Preproduction EOS 7D Mark II Cameras in Brazil for World Cup

It will certainly have a new generation sensor with DPAF. Canon wouldn't dare release their newest "semi-pro" body with a rehashed version of the driven-into-the-ground 18MP hanger on. The question, of coarse, is what improvements will the new design bring to the table. Killer frame rate and AF system is a given...
 
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Canon 14-24 said:
If I recall, the main selling point of the 7D when it was released was it's superior redesigned AF system and FPS over the XXD. Here was a solution to those in the prosumer segment that couldn't afford a 1D series to afford a better AF system and were complaining about the old 9 point AF system. It was definitely a more action/sports/wildlife kinda camera. Right now, I would say Canon's AF offerings are on-par - so really is a 7d mark II even needed?

My question is what "big" photography related improvements could they do to an already fine piece of equipment

I don't want to sound cynical, but I hope the 7DII isn't just a 70D with the 'top end' ergonomics, just as the xxD line had up until the 60 and 70D combined a rebel interface with the larger body.

A little faster, gain a proper rear wheel + joystick, maybe lose the pop up flash.....
 
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Sporgon said:
Canon 14-24 said:
If I recall, the main selling point of the 7D when it was released was it's superior redesigned AF system and FPS over the XXD. Here was a solution to those in the prosumer segment that couldn't afford a 1D series to afford a better AF system and were complaining about the old 9 point AF system. It was definitely a more action/sports/wildlife kinda camera. Right now, I would say Canon's AF offerings are on-par - so really is a 7d mark II even needed?

My question is what "big" photography related improvements could they do to an already fine piece of equipment

I don't want to sound cynical, but I hope the 7DII isn't just a 70D with the 'top end' ergonomics, just as the xxD line had up until the 60 and 70D combined a rebel interface with the larger body.

A little faster, gain a proper rear wheel + joystick, maybe lose the pop up flash.....

I don't know about losing the popup flash. That has always had the ability to remotely control other Canon flashes. You don't actually have to flash the popup, but you can use the IR comm. capabilities to trigger other off-camera flashes. That's a nice, pro-level feature. I would expect the 7D II to still have a flash, but have on capable of communicating with Canon's new radio line of flashes.

I expect the 7D II to also get a higher frame rate than the 5D III, at least 8fps if not 10fps, and I also expect it to get an improved AF system worthy of Canon's current pro line. I'm not sure the 61pt AF system will fit and APS-C frame, and I'm not sure it can be scaled to work with an APS-C frame. I do hope for something along the linesof a 41pt system, though.

It's been rumored before on multiple occasions, so I also expect the 7D II to have a lot of video feature enhancements. The video on the 7D is pretty lackluster. I don't quite know if the new video features will be 7DC level, but they should be of a higher level of quality and capability than any other models except the 5D III, and still maybe better than that.
 
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jrista said:
It's been rumored before on multiple occasions, so I also expect the 7D II to have a lot of video feature enhancements. The video on the 7D is pretty lackluster. I don't quite know if the new video features will be 7DC level, but they should be of a higher level of quality and capability than any other models except the 5D III, and still maybe better than that.

Yep I suspect it's going to marketed with video features, however still photography wise...I don't see these marginal upgrades such as +1-2 fps (from 8fps) being upgrade worthy though?

It's a prosumer ergonomic design+materials (solid top component over entire plastic) + the AF system that are the sell over the xxD and rebel lines.
 
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Personally, I think the 7D Mark II will be an awesome camera, much better than any other APS-C camera. But let me qualify that opinion.

I expect it's low light/noise performance to be considerably better than the aging 7D -- but only slightly better (or on par) with the 70D's. I don't expect it to come anywhere near any of the full-frame or APS-H cameras in that regard. It'd be NICE if it did, but anyone who's holding out for a major improvement in low light should really just pony up for a 5D Mark III (or a 6D if they don't need fast action type photography). Or a 1DX if they can afford it (or a second-hand 1D Mark IV).

Where I do expect a huge improvement is in performance for wildlife, sports and action shooting. In particular, burst rate, buffer and AI Servo AF improvements are going to be the main items for this camera.

