Canon EOS 7D Mark III Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
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unfocused
Photos/Photo Book Reviews: www.thecuriouseye.com
Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
I think the prediction might be a bit premature. I was expecting the second half of 2018.
Predicting new bodies based on past refresh cycles is a sure way to be wrong. Canon releases bodies when the technology and market is ready, not by some arbitrary schedule.
This should give us about a year of ridiculously raised expectations (1-1/1/2 stops high ISO noise improvement) followed by the inevitable disappointment and howls of how Canon is doomed.
I'm with the skeptics about the 90D release. I expect the 7DIII will have a new sensor and I expect Canon will go back to the original pattern of putting the new sensor into the XXD model six months to a year after it goes into the 7DIII. (Also possible the 7DIII gets a unique sensor that will never trickle down, but that would be out of character.)
Guaranteed:
On chip ADC will improve dynamic range a bit and may improve noise a bit;
Fully functional touch screen, wifi, nfc, blue tooth, GPS, etc.;
Next generation of autofocus (whatever that may be);
Another frame or two of fps speed;
Incremental improvements in sealing, build, etc.;
Multiple f8 focus points.
Likely:
Increase in mp count
First 4K in crop sensor
Possible:
One CFast and one CF Card slot to match 1DX II;
Next generation of the 5DIV post-exposure focus adjustment
Might be paired with the announcement of the mysterious 150-500/600 unicorn zoom.
I was worried that with the release of the 6DII this forum would have nothing new to fight about. Looks like that problem has been solved.
I think the prediction might be a bit premature. I was expecting the second half of 2018.
Predicting new bodies based on past refresh cycles is a sure way to be wrong. Canon releases bodies when the technology and market is ready, not by some arbitrary schedule.
This should give us about a year of ridiculously raised expectations (1-1/1/2 stops high ISO noise improvement) followed by the inevitable disappointment and howls of how Canon is doomed.
I'm with the skeptics about the 90D release. I expect the 7DIII will have a new sensor and I expect Canon will go back to the original pattern of putting the new sensor into the XXD model six months to a year after it goes into the 7DIII. (Also possible the 7DIII gets a unique sensor that will never trickle down, but that would be out of character.)
Guaranteed:
On chip ADC will improve dynamic range a bit and may improve noise a bit;
Fully functional touch screen, wifi, nfc, blue tooth, GPS, etc.;
Next generation of autofocus (whatever that may be);
Another frame or two of fps speed;
Incremental improvements in sealing, build, etc.;
Multiple f8 focus points.
Likely:
Increase in mp count
First 4K in crop sensor
Possible:
One CFast and one CF Card slot to match 1DX II;
Next generation of the 5DIV post-exposure focus adjustment
Might be paired with the announcement of the mysterious 150-500/600 unicorn zoom.
I was worried that with the release of the 6DII this forum would have nothing new to fight about. Looks like that problem has been solved.
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ashmadux
Art Director, Visual Artist, Freelance Photography
Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
The 7dmk2 is coming...but already here...but....
omg
(head explodes)
This should be interesting. The d500 rains all over the meh 7d2's parade already wet parade. The AF spread alone is spectacular. Auto AF tine tuning? Oh, apparently Canon doesn't think we want that.
Personally I hope the 7d2 tanks from here on in, so it can help dear ol' canon revive this once great line. 7d2= 'meh' sauce. and man do i despise that sensor. 7d3 has a chance to bring it back to glory.
Even the original 6d got more buzz then the 7d2.
The 7dmk2 is coming...but already here...but....
omg
(head explodes)
This should be interesting. The d500 rains all over the meh 7d2's parade already wet parade. The AF spread alone is spectacular. Auto AF tine tuning? Oh, apparently Canon doesn't think we want that.
Personally I hope the 7d2 tanks from here on in, so it can help dear ol' canon revive this once great line. 7d2= 'meh' sauce. and man do i despise that sensor. 7d3 has a chance to bring it back to glory.
