Announcements
No specs were given, but I’m told we can expect a 1Ds4 and 60D to be announced in February. There won’t be a Rebel until the “MAM” quarter.
Lenses
Another email says we can expect 3 lenses to be announced in February
More to come I’m sure.
cr
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I guess that MAM quarter means March, April, May.
Ditto on the MAM even though it is not a calendar quarter. Canon probably does not work on a Jan-Dec year.
Why even bother with a 60D at this point? The price point couldn’t be too much less than the 7D to be worth spending less a few hundred less for less features?
What could a 60D offer to remotely consider vs 7D?
I love my Canon but man they have made some strange business moves, which I thought they were correcting with the 7D.
This does make good sense, the 60D is sorely needed, and the Rebel is not, since the T1i has video and is fairly new. The 60D will sell very well too, most likely more than the 7D. Count on it.
it’s been like 4 days…
too long to wait for a rumor…
T_T
I see the 1Ds4 as a bottleneck for Canon high end dSLRs that need freeing before further updates for the rest. If the 1Ds4 is announced in February I’m pretty certain the 3D will be announced in September.
I’m fairly certain that, with the 7D directly competing against the D300, the 60D line will, from here on out, be in more direct competition with the D90 line; it just makes logical sense.
What this also means is that the D60 might not offer the same sorts of upgrades some want it to have. This would obviously keep it’s price point down.
I didn’t buy a 7D for the blurred images it produces, not for the price. It is a wondeful camera (it has everything I need) but, at least to me, for what I have seen so far, it has a ugly IQ.
A 60D with the same (or almost the same) features and with a GOOD sensor (12-15 MP max – better 12 – and yes, I know 50D has 15MP) would be a best buy for me, even at a very similar price, compared to the 7D.
What I want to see are sharp, sharp, sharp images and I’m really sad to say that nowadays, Nikon’s images are really sharp, while Canon’s aren’t. I’m seriously thinking to jump ship but I’ll give Canon one or two chances more.
Except the Rebel T1i actually competes pretty effectively against the D90.
I believe the 500D goes head on against the D5000.
Canon should reduce the weight of 60D to compete against D90.
Above reply is for Craig.
For Andrea: you are sprouting garbage.
Tripod mounted, manual focus, identical settings, 12 MP 450D left vs 18 MP 7D right, f/11 (diffraction limited):
http://thw.smugmug.com/Other/Temp/Diffraction/753732853_fSD5f-XL.jpg
I cannot see many differences between the two photos and actualy, this is the point. A 7D shoots like a 450D… Is it?
Note: I’m not saying that a 12MP sensor IS NECESSARILY better than a 18MP. I’m saying that I want a smaller (in terms of MP) sensor and a better sensor.
Maybe I’m sprouting garbage, saying that 7D is not the camera for me, but I prefer to spend about 2100 euro for a FF 5D II than 1700 fot the 7D. The IQ of the 5D is without any doubt superior. And maybe I don’t need thousand of gadget, but a really good image.
Anyway, the point is that, IMO, the 60D will have a great market, because there are many many persons that are not satisfied by 7D, even if they are sprouting garbage…
[don’t know if my English is 100% correct, forgive me if not]
You can make out more detail in the right photo (the 7D). Take a close look at the roof tiles on the building in the foreground, you’ll notice that it’s a little bit sharper.
You really see no difference in the level of detail, particularly the roof?
I don’t want a plasticky body for the xxD line. I’m buying it because of better ergonomics compared to the Rebel line. xxD are better since it has a little bit of sealing than none at all like the D90. I’ve used and seen a D90 and 40D got really wet by accident.
Funny, you talk about wanting sharp, sharp images, but can’t see the difference in sharpness between the two images? Are you sure you want sharp sharp images? :P
You’re English is fine. I would love to see some of the negative reviews of the 7D, and not from some paid sites but actual users. Most people I know who have it, have nothing but good things to say.
The 60D will be a good $1000us camera. Video, 15MP, slightly better High Iso( about 1/2 stop) Improved AF(but nobody will really notice the difference), and a 100% VF. It is significantly cheaper than the 7D, has more consumer like features, but still has that pro look that the soccer moms want. It will still sell a lot of bodies.
