Canon will bring an RF 400mm f/4 DO IS USM to the lineup in 2024

[EOS 4 Life]

You are down to 400 prime shooters who are pros, I don't think they are going to give up the subject separation to save $4k

Pros buy that lens to save weight.
If it is light enough then it will sell.

 

[rbr]

I had the 400 DO II for a while and really liked it, but didn't use it much and sold it off. At the time I had a 600f4 and the 100-400II and that lens just stayed home most of the time. A lens that would make a lot of sense to me from Canon would be a 600 f4.5 DO that could be significantly lighter and less expensive (hopefully) than a 600 f4 and could be turned into a 840 f6.3 and a fast enough 1200mm f9. No one makes anything like it, but that would be an ideal lens to me.

 

[john1970]

Frankly I would have preferred a 500 mm f4.5 or f5. Not interested in this lens because I already have the 100-300 mm f2.8 + 1.4x TC.

Waiting on the 200-500 mm f4.

 

[davidespinosa]

EF version is currently US $6900:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1081814-REG/canon_8404b002_ef_400mm_f_4_do.html

 

[DhlcadR6]

An RF 400 f/4 DO would surely be more that twice the price the Nikon 400 f/4.5.

I foresee the possibilities....

Canon introduces the RF 400 f/4 DO.
Anti-/hater: It's too expensive

Canon introduces the RF 400 f/5.6 DO.
Anti-/hater: It's too slow...Nikon/Sony has it brighter...blah blah blah...I can't shoot high-speed low-light sports now....blah blah blah...I'm switching to Nikon/Sony/Panasonic/m43/Fuji...blah blah blah...Canon is not innovating anymore...blah blah blah...why Canon has not doomed...blah blah blah...You guys are Canon fanboys for not using non-Canon gear...blah blah blah...

 

[DhlcadR6]

Is this rumor supposed to make me regret that I just spend 1200USD to get a used mk1 of the EF 400mm f4 DO

 

[[email protected]]

There is some hope in the DO line.

I've been disappointed that Canon's RF big whites have proven to be the same designs as the last iterations of the EF 400 f/2.8 and 600 f/4, and that the other focal length variants proved to be internally teleconverted versions of the same lenses. (Not that these are bad lenses at all. My favorite one at the moment is the EF 600 F/4, which is - but for the needed adapter - the same design as the newer RF equivalent.)

But if they come out with some DO options with fresh designs, we may see the innovation needle move a bit. I have my fingers crossed.

 

[EOS 4 Life]

There is some hope in the DO line.

I've been disappointed that Canon's RF big whites have proven to be the same designs as the last iterations of the EF 400 f/2.8 and 600 f/4, and that the other focal length variants proved to be internally teleconverted versions of the same lenses. (Not that these are bad lenses at all. My favorite one at the moment is the EF 600 F/4, which is - but for the needed adapter - the same design as the newer RF equivalent.)

But if they come out with some DO options with fresh designs, we may see the innovation needle move a bit. I have my fingers crossed.

I am not sure why people talk like the EF designs are old.
There was no reason to change them at all.
The DO versions probably won't be fresh designs either.
They will probably be older designs that were never turned into actual lenses.
There are plenty of patents already.

 

[EricN]

I am not sure why people talk like the EF designs are old.
There was no reason to change them at all.
The DO versions probably won't be fresh designs either.
They will probably be older designs that were never turned into actual lenses.
There are plenty of patents already.

I think some people enjoy complaining

 

[CrPr]

The EF 400 f4 DO II is one of my most used and beloved lenses, especially in combination with R5, R6, R7. Compared with my also loved RF 100-500, I would see image quality on par, with or without converters. For wildlife f4 versus f5.6 or 8 matters, especially in low light or fast action scenes. Compared to a 400 f2.8, its lower weight is a huge advantage for me on my hikes with or without a mountain bike. Half the price of a f2.8 version a 400 f4 is some kind of a sweet spot for me. As the EF version already has excellent image solo and with extenders, like all the big whites, I would not expect really significant improvements here. A new DO construction will hopefully come out with lower weight around 1600 grams. This would be a tempting option for me. As I know Canon, I would not be surprised by a 6000 Euro/US-Dollars price tag. That said, I still prefer the combination of such a light prime with or without extenders over a heavier and double priced 100-300 f2.8 + 1.4 extender. By the way, the main disadvantage of the new RF 200-800 I see in its f7.1 at 400 and only f8 at 500 mm.

 

[swkitt]

A 4/400 that weights around 1.2kg would be a great addition to the range.
The DOs are great lenses for many people (like nature photographers who hike a lot), the only reason they don't sell much is their price. If they price it like Nikon's, it will sell a lot !

