scyrene said:

With respect, the OP was hardly original in their position, and posting a rant on here, especially as its own thread is bound to attract comment of the type it has.

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The OP admitted to that rant, did not state a "Canon must or I switch" demand, and did in my mind seem to understand
that Canon made their choice. This would imply awareness of Canon's marketplace standing and strategies for that.

Therefore while anyone is fully entitled to respond with Canon knows better than individuals on how best to retain/increase their business position, that, as my current response, is a road travelled down so often that the trip has become tedious.

Regardless, I still read virtually all new posts since new info and forum members experiences/photos keep me mentally involved with all sorts of photography.

scyrene said:

My point is, how does audio for time lapse make sense conceptually? Do you capture audio for the duration of each still, then squish them into 1/30 sec or whatever the final frame rate is? Most time lapse that I have seen is either silent or has music/narration added afterwards.

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If you have a forest or a street it would be fine to put the atmo in real time under the images. So just using a part of the audio ... that is my intention. And this is easier to do if you have only one system which stores both and gives the data filenames showing that they are connected.

becceric said:

The sharing of that contrary viewpoint just felt like a very well read, oft repeated statement that did not further anything. Beating a dead horse.

About as redundant as what I just wrote.

And, well, a TS-R 14mm could very well be an item coursing through my neural pathways.

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With respect, the OP was hardly original in their position, and posting a rant on here, especially as its own thread is bound to attract comment of the type it has.

neuroanatomist said:

As long as it stays inside. LHe is also used to cool the coils in an MRI (an NMR with a bigger bore), like this 7 T / 30 cm bore magnet I 'bought' (with corporate funds, obviously) for small-animal imaging.

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We have a thread for small animal images (https://www.canonrumors.com/forum/threads/small-mammals.37405/) as long as they are not too big a bore.

m4ndr4ke said:

My guesses are the 28 2.8 and the 45 or 50 1.8. Non-IS, non-macro, classic focal lengths budget lenses.

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Yeah I also thought about the 28 STM as alternative to the 24 STM; but I'm totally guessing, maybe they'll give us just the 50 STM and and a cheap zoom like the 24-105, or if they want to go expensive the 28-70 STM but I don't know, I don't see too many retro lenses purchases if they redress 1000€ lenses.
But a 24/28, 45/50 and 85 retro triad would be cool, before sharp f2.8 std zooms you were doing and entire wedding with those three focals.

neuroanatomist said:

While it's unlikely that he will provide such data, even if he does I'd take it with a grain of salt.

Earlier this year, @CJaurelius provided some data to back up his statement that MILC prices were 'exploding'. He conveniently stopped at 2022, and left out the data for 2023 and 2024 that showed prices had flattened (they are still essentially flat through the latest CIPA data from October, 2025).

https://www.canonrumors.com/forum/threads/japan-bcn-sales-for-january-2025.44356/post-1020633

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As usual you try to pick out one item and ignore the overall argument as it was more nuanced.

CJaurelius said:

I think it's clear that the prices of individual cameras haven't tripled. The reason the average unit price is going up so fast is becuase mix of cameras sold each year is skewing toward more expensive cameras. If you sell 3 R50's and 1 R1 then the next year you sell 2 R50's and 2R1's the unit price jumps 50% even if they sell for the same price each year.

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CJaurelius said:

As I mentioned before it's not really just the price point but the actual type of camera. The bottom of the market is continuing to be eroded to competition. Cameras are getting more specialized to differentiate and compete. The market is become more niche by the day.

Even the fixed lens point and shoot crowd is moving upstream. The Powershot V1 cost more than an R50. If point and shoots are nearing $1k I think the trend line is a bit faster than you think.

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And I think the point I was making still stands today. Right now the latest CIPA report shows the value of all cameras shipped up on a price per unit year to date. The next couple months will be telling.

The companies financial statements reflect the same. Canon's sales revenue for example is going up faster than units sold indicating the price per unit is going up. Fuji's latest quarter revnue was up an insane 25% but not sure about their sales yet. However I doubt they grew sales by as much and instead sold a lot of higher priced cameras.

The outlier seems to be Nikon. They are taking the value approach in an effort to claw back market share. It will be interesting to see if that works.

I have done a Sydney SBD architecture walkaround shoot. Handheld as I would need a tripod side extension to avoid the tripod legs. Composition is really hard plus avoiding fingers on the body and toes and still trying to get horizon or other building alignment. Massive dynamic range as the sun was in a number of shots so exposing to the right and then bringing up shadows multiple stops was challenging plus some object removal. Hard circular cropping got rid of the edge aberrations and/or slight re-centering of the composition and still >8mm focal length.

That said, I was really happy with the results (see my Instagram). Small changes in physical location changed the comp so much that next time I will take more shots moving a little in different directions. Well worth the AUD500 (~USD300)

AlanF said:

As long as you keep it below 4.2K it's a liquid and lasts quite a while in a cryostat.