I think the 60D is needed in the Canon line of camera bodies. I plan to buy a new camera this Spring/Summer and have been reading as many expert and user reviews on the 7D as possible and I have come to the conclusion that the 7D would meet or exceed all of my needs in a camera. The image quality looks great, the AF system looks fantastic, the video appears to be just what most would be looking for in a DSLR with video capabilities, etc., etc., etc. The only problem with the camera for me is the price. Although I can rationalize the cost, trying to rationalize it to my wife is not as easy. Therefore, I have been waiting/hoping for the 60D. The Rebel series is very, very nice but I want something a bit more substantial in my hand, something with excellent IQ, better AF and FPS than a Rebel. My hope is that some of the new technology introduced into the 7D migrates to a new 60D. I know it won’t all be there and that is why it will/should/hope it costs about $1000-$1100. We all can’t drop $1700 on a camera…
Sure, the images are a world apart.. but is that even relevant, without having some sort of explanation to go with them? For all we know, the 450D image could have been up-sampled to match the resolution of 7D, while the 7D image might have been sharpened to further distinguish them. That’s not what I call an impartial comparison. Gusto, give us more info about those pics.
I personally don’t believe the 7D is capable of producing that sort of detail, but then again I only tried 3 bodies, so it might have something to do with sample variations. Anyway, judging from all the files I’ve seen the 7D produce, the IQ is nowhere near that shown in this comparison.
I agree with Andrea on this. Give us a good 12MP crop camera (with a reasonable AF, I might add). Even if they were both selling at the same price point, I’d pick it over the 7D anytime! I have high hopes for 60D.. but knowing Canon, I am prepared to be disappointed. Again.
The more I look at them, the more I am convinced that the left one is actually 7D and the right one Rebel :)
Thanks! :)
Well, actualy, I read not so many negative reviews, but it is very hard to say which ones are paid and which ones are not.
I saw some really bad images by people who criticized their own camera. One in particular was so blurry that I couldn’t even understand where the focus was set (it was a landscape).
[@ scott too]
Don’t misunderstand me: I’m not saying that images are bad. They are not as good as I expect from a xD camera which should compete with best Nikon’s cameras.
Ok boy. You surely don’t know but it is 4 AM here. I think I’ll concede myself at least three hours of bed, before going work. Maybe my eyes are really tired and I can’t see any difference in sharpness now… :) :) :)
Good night or good mornig to everybody :) :)
Cheers!
Just viewed them on my desktop PC and the difference is not as big as I thought.. and neither of them is all that sharp to begin with. Oh well, I still maintain the left one is 7D!
“No specs were given, but I’m told we can expect a 1Ds4 and 60D to be announced in February. There won’t be a Rebel until the “MAM” quarter.”
Nice way to improve ones CR credibility – send a vague prediction and hope for the best… This is just too vague to be believed, if the person sending this info would actually know something there would be more details.
1Ds4 is definitely coming along at some stage, would not be surprised if it was announced soon-ish. 60D, hmmm, it’s going to be interesting to see how Canon treats it, I think it should be a budget version of 7D – get rid of the more expensive features (wireless remote, 100% viewfinder), put it in a cheaper body and it just might squeeze into a respectable price point.
I also am looking to get a second camera body and would hope the 60D would be in the price range between 50D and 7D (hopefully close to the 1000USD range) as 7D is out of my budget. (fingers crossed)
“Why even bother with a 60D at this point? The price point couldn’t be too much less than the 7D to be worth spending less a few hundred less for less features?
What could a 60D offer to remotely consider vs 7D?”
Cheaper price. Not everyone needs a pro body and 7D is a pro body. Very few amateurs need the wireless flash, 100% viewfinder also adds to the overall cost, weather sealing is almost unnecessary for most amateur users.
60D as a cheaper version of 7D would be a fine camera.
Please jump ship. Canon doesn’t need you.
“I don’t want a plasticky body for the xxD line.”
So buy somethign from the pro line. You get what you pay for and you have lots of options, if you have a cheaper camera something has to give.
Oh, my God! Canon surely doesn’t!
But considering I’m spedindg 1000-2000 EUR every year, I hope Canon will consider people like me. Even if Canon won’t.
C’mon and take it easy mark.
Good night (really, this time!)
Py, I agree. That comparison is very weak. Those could have been handled a number of different ways.
If Canon messes up on the 60D, I’ll begin serious consideration on how to make a transition to Nikon without losing too much money. I never thought I’d think that. I’ve owned the original rebel, the 30D, the Xsi and the 40D. My kids have my old hand me downs (the 30D and the Xsi) and I hate to break ranks from them as we share lenses when we get together.
I sure hope they can make a body that will give me the features that will let me keep it for the next 5-7 years and not feel I am seriously missing out. Then I can focus on adding an L zoom to my lens collection. (I know some say get the L over advances in bodies, if you can only afford one. But L glass is double or triple the cost of the middle of the road lenses that are not that bad.)
My dream for the 60D is…. 12MP, 1-2 stop better ISO than the 40D, 7D-ish AF improvements, improved VF and the micro-focus of the 50D. I could live with that… C’mon Canon.
