Will you be disappointed if the 70d gets the same 18mp sensor?

[Mt Spokane Photography]

1 stop ISO improvement is hardly possible. Maybe 1/2 or 1/3 stop. What would, however, be possible are 3 stops in dynamic range at ISO 100. What would also be possible is to significantly increase the number of pixels without losing sensitivity after downscaling.

Therefore the safest bet is a higher megapixel sensor with slightly more noise and the same dynamic range after downscaling. Sad but true.

+1
one stop is wishful thinking.

 

[jebrady03]

Absolutely I'll be disappointed if the 70D doesn't have an improved (image quality-wise) sensor. Whether I intend to buy it or not is irrelevant to my disappointment because I do intend to upgrade my 60D at some point. If it's the 70D with an improved sensor or an 80D with an improved sensor on top of the 70D's improved sensor - doesn't matter to me. As long as there are noticeable improvements each time, that's what concerns me. Otherwise, Canon is falling behind and not offering IQ in the same ballpark as the competition and ultimately, that's what I want (class leading or at least class equivalent IQ) when I do decide to upgrade.

 

[steliosk]

same sensor = same IQ or worse (check dxo or dpreview samples where 600D has better quality than 650D)
no reason to upgrade

 

[insanitybeard]

Yes, I think Canon needs to show it hasn't stagnated and that it is able/willing to improve this particular area of it's APS-C camera bodies. Considering how long 4 years is in technology/electronics time, I am surprised it has been this long.

 

[Kathode-Ray]

Yes, I would be disappointed, but I think it is to be expected that it will be the same. The new Digic will improve noise behaviour a bit and Canon will probably add some new features like WiFi/GPS. Add flip-screen and support for STM lenses.

I hope they put AFMA back in the 70D... sigh...

 

[Marsu42]

It really depends what "the same" is, because the good ol' 18mp sensor has come a long way from the 7d (haunted by banding) to the newer Rebels with af helper pixels for lv focusing.

If they find a way to squeeze the last performance out of the tech like on the 6d (better noise patter = easier to nr, zero banding, some more dynamic range) *and* the 70d has great features *and* a very reasonable price the 70d will still be a great camera for shooting in good light. But knowing Canon that won't happen, it's either a lukewarm update *or* much more expensive than the competition d7100.

 

[dizeaz]

I will be disappointed no matter what they release. Even if I'm not waiting for the camera nor planning to buy it.
I already made up my mind.

 

[K-amps]

I would be ok if they gave us a 12-16 mp sensor with better shadow pull IQ and 1 stop high ISO capability... I think they could do this even with current tech they have been using... and would be disappointed if they kept the same 18mp sensor.

Personally... I'd like to see them release a 70D with 20-24mp and a 7Dii with a 14-16 mp low noise, high DR monster.

 

[paul13walnut5]

It's not about the quantity, it's about the quality.

I doubt the majority of target 70D users need anything more than 18MP. In fact if 1DX owners are happy with 18MP then it clearly isn't just about resolution.

Given the poor showing this sensor gets from DxO (if that matters to you, not a jot to me) then the fact that the cameras built around it can still give very good results speaks volumes for the wonders worked by the digic processors.

A newly designed 18MP with digic 6 could be really something. Even the old 18Mp with digic 6 could be something.

I am struggling to think what features canon could add that would make the camera a must have. The last must haves for me were PAL video, manual video exposure, manual audio levels, wireless flash was great, and the flip out screen really handy for video.

The 70D will have to be really something to tempt me to change, as I know the limitations and strengths of my current kit, which is why I haven't changed before now.

I'm not going to buy a 7D2 or 5D4 until my exsisting kit no longer delivers the goods. Maybe this is an old fashioned view. But then in video land I have lots of other things to buy beyond the camera and lenses (£500 for a mic, £150 for cans, £900 for tripod, £1500 for lights, £350 for audio interface, £3500 for mac and software, £1200 for RAID) incremental upgrades push a new camera down the list when what I have is working fine.

 

[RS2021]

With xxD bodies Canon "jumped the shark" when they updated the 50D with 60D... can't say I care that much with what they put in 70D.

