The Canon EOS R1 is coming, here are a few things to expect

TravelerNick

EOS 90D
Dec 4, 2020
104
60
On the F/11 lenses. Every increase in price shrinks the potential buyer pool. At the F/11 prices you can talk yourself into buying it and using it rarely.

At twice the price you start moving into the territory that only people who really think they need it will buy. That means all the fixed costs are spread over the smaller buyer base.

It's not just about price either. At F/8 the lens will be bigger and heavier. Further reducing the potential market.

I have virtually zero interest in anything over 200mm (and even that takes some convincing) but I'd likely buy the 600mm F/11 at the price. I'd even likely carry it.

An F/8 lens that is basically aimed at amateur wildlife shooters that don't want to spend the money on the exotic longer lenses but want something one stop faster than the F/11 is a pretty small market item. Niche items are rarely cheap.

Aren't there used EF lenses that can be adapted for similar prices? Canon also needs to compete with that further shrinking the pool of buyers.
 
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StevenA

EOS 90D
CR Pro
Jul 8, 2020
103
201
I'm not sure where you're coming from Steven, but you have just discounted and written off the years and years of practice, training, experimenting, visionary talents and skills, climbing on your belly through thorns to get the shot, determination, and plain hard work many have dedicated to perfecting their craft and creating images no one - I mean NO ONE - else could replicate. Just ask your daughter and she'll make you eat your words.

I haven't discounted anything. Modern tech is doing that - blame it. And actually, because of the advancements in cameras is the very reason my daughter picked up film. She said there was no challenge to digital and gains more satisfaction from getting an image on film.

Certainly we can agree film is more challenging? Thus, as I said, modern camera tech is blurring the lines between the novice and the professional.
 
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kaihp

EOS R
CR Pro
Mar 19, 2012
1,009
164
The Most Ancient Kingdom of Denmark
Certainly we can agree film is more challenging? Thus, as I said, modern camera tech is blurring the lines between the novice and the professional.
I'm not @garrev but I definitely agree that film was/is more challenging.

Modern cameras helps novices like me (going from a 5D3 to a 1Dx for autosports immediately doubled my keeper rate), but when panning technique comes in, I am still woefully inadequate. I may have access to same equipment as a pro, but but results are far behind. The fleshy bit behind the camera decides the images (still).
 

StevenA

EOS 90D
CR Pro
Jul 8, 2020
103
201
I'm not @garrev but I definitely agree that film was/is more challenging.

Modern cameras helps novices like me (going from a 5D3 to a 1Dx for autosports immediately doubled my keeper rate), but when panning technique comes in, I am still woefully inadequate. I may have access to same equipment as a pro, but but results are far behind. The fleshy bit behind the camera decides the images (still).

Yes, Agreed, But I wonder what your panning keeper rate would be using film, instead of a 1Dx?
 

gunship01

EOS M6 Mark II
Feb 3, 2013
70
3
I've no doubt there are people that will never be satisfied with the number of pixels a camera's sensor has and will always want more. For me, 45mp on the R5 is a sweet spot. Anything bigger would just slow down my process. For those suggesting 60mp or higher, that's a lot of mp for full frame sensor, may as well move into medium format if that's a big requirement.
Agreed Tom. Well put.
I'm with the group aligned with the ideological business aspect of 1) incremental development (not too much technological advancement at once so as to keep the customers aligned with the product and not jump ship) and 2) making the R1 emulate the competition's Z9 in specs and price (the final product being 45 MP and around $6K).
 
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SwissFrank

from EOS 1N to R
Dec 9, 2018
652
369
So far nothing in the R line has tempted me.

Gosh, Steve, IBIS? a 50/1.2 with literally ten times the resolution of the previous model? The R5's ability to nail focus on humans to birds? Or just another several stops of DR and ISO speed improvement?

I'll meet you half-way. I like shooting landscapes and cityscapes and want maximum detail in my shots and don't need AF or IBIS to do those, just a tripod. And I'd LOVE 100MP, but I wonder if the lenses for the camera line mentioned can actually resolve that finely? The Canon 50/1.2 can, I believe. If not, then we get a high-resolution photo of a poorly focused detail, and that's not compelling to me.
 

GoldWing

Canon EOS 1DXMKII
Oct 19, 2013
330
239
Los Angeles, CA
en.wikipedia.org
I "hear" that Nikon has over 400,000 pre-orders for the Z9 already as of last week.

How many of those people are not interested in a 45MP R1?

If the R1 is not 80 to 85MP Canon is cutting off their nose to spite their face. So easy to change frame rate by adjusting file size.

When was the last time Canon had 400,000 pre-orders on a camera?

