Sony Overtakes #2 Position in U.S. Full-Frame Interchangeable Lens Camera Market

[Canon Rumors]

<em>Record Sales from Sony Driving Growth in Overall Full-Frame Market</em></p>
<p><strong>SAN DIEGO, <span data-term="goog_1593236201">April 14, 2017</span></strong> – Sony Electronics – a worldwide leader in digital imaging and the world’s largest image sensor manufacturer, has announced today that their continued growth has vaulted them into the #2 overall position in the U.S. full-frame interchangeable lens camera market. <sup>1</sup></p>
<p>Sony’s interchangeable lens cameras and lenses have seen record sales in 2017, in particular within the U.S. full-frame camera market, where they have experienced double-digit growth (+23%)<sup> 2</sup> compared to the same period last year.  The popularity of key models including α7RII and α7SII has been paramount to this success.</p>
<p>Additionally, Sony’s rapid growth has helped to drive growth of the overall full-frame interchangeable lens camera market compared to the same period last year.  Without Sony’s contributions, the full-frame market would be facing a slight decline. <sup>3</sup></p>
<p><a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/unnamed.jpg"><img class="aligncenter size-full wp-image-29107" src="http://www.canonrumors.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/unnamed.jpg" alt="" width="624" height="400" srcset="http://www.canonrumors.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/unnamed.jpg 624w, http://www.canonrumors.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/unnamed-610x391.jpg 610w" sizes="(max-width: 624px) 100vw, 624px" /></a></p>
<p>“Our commitment to the industry is stronger than ever,” said Neal Manowitz, VP of Digital Imaging at Sony North America. “We are always listening to our customers, combining their feedback with our intense passion for innovation to deliver products, services and support like no other.”</p>
<p>A variety of exclusive stories and exciting content shot Sony α products can be found at <a href="http://www.alphauniverse.com/" data-saferedirecturl="https://www.google.com/url?hl=en&q=http://www.alphauniverse.com&source=gmail&ust=1492291096462000&usg=AFQjCNFwXHuwQlPQc9TH5E6RikRCoqTo8w">www.alphauniverse.com</a> , Sony’s community site built to educate, inspire and showcase all fans and customers of the Sony α brand.</p>
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[jebrady03]

It blows my mind how many websites have picked up the story but haven't bothered to look into it. Sony is claiming to have seized the number two position in revenue. The Nikon lineup as a whole is cheaper and older. Either of those factors could account for lower revenue but both of them together almost assures it.

 

[Hector1970]

The end is nigh!

 

[Bennymiata]

Poor Nikon.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

As Noted in the other thread, this is for a narrow period during which Sony had a blowout sale, $300 off plus $480 trade-in for any junk camera or lens. $780 off. This likely allowed them to sell down a lot of inventory that was not moving. The hope in doing this is that users will like their new camera, and spread the word. Otherwise, sales will slow down, since so many in the marked jumped at the deal.

 

[unfocused]

This is deceptive without the footnotes.

1. The NPD Group / Retail Tracking Service, U.S., Detachable Lens Camera, Full Frame, Based on Dollars, Jan- Feb 2017

2. The NPD Group / Retail Tracking Service, U.S., Detachable Lens Camera, Full Frame, Based on Dollars, Jan/Feb 2016- Jan/Feb 2017

3. The NPD Group / Retail Tracking Service, U.S., Detachable Lens Camera, Full Frame, Based on Dollars, Jan/Feb 2016- Jan/Feb 2017

So, reading the footnotes, Sony sold the most full frame detachable lens cameras from January to February of this year -- either a one- or two-month period.

Sony increased its own sales by 23% over the last year, while other manufacturers were essentially flat (-2%). That might be impressive, except we don't really know enough to form a comparison. The survey is based on sales prices. Sony's sales in dollars went up 23%, and other manufacturers were essentially flat.

But, it's hard to get a decent picture without knowing the total dollar value of Sony's sales or of other manufacturers' sales. If you sold $100 worth one year and then increased it to $123, that's 23%, but if other manufacturers are selling $100 million, then it's not so impressive.

 

[DominoDude]

Way too isolated collection of data to mean anything to anyone outside of Sony. I wouldn't take it seriously. And it is data coming from a country that managed to elect a certain special someone fairly recently - at times, logic and knowledge don't seem to be important for the choices made.

 

[bholliman]

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics"

Mark Twain, Benjamin Disraeli and others

Looks like Sony cherry picked data from a narrow window of time, when heavily discounted sales was going on (per Mt. Spokane) to show they have eclipsed Nikon as #2. Personally, I'd like to look at longer term sales data.

 

[romanr74]

It blows my mind how many websites have picked up the story but haven't bothered to look into it. Sony is claiming to have seized the number two position in revenue. The Nikon lineup as a whole is cheaper and older. Either of those factors could account for lower revenue but both of them together almost assures it.

Hence?

 

[tmroper]

Since the FF Nikons use Sony sensors, it's maybe possible Sony is even #1 is FF sensor sales. But in any event, who buys cameras in January and February? Seems like they'd be very slow months, and Sony found a way to breath some life into them.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics"

Mark Twain, Benjamin Disraeli and others

Looks like Sony cherry picked data from a narrow window of time, when heavily discounted sales was going on (per Mt. Spokane) to show they have eclipsed Nikon as #2. Personally, I'd like to look at longer term sales data.

You can bet that Sony won't show it, unless its favorable.

 

[DominoDude]

Thanks for the dislikes and the free speech...

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

Thanks for the dislikes and the free speech...