I think we can expect a much better frame rate of at least 10fps and possibly even the rumoured 12. In addition, I think we can expect to see a large buffer to take advantage of that frame rate. Expect it to at least match the post firmware 24 RAW buffer of the current 7D, but I expect it to do even better--possibly 30-35 RAW shots. Indeed, that would be almost a MUST have with the increased frame rate. I'd like to see the 12fps, but 10fps would certainly be a worthy improvement over the current 7D's 8fps or the 70D's 7fps. To those who don't think there's much of a difference between 8fps and 10fps, those extra 2 frames can make the difference between capturing the entire bird just as it leaves the branch, and getting a decapitated shot with just the wings and feet! And 12fps would be even better! Not to mention capturing much more of a stunning sequence, such as a canon shot or explosion at a War of 1812 re-enactment, or any number of other scenarios.

The area where APS-C cameras really need improvement is in AF. The 19 point AF system of the 7D is a pretty awesome piece of tech, but it misses too often compared to the AF systems of the 5D Mark III and 1DX, or even the 1D Mark IV. The 70D has gotten an improved version of the 7D's 19 point AF of course that is reputed to be more reliable than the 7D's system and that's fine for the xxD line, but the 7D Mark II needs a FIRST CLASS AF system to justify its premium price. Earlier rumours suggested it would get a variation on the 61 Point AF system of the 5D3/1DX and later ones suggested a revolutionary new AF that would be shared with a new 1 series camera. Either of those options work for me! The main thing it NEEDS is superior Servo tracking of moving targets, the same way the 5D3 and 1DX do. The current 7D struggles too often with moving targets like birds, even when you hold the active AF point on target.

I love my 7D, but I'm REALLY excited on the expected/rumoured improvements we can expect from this camera. I don't think it will just be some warmed over 70D with different ergonomics. That would be an epic failure if Canon did that after so much anticipation. I also expect it will have a DPAF (probably 24MP) and enhanced video, which is all good. It will have cleaner output than the 7D, but probably on par or moderately better than the 70D. Where it will mostly shine is in world-class speed and AF capabilities.

Time will tell!
 
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only thing that would make me buy/want a 7D MK2 is same/better image quality as sonys sensors.

less grain, better DR, less shadow noise, less banding in shadows.

when it´s a video beefed up 7D with a better AF but same image quality... i have no real use for it.

not that the 7D IQ is that bad... but i am not willing to spend that money in 2014 for basically 700D image quality.

canon has to make a real jump in APS-C IQ to get me interested in APS-C again.
 
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Canon 14-24 said:
jrista said:
It's been rumored before on multiple occasions, so I also expect the 7D II to have a lot of video feature enhancements. The video on the 7D is pretty lackluster. I don't quite know if the new video features will be 7DC level, but they should be of a higher level of quality and capability than any other models except the 5D III, and still maybe better than that.

Yep I suspect it's going to marketed with video features, however still photography wise...I don't see these marginal upgrades such as +1-2 fps (from 8fps) being upgrade worthy though?

It's a prosumer ergonomic design+materials (solid top component over entire plastic) + the AF system that are the sell over the xxD and rebel lines.

What you call "marginal" is actually a 25% improvement (I don't see it being 9fps, it'll probably be 10fps). A 25% improvement in anything is far more than marginal. Besides, the next step up would be 12fps, and I really don't see Canon pushing that kind of frame rate from the 1D X down to the 7D II, regardless of how the two cameras are classified. A 41pt AF system with the same kind of performance/precision/accuracy of the 61pt AF system would be a MASSIVE improvement over the 19pt AF system, so that's certainly not marginal. You also get more custom functions and configurable options with the 7D line than xxD and lower lines, along with C1-3 user configurable dial options. There is also the very strong likelihood it will get dual memory cards (I TRULY hope for dual CF/CFast2, but I suspect the 7D II will be gimped just like the 5D III with a CF and SD slot...in which case the feature is largely useless.)

