Bought 24-70 f/2.8 II -Soft, owners, please advice

[neuroanatomist]

FWIW, here's an example of two successive shots taken of a static scene from a stable tripod, with a reasonably shallow DoF (135L @ f/2). Two focus attempts, two very different planes of focus. I superimposed the 7D's AF diagram (it's the whole AF sensor, but I sized the green 'x' to approximate the actual area of the center AF point). You can see that based on the AF point itself, both of the images are 'in focus' according to the parameters used by the AF system (green lines crossing a contrast boundary). The situation with the horizontal measuring tape is analogous, and that's why the reliable AF calibration tools all have a focus target that's parallel to the image sensor.

 

[rpt]

Okay, doing new tests now - is 3 meters enough? Pictures follow.

PS: Somehow while seeing the picture in live view and later comparing it with the final image - live view seems much more in focus (at 10x) before taking the shot.

If your live view shot is focused and your AF shot is not, you need to AFMA. I use Reikan FoCal. I took neuro's suggestion and got the pro version. If you have a number of lenses it is a good investment.

 

[Viggo]

I did a quick and dirty test right now. They were all shot very close at 50cm or so, and the last one (2nd shot) at 70mm is about a meter or 1,5 away. All 100% crop. Go 3 meters away and the sharpness increases a LOT.

24

35

50

70

70 farther away

 

[zlatko]

Do yourself a bigger favor and get Reikan FoCal.

I use FoCal too. I think it does a very fine job. Nearly all lenses benefit from some AF microadjustment.

 

[Viggo]

Do yourself a bigger favor and get Reikan FoCal.

I use FoCal too. I think it does a very fine job. Nearly all lenses benefit from some AF microadjustment.

+1 All lenses I have owned since FoCal came out has been adjusted except, funny enough, the 50 L which was at 0 after 6 runs, all consistent.

 

[absente]

I did a quick and dirty test right now. They were all shot very close at 50cm or so, and the last one (2nd shot) at 70mm is about a meter or 1,5 away. All 100% crop. Go 3 meters away and the sharpness increases a LOT.

replicated it, more or less. White balance is off, it's 5AM and i finished the second bottle of bacardi ^^

Whats your sharpness setting (in camera) ? I shot those with +1
PS: I tried different AFMA settings but to be quite honest i didn't see any improvement.

PPS: Close focus seems to be no problem. What I am struggeling with is the long distance focus on 24mm, like the bacardi pics.

24 / 50cm

ccc1

35 / 50cm

cc2

50 / 50cm

ccc3

70 / 50cm

ccc4

70 / 170cm

ccc5

 

[absente]

If your live view shot is focused and your AF shot is not, you need to AFMA. I use Reikan FoCal. I took neuro's suggestion and got the pro version. If you have a number of lenses it is a good investment.

No, the shot itself is not focused - I am talking about the picture (10x) on the screen while taking the shot in LV

 

[Viggo]

They were shot in raw, and "normal" sharpening in Lr.

 

[rpt]

If your live view shot is focused and your AF shot is not, you need to AFMA. I use Reikan FoCal. I took neuro's suggestion and got the pro version. If you have a number of lenses it is a good investment.

No, the shot itself is not focused - I am talking about the picture (10x) on the screen while taking the shot in LV

You just can't arbitrarily set AFMA and check. Do a complete AFMA test and if it is still blurred, exchange the lens. neuro's page - the excerp of which he posted here is a good way to go. There are many other links on the net - not all worked for me. It is imperative that the light is good! Add extra light. It makes a difference. Also ensure the tripod is stable and you don't raise the center column. Mirror lock up is a good idea. Reduces shake. Also take at least 3 pictures at each AFMA value.

Hope this helps. My experience had been that things look like they are in focus at 10x magnification on the LCD but when you open the image on your machine it may not be so good... Until I successfully did AFMA. Had the most trouble for my 100-400L. It had defective focusing and IS which when repaired, all was well

 

[Pi]

You should do what was suggested several times: shoot a slanted target with detail. So far, you are giving us the sum of two numbers (lens softness + AF error) and asking us to guess one of them.