Me too. I have 4 to 5K U.S. to spend on either a Canon 3D, or a Nikon D4 or D3s if they can ever make enough of them that I’ll be able to buy one. I need FF, <21mp, great low noise at 12K ISO and pro autofocus. How hard can that be for Canon? It would have to sell well. I may be shooting two bodies in the near future, my 5D and either a new 3D or the Nikon option of D4. If I didn't believe that Canon's lenses are better I'd make the switch right now.
The 7D is NOT a pro-level body.
Have you thought about picking up a used 7D?
I think a lot of people complaining about the “soft” 7D better learn to use their cameras.
We even had one guy above complaining about the comparison that proved him wrong. Complaining that the 7D image was sharpened more, the 450D image could have been up-sampled to match the resolution of 7D etc. etc. Then he went on to insist the left image was the 7D and not the 450D. Talk about having your head in the sand. WOW!
Also, this “softness” issue is really a non-issue. Only noobs who don’t understand much will complain about it.
Quote from another person, but it sums up most of what I think:
“I am an anal pixel peeper but I don’t get fooled by the “oh, the 40D (or the XSi, XS, XT, etc.) seems sharper at 100%. There are a lot of good explanations for this phenomenon which explain that there is a difference between sharpness and resolving power. Just because an image loks sharper at 100% it does not necessarily mean that it resolves more detail than a less sharp but higher res sensor. If that was true would that make my 450D a better camera than my 7D I mean the images from my 450D may be a bit sharper at 100% than my 7D. However, it’s all about how much detail an image contains. Even if an image is sharper at 100% it doesn’t necessarily show more detail than another that looks a bit softer but everything in the picture is twice as big and more detailed.”
I have looked around a little and have considered that as an option. By the time I am ready to buy, there will probably be more used 7D bodies around. It really does seem to a great APSC camera.
Is TOO!
Seriously – how else do you explain all the pro features, extras and last but not least – its name? Of course it’s a pro body, aimed at either sports shooters as their main camera or as a back-up body for other professionals.
Well, I’m looking for the 100-400 IS II, although I really hope it is a 150-450 4.0-5.6.
135 1.8 IS
85 1.4 – with very fast AF
14-24 2.8
400 4.0 IS – not DO
3D – take the 7D, put in 18mp FF, 8 FPS, Pro 45 point AF, full weather-seals, optional wireless grip, flash commander.
Then I would get a 7D and a 3D.
Add a…..50 1.4 II
And might as well finish the 35 1.4 II
more interested in the lenses at this point…
My, I really wish people will start using common sense one of these days. That guy would be me, I guess, so let me explain and maybe this time you’ll get a better hold of what I’m saying. I said that there is a possibility that the pictures were altered in a way we weren’t informed about.. If that is not the case, I firmly believe the sharper image comes from a Rebel body. Get that?
In case anybody is wondering how I arrived at this conclusion, let me point something out: Just how many people have ever complained about diffraction on any particular Rebel body? Now compare that number with the number of people who are not happy with the 7D solely because of the diffraction coming into play too early on the aperture scale. I am one of them and yes, I have used the cam. Feature-wise, it’s awesome. But it falls short in what matters the most; the IQ. But that’s my opinion, feel free to disagree. Back to the reasoning.. Have you by any chance noticed the keyword for that comparison image? Diffraction, yeah. Does it make sense to show a diffraction comparison of a relatively unaffected Rebel and a 7D with its well known issues? Therefore, until somebody proves me wrong, I say the left image comes from 7D.
Ok, enough of my ramblings. Peace :)
Firstly, we agree the D3s rocks and is much better than the 1D4?
That also means we agree Nikon has the sensor design technology now, ya?
Alright, now look at the recently released D300s. It is 12 MP APS-C.
And the D300s is NOT any better than the 7D. Without the in-camera RAW NR of the D90/D5000, the D300s nearly represents the pinnacle of APS-C sensor technology… until it gets knocked out by the 7D.
Name me ONE APS-C sensor that is better than the 18 MP 7D WITHOUT resorting to in-camera RAW NR (like the D90/D5000 and Pentax K-x).
WRONG. At f/11 BOTH the 12 MP 450D and 18 MP 7D are already affected by diffraction.
And again, you’re wrong. I own both 450D and 7D (still do) and I took those comparison shots. So, the 450D is indeed the one on the left. Goes to show what an idiot Darwin Wiggett is, regardless of how good his professional photos are.
People keep throwing that D word around because they have no idea what they’re talking about. I bet you when Nikon releases their 18 MP D400, everyone will just clam up. It’s all about insecurity. It was the same way when the 5D was released? People were complaining about (i) corner softness (ii) vignetting (iii) poor dynamic range (!!!) (iv) FF belongs to a by-gone era and will disappear from the photography scene altogether (v) plastic Canon images. Do you hear any of these things now? Perhaps, we should start talking about plastic Sony images, plastic Pentax images and plastic Nikon images now. ;)
Alright, I humbly stand corrected.
