Canon Announces the EOS 5D Mark IV DSLR

Ozarker

Love, joy, and peace to all of good will.
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Pookie said:
CanonFanBoy said:
E said:
scyrene said:
E said:
Mikehit said:
E said:
Are you people feeling well? :-\

You're not reading what I'm posting, and you are really rude.

I am reading what you are writing.
Canon has not put high-end video functionality in the 5D4
I call it manufacturing to a price point
You see it as them deliberately crippling the product
My comment was highlighting that every manufacturer compromises to meet marketing aims. You don't like those compromises so you can either go with it or buy something else.

Simple fact is they are NOT going to make the 5D4 a high end video option. If you want high end video option buy a high end video camera.
If you were saying 'I would like to have seen...' then that is understandable. Complaining that they have deliberately crippled a product is refusing to accept reality of what they have chosen to produce.


How much would you have been willing to pay for a 5D4 with the video you would like to see?

But you are just proving to me again that you're not reading what I'm posting.

I have NOT asked for high-end video functionality in the 5D4.

And I have also written time and time again that I don't want to buy a video camera. But that I'm OK with paying for a non-crippled 1D C Mark II, if there were one.

So how come this is impossible for you to take in? I'm accused of writing the same thing over and over, but that's obviously because you're not reading and understanding it. My demands on Canon are fully reasonable.

Let's put this as clearly as possible: YOU have asked for certain features. OTHERS have asked for other features. If Canon put in all the features YOU AND OTHERS asked for, then it would be closer to a professional video camera. Unless you believe your personal desires are either more natural or somehow more important to Canon, then there's no way for the company to decide between your wishes and those of others. Does this make sense? Nobody is saying YOU want a pro video model. But one person's wishes cannot define a market. Capiche?

I have asked for a non-crippled camera, with the quality Canon delivered already in 2012, paired with slow motion. That is not a very unique request, that I don't share with anybody else.

I was dissappointed with 5D Mark IV, but I was ready to get a more expensive model instead. But, as Canon cripples their cameras, that model does not exist.

And no, there are plenty of users here who keep repeating that I should get a video camera. There is even one in the quoted post that I answered. If you care to read it.

Here come all the "crippled camera" guys out of the woodwork. Well, I have the perfect solution for you and all you had to do is look for it. It is simple to use, has every feature every camera of it's type has, and extremely easy to repair yourself if there is ever an problem... which is highly unlikely. AND you can get it for next to nothing, just like all you "crippled camera" guys would like. BEHOLD:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/151567-REG/Santa_Barbara_SWA2B_4_x_5_Pinhole.html

You see Charles, this is where the madness begins and why I left this forum in 2012... this banter is beyond ridiculous. Take a break for a bit and comeback when this has all died down. Go take pics if you can, forums are for bitching and whining, tech specs and has little to do with actual photography. Look how the CR forum jocks are eating it up, they love it because it gives them sense of usefulness... a million more posts and endless tit-for-tat.

Next up are the threads of madness "I got mine", "When will it ship?", "My 5D3 is now trash" and "Oh how Canon screwed me !!!" Followed by BS reviews and unboxing pics.

BTW... hope you're on the mend after the surgery, cheers. David...

Thanks David :) Almost out of the boot. The thread is hilarious to me because it is so crazy. To be honest, I might just get that pinhole camera for my trip into large format.Probably lots of fun and I could develop for myself. I've seen some cool photos over at flicker. Hope you are having a great day and that wedding season is giving you a breather. :) :) :)
 
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Ozarker

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M_S said:
Jack Douglas said:
Regarding the insanity, it's primarily caused by folk with lower posting numbers that that fly in and fly out, generally with little positive to offer. Otherwise CR is a pretty decent place to frequent, especially outside the gear threads. Of course there are exceptions. And then there is our beloved Dilbert.

Jack
You know, that comes with the tone here. It is "shut up" and "cry if you can, nobody cares", if you have a different opinion or follow a different line. Some guys simply say what they expected and get bashed down for being ignorant and selfish. Having read a lot in the forum in the last half year, I can clearly say, that that neuro guy is one of the worst pickers here. So in all due respect: if thats not pissing people off, i don't know. Open minded people will react in another way and argue differently than writing crap under the hood of irony and sarcasm.

Personally, I think Neuro is one of the fumiest people on the forum if you read him right.

I swear, listening to some of the butthurt whiners around here is like listening to Devo's version of "I Can't Get No Satisfaction" (emasculated undertones and all) over and over again.
 