 

[shashinkaman]

Dude, STAY OFF THE BREEZERS when you test your new toys!!

 

[absente]

I finally know where the drama begins - I was comparing the sharpness to my 70-200f 2.8, which I always used at sharpness set to "5" (in picture style). Of course, comparing a setting of "0" or "1" with the 24-70 can't beat it.

But it makes me wonder how people who shoot at a "1" on sharpness get crystal clear pictures - well I guess in PP. By the way, the factory setting on Canon cameras on automatic picture style is "3" - at least on my 5D3.

So today I shoot a lot of scenes with the setting on "3" - But from my (humble) experience, the AF and the sharpness on my 70-200 are better, in real life situations. An no, it's the non-IS version.

I had a situation today where my focus point "jumped" while focusing - it jumped over the whole frame (from left to right). I was focusing on a face, and it jumped to some tree's behind the person, about 10 meters away - happened the first time to me, shooting 7 years Canon gear.

Overall the current keeping rate is about 3 out of 9 or about 30% (single focus point, subject not moving fast, single shot). I never had a keeper rate as bad as this.

But at least it's possible to get some sharpness with the setting on "3", but if I could, I would exchange the lens. But I can't since the return/exchange policies in China are just retarded.

Product shot, for work. Distance 50cm, f/2.8 sharpening set to "3", focused with live-view. PP in LR with "standard sharpening"


Nanping Daifuku-054-2

same setting, but 100% crop at f/8 - unedited, straight from camera. I think it's acceptable given the close distance.


daifuku_crop

same shot like the above at f/2.8 (using PF, not LV)

daifuku_f28

even though i focused clearly on the "wall" it's blurred, while the top is in focus.
I guess that is a strong indication for a needed AFMA.

All shots taken at 35mm

 

[absente]

Didn't do them in burst mode, one shot, one point (far right), road was shaking, her head was moving to. Sharpness "3", no PP. First two pics 2.8 1/320, last one 1/500, I was (trying) to focus on the "wakeup". 100% crop @ 70mm.


wu_1


wu_2


wu_3

I would guess taht the shaky road is responsible for #1 and #3 - or was #2 just a lucky shot because I am in need of AFMA? I guess I have to run tonight the ML dot-point to try it out (hopefully without burning the 5D3).

and yeah, I am staying away tonight from the Breezer ^^

 

[neuroanatomist]

If you're focusing your product shots in Live View, AFMA doesn't apply

You're using LR, but shooting JPG? In RAW, the in-camera sharpness setting doesn't really matter...

 

[absente]

If you're focusing your product shots in Live View, AFMA doesn't apply

You're using LR, but shooting JPG? In RAW, the in-camera sharpness setting doesn't really matter...

Yeah, I need to deliver photos very fast, that's why I shoot in JPG. I never mastered to PP RAW files but it's on my to-do list for .. someday ^^

PS: The unfocused shot at 2.8 (cake) is using PF, not LV - (post edited)

 

[takesome1]

If you're focusing your product shots in Live View, AFMA doesn't apply

absente;
It took someone a while to say it, you were getting suggestions to do AFMA on a lens you are not getting sharp with manual focus. You can AFMA the lens to death, if it isn't sharp in live view at 10x on a tripod in decent light, it is not going to be sharp at all. AFMA doesn't correct a lens to sharpness that can not shoot a sharp picture.

I own the 24-70mm II and have tested several.
It is at its best between 24-50mm and specifically at 24mm. At 70mm some copies can get a little soft and this wouldn't be a concern for me.
At f/2.8 your should be getting excellent results with manual focus.
The pictures you posted are soft. From what you have described and what you have shown I think you got one of the softer copies.
Of the ones I tested I had one copy that was a bit soft at 24mm all the rest were excellent.
If your copy performed the way you have shown in my hands I would send it back.

