Quad-Pixel AF and a global shutter coming in 2021?

dolina

millennial
Dec 27, 2011
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But, you would still be watching that video on a smart phone display, where no one can tell it was shot in 8K. Plus, in 25 years you will be divorced and the last thing your new wife would want to look at would be your wedding video with wife #1.
Divorce is illegal where I live. ;) May not even occur a quarter century from now because of how backward people here are.

I watch YouTube and other videos on my 65". By 2026 I'm scheduling to get 8K microLED display.
 
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David - Sydney

EOS RP
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Dec 7, 2014
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But, you would still be watching that video on a smart phone display, where no one can tell it was shot in 8K. Plus, in 25 years you will be divorced and the last thing your new wife would want to look at would be your wedding video with wife #1.
Ouch! As someone who recently celebrated our 30th wedding anniversary, I beg to differ!
Our wedding was videoed at 480i (I think) and the quality is really poor but we still have it.
I recorded our daughter's wedding 4 years ago on my iphone on a tripod with a mic (separate to the professional video/stills) in 4k. Very big file but the quality is great and the phone didn't overheat after 90 minutes.
To forecast how we will watch a video taken today in 25 years' time is a bit ambitious. Humans are really bad at comprehending exponential growth. Perhaps AI will clean it all up and bring it to standard future quality irrespective of how it was recorded.
 

Codebunny

Elil
Sep 5, 2018
776
787
Scotland
Not sure about "trusted". Dual processors is standard for 1DX models in the past. My understanding is that (and correct me if I am wrong) most pro sports are sending jpg and not raw so the oversampling could be compared to the jpg engine.
I agree that a flippy screen wouldn't balance a 400mm/2.8 but the 1DX have always had leading video and a flippy screen is important for video. You can always fold it in if you don't use it as I do with the R5 for indoor events. Video will become more and more important over time.
Wildlife shooting is not always standing up so using a flippy screen for more comfortable waiting positions would be an advantage. The weather sealing for the 1DX combined with great video specs would be great for wildlife videography without using a dedicated video format.
Expeed is for Nikon vs Digic for Canon?
Connectivity is an issue for the R5. HDMI 2.0 is included but can't handle 8k/30, 4k/120 bandwidths. HDMI 2.1 is newer and hard to get certified cables for instance but does handle the bandwidth. New firmware promised by Canon for the R5 will have reduced (compressed) cinema raw which would hopefully allow external recording with greater record times without the CFe card heat. Whether HDMI2.1 or USD4 or UBS-C or 10G ethernet will be the question but connectivity will need to be greater than current connectors.
I don't see a split of models as the volume isn't there. It will have features that some won't use but they are all in the spare parts bin at the moment to be assembled :)

Regarding trust or trusted solutions: The environment is almost akin to distrusting anything new. Specifically in a stadium and the users seem to want to get a RAW image or perhaps even a JPEG as you suggest right over to the editors. Though when tethered, there isn't a need for a memory card, the images are being spat right at a editor and 2.5 Gbps ethernet would be a logical improvement here (5 and particularly 10 Gbps require new cable runs, expensive switches, and lots of cooling.).

I am still not convinced about the screen, I think the shooters will life on the EVF and for video you can use a R5 or a proper video camera that Canon will be delighted to sell you.

I did indeed mix up Expeed and Digic. Dual Digic X/11 make sense here, not so much for heat as it is for increased processing. Unless they can put out a multicore chip which is easier to shove on a board.

Replacing the HDMI 2.0 and USB-C port with a TB3 connector would give you HDMI 2.1 just with an adaptor or a TB3 to HDMI cable. A worth while tradeoff if the TB3 chip doesn't want to melt the camera.
 

analoggrotto

EOS RP
Aug 27, 2016
279
161
Perhaps they have determined a repeatable method to use all pixels to form the final image instead of half of the dual or forth of the quad pixel's sensor?

