Preorder: Canon EOS R5, Canon EOS R6 and new lenses

BakaBokeh

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I'm just a bit ignorant about the demand for 8k I guess. I mean do we even have computers that we can process that much data on? Or screens to view it on? I would think 4k would be sufficient for most customers? And if they demand 4k recordings for an entire event then you'd likely not be looking at a camera system like this anyway?

Proxies is your friend.

I can't speak for everyone, but I don't plan to publish to 8K for the foreseeable future. What I would do, is shoot 8K if the situation calls for it. I did not like the EOS R's 4K crop, but would use it as a tool if I needed extra reach. It was like an easy zooming solution because it had both crop and extra resolution which you could punch in even more if publishing in FHD.

One such use case for 8K is filming a band or performance on stage. As long as it isn't too long of a performance, you could put the R5 on a tripod and fit the entire stage. You could even include the audience as well. In post, you could have an establishing shot using the entire field of view. You could have an establishing shot of just the stage. The magical part would be zooming into the players or performers with no loss of resolution so it could look like a telephoto shot. And you could incorporate all the dynamic panning and zooming so when you complete an edit, you could make it appear as if you had multiple cameras recording a single performance. Obviously, you wouldn't get the telephoto effect of a telephoto lens, or the parallax effect from tilting/panning, but those would be lost on the untrained eye. It's that flexibility that gets me excited about 8K.
 
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Sep 3, 2018
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I agree. But pushing the video specs so boldly led me to believe Canon came up with some solution to handle this either via heat pipes or perhaps a vapor chamber. 10 mins of cooling gets another 3 mins of shooting in 8K. That gives you an idea on what not having any cooling solution leads too...

I absolutely cannot have the camera shut down on me in the middle of certain types of shoot. I'm sure others are in the same boat. While I have the same 29:59 limits on my A7III/RIII and A9 (which I don't shoot much video on), I have done 60mins (2 segments) of speeches in the evening after shooting 2 hours of pre-event b-roll without even seeing the overheat warning.

Maybe Canon will come up with something in a firmware to help with this after the camera is released.
Is this not just a case of wrong tool for the job and that requirement sounds like a job for the R6 rather than the R5?

What the R5 is delivering is resolution be that 8K or that rather sexy sounding down sampled 4K and 4K 120. The sample footage so far looks amazing all from this tiny camera.
 
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Michael Clark

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20 FPS in electronic shutter live view only like the 1DX. Also electronic shutter not in live view is not completely silent. Peter McKinnon has video posted on YouTube. No idea yet of rolling shutter or banding with LED of CFL lighting which only Sony A9 can handle.

Are you talking stills or video for light flicker?
 
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Michael Clark

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True, by design more critical on the wide side. But, again, I would be very surprised if that extending design would come without noticeable vignetting.

It's not like they have to design it to work when compacted. It's not a zoom, it just compacts for storage.
 
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Michael Clark

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Im not one of the ones that will blindly without non bias reviews buy this camera, which you'll start seeing them pop up soon on Youtube from the regulars. Only then will I order this camera and decide whether its actually worth it.

You can always cancel a preorder before it ships. In this case you'll have about three weeks to decide. Not that it makes any difference now, as you'd be near the bottom of the list.
 
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Sep 1, 2016
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Proxies is your friend.


One such use case for 8K is filming a band or performance on stage. As long as it isn't too long of a performance, you could put the R5 on a tripod and fit the entire stage. You could even include the audience as well. In post, you could have an establishing shot using the entire field of view. You could have an establishing shot of just the stage. The magical part would be zooming into the players or performers with no loss of resolution so it could look like a telephoto shot. And you could incorporate all the dynamic panning and zooming so when you complete an edit, you could make it appear as if you had multiple cameras recording a single performance. Obviously, you wouldn't get the telephoto effect of a telephoto lens, or the parallax effect from tilting/panning, but those would be lost on the untrained eye. It's that flexibility that gets me excited about 8K.

Maybe the reality distortion field worked on me too well, but 8k so I can shoot a key moment, pull a 35mpx image out of, *and* downsample to 4k for video is potentially a killer app. Want to see how it works practically first.
 
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Proxies is your friend.

I can't speak for everyone, but I don't plan to publish to 8K for the foreseeable future. What I would do, is shoot 8K if the situation calls for it. I did not like the EOS R's 4K crop, but would use it as a tool if I needed extra reach. It was like an easy zooming solution because it had both crop and extra resolution which you could punch in even more if publishing in FHD.

One such use case for 8K is filming a band or performance on stage. As long as it isn't too long of a performance, you could put the R5 on a tripod and fit the entire stage. You could even include the audience as well. In post, you could have an establishing shot using the entire field of view. You could have an establishing shot of just the stage. The magical part would be zooming into the players or performers with no loss of resolution so it could look like a telephoto shot. And you could incorporate all the dynamic panning and zooming so when you complete an edit, you could make it appear as if you had multiple cameras recording a single performance. Obviously, you wouldn't get the telephoto effect of a telephoto lens, or the parallax effect from tilting/panning, but those would be lost on the untrained eye. It's that flexibility that gets me excited about 8K.

Cropping gives the same effect as having a longer lens. I don't want to turn this into a back-and-forth sideshow, but use Google to pull up some expert write-ups about this online.
 