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As long as it stays inside. LHe is also used to cool the coils in an MRI (an NMR with a bigger bore), like this 7 T / 30 cm bore magnet I 'bought' (with corporate funds, obviously) for small-animal imaging.



The other thing that helps keep the coils cold is mylar insulation. Lots of mylar insulation. How do I know that? Pro tip to anyone installing a system like this...when first filling it with LHE, remember to open the pressure relief valve that is closed during transport. What happens when the team doing the install doesn't is...



The cylinder itself is pretty tough, most of the force of the explosion went out through the control box in back, the access door for which is seen in the bottom right image after being blown through the wall behind the magnet. Fortunately this happened at about 4 AM so no one was injured. Bruker replaced the magnet they destroyed (and paid to fix the room). The second install went fine.

Maximilian said:

But the camera sealing must be very good then. Not to avoid dust/moisture getting in, but H2 He from getting out.

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As long as you keep it below 4.2K it's a liquid and lasts quite a while in a cryostat. And, you can add a Gifford-McMahon refrigerator to condense any that boils off. Actually, detectors for far IR etc in the Herschl Space Observatory and the Planck HFI use liquid He at 0.1-1.7K. Professional observatory CCDs are cooled to 150-170K with liquid N.

Maximilian said:

But the camera sealing must be very good then. Not to avoid dust/moisture getting in, but H2 from getting out.

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That would be He . It is even sneakier than H2.

AlanF said:

We use liquid helium at 4.2K to cool our NMR coils. Might be a bit inconvenient for a camera sensor but should eliminate most of the circuit noise at low iso.

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Convenience be damned. Go for max DR.

Maximilian said:

If you know so much better than Canon developers (read the patent) why not apply at their R&D?
If they know better what they‘re doing, it seems that my argumentation is closer to their developments and patents than yours.

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I never suggested that I know better than Canon developers. I just suggested that liquid cooling could a viable possibility (with some obvious hurdles to be overcome). Graphene is a unique material and clearly an interesting choice for the application. I suspect Canon's engineers would avoid the complexity of liquid cooling if at all possible and that makes tons of sense. You do seem a bit cranky about your rather absolutist statement being corrected. Sorry if I hurt your feelings.

We use liquid helium at 4.2K to cool our NMR coils. Might be a bit inconvenient for a camera sensor but should eliminate most of the circuit noise at low iso.

Maximilian said:

The better the longer the heat pipe is, I know.
But how long could it be inside a camera body?
And how many flexible heat pipes do you know?
Just imagine way the patent mentions metal or graphene/graphite strips.

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Graphene is useful in this context because of its anisotropic thermal behavior (over 100 times more lateral heat flow than vertical). It sort of resembles a solid-state heat pipe. Flexible heat pipes are possible but not common, but liquid lines can be very flexible and that was where I started this discussion.

Maximilian said:

I don’t understand why you‘re trying to explain air cooling to me, When I already explained it.
To original topic was liquid vs. solid body heat transfer.
Of course, all heat losses have to be transferred to air - in the end.
Or do you have your private river in your camera bag.

Again: „heat transfer“ is what I argue about.

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I was responding to your statement "Liquids are used to cool CPUs because those are better than air (!!!). But worse than solid metals". I was simply pointing out that moving (or boiling as in vapor phase) liquids can be more efficient at heat transfer than the best of metals. You used your "passively" cooled CPU as an example, but you would have a hard time "passively" (i.e. conductively) cooling an RTX 5090, no matter how big the block of copper. Vapor phase or liquid are the only practical means that will move 600 watts from an area that small while keeping the temp under 100 deg. So, yes I was talking about heat transfer (and disagreeing with your statement).

Maximilian said:

Liquids are used to cool CPUs because those are better than air (!!!). But worse than solid metals.
Just with air the heat sink would become too big for most.
I have fully passive cooled PC with a heat sink filling almost half of the PC housing.
Guess what‘s the connection between CPU and heat sink?
Yes! Massive copper bars!!!

Liquid cooling is cheaper to bridge the (longer) distance between heat source and sink in most other applications.
And for convection (passive or pumped) you‘ll Need space.

I know what I‘m talking about because I work a lot with power semi conductors like IGBTs.

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Unless you have a river handy, the heat has to be eventually dissipated to air. Some metals have great conductivity, but typically, the closer you can get a moving liquid to the heat source (i.e. the less metal in the way), the better the result will be. Your "passive" cooled CPU is still air convection cooled. The massive blob of metal is just an extended heat spreader. CPU "air coolers" actually use vapor phase cooling, which can be fully as efficient as liquid cooling, but for CPUs, water cooling has more capacity, simply because you can get more surface area on a radiator (for that final connection to the air) than will fit on top of the CPU "air" cooler. I, too, have cooled many power Semis over the years along with some engines and other things that make heat and noise.