Even the original 6d got more buzz then the 7d2.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
The 7D2 is a great camera but i think Canon made a few mistakes:
1. leaving out the touchscreen - really? Including DPAF and leaving out touchscreen was strange. Basically every camera after the 7D2 has touchscreen, including the cheapest and most expensive one, the toughest and the most plasticky.
2. WIFI - I think Canon regretted this and tried to fix it later with the wifi "SD card"
The 7D2 is a great camera but i think Canon made a few mistakes:
1. leaving out the touchscreen - really? Including DPAF and leaving out touchscreen was strange. Basically every camera after the 7D2 has touchscreen, including the cheapest and most expensive one, the toughest and the most plasticky.
2. WIFI - I think Canon regretted this and tried to fix it later with the wifi "SD card"
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
This is my experience as well the photographers that I know who are birders are on the d500 and the 200-500 lens. They take some really nice images. The two I know rather well have both moved from the tamron lenses to the Nikon. They claim that the autofocus system is the best but they miss as many captures as I do with the 5D4. Their high iso images don't seem too far behind the 5D4 despite the 1.5x Nikon crop. So improvement of the sensor would seem to be critical to match or exceed the Nikon.
This is my experience as well the photographers that I know who are birders are on the d500 and the 200-500 lens. They take some really nice images. The two I know rather well have both moved from the tamron lenses to the Nikon. They claim that the autofocus system is the best but they miss as many captures as I do with the 5D4. Their high iso images don't seem too far behind the 5D4 despite the 1.5x Nikon crop. So improvement of the sensor would seem to be critical to match or exceed the Nikon.
Chaitanya said:Dont we already have a 7D mark II?
Here is one of sample pics from D500, its quite impressive camera and I know a lot of birders(who came to Canon system after 1st 7D as Nikon didnt release replacement to D300/s and now are back to shooting Nikon with D500 and 200-500mm lens)
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
Just like the 70D - 7DII relationship, it will probably use a similar sensor to the 80D but with Dual Digic 7 processors (a bit better noise performance) and a revamped AF and metering system (no more AF points but more available with f/8 maximum aperture and tracking better) and slight ergonomic changes. Fixed touch screen like the 5D IV would be logical.
After that we will probably see a 5DSR replacement and maybe something new on the mirrorless line as well.
Just like the 70D - 7DII relationship, it will probably use a similar sensor to the 80D but with Dual Digic 7 processors (a bit better noise performance) and a revamped AF and metering system (no more AF points but more available with f/8 maximum aperture and tracking better) and slight ergonomic changes. Fixed touch screen like the 5D IV would be logical.
After that we will probably see a 5DSR replacement and maybe something new on the mirrorless line as well.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
Agree, but when's the last time a product line got refreshed faster than it did before? I'm hard pressed to think of when that was.
I don't think any of us are sitting here with a stopwatch expecting our next [insert brand here] refresh in 3, 2, 1... I'm just saying that Canon has bulked up the portfolio and can't just break into a gallop when it feels like it.
So, yes, the 7D3 could absolutely come next year, but it would be rather un-Canon-like to do so. If it did, one would logically think the D500 + 200-500 combo was indeed doing market share damage to Canon such that it felt compelled to shake things up with their pipeline. I can't really think of another reason why they wouldn't try to maximize the ROI on their '5-year mission' with the 7D line.
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unfocused said:
Agree, but when's the last time a product line got refreshed faster than it did before? I'm hard pressed to think of when that was.
I don't think any of us are sitting here with a stopwatch expecting our next [insert brand here] refresh in 3, 2, 1... I'm just saying that Canon has bulked up the portfolio and can't just break into a gallop when it feels like it.
So, yes, the 7D3 could absolutely come next year, but it would be rather un-Canon-like to do so. If it did, one would logically think the D500 + 200-500 combo was indeed doing market share damage to Canon such that it felt compelled to shake things up with their pipeline. I can't really think of another reason why they wouldn't try to maximize the ROI on their '5-year mission' with the 7D line.
- A
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
Good list. Agree in broad strokes.
+1 on the unicorn (longer than 400 without a T/C) super zoom coming out with it. That's a no-brainer release pairing to me.