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Michael Clark

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Unemployment in the US is higher than it's ever been since the great depression. I think the number of people ready to drop 4 grand on a camera is a little lower than it would normally be right now.

Most of the increased unemployment is for those with lower paying jobs. Not many folks working those jobs would be able to afford a $4K camera even in a boom economy.
 
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Apr 25, 2011
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Maybe the reality distortion field worked on me too well, but 8k so I can shoot a key moment, pull a 35mpx image out of, *and* downsample to 4k for video is potentially a killer app. Want to see how it works practically first.
Likely not well. While it's technically possible, you would want 180 degree shutter for video, but much higher shutter speed for stills, unless you want to capture a moment when your subject temporarily freezes.
 
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AlanF

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As has been said, this has been discussed to death but here is a quick breakdown.
1/ VAT 20%
2/ Import duty 5%
3/ EU/UK enforced warranty obligations. For example I believe most EU countries have a 24 month warranty, the USA get 12 months, this is a real thing that costs Canon Europe money Canon USA doesn't have to spend.
4/ Economies of scale.

So take a price of $3,899, put 5% duty on that, $4094; put 20% VAT on that because VAT gets charged on the duty too, $4,913; throw in an extra 12month warranty for a total of $5013. Or £3,972. Now adjust for the economies of scale because the USA market is a lot bigger than the UK market so it is a lot more efficient and you are barking up the wrong tree. Get over it or get on a plane and get one from B&H, it will cost you $3,899 plus sales tax, or $4,245. You can claim the sales tax back but you are then liable to pay the UK duty and VAT and you are still out the price of the flight and accommodation and should you need warranty work you will probably have to ship it back to the USA.
There is no import duty for digital cameras into the UK, just 20% VAT. There is 6.7% import duty + 20% VAT on lenses (0 if on the camera. Details for thoise importing:
Lenses - tariff code 9002 11 00 90 duty rate 6.7%
Digital still cameras (e.g. DSLR's) including if equipped with a lens - tariff code 8525 80 30 00 duty rate 0%
 
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Nov 12, 2016
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Most of the increased unemployment is for those with lower paying jobs. Not many folks working those jobs would be able to afford a $4K camera even in a boom economy.
I already went through this in two other posts. Yes, people in lower paying jobs aren't buying a $4k camera, but some of them are the ones that would hire a photographer for various reasons who would buy a $4k camera.

And if they aren't making money, the photographer isn't getting hired for jobs. Everything is interconnected.
 
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Michael Clark

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I would be shocked if there weren't at least some professionals that might have otherwise bought this new camera, but facing a dry spell of work, are deciding to hold off on new equipment purchases.

There are probably many, but they are no longer the primary buyers of Canon's high end gear.

The full-time professional photographer no longer drives Canon's product cycles and marketing for their high end bodies and lenses, with the possible exception of the 1-Series, and the ratios between full-time pros and well heeled enthusiasts/part timers buying 1-series cameras has also shifted, though not as radically as with the rest of Canon's product line.

The number of full-time pros working in staff positions for media companies that will automatically buy the newest gear for at least some of their staffers is nowhere near what it was a few years ago. In the past the vast majority of full-time working pros were photojournalists in staff positions. Now most of the few full-time PJs that remain are freelancers working for pennies on the dollar compared to their old staff jobs. They can't afford to replace anything until it breaks beyond repair. There weren't near as many commercial, ad, and other types of full time shooters as PJs back in the day, and those numbers aren't going up now, either.

The high end camera market is increasingly being guided by what well heeled enthusiasts and "weekend warriors" shooting events, weddings, and even high level pro sports want and can afford.
 
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Michael Clark

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I already went through this in two other posts. Yes, people in lower paying jobs aren't buying a $4k camera, but some of them are the ones that would hire a photographer for various reasons who would buy a $4k camera.

And if they aren't making money, the photographer isn't getting hired for jobs. Everything is interconnected.

People working sub-$30K per year jobs are not the one hiring pros very often, either.
 
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There is no import duty for digital cameras into the UK, just 20% VAT. There is 6.7% import duty + 20% VAT on lenses (0 if on the camera. Details for thoise importing:
Lenses - tariff code 9002 11 00 90 duty rate 6.7%
Digital still cameras (e.g. DSLR's) including if equipped with a lens - tariff code 8525 80 30 00 duty rate 0%
I read the same code but different tariff, my info was probably old though as I just checked here https://www.trade-tariff.service.gov.uk/commodities/8525803000?currency=EUR interesting that film cameras do still have duty!
 
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Michael Clark

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I wouldn’t necessarily disagree but I would also like to see a Venn diagram of ’professional’ user vs amateur user historical purchasing.

One circle is a LOT smaller than it used to be, and it isn't the one for the amateurs/enthusiasts/"weekend warriors".
 
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People working sub-$30K per year jobs are not the one hiring pros very often, either.
Ok fine... The people working the sub-$30K jobs will not shop as much at the business owned by the person who would be hiring a photographer for their wedding, family reunion, whatever.

Any way you slice it, less money moving through the economy means less people ultimately shelling out for a new camera.
 
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BakaBokeh

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Cropping gives the same effect as having a longer lens. I don't want to turn this into a back-and-forth sideshow, but use Google to pull up some expert write-ups about this online.
I thought about it, and you are right... I don't want this to go back-and-forth. I'm just gonna agree with you. (y)
 
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