Canon 7Dii vs Nikon D750 Dynamic Range Test

[MichaelTheMaven]

I was happy to get my Canon 7Dii yesterday and being in the middle of reviewing the Nikon D750, I decided to put them both through a Dynamic Range test I have been working on. I know it is an Apples to Oranges comparison, but I was curious none-the-less.

Im not a huge fan of, nor believed a certain testing website for various reasons, and have always read their scores with skepticism because their methodology is mostly proprietary and scoring system whacky. In fact, I have long wanted to come up with a DR test simply to confirm or deny their DR tests to some degree.

I am long time (12 years Canon owner and shooter vs 3.5 years of Nikon), so if anything I would naturally be more biased towards Canon, but in this test I think we are looking at a DR for the 7Dii very similar to that of the Canon 5Diii.

In the past, some of you have been very insightful with suggestions and tips to improve my tests, and therefore I invite your scrutiny and suggestions. Many others of you have ridiculed me, which also actually improved the quality of my tests, so I guess I invite that as well, as long as there is some creativity involved in the ridiculing.

What do you guys think I can do to improve this beyond the obvious (cropping straight).

What would be a good way to figure out total DR and noise cut offs?

http://www.michaelthemaven.com/?postID=3431&canon-7dii-vs-nikon-d750-dynamic-range-test-by-michael-the-maven

In any event enjoy!

 

[YuengLinger]

OH, boy. Here we go.

 

[lintoni]

OH, boy. Here we go.

 

[retina]

I was happy to get my Canon 7Dii yesterday

congrats, don't forget to post some photos!

I know it is an Apples to Oranges comparison

do you, really?

What do you guys think I can do to improve this

hmm.. you could start by not wasting your time with a useless test like this.
it's clear that Sony/Nikon sensor has more DR in this current generation of cameras, this has been tested a billion times now.
go out there and shoot, improve your photography skills. life is short.

 

[2n10]

Thank you for doing the testing and braving wrath. It is apparent that there are 2 schools of thought and that as you have acknowledged while you are most likely biased towards Canon your test is biased to the Sony sensor since you are only looking at the dark end of the scale.

 

[fragilesi]

Excuse my ignorance ( please ).

But why are the Canon pictures so much darker with "real" black while the Nikon is just a washed out grey colour?

 

[East Wind Photography]

Well I tend to agree. A DR test is not all about shadow noise. All this test shows is that at ISO 100 the sony sensor has better noise and shadow recovery. Would liked to have seen the conprison of all three cameras at the highlight end using the same settings.

Also would be nice to see this comparison at a few ISO ranges up to 3200 or higher if there is a useful comparison to be had. It is well known that most sensors yield better shadow DR at higher ISOs and less so on the highlights.

I dont recall if you mentioned this but when comparing crop vs full frame you also need to adjust your distance to the subject to compensate for the crop factor. While it may not affect the DR and shadow tests it will affect the percepted noise levels since you need to enlarge the full frame image to match that taken with the the crop sensor. For those that are really anal you can even go as far as ensuring the subject covers the same number of pixels on both sensors so the resolution matches in the tests.

I would not say you are comparing apples and oranges. YOu just need to be more comprehensive in the tests. As you can see there are many ways to run tests and no one test will give you all of the answers.

 

[mjbehnke]

Why are you comparing a Canon 7Dii Crop Sensor to a Nikon D750(sony) Full Frame Sensor?

 

[bgosselin]

Can you also do your tests with jpeg out of the camera? Different ISO would be nice. My understanding is that Canon sensor DR are essentially the same as Nikon at ISO 800 and higher.

 

[StudentOfLight]

Hi Michael,
Regarding the D750... a certain testing website states that the dynamic range (straight out of camera) for the D750 at ISO 100 to be about 13.7 stops. You mentioned that there is potential for highlight recovery. If there is one stop of highlight recovery available then their result correlates directly with what you captured.

In a 14-bit-world having 13.7Ev in a single capture is quite sensational. I can't wait for 18-20MP full frame camera with 16-bit on-sensor ADC.

 

[StudentOfLight]

Can you also do your tests with jpeg out of the camera? Different ISO would be nice. My understanding is that Canon sensor DR are essentially the same as Nikon at ISO 800 and higher.

I think the point of Michael's test was to demonstrate the maximum DR of the cameras, which would be at their respective low-ISO-setting (e.g. ISO 100). If you were shooting with the Nikon D750 in a High Dynamic Ranged scene would you rather shoot at ISO 800 and thereby sacrifice some potential highlight and/or shadow details or would you rather shoot at ISO 100 which would give you the maximum range?

 

[Loswr]

If you were shooting with the Nikon D750 in a High Dynamic Ranged scene would you rather shoot at ISO 800 and thereby sacrifice some potential highlight and/or shadow details or would you rather shoot at ISO 100 which would give you the maximum range?

I would rather select the aperture for the DoF I want, and the shutter speed based on motion in the scene (if any, and if I want to freeze it). If that means sacrificing some potential highlight/shadow details because I need to use higher than base ISO, so be it.