Its like parading a Granny in supermodel clothes...still wrinkled and saggy underneath

 

[Area256]

Having just sold a 60D, I'm not about to buy the 70D, still it would be nice to see some new sensor tech - if only because it means it'll find its way into higher end models. My money would be on the 7D2 getting the new sensor though - if the new sensor is really a lot better, than it makes sense to put it in an expensive body to get some of the R&D money back. The 70D will have to go head-to-head with the D7100, but the 7D2 as rumoured will have no real completion, so Canon can charge a lot more...

 

[Rienzphotoz]

If it is the same sensor, yes it'd obviously be a disappointment ... but I don't care about the "Mega Pixel" count and have no problem if it is 18 MP as long as it is a newly developed sensor.

 

[Nishi Drew]

I think some people are missing the point about Canon using the 18mp over and over, who cares if the next camera has 18mp resolution, might as well have less, it's about how they've been using the same sensor for every release post 7D. That's insane, from 7D to 60D to every rebel and M, I have a friend's 60D on me now and good grief ISO 400 and the noise can't touch that of the 5DMk2, daylight fine, but indoor I can't just shoot at 3200 and brush up some loose noise like with the 5DII and that's even older now. Feels like sensor tech is in a standstill since 2008, of course FF beats Crop, but 5yr old FF beating the crop sensor that Canon proudly presents in 2013?? If they don't stuff something worth it in the 70D then the 7DMk2 better or.... I might just break and throw them more money for an expensive FF (cursing Canon and wishing I made the move to the dark side, Canon video hasn't budged either and just sucks compared to everyone else nowadays.)
The 5DMk3 is good but not 'that' much better over the Mk2, I'll choose that if I could spare for it, and the 1DX sure, but that's an impossible league for most.
So, YES, will be disappointed if the 70D had the same sensor

 

[paul13walnut5]

with x0D series looked at in isolation. At the same time they gave us the 7D, which was, and remains miles above the x0D series cameras, and perhaps after the meh incremental upgrades from 20d, 30d, 40d is perhaps the camera that the 50d should have been all along.

The 60D is hard done to I think, why for example would folk who want mfa not also want a half decent AF system like they put in the 7D?

Who really uses PC synch sockets anymore? (well me, but I suspect I am an exceptional case, and I only use it occassionally)

They also gave the rebels a better AF system to give that range more seperation in the 650D.

Are and should x0D users be a protected species? do we need the x0D series at all? If the 7D2 is priced bonkers nuts then there may be a more natural place for a new x0D camera to come in.

If the 7D2 is priced well then I don't think we need a 70D.

To play devils addvocate i would be delighted if the 70D had an 8MP 16:9 sensor, like that from the c100/300.

It would satisfy my stills requirements and probably make for an ideal budget cinema EOS.

 

[interpilot]

Yes, very much so. It's quite simple really: I'll buy one if it has an improved sensor, AFMA, and nicer (the 7d's 19pt?) AF. I don't see why any of these wouldn't happen. If they wouldn't have waited for an improved sensor, they could (would, should) have kicked a 70D out the door a year ago; if they weren't planning improved AF, they wouldn't have moved the 60D's current AF system down to the 650D.

If not, I'll probably go off in the other direction, and invest in pure shooting pleasure.. probably meaning Fuji, as soon as they add a decent longer lens. Although I am wondering if that isn't the better route to begin with .

 

[interpilot]

with x0D series looked at in isolation. At the same time they gave us the 7D, which was, and remains miles above the x0D series cameras, and perhaps after the meh incremental upgrades from 20d, 30d, 40d is perhaps the camera that the 50d should have been all along.

The 60D is hard done to I think, why for example would folk who want mfa not also want a half decent AF system like they put in the 7D?

Who really uses PC synch sockets anymore? (well me, but I suspect I am an exceptional case, and I only use it occassionally)

They also gave the rebels a better AF system to give that range more seperation in the 650D.

