf to his eye and his fingers will turns the lens the right way enough automatically.

Or, if he or she is used to that other camera system, an experienced cameraperson will automatically turn it the right amount in the wrong direction every time....

Traditionally, certainly not, there was uniformity in design between Fujinon & Canon ENG lenses, and certainly between bodies, be they grass valley, sony, ikegami, panasonic. A stringer getting a lot of work from say the bbc would probably buy a betacamsx or digibeta, and itn stringer would probably buy a dvcpro, but the majority of camera ops would use different cameras on different jobs, so the core finctions coukd all be accessed through external switchgear, and other than some differences in the filter wheels (some were split by colour and nd, others were on the same wheel) things like setting wb, audio channels, knee circuits, gain etc were all exactly the same.

I have to say, and this is a gross generalisation but I'll stand by it, I've never met a pro video user using a nikon body ever. I've met plenty of nikon users who would adapt their f lenses to a 5d, but I have never met anybody using a nikon body (they were fixed at 24p and had auto exposure and no audio controls up until relatively recently)

In the dslr realm I do use third party lenses, and yes some turn canon some turn anti-canon, but with regular use you remember which is which without having to check, and mistakes are usually quickly detected on large sensor cameras.
In my own shooting style I like to use subject motion to accentuate depth of field, so prefocus on a desirable point then let the subject move through it, if I'm shooting moving camera to moving subject I will tend to be closer, wider and use zone focusing.

One great thing with video us that with 1/50th and iso 100, even at civilian twilight, you actually have lots and lots of aperture to play with. If I need greater depth of field I'll just use a weaker or no nd filter and stop down.

If I was long lensing and tracking, say at a sports event, then I'd more likely be on a pedastol ISO camera with powered long throw zoom servo and electronic follow focus.

 

[dgatwood]

A trained experienced cameraman will put an evf to his eye and his fingers will turns the lens the right way enough automatically.

Or, if he or she is used to that other camera system, an experienced cameraperson will automatically turn it the right amount in the wrong direction every time....

Traditionally, certainly not, there was uniformity in design between Fujinon & Canon ENG lenses, and certainly between bodies, be they grass valley, sony, ikegami, panasonic.

I realize that. I was just using it as an opportunity to take a cheap shot at Nikon.

I have to say, and this is a gross generalisation but I'll stand by it, I've never met a pro video user using a nikon body ever.

Me either. Then again, I've never met a pope, but I know that at least two of them exist. The same principle applies (and probably with similar numbers).

 

[jeffa4444]

We own a professional lighting and camera rental business for stills and lower end pro-video.
We carry Canon, Nikon, Leica (S2), Hasselblad for stills / video and Canon C300 / C 500 for video as well as Black Magic. Never had any requests for Sony DSLRs or their lenses. Sony make great video cameras in our main rental business we have Sony F55s, F5s etc. but the glass is Cooke, Zeiss, Leica, Angenieux etc.

No question sensor design wise Sony are currently the kings, just ask Nikon, Pentax, Olympus, Hasselblad, Phase One and even Canon. But Sony over complicate cameras they cannot help themselves they forget they are a lightbox or a computer with an imager, the lenses are more important and they cannot compete with Canon or Nikon in this area, yet.

 

[martti]

A very good point about the Sony lenses. There is nothing much we can say for them except that they have developed the chip that corrects the optical shortcomings to a very high level. They are good in electronics so an optical problem gets treated with electronics. It seems as if their success has taken them by surpise. The only clear idea of their customers seems to be that they (we) already have a selection of adaptable quality lenses so that they are in no hurry to produce them by themselves. And that we are probably well versed in different brands of cameras and computers so that there is no need for a manual. Somebody will write one and there will be videos on YouTube. Which is true.

Sony does have an 11% stake in Tamron. They bought the Minolta camera department which had already fused with Konica. Both brands were known for their high quality optics at the time. Zeiss designs the Touit product line. The lenses are assembled in Japan to very high standards but unfortunately at unacceptably high prices. The E-mount 32mm (50mm f/1.8 equivalent) costs 580 dollars. That is pretty steep for an APS-C normal lens. The 16-70 f/4 stabilized zoom costs as much as the 24-70 f/4 Canon EF. Hopefully, the co-operation with Tamron will eventually bring a solution to this problem.

 

[wickidwombat]

my dad got the a6000 when it came out with the top end ziess zoom 16-70 f4 or something like that
its an ok camera but i was playing with it side by side while using my eos-m and 11-22

the things i noticed are

the a6000 AF is not very accurate while it's burst rate blows the doors off the eos m the M is much more accurate and consistant for actually getting stuff in focus even in servo...

jpg files out of camera on the a6000 are horrible (not sure if they fixed this with firmware) raws are fine though

low iso (iso 100) shadow recovery on the a6000 raw files are just sooo much better than the m can do
handy if you under expose by 5 stops on a regular basis....
high iso performance is basically a wash iso 3200 and 6400 theres nothing in it between these 2

bag space, you can fit 2 eos m bodies in the same space the a6000 takes

not having a touch screen on the a6000 was annoying since i was used to the M and kept trying to touch the screen to change stuff on the a6000

overall the build on the a6000 is not too bad its a decent camera but overall I still prefered the EOS-M to it

 

[martti]

My Little Sony is getting here through DHL. Very typically, there are no events recorded once the item entered the Paris CDG airport. The French detestent everything coming from foreign countries, especially Asia. When they detestent they ignorent. Also, this is the only country in the world where the customs officers cannot read any English, not even numbers.

 

[Maiaibing]

if you use a face tracking feature for your autofocus you probably are not skilled enough to be using a $7k camera in the first place.

I remember when Canon said that autofocus had no interest at all as "their" photographers would never rely on such a feature. After Minolta started selling more SLRs than Nikon and Canon combined Canon somehow changed their mind...

Personally, I would love such a feature on my next DSLR.