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Jack Douglas

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Apr 10, 2013
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CanonFanBoy said:
M_S said:
Jack Douglas said:
Regarding the insanity, it's primarily caused by folk with lower posting numbers that that fly in and fly out, generally with little positive to offer. Otherwise CR is a pretty decent place to frequent, especially outside the gear threads. Of course there are exceptions. And then there is our beloved Dilbert.

Jack
You know, that comes with the tone here. It is "shut up" and "cry if you can, nobody cares", if you have a different opinion or follow a different line. Some guys simply say what they expected and get bashed down for being ignorant and selfish. Having read a lot in the forum in the last half year, I can clearly say, that that neuro guy is one of the worst pickers here. So in all due respect: if thats not pissing people off, i don't know. Open minded people will react in another way and argue differently than writing crap under the hood of irony and sarcasm.

Personally, I think Neuro is one of the fumiest people on the forum if you read him right.

I swear, listening to some of the butthurt whiners around here is like listening to Devo's version of "I Can't Get No Satisfaction" (emasculated undertones and all) over and over again.

I get lots of laughs from lots of the interactions and disputes. It's this childish demanding by people who think the world revolves around them that irritates me. Never the less we've survived another onslaught.

This is a Canon forum. Wouldn't one expect a lot of happy Canon shooters producing great results with the generally great Canon cameras that we have. Or is this some kind of contest with other manufacturers? I'm thrilled with my photos from the last 3 years with my lowly 6D, why would I want to moan and groan. Now it's my time to step up one level.

Jack
 
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Feb 8, 2013
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M_S said:
Dual pixel raw explained:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcQ9MSRRvn4

Seems to me, that the area you can adjust is very very tiny.

Looks legit to me.

For Macro shooting this has got to be the most significant feature implemented in a camera since Image Stabilization, sometimes I have to take a dozen pictures just to try and get just the right slice of focus.

Even if I use a different body for other things, this feature is an absolute must have for Macro. Hopefully we get DPAF in the Rebel line (or on an EOS-M) sooner rather than later.
 
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unfocused

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Jack Douglas said:
M_S said:
Jack Douglas said:
...CR is a pretty decent place to frequent, especially outside the gear threads. Of course there are exceptions...
...Some guys simply say what they expected and get bashed down for being ignorant and selfish...

..It's this childish demanding by people who think the world revolves around them that irritates me. Never the less we've survived another onslaught.

This is a Canon forum. Wouldn't one expect a lot of happy Canon shooters producing great results with the generally great Canon cameras that we have. Or is this some kind of contest with other manufacturers?

I've frequented this forum for far too long – going back to the pre-7D I days. In fact, I even remember when Neuro owned a 7D. But I digress.

I think most of the people on this forum just enjoy anticipating and following technological advancements in cameras in general and Canon in particular. Many are very good photographers and this is just something of a mindless release coupled with some entertaining debates.

The longer you are on this forum, the more you learn the individual traits of different contributors. Most are reasonable and rational. They have their pet interests and tend to push those, but generally they keep it in perspective.

But there is also a core group of people who are just never happy with anything Canon does. They have an ax to grind and, honestly, if Canon were to announce a plan that guaranteed world peace and prosperity, they would still complain.

Even the complaining is generally tolerated, until it reaches the point where it's clear they don't know or understand facts.

I edited this exchange down to a couple of illustrative quotes: "Some guys simply say what they expected and get bashed down for being ignorant and selfish."

That only occurs when what they expected is ignorant and selfish (or more precisely, self-centered.)

"It's this childish demanding by people who think the world revolves around them that irritates me."

This is the key counterpoint. Saying what you expected or even wanted is fine, but too many people make the leap from "this is what I wanted" to "I'm being denied what I wanted because Canon is stupid/selfish/evil/old/unimaginative/greedy/doomed." That attitude is certain to generate criticism and disdain from others. If the person expressing the negative viewpoint also demonstrates total disregard for facts, capitalism, and technology, it is generally not very well received on the forum. I don't have any problem with that.
 
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dlee13

Canon EOS R6
May 13, 2014
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davidj said:
gmrza said:
Roo said:
$5699 rrp in Oz :eek: now off my shopping list for now

Michaels is advertising it for $4999. They are generally not the cheapest, so expect street prices to drop below $5000. I would give it at least a year for prices to settle.
For most of those who have the 5DIII, there is hardly a desperate need to upgrade, unless you have really punished your 5DIII.