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unfocused said:
Good list. Agree in broad strokes.
+1 on the unicorn (longer than 400 without a T/C) super zoom coming out with it. That's a no-brainer release pairing to me.
- A
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
in terms of stills shooting its not gonna blow the 1DX away so meh.
if they manage to make the sensor as good as D500, its gonna be something. that sensor is just superb for aps-c.
in terms of stills shooting its not gonna blow the 1DX away so meh.
if they manage to make the sensor as good as D500, its gonna be something. that sensor is just superb for aps-c.
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unfocused
Photos/Photo Book Reviews: www.thecuriouseye.com
Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
I think the 7D and 7D II timeline is misleading. There were a couple of unique factors from what I can tell. First, Nikon all but abandoned the market at the time, leaving the 7D with no competition. Second, there is some evidence that Canon was undertaking major changes in its manufacturing that may have delayed development of the 7DII. The firmware release of the 7D 1/2 was certainly unusual and kind of screws up any timeline for the 7D series.
Still, even with all that factored in, the refresh does seem to be coming sooner than expected (if the rumor is correct). I don't doubt for a minute that the D500 may have something to do with that -- although in terms of actual performance, the 7DII holds its own against the newer D500. (The sample photograph someone posted above that was shot with a D500 doesn't show anything that couldn't be done with a 7DII)
I would add that I think Canon did make a couple of errors with the 7DII by not including a full touch screen, full wifi and multiple f8 focus points. The fact that they released the wifi card is pretty strong evidence that they know they make a mistake on that front.
Finally, perception can be everything and even though the 7DII gives up very little ground to the D500, that is not what many people think. So I agree Canon may be feeling some competitive pressure.
If they release the 7DIII with a 500mm f5.6 "L" zoom that sells for $3,000 or less they will recapture any lost ground and then some. I personally hope they steer away from a cheap "consumer" zoom like Nikon's.
ahsanford said:
I think the 7D and 7D II timeline is misleading. There were a couple of unique factors from what I can tell. First, Nikon all but abandoned the market at the time, leaving the 7D with no competition. Second, there is some evidence that Canon was undertaking major changes in its manufacturing that may have delayed development of the 7DII. The firmware release of the 7D 1/2 was certainly unusual and kind of screws up any timeline for the 7D series.
Still, even with all that factored in, the refresh does seem to be coming sooner than expected (if the rumor is correct). I don't doubt for a minute that the D500 may have something to do with that -- although in terms of actual performance, the 7DII holds its own against the newer D500. (The sample photograph someone posted above that was shot with a D500 doesn't show anything that couldn't be done with a 7DII)
I would add that I think Canon did make a couple of errors with the 7DII by not including a full touch screen, full wifi and multiple f8 focus points. The fact that they released the wifi card is pretty strong evidence that they know they make a mistake on that front.
Finally, perception can be everything and even though the 7DII gives up very little ground to the D500, that is not what many people think. So I agree Canon may be feeling some competitive pressure.
If they release the 7DIII with a 500mm f5.6 "L" zoom that sells for $3,000 or less they will recapture any lost ground and then some. I personally hope they steer away from a cheap "consumer" zoom like Nikon's.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
Lets not forget the 2011 Tōhoku earthquake and tsunami.
I don't know that Canon said specifically which products were delayed/impacted but I'm pretty sure they acknowledged that facilities and capabilities took a hit. The 7D II came out much later than expected at the time and there was the unusual, if not unprecedented, 7D update that was more than just fixes.
It seems misguided to expect the 7DII-7DIII refresh period to be in any way related to the 7D-7DII refresh period.
Lets not forget the 2011 Tōhoku earthquake and tsunami.
I don't know that Canon said specifically which products were delayed/impacted but I'm pretty sure they acknowledged that facilities and capabilities took a hit. The 7D II came out much later than expected at the time and there was the unusual, if not unprecedented, 7D update that was more than just fixes.
