5Diii vs Sony A7s vs GH4

[MichaelTheMaven]

Hey guys, Im planning a comparison video between the 5Diii, A7s and GH4. I have gotten a lot of good insight from you all in the past, but I am opening this up to suggestions you might want to see?

I looked at the GH4 and have one now, it is very impressive for video work. (Like amazingly). It ran into issues with sports focusing.

What tests would you guys like to in a match-up between these three other than the typical ones I normally do:

- ISO Noise
- Sports Shooting
- Dynamic Range
- HDR
- Portrait Comparison
- Video Moire
- Etc?

I thank you in advance!

Michael

 

[captainkanji]

I liked the low light focus test you did with the 6D and D600. Seeing as how the Sony is supposedly the new king of low light, this would interest me.

 

[LostBoyNZ]

I'd love an astrophotgraphy comparison, but that might be complicated. I'd love to see how each one does with say a 30 second exposure of the sky, in particular how high you can push it with the A7s compared to the others.

 

[Renaissance]

Just make sure to specify how much sharpening you do in post to the 5dmk3 footage.
I have been shooting it against the GH4 too, and I find that I prefer the 5d footage for portraits,
especially close-ups. Also, the 5d looks for cinematic and filmic, while the GH4 is looking too video-ish.
I like the GH4 though for high-detail nature work, or sports, but I don't prefer it for my style of narrative video work.

 

[pedro]

Please do a High ISO noise test in RAW with the 5D3 and the A7s. With the 5D3 files downsampled to 12 MP. I'd be especially intrested in 25k, 51k, 102k streetshots...Thanks and great offer and idea! This must be a lot of fun. Regards, Peter.

 

[MichaelTheMaven]

Thank you for the input everyone- I appreciate it. I have all over you suggestions on my list.

I think the astrophotography comparison is a great idea, especially with the high ISO performance of the A7s. Ill do the low light focusing too (its rated down to -4 EV which is supposedly better than the 6D), and the noise performance tests.

Ill post any preliminary stuff here for feedback as well.

Thanks again and keep the ideas coming if you have any more

 

[LostBoyNZ]

Thanks very much! I really look forward to seeing how the cameras do

If you happen to have an EF adapter for the Sony, it'd be interesting to see an auto focus test with an EF lens too. For a lot of Canon lenses owners who like the Sony, but don't want to switch all their lenses. I've heard the auto focus was very slow on the A7r, so I assume it'll be the same here.

 

[MichaelTheMaven]

That is one thing I have already noticed about the E Mount, is that there aren't a lot of really wide aperture lenses for it, seems most of them are f4 or f2.8, only a handful of comparatively expensive 1.8s.

I have actually 2 different EF adapters I am testing, one has Autofocus, I hear it is a little slow, but I will definitely test it, I have a bunch of wide aperture Canon glass Ill put on it.

Now if only that Shogun Recorder was available....

 

[mrsfotografie]

That is one thing I have already noticed about the E Mount, is that there aren't a lot of really wide aperture lenses for it, seems most of them are f4 or f2.8, only a handful of comparatively expensive 1.8s.

I have actually 2 different EF adapters I am testing, one has Autofocus, I hear it is a little slow, but I will definitely test it, I have a bunch of wide aperture Canon glass Ill put on it.

Now if only that Shogun Recorder was available....

If you're willing to accept MF for WA purposes, that suddenly opens up a world of possibilities (and affordable glass)

 

[Cheryll]

:

- ISO Noise (very interesting downsample to 12 MP)
- Sports Shooting
- Dynamic Range (Yes)
- HDR ( with internal HDR function)
- Portrait Comparison
- Video Moire
- Etc?

When you have done it, please post the link to the comparison here

 

[MichaelTheMaven]

I have the A7s in hand, also have a GH4 and 5Diii. I've done some initial testing and should have more show later tomorrow (July 2nd).

I have mixed feelings, but in my limited time playing around with it here are some thoughts:

- Great ISO performance, but the higher ISOs are indeed pretty grainy.
- Incredible Low Light focusing sensitivity. More than anything I have ever tested, but only with native Sony lenses.
- Im already wishing Sony had many more lenses made for it with very wide apertures
- Paired with the Metabones Speedbooster and wide aperture glass, it could be a low light monster, especially for video.
- The Metabones Adapter, (not the speed booster) AF pretty much did not work, at all. I might have a bad copy. I hear it is slower, but is still supposed to work, but I had no such success with it.

I was very impressed with the DR and colors it could see beyond my own eyes, as grainy as it was:

http://www.michaelthemaven.com/?postID=3288&sony-a7s-low-light-portrait-test-maxed-out-at-iso-409-600

There will probably be a sweet spot for low light portraits, but I would imagine it is around ISO 25,600.

Ill post the ISO charts later today.

 

[wickidwombat]

Thank you for the input everyone- I appreciate it. I have all over you suggestions on my list.