That being said, I have also used both cameras (although I don’t own the 7D and most likely never will), and I can tell you that my experience is very different from yours.
But enough of this. I never said the 7D is a bad camera, I am simply voicing my opinion that it is not suited for my needs. Some people agree, some don’t.
I’ll also answer your other question from way above: I can’t really name a crop camera with better high ISO performance than 7D. Never blamed the 7D of poor ISO performance, did I? My only gripe with this camera is the softness it exhibits; nothing less, nothing more.
I want a 7Ds (FF).
Give it 15 – 30 MP FF sensor, I wouldn’t mind anything in that range if it has all the features of the 7D with FF. That camera would be worth $3000 to me (maybe more).
Check this site out and tell me it’s not a pro level body: http://canonfieldreviews.com/7d-1-weather-sealing/
It will be interesting to see how Canon places the 60D with respect to the 7D.
Regarding the lenses, the 100-400 and 24-70 f2.8 are due for an update!
Play that 3D a bit different:
scale both imaging sensor as well as the AF/metering-module to FF.
Add spot metering linked to the AF point to both 3D and 7D – after all the center region can do it, and the metering grid is evenly spread, and the matrix metering already uses the functionality. Adding a CF that switches from spot to “matrix without factoring in any measurements apart from the cell under the selected point” should be trivial.
That would be something that looks good when compared to a D700 and probably its successor while still leaving some separating room to the 1D(s).
Canon EOS 2000D and EOS 6000D?
By PR admin | January 18, 2010
Tis rumor is brought to you directly by Canon – go to this URL:
http://www.canon.nl/Support/Consumer_Products/products/printers/Compact_Photo/ES_series/SELPHY_ES2.aspx?faqtcmuri=tcm:16-540751&page=1&type=faq
This is a site that shows cameras compatibility with Windows XP SP3. On the bottom of he page, click on “klik hier om alle modellen modellen te zien” which means click here to see all models and scroll down to the EOS models:
It is good to know that the new Canon EOS 2000D and the Canon EOS 6000D will be compatible with Windows XP
The only ‘issue’ with 7D is you really need to mount good lenses on it. :)
If you don’t wish to splurge on good lenses, then you can always shoot mRAW or downscale the pics to 12 MP. All that softness will suddenly disappear with poorer lenses.
IMO, these lenses need to be released:
14-24 f/2.8L USM
24-70 f/2.8L IS USM
100-400 f/4-5.6L IS USM Mk2
35 f/2 ring USM
50 f/1.4 ring USM
You won’t see the 3D any time soon ‘cos the 5D2 is selling very well.
The 7D was thrown into the market only because the 50D was a poor seller.
PhotoRumors is talking about 2000D and 6000D. See here: http://photorumors.com/2010/01/18/canon-eos-2000d-and-eos-6000d/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+PhotoRumors+%28PhotoRumors.com%29&utm_content=Google+Reader
cant wait!
Canon currently have a huge gap between the 500D and 7D. They need a camera costing around £800-1000 with a kit lens.
On the three lenses…
What I want: 14-24mm f/4L USM for $1000-1200. What we’ll get: 14-24mm f/2.8L USM for $1600
What I want: 100-300mm f/4L IS USM for $1200-1400. What we’ll get: 100-400mm f/4-5.6L II IS USM for $1600-1800.
What I want: 35, 40 or 45mm f/3.5L TS-E for $1000-1200. What we’ll get: 24-70mm f/2.8L II IS USM for $1600-1800.
try using a good lens + microadjustement
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos7d/page21.asp 7d vs 50d (that’s dpreview) and you can download the whole JPG. they used a EF 50 f/1.4. here are the FF’s: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos5dmarkii/page29.asp EF 85 f/1.8 used.
All 4 test shot at ISO 100, f/9
I guess IQ wise talking about the 7D you are missing a point here. dpreview shows both experiences.
what is a way to determine weather it’s PRO- or NON-PRO- body????
i mean to your opinion
the way to determine it is to ask a canon official, like one of the bosses in Canon Norway: “EOS 7D embraces very wide, it is suitable for all, from beginners to pros.” “Although we do not promote EOS 7D as a professional camera, it is a pro camera at amateur price. You get metering and autofocus of the highest class.”
http://translate.google.no/translate?hl=no&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.foto.no%2Fcgi-bin%2Farticles%2FarticleView.cgi%3FarticleId%3D42484
3D, where art thou..