Are and should x0D users be a protected species? do we need the x0D series at all? If the 7D2 is priced bonkers nuts then there may be a more natural place for a new x0D camera to come in.

If the 7D2 is priced well then I don't think we need a 70D.

To play devils addvocate i would be delighted if the 70D had an 8MP 16:9 sensor, like that from the c100/300.

It would satisfy my stills requirements and probably make for an ideal budget cinema EOS.

Except that I wouldn't want a camera of those dimensions (both size and weight). If it would be 60D-like in those aspects, fine with me . But apparently, both Canon and Nikon seem to think that more "advanced" features are inherently tied to bigger and heavier bodies :-\

 

[RGF]

If the 7D M2 has a sensor that is not improved over T4i, .... then it will be time to switch to Nikon

 

[kubelik]

that fact that I can now buy a computer that's twice as fast and half as expensive as it was in 2009 tells me everything I need to know about how much Canon has been milking their APS-C chip. sure they've added on-chip autofocus now, but a badly implemented feature does not count as improvement.

I'm really happy to see Canon diving into a whole bunch of new areas with cameras like the EOS M and the SL1, but let's get something straight: the body development team are not (hopefully not) the same guys that are the sensor development team. so there is no justification for the near-zero evolution of Canon's APS-C sensor line.

is there anything inherently wrong with the 18 MP APS-C sensor? no. we were pretty happy when the 7D got released with it, and while it never came close to matching the 5DII's sensor, I don't think anyone really expected it to. the sensor was great then, and is just as good now as it was then. the issue to me isn't really the sensor itself, it's what it signifies from Canon. it's Canon telling us that they don't feel that they need to innovate. it's Canon telling us they think we're dumb enough to think that sticking a t5i sticker on a t4i means it's "new". it's Canon lying to us that we shouldn't judge the chip's autofocus speed on the EOS M because it's pre-production, and it'll get much faster by the time of the actual release.

I don't think the folks at Canon are stupid, but I do feel they take the liberty of thinking that their consumer base is a little dim. the t5i is definitely toeing the line of "let's see how sheep-like our customer base is" and I hope the 70D and 7DII have not been treated the same way.

 

[Peter007]

I bought my first DSLR a Canon 60D two years ago for a decent price with an 18 -200mm lens. It take fantastic video but lacks the auto-focus mode. The best feature by far is the articulated viewer which I use for awkward shots. After being introduced in 2010 I would expect the 70D to have better ISO performance, more auto-focus points and auto-focus during video and 7fps continuous. If it comes in a 24mp sensor I would buy it on the spot. I looked at the Canon 6D but for my liking is missing a flip up flash and the articulated viewer which are very handy.
70D with a 24mp sensor please!!

 

[CanNotYet]

that fact that I can now buy a computer that's twice as fast and half as expensive as it was in 2009 tells me everything I need to know about how much Canon has been milking their APS-C chip. sure they've added on-chip autofocus now, but a badly implemented feature does not count as improvement.

I'm really happy to see Canon diving into a whole bunch of new areas with cameras like the EOS M and the SL1, but let's get something straight: the body development team are not (hopefully not) the same guys that are the sensor development team. so there is no justification for the near-zero evolution of Canon's APS-C sensor line.

is there anything inherently wrong with the 18 MP APS-C sensor? no. we were pretty happy when the 7D got released with it, and while it never came close to matching the 5DII's sensor, I don't think anyone really expected it to. the sensor was great then, and is just as good now as it was then. the issue to me isn't really the sensor itself, it's what it signifies from Canon. it's Canon telling us that they don't feel that they need to innovate. it's Canon telling us they think we're dumb enough to think that sticking a t5i sticker on a t4i means it's "new". it's Canon lying to us that we shouldn't judge the chip's autofocus speed on the EOS M because it's pre-production, and it'll get much faster by the time of the actual release.

I don't think the folks at Canon are stupid, but I do feel they take the liberty of thinking that their consumer base is a little dim. the t5i is definitely toeing the line of "let's see how sheep-like our customer base is" and I hope the 70D and 7DII have not been treated the same way.

I agree fully with this. Well put, my friend!