It seems misguided to expect the 7DII-7DIII refresh period to be in any way related to the 7D-7DII refresh period.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
Low ISO IQ will be improved almost certainly. High ISO IQ... well, you're fighting against physics there. Expecting any large improvements there is just not realistic.
jayt567 said:
Low ISO IQ will be improved almost certainly. High ISO IQ... well, you're fighting against physics there. Expecting any large improvements there is just not realistic.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
From what I have read from people who actually used that on the Nikon weren't particularly impressed with it. Seems like one of those 'nice ideas in theory but needs much more work in practice'.
ashmadux said:
From what I have read from people who actually used that on the Nikon weren't particularly impressed with it. Seems like one of those 'nice ideas in theory but needs much more work in practice'.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
The main issue is whether it will have a low pass filter or not. The 7D line is analogous to Nikon's D500 and that Nikon has been moving sports and wildlife photographers over as the lack of filter makes it able to render far more detail than the 7D2. The 7D3 is going to have to either have no filter or have the filter but break new ground in APS-C resolution (think 30mp+ to overcome the filter) to stay competitive. With a filter on the current 24mp limit, the Nikon will continue to be the best choice for sports & wildlife.
B) The "time for 4K" was every camera in the last 18 months or so, but looking forward, it makes most sense for the 90D and 7D3 to get it over the 6D2 which is primarily set as a stills upgrade and a manufacturer's replacement of the 5D3.
The main issue is whether it will have a low pass filter or not. The 7D line is analogous to Nikon's D500 and that Nikon has been moving sports and wildlife photographers over as the lack of filter makes it able to render far more detail than the 7D2. The 7D3 is going to have to either have no filter or have the filter but break new ground in APS-C resolution (think 30mp+ to overcome the filter) to stay competitive. With a filter on the current 24mp limit, the Nikon will continue to be the best choice for sports & wildlife.
A) The 6D2 only has one card slot; it's not a wedding camera.jayt567 said:
B) The "time for 4K" was every camera in the last 18 months or so, but looking forward, it makes most sense for the 90D and 7D3 to get it over the 6D2 which is primarily set as a stills upgrade and a manufacturer's replacement of the 5D3.
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
Rubbish. Every time this talk of 'second card slot' comes up it is clear there are many pros who don't think a second slot is important.
And even if it is not one that some pros look to as a primary camera,if you are saying lack of dual slots remove it as a back up I would venture you don't really know what you are talking about.
Jeez, we've had 50+ pages of discussion on this for the 6D2 that is only just been released and you are already critcising Canon on this issue for a camera that is not even going to be announced for another year...?
aceflibble said:
Rubbish. Every time this talk of 'second card slot' comes up it is clear there are many pros who don't think a second slot is important.
And even if it is not one that some pros look to as a primary camera,if you are saying lack of dual slots remove it as a back up I would venture you don't really know what you are talking about.
And the 7D3 would not be primarily a stills camera?aceflibble said:
Jeez, we've had 50+ pages of discussion on this for the 6D2 that is only just been released and you are already critcising Canon on this issue for a camera that is not even going to be announced for another year...?
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Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Coming First Half of 2018 [CR2]
Canon has been implementing an major upgrading of sensor technology, including touchscreen focussing, on sensor ADC, and PDAF across its camera line. It seems likely that some disruption of this strategy influenced what features the 7DIi did or did not have, as well as the timing of its release. The disruption could have been by the earthquake, or it could have been from unanticipated problems in the implementation of some features, which were then left out of the 7DII.
In any case, the 7DIii could become something of a catchup camera to get things back on track, which could lead to a 7DIII showing up sooner rather than later.
Lurker said:
Canon has been implementing an major upgrading of sensor technology, including touchscreen focussing, on sensor ADC, and PDAF across its camera line. It seems likely that some disruption of this strategy influenced what features the 7DIi did or did not have, as well as the timing of its release. The disruption could have been by the earthquake, or it could have been from unanticipated problems in the implementation of some features, which were then left out of the 7DII.
In any case, the 7DIii could become something of a catchup camera to get things back on track, which could lead to a 7DIII showing up sooner rather than later.
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