“still has that pro look that the soccer moms want”
I’m so sure people buy cameras because of how they look. If that were the case all the soccer moms would be shooting Pentax with their rainbow assortment of colors to choose from.
It also fails to list the 5Dmk2
not sure this is that good of a list
Thank you, but I was asking Joe, he says 7D is not a pro body. I wounder how can he determine that?
yeah, I meant it only as a follow-up..;-)
50D.
The 7D’s resolution is limited by:
– Quality of the lens. This sensor has the smallest pixel pitch of any Canon DSLR sensor ever produced.
– Stability of the camera (forget the old “reciprocal of the focal length” rule, it’s more like double that if you want it really clean at the per-pixel level)
– eventually, at very small apertures, diffraction
With unprocessed RAW output, I don’t understand how a sensor itsself can be “soft” or “sharp”; it’s just sampling whatever image lands on it.
50D has no video.
A question, If canon wanted to keep pushing the pixel marketing envelope might there space for say a 20MP APS-C with a top ISO of 6400 – Good headlines even if its not what’s wanted by us rumour chasers.
I hope not, i want either and or both of bigger pixel sites (FF), better high ISO.
I agree.
Personally, I think Canon has already driven off the Megapixel race cliff.
What’s funny is they are racing themselves as Nikon and Canon customers like me roll their eyes !
Thats a good point. By:
-Removing wireless flash controller
-Reducing VF size
-Using ~50Dish weather sealing
Canon could probably slice enough bucks off to come up with a model priced between the 500D and the 7D. After all, whats the target price? USD1300? Plausible.
Although it’ll most probably have a 15MP sensor. If the 500D is 15MP, and the 7D 18MP, do we honestly see Canon making a 12MP dip in between? Nope.
D3s has better IQ than the 1d4. It is full frame so in all cases it is easier to make a full frame camera have better iq than a non full frame.
You can’t compare how good a companies sensor technology when you aren’t comparing apples to apples in the same generation.
Anyways!
While I don’t agree with your stance on the 7d not being able to resolve detail. I had the 7d , upgraded to the 1d4… and often wonder why I don’t go back to the 7d (price / performance ).. I have 5d II also btw. I think it’s an amazing camera for it’s price point.
I do agree it would be great if with the 60d Canon decided to lower or keep the mp the same and start showing off their sensor engineering.
Also known as, I want good stuff, but I don’t want to pay full price for it.
If you really want cheaper stuff, give your Congressman a call, and tell him to stop printing so much money. The moment the greenback goes up against the yen, you can bet these things will be cheaper.
What Andrea really needs is a DSLR w/ a 1-pixel sensor, so it would get really, really sharp images and would get up to ISO 1,000,000,000,000 w/ little noise…
I don’t understand.
If you don’t like those pixels, Canon gives you the option to shoot mRAW or downsize your photos. All your ‘soft’ lenses suddenly become sharp and noise at the pixel level is reduced. So, what’s the problem???
When Nikon releases an 18 MP D400, will that shut everyone up? I bet no ones dares to utter the D word ever again, the same no one ever talks about FF being a niche market after the D3 was released. :) Oh, what about bad vignetting with FF lenses. :) Where did all that go?
The thing people with selective information processing decide to ignore is that they are finding ways to make their sensors work better as they are increasing the mp. It’s funny how many people think 12mp is the holy grail just because Nikon was stuck on 12mp for a long time.
If the d400 or d4 become 16-18 mp I bet the same people will be like OMG NIKON IS THE BEST IT RAISED TO 18mp!!!!!
If Canon decided to bring themselves down and stop trying to continually push the bar with both the technology behind the sensor and the megapixels in it I’m pretty sure they could atleast match if not beat Nikon hands down in 100% crop pixel peeping goodness.
Um, no, that was not a screed that Canon stuff is too expensive. I don’t mind paying full price. It was rather an outlook that Canon is unlikely to make the lenses for which I’m wishing. On the wide angle, I don’t want the bulk of f/2.8 for hiking and an f/4 should be less expensive since it requires smaller elements. For the telephoto, $1200-1400 would be reasonable for a 100-300 f/4 with IS. I just don’t like the 100-400 because of the push-pull design and the fact it is not constant maximum aperture. For the normal I’d like to see a mark II of the wide angle to normal range that is not prohibitively expensive. The current model is in the same price range.
Your English is much better than my German. You bring up a point you’ve read about that others have documented (http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Canon-EOS-7D-Digital-SLR-Camera-Review.aspx), and people jump all over you.
When did people on the internet get so nasty?
(I think circa 2002.)
AA filters
I am a new follower to this site and enjoy reading of the Canon Rumors. I have a 40D and am very happy with it – except the low light situations in an arena where a flash isn’t always great. So Im still holding out that a 3D might be released. For me it doesn’t make sense to just upgrade to another crop IF there might be a better FF coming out which will cater to those of us who need the better AF and speed.
