600mm too long?

[Mt Spokane Photography]

Where I live you can rarely get close enough to birds. 600 is not long enough for me. But, on my one birding holiday in Brazil, the 100-400 on a 7D was pretty optimal as we got so close to the birds and a 600 would have been too long and unwieldy for much of the time.

I agree, I can rarely get close enough.

The issue becomes complicated with very long focal lengths, distortion from the air, haze, vibration, and the like seem to make 1200mm as much as I can handle. I tried my 600mm with 2 TC's stacked so it was at 1680mm and ended up with really poor quality images. This was partly due to vibration, distortion from the two TC's, and haze or air currents. Even then, eagles that I thought were close were still too small in the image, and cropping severely made it worse yet.

 

[Morlin]

Morlin, yes the lens is just the first big expense. It can be handheld for about 10 or 15 seconds....more if you work out with it! Not something you want to do every day. The shot below is one I took hand held on a VERY windy and cold morning (hat blew off and ended up hiking after it after the shoot) with IS enabled. I had just pulled into a parking lot and this adult was feeding in a tree over a nearby creek...no time to deal with tripods or monopods...just get out and start shooting...freezing cold and screaming in pain from holding the lens up for so long...but I got the shot. So maybe get the lens and move forward with the accessories later. Have some fun first.


Really like the picture of the eagle. Birds of prey is nothing that has been avaliable for me earlier but that will
really change after getting the lens.

Yes I might follow your advice getting the lens as soon as possible. I would love to have some more winter shots on red foxes in the snow and this time of year the wild boars are out even in the bright sunlight in the middle of the day. The tripod I have is a bad one. Not solid enough but better than nothing. Even the ballhead could work just to get a decent steady shot. Nothing like a gimbal head to work with but instead of spending more time saving money I could get the lens a couple of month earlier and use it hand held or just use bean bags or other stuff like branches or just the ground to keep it steady.

It´s the mkii version I will get.

After I have bought it I will publish one of the pictures in this thread taken on the first day out no matter what kind of animal or the quality of the picture =)

 

[East Wind Photography]

Morlin, yes the lens is just the first big expense. It can be handheld for about 10 or 15 seconds....more if you work out with it! Not something you want to do every day. The shot below is one I took hand held on a VERY windy and cold morning (hat blew off and ended up hiking after it after the shoot) with IS enabled. I had just pulled into a parking lot and this adult was feeding in a tree over a nearby creek...no time to deal with tripods or monopods...just get out and start shooting...freezing cold and screaming in pain from holding the lens up for so long...but I got the shot. So maybe get the lens and move forward with the accessories later. Have some fun first.


Really like the picture of the eagle. Birds of prey is nothing that has been avaliable for me earlier but that will
really change after getting the lens.

Yes I might follow your advice getting the lens as soon as possible. I would love to have some more winter shots on red foxes in the snow and this time of year the wild boars are out even in the bright sunlight in the middle of the day. The tripod I have is a bad one. Not solid enough but better than nothing. Even the ballhead could work just to get a decent steady shot. Nothing like a gimbal head to work with but instead of spending more time saving money I could get the lens a couple of month earlier and use it hand held or just use bean bags or other stuff like branches or just the ground to keep it steady.

It´s the mkii version I will get.

After I have bought it I will publish one of the pictures in this thread taken on the first day out no matter what kind of animal or the quality of the picture =)

I often use it with a monopod and ball head attached as well so you don't need something extravegent to get a steady shot.

 

[Morlin]

And now I have bought it!!

Just needed to tell someone before I expload from the inside of excitement! =)

I hope I can get it at the store this Thursday or Friday. Also bought a 1,4 converter and a Lowepro Lens trekker AW II. This weekend I will also order a RRS TVC-34L, Wimberley gimbal head, RRS lens foot and some other stuff.

Broke but happy =)

Thank you all for your advices.

 

[mackguyver]

Broke but happy =)

I think we all know that feeling, but congrats on the new lens and upcoming gear. I'm sure you'll make great use of it.

 

[sagittariansrock]

And now I have bought it!!

Just needed to tell someone before I expload from the inside of excitement! =)

I hope I can get it at the store this Thursday or Friday. Also bought a 1,4 converter and a Lowepro Lens trekker AW II. This weekend I will also order a RRS TVC-34L, Wimberley gimbal head, RRS lens foot and some other stuff.