As for the DR of the 7DII, I'll just wait for DxO to test it and post the measurement data.

 

[Skulker]

Excuse my ignorance ( please ).

But why are the Canon pictures so much darker with "real" black while the Nikon is just a washed out grey colour?

Because he's deliberately messing up the shots taken with the Canon? No surely not! After all he's already said he favors Canon and I'm sure he wouldn't tell porkies just to get traffic onto his website.


I'm convinced this is a fair and reasonable test. No, you're not convinced? Well as good as he can do then. Still not convinced? How about maybe he knows what he's doing and maybe his main interest is not a fair and reasonable test?


Now the most important question for me. How do I stop the website from telling me this thread exists?

 

[tayassu]

I don't understand that whole DR thing... I get what it is about, but with the RAW flies of my old 7D I can bump up the shadows well enough, even @ISO3200! And that should be enough not to have every fifth thread going on about this!

 

[tcmatthews]

I was happy to get my Canon 7Dii yesterday and being in the middle of reviewing the Nikon D750, I decided to put them both through a Dynamic Range test I have been working on. I know it is an Apples to Oranges comparison, but I was curious none-the-less.

As you have stated this is an Apple to Oranges test. Quite frankly if I was buying the 7Dii I would not be buying one for DR. End argument.

 

[StudentOfLight]

If you were shooting with the Nikon D750 in a High Dynamic Ranged scene would you rather shoot at ISO 800 and thereby sacrifice some potential highlight and/or shadow details or would you rather shoot at ISO 100 which would give you the maximum range?

I would rather select the aperture for the DoF I want, and the shutter speed based on motion in the scene (if any, and if I want to freeze it). If that means sacrificing some potential highlight/shadow details because I need to use higher than base ISO, so be it.

As for the DR of the 7DII, I'll just wait for DxO to test it and post the measurement data.

So you are saying that your goal would not be to capture the maximum DR of the scene. That is a fair choice on your part and of course there are situations that call for creative choices and I respect that.

I would like to point out that you didn't quote me fully. My first sentence in the (relatively short) paragraph was that I thought Michael's goal was to demonstrate the maximum DR of the camera(s) so my example was related to that assumption. Hence, in my example the goal is maximum DR capture so using a higher ISO would result in failing to achieve that goal.

 

[klickflip]

Firsty well done and v brave doing this and posting! Can I ask how the hell have you got so much noise in ISO100 images ? They look like is 128000 shots. A well exposed shot sat 100ISO even a predominantly dark image should not have that much noise in it. - Are these huge crops into the frame and have you lifted the exposure 3 stops or something?

If you are in the envious positions to have 7DII and D750 would it not be more beneficial to set them up side by side and shoot some real tests of landscape , cityscape , portrait and still life etc.
Id be really interested to see the difference side by side.
Now we all know that the D750 will be a fair bit cleaner and esp in the shadows depending how much you recover these for artistic reasons. But as long as you don't go mad and maybe recover slightly shadow and highlights to get a nice result which is what most people do.

Try some interesting examples shooting into the sun at dusk etc and lets see what these awesome babies can do!
Please seriously stop wasting you time on photographing charts!

 

[MichaelTheMaven]

Sorry about not explaining more carefully, good feedback.

Yes, essentially I am looking for the total DR I can squeeze out of a RAW file but recovering in the shadows, so both files have +2.6 Exposure (the point where the first swatch overexposes) and shadow recovery all the way. Part of the problem is I cannot import the 7Dii into Camera RAW and have to use RAW Therapee which I am totally unfamiliar with.

I believe it is Apples to Oranges in some regards because it is full frame vs crop (and photo site size seems to effect noise performance), but the reason I wanted to test is because they both have the most current sensors and processors from respective companies.

Im basically trying to get as many 1/3 stops of range captured with one end (the highlights) being clipped out. There is some room for recovery there, so its limiting my ability to find total DR, but all things being equal, it allows me to get something a little more illustrative than just recovering some shadows in an image.

Thank you for the suggestion to get out and shoot. My Dad just dropped off his Tamron 150-600, Im going to take it down the to beach! Im listening to all your feedback, so thank you for that as well.

M

 

[mjbehnke]

I still think you need to compare crop sensor to crop sensor. Not crop sensor to full frame. Proves nothing, except that full frame sensors have better DR.

Unless I'm missing your point in all this? Fill me in?

 

[Marsu42]

In a 14-bit-world having 13.7Ev in a single capture is quite sensational. I can't wait for 18-20MP full frame camera with 16-bit on-sensor ADC.

Only 13.7ev dynamo race and 14 bit resolution? That's pathetic - with my 6d and Magic Lantern, I'm getting 14.5 stops and 16bit raw files.

Without ML, I admit I'd be quite lost with what I shoot - but once you accept the usability hassle, there's really little reason to complain about dr on Canon (except 1d/7d2 which don't have ML (yet for the latter)).