For those of you complaining about soft images and low quality… perhaps practice more! The camera is just 1/2 of the photograph equation. If you dont know how to properly use it you wont get the quality it is capable of!
Happy shooting :)
what is “pro”?
i had a shot taken with a canon powershot s70 used in the london times.
what is pro?
enoughhhhhhh with 60D…that’s just a rumor!
this is the new rumor…
aside from 1Ds4…the new camera will be 7Ds
with APSH sensor!!!! nice!…
amen.
I like the push/pull design.
Good point….spot metering should be linked to the AF point
Bring it !! Bring it, Canon !
You make up your own premise referencing Nikon and people stuck on 12Mpixels, then you create an argument around it. Your crazy.
If you find that increasing Megapixels while keeping ISO sensitivity noise constant is progress, then yes, Canon is doing the right thing by you.
Locked into Canon, I have more than enough Megapixels using my 8Mpixel Canon 30D for 95% of my shots – and I do lots of cropping.
I agree using mRAW is a clever way to do in-camera noise and sharpness improvements. I rather do all my image processing outside the camera and use RAW for it’s intended use – off sensor data.
What is it with bringing up Nikon in every criticism of Canon? You’re nothing but a Canon apologist in love with a brand. I’m just a customer.
No, he’s not crazy. Nikon currently has 9 or 10 12MP DSLRs. That is why their fanbois keep on saying “12MP is enough for me”, since Nikon only has 1 DSLR that goes past 12MP. Same thing when the 5D was released in 2005. Every Nikon fankid on DPR kept saying DX was the future since it “gets to use the best central part out of the lenses”. Of course, that argument disappeared in 2007 :P.
Then you shouldn’t be using any Nikon/Sony or Pentax DSLR then. They all use cooked RAW for NR purposes so their output would get good reviews in DPR.
APS H Plus 21mpix ( o no )
It’s not about the color. It’s about being the best on the field. To the soccer moms, the xxD series is definitely better than the rebel series, you can see it. It is all a competition, and the xxD pricepoint allows them to rationalize it. Even though it is just going to be used on auto with the popup flash and kit lens. Don’t get me wrong, the xxDs are great cameras. I own a 40D. Canon has changed its target audience though. It used to be for prosumers out in the field taking wildlife and sports photos. Now the 7D has that covered and canon is just raising the bar for everyone a little. So now its either for the soccer mom type that want a better camera, but don’t know how to use it, or the prosumer who does know how to use it, but can’t afford better. I am including myself in the latter cadre.
My 60D wish list:
12mp
720p 30fps video (1080p would be nicer)
improved noise reduction over 40D
920,000 pixel display
higher ISO
external flash control(like 7D)
< $1,200 (street price)
For those of you wanting LESS megapixels. Check out latest rumor at Northlight. “18th A recent 60D comment also suggested that the 1Ds4 was due next month at 21MP.
Hmmm …Unless it’s 21MP of very special pixels (full colour) I can’t see Canon’s flagship SLR trailing Nikon and Sony in the MP counts…”
While I find it unlikely that Canon would release their professional 1Ds Mark IV with less than 30 MP it makes you wonder. What they might have up their sleeves.
You do not own a 7D and apparently have never used one. Did you gain all this knowledge about the 7d reading items also written by someone who did not own one, or didn’t know how to use it.
The first few images I took with mine were a bit disappointing, it turned out that i wasn’t using the new AF correctly. After that, it was excellent. It is not the image quality of my 5d MK II, but the price is a lot less too.
heh
If Pro’s use it, its a pro body. This makes most DSLR’s pro bodies, and even some point and shoot cameras.
Yes, I know people who make a decent income using a point and shoot. They travel around with their studio trailer and setup a photo area making photo T-Shirts and photo coffee mugs at fairs and events.
A lot of companies don’t seem to. At least it’s reasonably specific, as opposed to “Q2” which could be anywhere from February to July.
Oh wow. If diffraction is a problem on one camera and not another, that is about the best proof you can have that the camera with the diffraction “problem” is out-resolving the one with “no problem.” Why? Because diffraction is purely a function of the lens. If you use the same lens with the same aperture, you will have *exactly* the same amount of diffraction in the light falling on the sensor. Now, whether you can *see* the diffraction is another matter – the one that can’t see it is being limited by other factors, whereas the one that can has sufficient resolving power to, well, see it. So I’m afraid you have it exactly backwards (but you’re hardly alone as many many people seem to be confused about diffraction.)