There is also the high likelihood it will be getting a new sensor (I think it is extremely remote that it would get the 18mp or even the 20mp APS-C sensors...Canon KNOWS they have to really break new ground with the 7D II).

These are all benefits that lower cameras don't get (although the 70D does have one single configurable C user mode dial option). It isn't just one feature or another, it's the complex of features packaged into a single camera. Same deal as with the 5D III...people cherry pick one feature or another to talk about, and no single feature of the 5D III is particularly significant over the 5D II (with the exception of the AF system)...but the camera as a whole, all the features of the 5D III put together, make it a VERY radical upgrade. I think the 7D II will be the same kind of release.
 
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jrista said:
There is also the high likelihood it will be getting a new sensor (I think it is extremely remote that it would get the 18mp or even the 20mp APS-C sensors...Canon KNOWS they have to really break new ground with the 7D II).

not to spit into your coffee.. but i thought that about kodak for a decade.
and nothing happend.
 
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I'm wondering if what CW reported in Dec 2013 of Canon working on one of their most significant changes in some time and the past rumours of a professional Mirrorless camera with a EVF could infact be this 7D follow-up...

I could genuinely see that happening - could certainly speed up the FPS to that of some phone and P&S cameras and utilise that 80-ish-percent on-sensor coverage for DPAF plus Viewfinder shooting! ;)

I could still also see this banging out 12-14 fps as a dSLR, complete with grip, like a further-cropped 1D, to get back the more-reach sports and wildlife shooters with a real pro crop cam!
70D's hopped back to being more professional, 7D's going 1D @ 1.6... Perhaps?!
 
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I could see them updating the existing 45p AF system of the earlier 1D's and integrating it here, but I had read an article earlier regarding the future of DPAP that suggested that we would be seeing significant improvements in that technology. IF that is the case for this rumored camera, it wouldn't be that far fetched to see a camera with high FPS as an optical view finder would not necessarily be needed anymore. I do not have a 70D, but can someone comment on using live view to track moving people? I would think it would be a sports photographer's dream to use live view, touch the screen on the player they want to track, then let the camera keep them in focus as they play while clicking away.

I'm probably speaking crazy talk, but I think that would be awesome.
 
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wsmith96 said:
I could see them updating the existing 45p AF system of the earlier 1D's and integrating it here, but I had read an article earlier regarding the future of DPAP that suggested that we would be seeing significant improvements in that technology. IF that is the case for this rumored camera, it wouldn't be that far fetched to see a camera with high FPS as an optical view finder would not necessarily be needed anymore. I do not have a 70D, but can someone comment on using live view to track moving people? I would think it would be a sports photographer's dream to use live view, touch the screen on the player they want to track, then let the camera keep them in focus as they play while clicking away.

I'm probably speaking crazy talk, but I think that would be awesome.
Being as I have a p/s camera that can not only track people, but recognize which person and tag the photo with their name, I think you are bang on the target.
 
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pierlux said:
Agreed. After 5 years it has to be something exciting. The same has happened with the 1Ds3/1D4 to 1Dx and 5D2 to 5D3 transitions, both noteworthy improvements. A 5-year interval between releases was a loooong time even during the film age.
The EOS-1 ran from 1989 to 1994 (5 years) followed by the EOS1-n which ran till 2000 (6 years) followed by the EOS 1-V which I believe you can still buy (14 years). The venerable Canon A1 ran from 1978-1985. The legendary EOS-3 had a huge lifespan, 1998-2007.

As the dust has settled after the initial decade of the digital revolution, we'll continue to see just incremental improvements and longer lives between updates. Personally I find this both refreshing and irrationally irritating.

-pw
 
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Rowbear said:
How about a return to the APS-H size sensor for the 7D Mk II ?
Not going to happen!

An APS-H camera can not use any of the APS-C lenses, does not have the "reach" of APS-C, and does not have the low light capabilities or IQ of FF. You get the disadvantages of both with none of the advantages of either.

You would be better off with a FF camera.

APS-H came about when FF sensors were hard to manufacture and expensive. Now, the cost difference would be minimal. The real question should be how long will APS-C last in DSLRs....
 
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