You should realize that this is a private forum, there is no free speech.

Political comments are forbidden in the forum because it just causes problems.

 

[Hflm]

This is deceptive without the footnotes.

1. The NPD Group / Retail Tracking Service, U.S., Detachable Lens Camera, Full Frame, Based on Dollars, Jan- Feb 2017

2. The NPD Group / Retail Tracking Service, U.S., Detachable Lens Camera, Full Frame, Based on Dollars, Jan/Feb 2016- Jan/Feb 2017

3. The NPD Group / Retail Tracking Service, U.S., Detachable Lens Camera, Full Frame, Based on Dollars, Jan/Feb 2016- Jan/Feb 2017

So, reading the footnotes, Sony sold the most full frame detachable lens cameras from January to February of this year -- either a one- or two-month period.

Sony increased its own sales by 23% over the last year, while other manufacturers were essentially flat (-2%). That might be impressive, except we don't really know enough to form a comparison. The survey is based on sales prices. Sony's sales in dollars went up 23%, and other manufacturers were essentially flat.

But, it's hard to get a decent picture without knowing the total dollar value of Sony's sales or of other manufacturers' sales. If you sold $100 worth one year and then increased it to $123, that's 23%, but if other manufacturers are selling $100 million, then it's not so impressive.

Fully agree. Sony is mixing different things, by reporting value in $ for two months (NOT unit sales), therefore likely a local extremum. Then they present a graph showing _lens_ sale increase over the whole year, giving the impression to be in front of Nikon both in sales and units (lenses + bodies) for not just a moment in time. Additionally, the graph implies that the market would shrink without Sony being in the game, neglecting that a non-negligible percentage of the customers would have bought Canikon gear instead.
Pretty cheap marketing in my personal opinion.

 

[Tugela]

As Noted in the other thread, this is for a narrow period during which Sony had a blowout sale, $300 off plus $480 trade-in for any junk camera or lens. $780 off. This likely allowed them to sell down a lot of inventory that was not moving. The hope in doing this is that users will like their new camera, and spread the word. Otherwise, sales will slow down, since so many in the marked jumped at the deal.

Except of course that their next models are likely going to start hitting the market soon. No doubt you believe that the release of newer more sophisticated cameras will cause sales to crater.

More likely sales will spike when that happens (as they always do when the next generation of a camera model comes out)

 

[Tugela]

It should not be too surprising considering that cameras shipments to the Americas show DSLR declining by ~10% during this period, but MILCs increasing by ~100%

http://www.cipa.jp/stats/documents/e/d-201702_e.pdf

The trends are similar in other areas, but not quite as extreme as in the Americas. But MILCS (presumably the bulk of which come from Sony) have made significant ground on DSLRs in the first two months of the year.

 

[rrcphoto]

It should not be too surprising considering that cameras shipments to the Americas show DSLR declining by ~10% during this period, but MILCs increasing by ~100%

100% of nothing is nothing.

it's also shipments and the "value" that CIPA gets is offered by the individual companies, there's no real standard there. it's most likely some FOB value, however, whatever, that FOB value is set by the distributing company is entirely arbitrary. canon's FOB price that we saw in some documents is around 50% of retail. if Sony or olympus / panasonic have a different FOB %, then the results are skewed.

there's only two "real" datapoints one is units, the other is retail sales numbers over a long period of time to remove the bursty nature of flash sales.

As an example Canon started their spring sales this month. Obviously it will effect sales for them when it's on, versus when it's off. Nikon will most likely follow suit.

in actual "REAL" quantitative numbers, only 38,470 mirrorless got shipped into NA for the first two months of the year - making that look, real small as mirrorless usually does, and still only 27% share of the ILC market in the americas - and that's including the fact that there was a fair amount of notable mirrorless releases in the first two months of the year.

Panasonic, Olympus had releases that will spike shipments for the first two months of the year as well as the perceived "value" since both units are very expensive over their last year's prior units.

 

[Woody]

It should not be too surprising considering that cameras shipments to the Americas show DSLR declining by ~10% during this period, but MILCs increasing by ~100%

http://www.cipa.jp/stats/documents/e/d-201702_e.pdf

The trends are similar in other areas, but not quite as extreme as in the Americas. But MILCS (presumably the bulk of which come from Sony) have made significant ground on DSLRs in the first two months of the year.

Look at the trend for monthy shipment over the years:
http://www.sansmirror.com/newsviews/mirrorless-nibbles-away-at.html

You'll see the sales of DSLRs tends to be low in the beginning of every year.

There is no doubt sales of MILCs will overtake that of DSLRs eventually. But it's just not happening at the rate MILC supporters are prognosticating.

 

[Jopa]

Sony's PR at its best. I bet some independent marketing research agency can prove Pentax is #1.

 

[Hillsilly]

Sony might have cherry-picked the data, but I also find it interesting that people are discrediting Sony's claims because they are selling higher priced cameras (which has increased their $$ sales volume).

But if I was Nikon or Canon, that would be the most disconcerting thing. Nikon and Canon might still be able to rely on their lower priced cameras, which are often purchased by people as their first step into a better camera system than their phone. But it seems more experienced photographers, when looking to upgrade or add another body, are giving serious consideration to Sony. In an industry where the manufacturers also take pride in being the best (as well as the biggest), hopefully we'll start seeing more innovation from both Canon and Nikon as they fight to retain market share.

I'm sure they wished they started this sooner, but to Canon's credit, they've put a lot of effort into combating this with new EF-S primes and mirrorless offerings. But Nikon seem to be lacking in both.