Another misconception about diffraction (though you’re not guilty of this one insofar as I can see): It’s not even that the camera “needs” a better lens; it’s just that it will do better with a better lens, whereas the other camera won’t (and even that isn’t the complete story, because the “limits” of lenses and sensors aren’t hard barriers – you stand to gain until one is about 2x better than the “limit” of the other. Look up Nyquist–Shannon sampling theorem for more.)
You joke, but such a beast (a single pixel camera) already exists: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6263551.stm
If you’re interested you can even download the data sets (i.e. RAW files) from the research group that created it: http://dsp.rice.edu/cscamera
Have the same dilemma. My purchase horizon is a little earlier(with early spring trips to national parks planned). I’m waiting for this Feb 9th announcement. If a decent sounding 60D is presented I may rent for my spring trips and buy the 60D when it is released, otherwise I may be buying a 7D on Feb 10th(grrrr as a few hundred bucks run away which otherwise would have been used on glass)
LOL! Thanks dear. I’ll immediately buy one.
Hoping that the viewfinder could be big enough, and with 100% coverage, obviously :)
It is funny to see how people are linked to this brand. I own and use Canon (and when I started using Canon, I thought it was the best). I simply don’t think it anymore but it is not a dram. Most of us are obliged to buy the same brand because we have lenses. Otherwise most of us (I think) would buy a Nikon, a Canon, a Nikon, a Canon and so on, unless one brand makes the best model. But camera market doesn’t allow you to do this without loosing a lot of money. Canon, Nikon: who cares? I prefer to be free and think that there are times when Canon is better but there are also times (now IMO) that Nikon is better. This was probably less true in the past because (always IMO) Canon was an absolute leader.
See you (I’ll send you some of my 1 pixel snaps, just to have your opinion on the REAL SHARPNESS. Thank you in advance).
You’re absolutely right. I was very close to buy one and I live in a very small town in which no one as a 7D, nor I know anybody that owns one. I’m letting speak my eyes, for what I saw on the web. (But I grant you that I’m really indecise about buying it or not – I’m waiting for something that better matches my needs. And, well, I’m only saying that from a xD class camera I was expecting more, not that the 7D is horrible. If I consider the price I could even say it is half a miracle).
Bye
Bingoooo.you’re a genius. Nikon doesn’t have sensor technology..they are relying on Sony. Canon kicks their butt!!!.
adios..
It started twenty-odd years before then, on Usenet.
Nikon is producing their own sensors now i.e. in the D3, D3S. Note that Canon is also now using a Sony sensor in the G11.
SOMEONE SAY SHARP ONE MORE TIME
The 7D does sound like a fantastic camera. The reviews by the “experts” and owners are very positive. People continue to rave about the new AF system–which is what why I am interested in it. Depending on which National Park you are going to, that new AF system could be well worth it. A couple of years ago I went to Yellowstone with two terrible binoculars and because of that, I now have a very, very nice pair of binoculars and a very nice spotting scope (highly recommended for Yellowstone). My point is, I did not spend the money before my trip and I regretted it, so maybe the 7D would actually be better…but it would be nice to have the extra few hundred toward a lens…300 f4, 400f5.6?
Agree. The 7d could have been even better if the camera had a weaker AA filter.
But DPReview’s tests don’t lie: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos7d/page29.asp
The 7D sensor clearly resolves more detail than any other APS-C DSLR on the market, strong AA filter or not.
If you’re not getting sharp results from the 7D, I don’t think the problem is the sensor…
Not too long to wait for a GOOD rumor
I think CR guy has a better filter himself these days :-)
September
Get faster lenses :-)
SHARP!
Regarding AA-filters and slight diffraction problems:
try RAW Therapee, or anything that offers deconvolution as a sharpening technique.
It takes a lot of processing power, but deals nicely with blurs that have well known causes.
Yes. Very SHARP
Then you don’t know anything about cameras. Just buy some P&S. 7D is not for you.
Don’t see it, 7D with a bigger sensor would obviously cost more than 7D so how could it be marketed as a lower-level xxD body? If 60D is going to have ASC-H sensor it’s not going to share a lot of features with 7D to sell for a reasonable price.
*135 1.8 IS
Why do you need IS on a studio, portrait lens?
*85 1.4 – with very fast AF
Makes some sense but I don’t think Canon would make three different 85mm lenses
*3D – take the 7D, put in 18mp FF, 8 FPS, Pro 45 point AF, full weather-seals, optional wireless grip, flash commander.
That’s 5DIII. Stop dreaming and fantasizing about 3D. You made it into this fantasy camera where there is absolutely no reliable information about it at all. My guess is that if 3D will even be manufactured it will be to 1D what 7D is to 4D.
Well it does have the best IQ of all the APS-C cameras.
Show me one that is better.
You can’t expect miracle.