Every one of the lenses I tested I did a AFMA, all of the lenses performed differently on the same bodies. All required some adjustment and the values were always different across the range.

 

[davet4]

absente

i am in the same situation (although not the same lens), i am currently in china and i bought the 5dmkIII with the 24-105mm lens. and i am also getting 'soft' pictures. i really thought it was just me and i needed to get use to using the camera, but after what i have read here it seems a common fault...if you do managed to get sharper pictures i would be interested in what you did...

 

[absente]

absente

i am in the same situation (although not the same lens), i am currently in china and i bought the 5dmkIII with the 24-105mm lens. and i am also getting 'soft' pictures. i really thought it was just me and i needed to get use to using the camera, but after what i have read here it seems a common fault...if you do managed to get sharper pictures i would be interested in what you did...

I am raising in-camera sharpness "to death", e.g. 3-5 and pictures are "acceptable" (but I am very picky). I have no clue if other people do the same to get good results.

What's your sharpness setting in picture style (RAW/JPG, doesn't matter)? Try increasing to 5, that solved my problems with the 5D3 (that I bought in China, too). Which city are you in?

As for China - since everyone is complaining that we get our equipment so cheap. Yeah, it's 10-20% cheaper than B&H, but there is one little but - You can't test it before you buy. It's common practice here if you buy new stuff. You can't even look at the lens/camera, because that would mean ripping the seal off (the box), and then the gear is considered "used". After you pay, you can - and surprise, no return policy for "picky customers" - Pure BS.

In reality, dealers know about soft lenses, and they do this in order to sell everything - otherwise people would just buy the "sharp" one's. At least thats the situation in Chongqing, Shanghai and Beijing where I tried to test my gear before buying it.

At the end, I am buying all y gear "blind" and have to live with the consequences. Would I pay 20% more to be able to test it? Yes.

 

[absente]

absente;

It took someone a while to say it, you were getting suggestions to do AFMA on a lens you are not getting sharp with manual focus. You can AFMA the lens to death, if it isn't sharp in live view at 10x on a tripod in decent light, it is not going to be sharp at all. AFMA doesn't correct a lens to sharpness that can not shoot a sharp picture.

It is sharp on live-view, on the display - but the final image is a little off (after I press the shutter using tripod etc) - yet not every time. That's what I've stated in the beginning. It's the first time I have a problem like this, and I really have no clue. But it happens only on sharpness set to "0" or "1" - with "5" it's far better.

What sharpness setting are you using with your lens to test it? If possible, could you shoot the box or something else at your current settings, and let me repeat it - with exact values? That would help me out, since I already have one comparison.

 

[takesome1]

absente;

It took someone a while to say it, you were getting suggestions to do AFMA on a lens you are not getting sharp with manual focus. You can AFMA the lens to death, if it isn't sharp in live view at 10x on a tripod in decent light, it is not going to be sharp at all. AFMA doesn't correct a lens to sharpness that can not shoot a sharp picture.

It is sharp on live-view, on the display - but the final image is a little off (after I press the shutter using tripod etc) - yet not every time. That's what I've stated in the beginning. It's the first time I have a problem like this, and I really have no clue. But it happens only on sharpness set to "0" or "1" - with "5" it's far better.

What sharpness setting are you using with your lens to test it? If possible, could you shoot the box or something else at your current settings, and let me repeat it - with exact values? That would help me out, since I already have one comparison.

Setting of 1, of course you can sharpen.
If it is sharp sometimes and not others, you mention after you push the button. If it takes some pics that are sharp in MF, and others that are not then most likely it is you. Pushing the button, just that action can set up vibration in your camera. If you use a release, how you hold the release can set up a vibration. Use the delay settings, say 3 seconds. Make sure nothing is touching the camera when it fires and see if that helps.

I would shoot samples for you, but I am not going to be able to. I am not by the camera right now, and have a full schedule (sorry).