I came here to say that. Canon's web store is $5699, JB is $5699, Teds is $5199, and Michaels is $4999. It's being offered as body only or with the 24-70 2.8. I'm guessing they'll start offering the kit with the new 24-105 a bit later on, which will mirror what they did in Australia with the 5D III with the premium kit (24-105) and the professional kit (24-70 2.8 ).

It's a lot of money, but AU$4999 is slightly less than the US price of US$3499 plus 10% GST.

Digidirect has it for $4988 so they win for the best price so far.
 
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PureClassA

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"It's this childish demanding by people who think the world revolves around them that irritates me."

Precisely.

This is where some people go off the rails from honest debate to Troll territory. And there are more than a few of these I've seen launch their CR Forum tenure this way with Post #1 and then pop in only to complain more. Makes you wonder what on Earth is so wrong in their lives that they make the time to register for a blog about a product they clearly dont like and make additional time and pointed effort to pop off on it every chance they have.

Meanwhile, some of us can look at this product and say "Well it looks like a great camera, but it's not the right one for me because of (x)". I have a 5D3 and will NOT be upgrading to a 5D4 for several reasons. (I bought another light capturing toy tonight instead) But none of the reasons are because "the camera sucks" "its overpriced crap" "SoNikon is better and Canon is doooooooomed" or any of the other tripe I read here.
 
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Ozarker

Love, joy, and peace to all of good will.
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Jan 28, 2015
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Jack Douglas said:
CanonFanBoy said:
M_S said:
Jack Douglas said:
Regarding the insanity, it's primarily caused by folk with lower posting numbers that that fly in and fly out, generally with little positive to offer. Otherwise CR is a pretty decent place to frequent, especially outside the gear threads. Of course there are exceptions. And then there is our beloved Dilbert.

Jack
You know, that comes with the tone here. It is "shut up" and "cry if you can, nobody cares", if you have a different opinion or follow a different line. Some guys simply say what they expected and get bashed down for being ignorant and selfish. Having read a lot in the forum in the last half year, I can clearly say, that that neuro guy is one of the worst pickers here. So in all due respect: if thats not pissing people off, i don't know. Open minded people will react in another way and argue differently than writing crap under the hood of irony and sarcasm.

Personally, I think Neuro is one of the fumiest people on the forum if you read him right.

I swear, listening to some of the butthurt whiners around here is like listening to Devo's version of "I Can't Get No Satisfaction" (emasculated undertones and all) over and over again.

I get lots of laughs from lots of the interactions and disputes. It's this childish demanding by people who think the world revolves around them that irritates me. Never the less we've survived another onslaught.

This is a Canon forum. Wouldn't one expect a lot of happy Canon shooters producing great results with the generally great Canon cameras that we have. Or is this some kind of contest with other manufacturers? I'm thrilled with my photos from the last 3 years with my lowly 6D, why would I want to moan and groan. Now it's my time to step up one level.

Jack

I wouldn't be ashamed of that 6D. Great camera! Congrats on stepping up. :)
 
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Haven't read all 26 pages of this thread, but I've read about half. Nobody seems to be talking about the bizarre swapping of the positions of the buttons on the top deck. Push the rightmost button, and the functions are in the opposite order. So adjusting ISO is now the rear dial instead of the top dial.

Gonna be fun for those of us using a Mk III and Mk IV at the same time.

Frankly, I think that's the only possible reason they did it: to frustrate users enough to get two identical bodies. They keep fiddling with those top deck controls when they aren't broken.
 
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I have just spent the last half hour reading through the majority of posts I had not seen and have a feeling we're in a loop. I am continually surprised to see all the noise around its video performance. To me it looks like a very capable camera, considering it is a stills camera with (fairly advanced) video capability. In another forum, a guy posted a “Stanley Kubrick has reshot the 2001 A Space Odyssey in stunning 1.74x crop format … he’s not happy with the result!!!” link. I did not bother to read the link, since video is of no interest, but if people expected that kind of capabilities from a stills camera? … ::)

To me, this camera looks fine on paper. I probably don’t get my interchangeable focusing screens on this one either, which is disappointing, but something I could have lived with. I did expect to see metering locked to AF point, but I could live with that too.

The one thing we know nothing of, which is by far the most important thing for me, is what we’ll be getting from the sensor. I have only seen some processed jpeg images, so, other than having confirmed that this camera shoot stills, I know nothing. I have seen no mention of improved DR or noise performance, which I would have expected, if something significant had happened. We’ll have to wait for the reviews.