I think the astrophotography comparison is a great idea, especially with the high ISO performance of the A7s. Ill do the low light focusing too (its rated down to -4 EV which is supposedly better than the 6D), and the noise performance tests.

Ill post any preliminary stuff here for feedback as well.

Thanks again and keep the ideas coming if you have any more

why not give the 6D a cameo in this aspect of the comparison since its supposed to be better in low light than the 5Dmk3...

 

[MichaelTheMaven]

It is tempting to bring the 6D into the tests as the next closest competitor, the A7S is so good at low light focusing I am shocked. It has me loving it one second and being disappointed the next. Took it out for sports shooting this am. 1.5fps on servo focusing?? Really? The A7S is not a camera for sports.

Ill have to redo the ISO noise chart of the A7s vs the 5Diii (a touch out of focus), but the A7S vs GH4 Noise Chart is now up. Huge advantage to the A7s.

We resized the GH4 down to 12MB. Also, from what Ive seen, the A7s has about a 1 stop advantage over the 5Diii in higher ISOs when resized, Again Ill have the 5Diii ISO chart up soon.

http://www.michaelthemaven.com/?postID=3290&sony-a7s-vs-panasonic-gh4-iso-noise-comparison-charts

M

 

[sdsr]

- The Metabones Adapter, (not the speed booster) AF pretty much did not work, at all. I might have a bad copy. I hear it is slower, but is still supposed to work, but I had no such success with it.

AF on that adapter only works with a rather small number of lenses. A list is posted on their website (though I've found that one or two work that aren't on that list including 28mm IS and, weirdly, the new 10-18mm EF-S); maybe the lenses you used aren't included?

(But even if the AF doesn't work, you should still get EXIF data and in-camera aperture control, which for me is the main use of that adapter because Sony's mirrorless bodies - like most these days - make MF relatively easy.)

 

[Niki]

I have the A7s in hand, also have a GH4 and 5Diii. I've done some initial testing and should have more show later tomorrow (July 2nd).

I have mixed feelings, but in my limited time playing around with it here are some thoughts:

- Great ISO performance, but the higher ISOs are indeed pretty grainy.
- Incredible Low Light focusing sensitivity. More than anything I have ever tested, but only with native Sony lenses.
- Im already wishing Sony had many more lenses made for it with very wide apertures
- Paired with the Metabones Speedbooster and wide aperture glass, it could be a low light monster, especially for video.
- The Metabones Adapter, (not the speed booster) AF pretty much did not work, at all. I might have a bad copy. I hear it is slower, but is still supposed to work, but I had no such success with it.

I was very impressed with the DR and colors it could see beyond my own eyes, as grainy as it was:

http://www.michaelthemaven.com/?postID=3288&sony-a7s-low-light-portrait-test-maxed-out-at-iso-409-600

There will probably be a sweet spot for low light portraits, but I would imagine it is around ISO 25,600.

Ill post the ISO charts later today.

5d3 + m.l. for video and stills tests??

 

[npherno]

Wow, I just took a look at the A7s, and am pretty amazed. The performance of that camera is remarkable! When your sensor can take photos in the dark at ISO 80,000, that is really game changing.
Canon and Nikon should be worried--Sony's
Canon or Nikon would charge $10,000 for their camera if they had a product with these results.

Reviews-
http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/2014/07/01/the-sony-a7s-digital-camera-review-wow-period/
http://www.samhurdphotography.com/2014/gear-reviews/sony-a7s-review-sony-a7s-vs-a7r

From the WSJ:

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304558804579376172286073420

Detractors say mirrorless cameras are another futile attempt to save the camera industry from smartphones. That doesn't mean they can't keep grabbing customer attention as the technology improves. A certain segment of consumers are always likely to want something better than the masses. That's where mirrorless could erode the high-end DSLRs that Canon and Nikon have banked on as less vulnerable to the smartphone trend.

The scope for disruption could be far greater than some expect. Sony is already offering mirrorless cameras with "full frame" image sensors as large as top-end DSLR cameras. That means it's plausible high-end hobbyists and some professional photographers will make the switch in coming years.

Nikon and Canon have one big advantage—their lines of interchangeable lenses that keep longtime users loyal. If the companies are smart, they will capitalize on this by building on their currently minimal offerings of mirrorless cameras that can use their existing lenses.

Japan's digital camera makers were blindsided by the impact of smartphones on the industry. They should have no excuse if they let technology pass them over again.



Luminous Landscape writes:

“DSLRs will diminish in market share and likely will become a niche product for wealthy enthusiasts. Mainstream enthusiasts will move to so-called mirrorless system cameras and the mass market will happily take pictures with their smartphones while uploading them in real-time to Facebook.
Sony has seen the writing on the wall better than most. So have Olympus, Fuji and Panasonic. Nikon and Canon have had an ostrich-like mentality and are therefore about to be side-swiped by a market shift of tsunami proportions. Unless their market planners grow the cojones needed to adapt to the changing marketplace, in a few short years there’ll be a lot of executives in Japan staring out the window at a train that has swiftly left the station.”


