5Ds : dawn of a new era for primes ?

Sporgon

5% of gear used 95% of the time
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Nov 11, 2012
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My photographic career goes back well into the days of 35mm film, and with that medium cropping was generally very undesirable. You will occasionally find people on internet forums who claim that their 35mm film is about 20 mp because it scans at around 20 meg of information, but much of that information is grain. In real terms of resolution, at least in terms of visual enlargement, 35mm film is about equal to 8 - 10 mp, depending on which emulsions were used.

When I first started with FF digital in 2005, I quickly found that framing on a 12.7 mp 5D was much more forgiving than I had experienced before, and then when adding the 21 mp 5DII there was quite a jump in how much I could crop without any real enlargement issues.

Over the last twenty years or so there has been major development and improvement in zoom lenses, until recently very much at the expense of fixed focal length lens development. However one area where zoom lenses have not been able to make much progress is in size and weight ( though weight has been improved a little), aperture speed and price. Indeed if anything price is going up ! I often hear about people who are changing their Canon / Nikon system for something smaller and lighter. Indeed I was one of them a few years back. Without exception these people all were toting the finest f/2.8 zooms, often adding in a 100-400L as well.

When it comes to mp I am one of those people who think that, in a small, portable camera, 18 mp or so is quite enough. In fact when stitching the panoramics I would be quite happy to have 12. With good lenses and excellent technique 18 to 20 mp offers ridiculous levels of detail, in picture sizes that are generally much larger than most people want. At Building Panoramics I am constantly being asked for pictures that are smaller than my standard size. Originally I found this insulting; now I just find it annoying.

My initial reaction to the 50 mp 5Ds is that I don't need or want that amount of pixels. ( I'm not mentioning the 'r'. I'm one of those people that known that once you have run a light USM there is no practically perceptual difference in detail).

But then I got think about my circumstances with primes. I generally prefer a few light, fast primes to a heavier, slower zoom. If a 21 mp camera allows more practical cropping then a 50 mp one is even better, assuming you are making the pixels count. Primes offer lighter, faster, sharper in frame edges, less distortion, shallower entry pupil ( for stitching), better balance on a smaller camera. I wont say cheaper because by the time you have a few of them to equal a zoom they are as expensive, if not more so. Certainly the extra mp will allow more 'focal length flexibility with fixed focal length lenses.

Also interesting that the 5Ds is a little lighter than the 5DIII. I'm guessing that it probably lacks the stainless steel bottom plate of the 5DIII. But lighter is better for lugging around the country side.

Maybe we will see more development in primes now. Thoughts ?
 
It would be nice to see an absolutely EPIC 35 L II to tag along the 5ds, but we all know it's much more likely we find a huge tribe of Bigfoot having loads of unicorns as pets on small planet guarded by a few Yeti's..
 
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Of course.

Canon (or any lens company) can't stop pushing R&D.
They would be out of business in a few years. Lenses can last decades, if you do not improve you are not selling lenses.

I have the impression you think Canon is focusing more on Zooms than primes. Maybe to a certain extent, only because many of the older zooms could benefit more. Most of the super tele's have a version II released not long ago.
There have been rumors of a 35mm F/1.4 L II.

I believe the primes will be coming.
 
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Exactly my situation. I use primes exclusively, choose Zeiss for their superior quality (e.g., the Canon 180 macro has distinct lateral color problems, while the Zeiss 100 MP has zero, none, zilch), and am excited getting the 5dSR; upgrade from current 5dmKII. I shoot "few" images, 95% on tripod, having done quite a bit of 4x5" on an Arca. Storage is not an issues, particularly with today's RAIDs.
Eventually, people will notice that those zooms just can't deliver on small pixel sensors; most people still don't recognize the greater relevance of pixel size when it comes to matching lens quality to sensor (same as on 7D, by the way). The majority will think that 50 MP is just hype rather than question the lenses they use. Oh well. Possibly look at MTF of zoom vs primes, and suddenly some lights go on. And, what tripod do you use, and do you know how to use it? One may also revise the old longest time handheld = 1/focal length, to 1/2xfocal length.
I know I am the minority here, but I welcome the 5dSR. Happy to shell out 5K for body, grip, RRS L-bracket. 21 MP is just not quite enough for page spread in book. If I go through trouble of printing in 5 color (CMYK & dense black), I don't want to be hamstrung by "low" pixel count. One follow up cost may be a couple of 4K displays, replacing my dual 27" Cinemas.
50 MP is utter overkill for web, powerpoint, newspaper, and scrapbooking, but that is not what I'm after, and that is not the target audience.

So yes, there will be a dawn for primes, but not Canon primes, but Zeiss and maybe Voigtländer. Primes is not the only factor, but AF requires wider mechanical tolerances, while MF lenses are precision manufactured. The slightest mis-alignment of lenses elements will kill the image quality. Canon Cine lenses may work OK, never used one, but that's even more esoteric than using Zeiss ZE glass.

Two uncertainties about the 5dSR:
- can focussing screens be changed? I assume it is like on 5dmkiii, but not sure. Asked Canon, and they could not tell. This is critical for MF shooters.
- Is tripod socket on battery grip also re-inforced? The battery grip screw gets loose quickly on the 5dmkII, so I put lock-tight on it. Now it is solid, but I cannot remove grip from body anymore.
 
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Canon is going to make the lenses that bring in the $$. They have started making low cost primes that are very good for the price, I am in doubt that we will see a bunch of new primes, they are doing pretty well with zooms, and the higher ISO bodies don't need wide aperture lenses, so they may just leave that segment to Sigma and concentrate on the big profit makers.

They could certainly come out with a $2000 35mm L, and 50mm f/1.4 L, and same for 85mm, 135mm, ect. I think that the market conditions are against it, but they probably have designs waiting for the marketing go ahead.
 
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Zeidora said:
Two uncertainties about the 5dSR:
- can focussing screens be changed? I assume it is like on 5dmkiii, but not sure. Asked Canon, and they could not tell. This is critical for MF shooters.
- Is tripod socket on battery grip also re-inforced? The battery grip screw gets loose quickly on the 5dmkII, so I put lock-tight on it. Now it is solid, but I cannot remove grip from body anymore.
Answer to the first is No. The focusing screen is listed as fixed, which was a major turn-off for me. My prime use of the 5Ds would have been with the Zeiss primes. On the 5DIII I have a custom built S-screen from Focusing Screens (from Taiwan, 3x the price of a Canon screen, which is still pretty cheap. He ships to anywhere). And since the camera seems to be using the 5DIII housing, I hope it will fit and that I can do the work myself.

Answer to the second is probably also no, since it can use all accessories from the 5DIII, including battery grip and L-plates.
 
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