Now if you wish they had used the 5D2 sensor in it (and reduced fps to 6.3) then that is another matter. I”m sure many people wish that.
Wish you were in charge of Canon Lens division! :)
Maybe toss in a 400 f/5.6 IS to the mix too.
Obviously my post was in response to those who are dreaming of a plastic body for the xxD.
That’s why the xxD line is made of Mg alloy bodies.
There will be not enough distinction between the xxD and rebels if they make the xxD plastic.
Even if they produce their own sensors, the fact remains they have been stuck in 12mp land for a long time already.
canon already has a 15mp sensor. They could improve SNR why settle for less.
I bring up Nikon because that is what EVERYONE looks up to for that sense of security. :D
LOL WHAT’S SHARPER:
1. 50MM F/1.2 SHOT AT F/2.8 ON A 7D
2. EDGE OF A 5DMKII FRAME SHOT WITH A 16-35L AT 2.8
3. ANY 1DMKIII IMAGE. WELL PERHAPS WITH A 50 1.2 THE FOCUSING ISSUES OF BOTH WOULD COUNTER EACH OTHER AND PRODUCE FOCUSED SHOTS???
7D IS A SMOOTH CRIMINAL!!
CANON ARE YOU OK??CANON ARE YOU OK?? ARE YOU OK CANON??? YOU’VE BEEN HIT BY YOU’VE BEEN STRUCK BY SMOOTHED PIXELS! NOI-NA-NOISE-NOI-NA-NOISE-NOI-NA-NOISE-NOI-SE REDUCTION!!!
You really think that’s unintentional? Stuck is probably the wrong choice of words.
no joke!
i’m waiting to buy a 5d not before the 24-70 2.8L IS comes out!
LOL! Thank you too. I’ll be following your tipps, after having bought the 1 pixel camera and saved enough money more. :)
You were so useful to me. Many many thanks!
who’s bad?
This past December when I took my niece to Santa’s Enchanted Forest in Miami there was a photo studio there and they had tons of people walking around with powershots. They’d coerce you into taking your picture then you go to their booth where they charge you about $7 per 5×7 with a snazzy (ugly) Christmas border. 8×10’s where in the neighborhood of $15. They must have made such a killing in the one month that the fair ran for.
Ha. You’re probably right.
I’m looking to get a new camera this year, and I’m hoping the 60D is indeed coming.
My concern is that it will have an 18mp sensor, in which case why wouldn’t I just push for the 7D? For a few hundred bucks more, why not?
But then I start thinking if I’m going to pay $1700 for a camera why not just pay a little more and get the full frame 5DII? At which point I’ve jumped in price from (probably) around $1100 to $2500.
So, I’m back waiting for the 60D.
I am curious as to how large you can make prints on the 7D? If you’re shooting landscapes at F8 or smaller at what point will prints start looking noticeably softer?
If we get 35MP the MTF charts with 30 lines per mm are more or less useless: We need 60 lines per mm to get an impression about the performance of the lens.
Is there anything to hide, shall we continue to buy Zeiss instead? Zeiss-Macro 50mm f/2 seems to be the best at f/2 ???
guys…let’s move to nikon!!
I hope a FF version of 7D which is less than $4000 will be released soon. No need HD camera function, just pure DSLR will be fine for me.
I’d like it to have 18 megs, to stay in the lead. 15megs have been out for 1.5 yrs, and is no more res than our oldish 50D.
Why roll your eyes ? small res…get a 40D. For pro use, we need res.
How come, that an FF 7D would cost more than a 5DMkII? Anyone? Wouldn’t it kill the 1D line pricewise which is APS-H?
From what I understand the AF system in the 7D is far superior to the one in the 5DII, which would probably add to the cost. Not to mention the flash transmitter doohickey, and whatever else little extras the 7D has that the 5DII doesn’t.
It would seem that a FF 7D-esque camera would cut into the 1D line, which is why we may never see it.
Thanks for that charles bronson.
agreed on the 3D/7DFF.
if that gets released, it will cannibalize the 1 series.
even the 1ds only has 5fps.
–
anyway, i’m waiting for the 135 IS version (in reply to the above, because i won’t be using it in a studio, i need handheld ambient lighting IS)
50 1.4 II would be very welcome
even a 35 f2 or f1.8 is needed to match the nikkor counterpart. i’m a canon user, but i’d actually advise newbies who don’t plan to shell out on 2.8 zooms to get a nikon body and the 35, 50 and 85 1.8 primes. (i have the 35 1.4, but sometimes, it’s just simpler to bring a small lens)
85 1.4 would be welcome as well, price gap and weight gap between the 1.2 and 1.8 (which i have) is way too big. (they did it for the 50 FL, why not 85)