Broke but happy =)

Thank you all for your advices.

Nice one, congrats!
Now looking forward to seeing those birds and foxes
Indeed, a quick browse through the lens galleries usually makes my day a lot better...

 

[9VIII]

And now I have bought it!!

Just needed to tell someone before I expload from the inside of excitement! =)

I hope I can get it at the store this Thursday or Friday. Also bought a 1,4 converter and a Lowepro Lens trekker AW II. This weekend I will also order a RRS TVC-34L, Wimberley gimbal head, RRS lens foot and some other stuff.

Broke but happy =)

Thank you all for your advices.

Good job, depending on the actual definition of "broke". I would never want to put myself in a position where I actually have nothing in the bank, but spending leftover cash is a good feeling.

Right now I'm debating between getting a new car, or a nice used car with leftovers going to a big white. I really have no need for any of it, but those who are good at saving get to have these problems.

 

[Loswr]

Congrats and enjoy!

 

[Dylan777]

Broke but happy =)

I think we all know that feeling, but congrats on the new lens and upcoming gear. I'm sure you'll make great use of it.

+1....stay broke with photography(hobby) bank account is OK

 

[Dylan777]

A 300/2.8 and 600/4 combo is great. I decided to go for the 200-400 in combination with the 600. I have not regretted it. I would not worry much about DOF with the 200-400. 400 at f4 gives you pretty thin DOF and a good pop. At 560 f5.6 it is the same. But the primes are of course a little bit thinner. I had the 400 f2.8L IS II, but sold it when I got the 200-400. I am still thinking about the 300 f2.8L IS II. It may have the fastest and most accurate AF and it is extremely sharp, even with the 1.4x/2xIII extenders.

Regarding the 600, I have almost never felt that it is too long. I actually believe >80% of my shots are with the 1.4xIII extender. Since you have to do this a bit theoretically, one way of getting a feel for it is to calculate how far away you need to be, for whatever you are shooting to fill the frame, and then go out a see what that means in real life. My guess would be that you could use the 600 for most of it. If you complement that with a 300, you are definitely well set up.

I might take this route very soon.........

 

[Dylan777]

And now I have bought it!!

Just needed to tell someone before I expload from the inside of excitement! =)

I hope I can get it at the store this Thursday or Friday. Also bought a 1,4 converter and a Lowepro Lens trekker AW II. This weekend I will also order a RRS TVC-34L, Wimberley gimbal head, RRS lens foot and some other stuff.

Broke but happy =)

Thank you all for your advices.

Congrats.........don't be shy to post some pics

 

[applecider]

Two pictures from a walk around a local park in Portland OR during a sunny January day. Both taken with the 600mm with a 2x extender. The first a Great Blue Heron in a tree over the path and the second a wood duck taking off- with an inadequate shutter speed causing unsharpness. The GBH is cropped a little the wood duck is adobe bridged for exposure and sharpness conversion from raw to jpeg, otherwise unchanged.
Edit my point here is that the the 840 (600+1.4) is not too long for a variety of fairly close range wild life use, the second picture would have been better if I had been able to remove the 1.4, and upped the shutter speed.

 

[Morlin]

Thank you all.

Like a child waiting for Christmas I´m almost having a hard time getting to sleep because of the excitement and expectations. I know though that there will be a learning period to use that focal length but I´m willing to practice.

I have my "camera gear account" and that one will be pretty empty after this but I sold my motorbike (a sports bike with expensive insurance) and did a lot of paid studio photography and so on last year to save the money needed. I guess I would have a pretty upset girlfriend if this was taken from our ordinary account but she is very understanding and knows that this is my only interest and there is no place I´m so calm and feeling so good as in the woods. =)

Pictures will be posted later and I totally agree that a daily check in the lens picture category and also the different categories as BIF and so on is worth a daily check =)

Really glad I found this forum. So many people with knowledge that are helpful and also have humor. Much appreciated.

For those interested here is a link to some pictures. http://www.pbnphoto.se/djur

Have more on Facebook. Also PBN Photo. The language is Swedish but I guess you can have a look around anyway. "Fotogalleri" = Photo gallery. The site is not the best when it comes to looking at pictures but it´s free and ok enough for me and my hobby for now.