I can't find the article, but a Sony VP said that they wanted to be number two in the camera market in say 5 years.

If they keep up the innovation, I think they have a chance. They are really making cameras people want, with great new technology. I bought a NEX5 for its size and image quality, and its great (save for the menu system).

Apparently I am not the only one wondering if my next camera will be a Canon.
Look here--
http://www.michaelfrye.com/landscape-photography-blog/2014/04/18/sony-a7r/
http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/has-sony-finally-gained-the-right-momentum-to-challenge-nikon-and-canon/

 

[MichaelTheMaven]

Those are some great reviews you shared- thank you!

The A7S is growing on me the more I shoot with it. Did lots of sports type tests and there are a few weird things Im seeing. Definitely not a sports shooting camera, but can be used for the occasional shot if you have nothing else.

I did check out it's low light focusing ability again. Far off the charts of anything Ive ever seen or can measure with a light meter. It almost appears as if it is boosting the signal into live view and focusing off of the boosted signal. Only when I went into a very dark room with all the lights turned off did it actually start to struggle.

M

 

[mrsfotografie]

If they keep up the innovation, I think they have a chance. They are really making cameras people want, with great new technology. I bought a NEX5 for its size and image quality, and its great (save for the menu system).

I think the same of my NEX-6; only wish it had the A7's menu structure because the menu structure is amateuristic and not user friendly if you need to change advanced options while shooting.

Sony needs more good (and reasonably affordable) lenses too; I'm not too impressed with their lens line-up and I'm getting to the point that I think I'll sell on my 16-50 & 55-210 OSS because I'd rather use adapted FD lenses.

 

[npherno]

If they keep up the innovation, I think they have a chance. They are really making cameras people want, with great new technology. I bought a NEX5 for its size and image quality, and its great (save for the menu system).

I think the same of my NEX-6; only wish it had the A7's menu structure because the menu structure is amateuristic and not user friendly if you need to change advanced options while shooting.

Sony needs more good (and reasonably affordable) lenses too; I'm not too impressed with their lens line-up and I'm getting to the point that I think I'll sell on my 16-50 & 55-210 OSS because I'd rather use adapted FD lenses.

You see, this is where I think Sony is turning a liability into an asset. I also figured it would be hard to leave Canon because of lens investments. Sony seems to be encouraging third parties to make adapters to use any lens with their cameras, WITH AUTOFOCUS. Leica lenses seem to be what a lot of Sony users are using, but certainly Canon lenses would work well.

http://www.eoshd.com/eoshd-shooters-guide-sony-a7-a7r-lenses

I love my 50D, but Canon definitely annoys me with their constant arbitrary cutting features and segmentation of their products. They seem to never want to deliver their best, but simply what the market will tolerate.

Canon and Nikon both better wake up before customers leave in droves. Sony's cameras are still rough around the edges, but the features they offer are very convincing, especially when portability isn't an issue. I personally cannot afford a A7s now, but when I can, I think Sony will be ready for prime time, and will have smoothed those remaining issues (maybe one or two years).

Btw, my previous statement is correct--Canon does have a low light king-the 1DC and it is $10,000, lol.

http://www.eoshd.com/content/13071/25-ways-sony-a7s-trumps-canon-1d-c

 

[mrsfotografie]

If they keep up the innovation, I think they have a chance. They are really making cameras people want, with great new technology. I bought a NEX5 for its size and image quality, and its great (save for the menu system).

I think the same of my NEX-6; only wish it had the A7's menu structure because the menu structure is amateuristic and not user friendly if you need to change advanced options while shooting.

Sony needs more good (and reasonably affordable) lenses too; I'm not too impressed with their lens line-up and I'm getting to the point that I think I'll sell on my 16-50 & 55-210 OSS because I'd rather use adapted FD lenses.

You see, this is where I think Sony is turning a liability into an asset. I also figured it would be hard to leave Canon because of lens investments. Sony seems to be encouraging third parties to make adapters to use any lens with their cameras, WITH AUTOFOCUS. Leica lenses seem to be what a lot of Sony users are using, but certainly Canon lenses would work well.

http://www.eoshd.com/eoshd-shooters-guide-sony-a7-a7r-lenses

I love my 50D, but Canon definitely annoys me with their constant arbitrary cutting features and segmentation of their products. They seem to never want to deliver their best, but simply what the market will tolerate.

Canon and Nikon both better wake up before customers leave in droves. Sony's cameras are still rough around the edges, but the features they offer are very convincing, especially when portability isn't an issue. I personally cannot afford a A7s now, but when I can, I think Sony will be ready for prime time, and will have smoothed those remaining issues (maybe one or two years).

Btw, my previous statement is correct--Canon does have a low light king-the 1DC and it is $10,000, lol.

http://www.eoshd.com/content/13071/25-ways-sony-a7s-trumps-canon-1d-c

It's great that you can adapt almost any lens to a NEX or a7*, but for the best AF performance you need native lenses.