The only thing I know is that they have priced themselves off the playground I am on. As many will know, I do spend lots of money on this hobby, but I don’t accept being ripped off. So Canon; Be reasonable and I will get both the camera and the two new lenses. If not, you’ll have to sell to all the others .. (it is only 30% cheaper than a 1DX-II and it is $1.000 more expensive than a 5DSR :eek:).
 
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AviatorAddis said:
Considering this crazy crop factor for 4K, is it possible to put an APS-C EFS lens like the Tamron SP 17-50MM F/2.8 Di II VC or better on this body? If it fits, I don't know what the equivalent would work out as.

I've read here before that non-Canon EF-S lenses actually use the EF mount because of patents or something, but they have focal lengths and image circles appropriate for crop sensor bodies. Actual EF-S lenses can go deeper into the camera body, which might cause the mirror to hit the lens. Assuming this is all correct, this means that the Tamron 17-50 or the Sigma 8-16 should work for 4K video on the 5D IV, but the Canon 17-55 won't.
 
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pwp

Oct 25, 2010
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Stephen Melvin said:
Haven't read all 26 pages of this thread, but I've read about half. Nobody seems to be talking about the bizarre swapping of the positions of the buttons on the top deck. Push the rightmost button, and the functions are in the opposite order. So adjusting ISO is now the rear dial instead of the top dial.

Gonna be fun for those of us using a Mk III and Mk IV at the same time.

Frankly, I think that's the only possible reason they did it: to frustrate users enough to get two identical bodies. They keep fiddling with those top deck controls when they aren't broken.

It was an odd move, but in working reality, it's really of very little consequence, barely noticeable.
FWIW I have always assigned ISO to the Set button. Give it a try.

I'm gobsmacked that the headline feature, Dual Pixel RAW can only be processed in Canon's software. Do you know a single professional who works with even modest volumes who uses Canon's lame software? Canon can't do software. Who's going to give up a highly evolved Lightroom or Capture One workflow to process their Dual Pixel RAW files in DPP? Take it from me...for the most part it ain't going to happen.

There are lots of other far more inexplicable design/feature decisions or exclusions that make the 5D MkIV a huge disappointment. It could have so easily been revolutionary.

-pw
 
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AlanF

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pwp said:
Stephen Melvin said:
Haven't read all 26 pages of this thread, but I've read about half. Nobody seems to be talking about the bizarre swapping of the positions of the buttons on the top deck. Push the rightmost button, and the functions are in the opposite order. So adjusting ISO is now the rear dial instead of the top dial.

Gonna be fun for those of us using a Mk III and Mk IV at the same time.

Frankly, I think that's the only possible reason they did it: to frustrate users enough to get two identical bodies. They keep fiddling with those top deck controls when they aren't broken.

It was an odd move, but in working reality, it's really of very little consequence, barely noticeable.
FWIW I have always assigned ISO to the Set button. Give it a try.

I'm gobsmacked that the headline feature, Dual Pixel RAW can only be processed in Canon's software. Do you know a single professional who works with even modest volumes who uses Canon's lame software? Canon can't do software. Who's going to give up a highly evolved Lightroom or Capture One workflow to process their Dual Pixel RAW files in DPP? Take it from me...for the most part it ain't going to happen.

There are lots of other far more inexplicable design/feature decisions or exclusions that make the 5D MkIV a huge disappointment. It could have so easily been revolutionary.

-pw

Why are you gobsmacked? If you introduce a totally novel feature then it is likely that existing third party software won't work. So, what do you, not innovate? We have to see now what output formats can be produced from the next generation of DPP.
 
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Jul 28, 2015
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davidhfe said:
How about defining it differently: I had hoped to see Canon include more of the features available at this price point (and below) from other manufacturers. This would increase my confidence that I am continuing to invest in a system that will meet my needs for the next 4+ years.

(For the record, I am still shooting on a 60D so a big part of my hesitancy about this camera is that I have never imagined being in a place where I could drop $3,500 on a body)

That's a fair enough comment. But I would then ask: given that other manufacturers have features that (in theory) Canon could put in their camera, how many thing do Canon have that other manufacturers don't? And if you want to combine all of those features in a single body then the price is going to be much more than the current 3.7k that people are already complaining about!"


All companies have a fixed R&D budget it is feasible to say that with their large lens line-up they are prioritising that money on AF ergonomics. That's Ok for me.
 
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pwp said:
Here's a bit more...Tony Northrups 30 minute preview:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quwAvqcbLRw

The video mob are roundly underwhelmed. Nice stills camera though.

-pw
Sounds right to me. Will sure keep the 5DS/R as my prime camera.

However, current backup is 6D which could make it worth while to go for a 5DIV.
 
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