For example, the 5D4 is 60 ish MP for dual pixel but produces 30 MP images - with, say, double the processing and onboard memory; could this become a native 60MP sensor?
 

David - Sydney

EOS RP
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Dec 7, 2014
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Regarding trust or trusted solutions: The environment is almost akin to distrusting anything new. Specifically in a stadium and the users seem to want to get a RAW image or perhaps even a JPEG as you suggest right over to the editors. Though when tethered, there isn't a need for a memory card, the images are being spat right at a editor and 2.5 Gbps ethernet would be a logical improvement here (5 and particularly 10 Gbps require new cable runs, expensive switches, and lots of cooling.).

Dual Digic X/11 make sense here, not so much for heat as it is for increased processing. Unless they can put out a multicore chip which is easier to shove on a board.

Replacing the HDMI 2.0 and USB-C port with a TB3 connector would give you HDMI 2.1 just with an adaptor or a TB3 to HDMI cable. A worth while tradeoff if the TB3 chip doesn't want to melt the camera.
Another connectivity option is 5G wireless. The speed is sufficient but coverage is the issue for the moment. 4 years time will be a very different story though.
We have seen that thermal solutions for a single processor in the R5 is problematic. Heat pipes could improve it but dual processors will distribute the heat more evenly to the body especially if each doesn't need to run at current R5 temperatures. Bigger body also mean low temperature burns are easier to manage.
 

Pixel

EOS 90D
CR Pro
Sep 6, 2011
193
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It won't be called "R1"
Name one other pro flagship camera not called EOS-1(something)...not to mention over three decades of precedent.
 

navastronia

EOS RP + 5D Classic
Aug 31, 2018
682
794
If I was getting married today I'd want it to be recorded in 8K. I'd even buy extra R5 bodies for the production team so they can easily swap out bodies when it needs to cool down.

Why the need for 8K? By your 10th anniversary 8K displays would cost as much as a 65" 4K OLED TVs are today. By your silver anniversary 8K displays would sell for $300.

I'm not sure I'd hold up to 8K capture at my own wedding unless I were wearing makeup ;)
 
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usern4cr

R5
CR Pro
Sep 2, 2018
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Divorce is illegal where I live. ;) May not even occur a quarter century from now because of how backward people here are.

I watch YouTube and other videos on my 65". By 2026 I'm scheduling to get 8K microLED display.
Sorry to hear about divorce being illegal. I guess there are a lot of things you might wish were different, too.
I'm glad you can contribute to the talk here. :)
 

David - Sydney

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Dec 7, 2014
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It won't be called "R1"
Name one other pro flagship camera not called EOS-1(something)...not to mention over three decades of precedent.
You are right about the EOS prefix which all Canon bodies have had but mirrorless have had a letter prefix ie M and R series. The EOS-R1 is the likely name to differentiate it from the 1DX series DLSR
Not to mention the Rebel/Kiis naming variants in different regions.
Full list at:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canon_EOS
 
Mar 13, 2020
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The Panasonic GH5 (along many other Panas) got a fullsize HDMI Port and its a noteable smaller Camera.

Just a quick aside - the GH5 is pretty much the same size as the R5. Same height and thickness, just a slightly different shape.

That said, no excuse for Canon not putting a proper HDMI port on the R5. Especially given its price.
 

Pixel

EOS 90D
CR Pro
Sep 6, 2011
193
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You are right about the EOS prefix which all Canon bodies have had but mirrorless have had a letter prefix ie M and R series. The EOS-R1 is the likely name to differentiate it from the 1DX series DLSR
Not to mention the Rebel/Kiis naming variants in different regions.
Full list at:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canon_EOS
But there also won't be anymore EOS-1Dx's and my guess is that their new flagship will carry on the EOS-1 moniker albeit with an "R" now.
 
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AEWest

EOS RP
Jan 30, 2020
241
293
A few thoughts on this. Not criticizing, just thinking while typing...