Now I will try to get some sleep to make the time go faster until Thursday =)

 

[candc]

You have a lot of really good photos posted on that site. Looking at what you have there I would think the 200-400 would fit the variety of shooting that you do very well, I really don't think you are going to be wanting a shallower dof than what that lens offers, usually you want to stop down at those long fl to get more in focus, not less.

 

[9VIII]

Is that doughnuts I see?

 

[Morlin]

Is that doughnuts I see?

Doughnuts? Where? Or what do you mean?

 

[Morlin]

You have a lot of really good photos posted on that site. Looking at what you have there I would think the 200-400 would fit the variety of shooting that you do very well, I really don't think you are going to be wanting a shallower dof than what that lens offers, usually you want to stop down at those long fl to get more in focus, not less.

Thank you. I have a lot more that do qualify for my little site but I´m a bit lazy updating it. Might be more often when I have the 600mm =)

The choice was hard between the 600mm and the 200-400mm but my thought was that when I walk around in the woods doing my best to come near the animals and don´t have a specific breed in mind to photograph and where the 200-400mm and the flexibility that it offers would come in handy I think it´s too heavy and big to be seen as versatile. And when I move around like that in the woods I don´t like to carry too much heavy gear and want to be able to crawl and move very easy to get close. For an example I often climb up a little bit in a tree and so on to get closer to the animals. Today I use a 70-200 for that but my goal is to have a 300mm 2,8 for that and also use it with converters when I want the portability and also reach. But for the longer distance shots and when I have planned where to sit and need the reach I think that 600mm will come in handy.

Thanks though for the advice and your thoughts.

 

[Deleted member 91053]

Thank you. I have a lot more that do qualify for my little site but I´m a bit lazy updating it. Might be more often when I have the 600mm =)

The choice was hard between the 600mm and the 200-400mm but my thought was that when I walk around in the woods doing my best to come near the animals and don´t have a specific breed in mind to photograph and where the 200-400mm and the flexibility that it offers would come in handy I think it´s too heavy and big to be seen as versatile. And when I move around like that in the woods I don´t like to carry too much heavy gear and want to be able to crawl and move very easy to get close. For an example I often climb up a little bit in a tree and so on to get closer to the animals. Today I use a 70-200 for that but my goal is to have a 300mm 2,8 for that and also use it with converters when I want the portability and also reach. But for the longer distance shots and when I have planned where to sit and need the reach I think that 600mm will come in handy.

Thanks though for the advice and your thoughts.
[/quote]

I found the combination of a 600 F4 IS Mk1 and a 300 F2.8 IS Mk1 to be excellent but a bit heavy when carrying both! Given that you have bought the, much lighter, 600 Mk2 adding a 300 F2.8 would still allow you to cover reasonable distances and offer great flexibility (greater with your extenders). When you have to do some more serious walking the 300 will shine as it works so well with extenders, it will fit (with the hood in the ready position) in your pack and give a very good lightweight setup with serious reach in good light.
You are going to have some fun with your new lens, adding a 300 F2.8 will just be icing on the cake!

 

[East Wind Photography]

And now I have bought it!!

Just needed to tell someone before I expload from the inside of excitement! =)

I hope I can get it at the store this Thursday or Friday. Also bought a 1,4 converter and a Lowepro Lens trekker AW II. This weekend I will also order a RRS TVC-34L, Wimberley gimbal head, RRS lens foot and some other stuff.

Broke but happy =)

Thank you all for your advices.

Good job, depending on the actual definition of "broke". I would never want to put myself in a position where I actually have nothing in the bank, but spending leftover cash is a good feeling.

Right now I'm debating between getting a new car, or a nice used car with leftovers going to a big white. I really have no need for any of it, but those who are good at saving get to have these problems.

Go with a used car and a big white. A new car doesnt get you much but a loss of thousands as soon as youndrive it off the lot. Put that money toward a good lens. There really is no other logical choice in the matter.

 

[9VIII]

Is that doughnuts I see?

Doughnuts? Where? Or what do you mean?

On your website, in the tenth image from the bottom (and a few others) the bokeh looks like the ring effect you get with a mirror lens. If that's the case it makes your images that much more impressive, as far as I know mirror lenses don't have autofocus.