The R1 might be Canon's last chance. And how do our current Canon inventory of $12,000 f/2.8 400mm , compare to the new Nikon 2.8 400MM with a built in TC?

If the R1 is 80 to 85MP our agency is prepared to replace every 1DX, 1DXII and 1DXMKIII in inventory as well as invest in new optimized glass for the RF platform. While the few million we'll be spending might not drive Canon's final decision. There are too many like us on the agency side, sports team, league, magazine, digital producers and even enthusiasts to realize that the initial base could exceed Nikon's 400,000 orders. More important, look at the cross-over from other genres. Multiple fashion, wildlife and wedding photographers have said they would move to a platform with that resolution.

Of the 400,000 Z9 pre-orders.... How many people would cancel their Z9's, if Canon announced the R1 has a significantly better resolution to offer?

Canon needs to step up well before 3rd 1/4 2022... Or the ship will have sailed......
 
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stevelee

FT-QL
CR Pro
Jul 6, 2017
2,176
882
Davidson, NC
Gosh, Steve, IBIS? a 50/1.2 with literally ten times the resolution of the previous model? The R5's ability to nail focus on humans to birds? Or just another several stops of DR and ISO speed improvement?

I'll meet you half-way. I like shooting landscapes and cityscapes and want maximum detail in my shots and don't need AF or IBIS to do those, just a tripod. And I'd LOVE 100MP, but I wonder if the lenses for the camera line mentioned can actually resolve that finely? The Canon 50/1.2 can, I believe. If not, then we get a high-resolution photo of a poorly focused detail, and that's not compelling to me.
I have very little use for a 50mm prime. I think I have used my f/1.4 on one occasion since I got the 6D2, when I knew I’d be taking a picture of a small group in available light. If I take anything in that focal length range, my kit zoom works fine otherwise. All my pictures of humans or birds appear sharp. One guy in the small group shot appeared slightly fuzzy because he was a bit farther away than others. The cure for that would have been to stop down slightly more, not having the camera focus on somebody else’s eye or focusing on one of his eyes and making everybody else fuzzy. As it was, when I resized for use in the neighborhood newsletter and for the web, he didn’t look fuzzy, at least not so anybody would notice.

All the things you list are nice, and I am happy they are available for people who want or need them. I have not perceived the need. Hence the lack of temptation. I am thinking of my own picture taking, which is not the same as that of a lot of folks here, apparently.

The reviews I have seen of the Fuji GX lenses tend to rave about them, some more so than others, but all really good. I would do more reading up before I decided on the two lenses I would buy, with usefulness for what I want to do the main concern. The kinds of things I would shoot with the 100S would not need IBIS or fast autofocus or birds’ eyes, just a tripod and some patience, not much unlike you.

Yesterday may be instructive. Yesterday was beautiful. The 7.8 acres of woods behind my house are looking very nice now with increasing fall colors. It has been a very busy weekend, so when I got home after lunch yesterday, I was bushed and just sat down and dozed off rather than taking the camera out into the woods. If I had had another $10,000+ of gear, I still would have sat down and dozed off. I think Wednesday will still be nice, so maybe that will be a good day to go out and shoot pictures with what I have now. If lunch with a friend tomorrow doesn’t go on too long, I could start scoping out a trail in the afternoon. I’ll put the battery on to charge tonight, just in case.

The moral of all that is that if I don’t go out to shoot over the next couple days or if it turns out to be not that much fun, then I can reasonably conclude that I’m not really that interested in expanding my landscape photography, and the temptation for that equipment will be significantly attenuated. OTOH, if my reaction is “Gee, I wish I had another 75 megapixels for this great shot,” my credit card could take a good hit before Friday.
 
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SwissFrank

from EOS 1N to R
Dec 9, 2018
652
369
The R1 might be Canon's last chance.

O my gosh, Cannon is DOOOOOOMED!

Seriously, haven't they been #1 in camera sales since 1991 or so? I think even if they slip to #2 they'd be fine but I think last sales figures showed them increasing their market share. Most people don't even WANT a 1 model, too big, too heavy.
 

stevelee

FT-QL
CR Pro
Jul 6, 2017
2,176
882
Davidson, NC
I did go out on trail in the woods behind my house yesterday. I took the 16–35mm zoom, but no tripod. I was really intending just to scope out things for this afternoon. I was surprised how green the trees there still were, so I didn’t go back today. I took a few pictures anyway, and a couple of them looked like another 75MP might be in order. But really, stopping down a bit and using a tripod would likely have cured what ails those pictures. I wasn’t being very careful even as it was.
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The trees you can see from my bedroom, living room, and deck looked even nicer today than yesterday. Even the maples out front are looking good. So late in the afternoon I took a few pictures from the deck. Here is one out back, and one of a tree out front seen from between the houses.
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