I think we overestimate the impact of Olympics. Photographers at the Olympics represent a tiny fraction of a fraction of the professional sports photographer universe, which in itself is very small. Most sports photographers today are more likely to be like me -- employed by an institution, such as a college or university -- or trying to eke out a living through freelance contracts or hanging on as one of the few remaining local newspaper photographers out there or selling pictures to particpants and their families at local sporting events. There remain a few top level sports photographers, people like Scott Kelby and Peter Read Miller for example, but even these guys are contract workers. Point being that even if Canon sold two bodies to every single photographer covering the Olympics, it wouldn't be enough to sustain the line.

Sales these day are at least as likley, and probably more so, to be coming from amateurs who have sufficient disposible income and the desire to own the top of the line camera. As I said in a previous post, the olympics is important not because it puts cameras in the hands of pros but because it represents a marketing opportunity to sell cameras to enthusiasts who have the money to afford the top of the line.

Not disagreeing with your point, just adding that I doubt Olympics-related sales even enters into Canon's calculations one way or another. I've said before that I can't see any real Olympic photographers taking the risk of shooting events with a new and untried body, especially given that COVID-19 means they will have had limited events to become familiar with the camera before the Olympics.

On the other hand, the promotional aspect of the Olympics does enter into the equation and I can see Canon finagling press access for a bunch of photographers to take pictures using an R1 so they can promote it in their marketing campaign.



Stand alone for now. Rumors of the death of the DSLR might be greatly exagerated. If Canon continues offering DSLRs in any form, the smart controller is likely to become a standard feature. (It is, by the way, a great feature and negates one of the big advantages of mirrorless in my personal opinion.)



Plus, we don't know how much new development costs were actually invested in the sensor, which was an incremental improvement over the existing 1Dx II sensor. And, we don't know, but can assume, that development costs for sensors transfer across the varying resolutions.



Exactly.
Why such a focus on the Olympics? Certainly the FIFA World Cup is an equally large event for sports photography and it comes around in 2022, which may work better for the timing of the R1 release.
 

Quackator

EOS RP
Jul 19, 2011
376
221
Find me a fast big flash unit that doesn't cost $1,000's, cameras and
flashes have grown up together and whilst very low power flashes can
have exceptionally fast durations once you want any kind of power
output the duration time goes way up.

I have a bunch of Hensel Expert D 250 SPEED which are able to
fire 64 Ws at 16fps while at the same time maintaining very short
flash durations. 64 ws is pretty much what a 600EX-RT fires at
full power. Coupled with an inverter this is still very transportable.
The Hensel Power Max L inverter will give you more than 10,000
pops at 64 ws with this baby and one single battery charge.
No overheating, of course.

Due to the ultrashort flash durations and extremely fast recycle times
this is good for fill flash 1 f-stop below bright sunlight at 1/4000 sec / f=2.8
across 60ft distance.

Tested successsfully up to 1/2000 sec with the leaf shutter of a G5X.
Just needed to wait for a reasonable fast camera with global shutter.

The flash is there, proven to work as intended and already in my bag.
Now bring on the camera.
 

raptor3x

EOS RP
Jan 26, 2012
610
99
State College, PA
whumber.com
Perhaps they have determined a repeatable method to use all pixels to form the final image instead of half of the dual or forth of the quad pixel's sensor?

For example, the 5D4 is 60 ish MP for dual pixel but produces 30 MP images - with, say, double the processing and onboard memory; could this become a native 60MP sensor?

You already have that capability with DualPixel RAW, it's just nobody is processing it that way.
 
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Quackator

EOS RP
Jul 19, 2011
376
221
None of which is worth a damn if the venue doesn't permit flash photography. Red-carpet reception lines might, but most sporting events and concerts do not.

Don't stop thinking at news gathering opportunities.
Commercials, staged sports shots.... there's more.
 
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