P-visie said:

Do you have any data to back up that statement? Sony had a 28.5% market share of camera’s sold in 2024. That is about 2.33 million camera’s……

Source: The Nikkei Industry Map 2026 via Sony Alpha Rumors.

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While it's unlikely that he will provide such data, even if he does I'd take it with a grain of salt.

Earlier this year, @CJaurelius provided some data to back up his statement that MILC prices were 'exploding'. He conveniently stopped at 2022, and left out the data for 2023 and 2024 that showed prices had flattened (they are still essentially flat through the latest CIPA data from October, 2025).

AlanF said:

The convection and heat effects on refractive index would be just like those on using a long telephoto lens on a hot summer's day with the sun baking the ground!

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Yes, front side liquid cooling would be a challenge. If a proper seal could be made, backside liquid cooling is a possibility. Just think, a micro-miniature CPU cooler, pump and all . It could be very lightweight and would not be subject to dust like a fan. The coolant hoses would likely be more flexible than the graphene strips in the patent.

Dragon said:

Liquids don't have great conductivity, but they make up for that with convection (i.e. they move). This is why water cooling is the most efficient way to cool your CPU (in that case, forced convection with a pump). The catch with liquid cooling would be managing the refractive index of the liquid (and avoiding bubbles)

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The convection and heat effects on refractive index would be just like those on using a long telephoto lens on a hot summer's day with the sun baking the ground!

Maximilian said:

Thanks for sharing @Richard CR

I hope they can keep fans or else away from the body by the use of that - at least for stills mainly cams. I'm not interested in long time video, but others are.


The thermal conductivity λ (lambda, GER) or κ (kappa, INT) of copper is ~ 380 W/(m·K), the one of oil 0,15 W/(m·K) and of water 0,5562 W/(m·K).
So many metals are about 600 to 1000 times more effective in thermal conductivity than liquids.
Silver would be the best metal (429), graphene (5300) the highest mentioned in (GER) wiki.

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Liquids don't have great conductivity, but they make up for that with convection (i.e. they move). This is why water cooling is the most efficient way to cool your CPU (in that case, forced convection with a pump). The catch with liquid cooling would be managing the refractive index of the liquid (and avoiding bubbles)

CJaurelius said:

A large part of the Sony customer base isn't hobbyist like what you see here. Their base is comprized of content creators and Youtuber's using their cameras to try and make a living.

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I think this is very far from reality

P-visie said:

Sony had a 28.5% market share of camera’s sold in 2024. That is about 2.33 million camera’s

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Many of those are 5-to-9 joes like me and some random people with moderate to high interest in photography.

DhlcadR6 said:

I'm curious if it'll be better to use oil/liquid cool. The fluid itself can dampen the sensor, and wouldn't the cooling be more effective as there's more surface to conduct the heat away from CMOS.

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IBIS is not the dampen the sensor. It is trying to counter act the whole camera moving in people handheld situation. Anyways those liquid are not good heat conductors.

CJaurelius said:

A large part of the Sony customer base isn't hobbyist like what you see here. Their base is comprized of content creators and Youtuber's using their cameras to try and make a living.

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Do you have any data to back up that statement? Sony had a 28.5% market share of camera’s sold in 2024. That is about 2.33 million camera’s……

Source: The Nikkei Industry Map 2026 via Sony Alpha Rumors.

Walrus said:

They'll probably re-dress the 45 STM because it's perfect as a retro lens and it's cheap for what it is, maybe the 24 STM, possibly the 85 F2, I don't see many other options,

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My guesses are the 28 2.8 and the 45 or 50 1.8. Non-IS, non-macro, classic focal lengths budget lenses.

A great article overall, and I think Canon Rumours is a great place to centralize material such as this. Canon's technical archives are the source of truth, of course, but this is convenient and fun.

Personally, I find that even with the amazing AF capabilities in today's R series cameras I still find myself using manual override at rodeos, marshes, wheat fields, etc. I've kept my EF lens stable as a result, and as much as I do appreciate the RF lenses for many factors I simply cannot justify to myself plunking down $1-$6k on anything that does not offer manual focus override without first needing to hit a power button after a moment. Plenty of other toys to get instead. The EF lenses at the L tier are plenty fine for many modern photos, and instant manual is awesome. It really sucked to see RF lens focusing tech partially step back to 1987 when the lenses were first released. If instant manual override returned to the RF line without the need to wake the camera up I would very much seriously consider a lens replacement spree. For now, every so often a Canadian retailer offers stuff like the 50mm f/1.2 for 50% off due to overstock. Unless someone needs the latest and greatest for what they do, it's hard to beat those kinds of deals.

On the other hand, I haven't really turned the ring on many RF lenses this last year. Maybe someone here has and can pleasantly surprise me with a, "hey, check out the XYZ -- it works just like the EF XYZ L USM but sharper, faster, more rainbow-y and also manual MFs with a twist and a dead battery" remark.

But, no doubt, purely from an engineering nerd perspective the advancements are cool!