 

[mpmark]

Interesting. I wonder if the direct replacement White primes will all be DO lenses going forwards. It makes sense if this lens is built as a RF 400mm f2.8 DO and then releasing a 100-400mm f2.8 L. It literally could be a smallest adn lightest 400mm f2.8 ever constructed.

Absolutely NOT a replacement for the conventional, there is draw backs to defractive optics, the background bokeh for starters. So no it will not be a replacement, it will be a smaller option and with options comes drawbacks

 

[MiJax]

....My RF100-500mm at 500mm outperformed the DO at 400mm...

This has been pretty consistent through the years, the 400 DO is run really hard (or outright beat) by the current L zoom. That's not the case for any of the other super teles. Tough sell when you are seeing 1 stop or less for 3 - 4X the cost.

Personally, I loved my DO when I was using it, but it will be VERY hard to buy another one. The difference in IQ has been too noticeable for me, when compared to other uber dollar lenses.

 

[MiJax]

I would like to see Canon take DO, BR, and whatever other tech acronym they've got and use it to make a 400 f2.8 that weighs in at 2kg or less. That would be a big win.

As for Rf 400 f4 DO it should weigh less than Sony's new 300 f2.8, preferably 1.2kg or less.

IMO, the problem with this idea is, they would have to make and sell 2 separate 400mm 2.8's to make this work (one conventional and one DO). DO lenses are great when the user isn't looking for the utmost in optical performance, but this lens class is designed for the top tier in optical performance. So, it would be highly unlikely to see this.

As for the super light weight aspect, its possible, but I fear something would have to give to make it work. IMO, that would mean crazier than crazy price tag as they try to find ways to correct aberrations without adding weight and elements, or lagging optical performance by just accepting the physics are too tough to deal with for a reasonable price.

To play devil's advocate for your idea, the 400mm 2.8 would probably be one of the better fits for a DO lens. I say this because it would be a lens that is less likely to be put in a specular highlight situation where these lenses have a little trouble. Being a 2.8, it is expected to be used in lower light levels fairly often, which would suit the DO optics to an extent. But overall, I think the expense to create it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense.

 

[MJ]

Finally a rumor of a new super telephoto I enjoy... sounds just like what I'm waiting for!
Also please bring on a 600mm and 800mm DO version just like Nikon

 

[Dreysi]

Lovely but what PRICE this will be??

We don't know at this point, but suggest you start doing your glute exercises in preparation for this announcement.

 

[Dreysi]

An RF 400 f/4 DO would surely be more that twice the price the Nikon 400 f/4.5.

Yep, it's one of the features.

 

[EricN]

We don't know at this point, but suggest you start doing your glute exercises in preparation for this announcement.

What are the glute exercises for?

 

[mxwphoto]

IMO, the problem with this idea is, they would have to make and sell 2 separate 400mm 2.8's to make this work (one conventional and one DO). DO lenses are great when the user isn't looking for the utmost in optical performance, but this lens class is designed for the top tier in optical performance. So, it would be highly unlikely to see this.

As for the super light weight aspect, its possible, but I fear something would have to give to make it work. IMO, that would mean crazier than crazy price tag as they try to find ways to correct aberrations without adding weight and elements, or lagging optical performance by just accepting the physics are too tough to deal with for a reasonable price.

To play devil's advocate for your idea, the 400mm 2.8 would probably be one of the better fits for a DO lens. I say this because it would be a lens that is less likely to be put in a specular highlight situation where these lenses have a little trouble. Being a 2.8, it is expected to be used in lower light levels fairly often, which would suit the DO optics to an extent. But overall, I think the expense to create it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense.

To solve the duplication conundrum, Canon can just make the 400mm f2 into a reality via conventional lenses and leave the 400 f2.8 as a light weight DO. You get 2x the news coverage, 2x the world's firsts for 400 f2, 400 f2.8 with DO (and lightest 400 2.8 achievement as well), and get to jack everything up 2x the price for them.

 

[GMCPhotographics]

IMO, the problem with this idea is, they would have to make and sell 2 separate 400mm 2.8's to make this work (one conventional and one DO). DO lenses are great when the user isn't looking for the utmost in optical performance, but this lens class is designed for the top tier in optical performance. So, it would be highly unlikely to see this.

As for the super light weight aspect, its possible, but I fear something would have to give to make it work. IMO, that would mean crazier than crazy price tag as they try to find ways to correct aberrations without adding weight and elements, or lagging optical performance by just accepting the physics are too tough to deal with for a reasonable price.

To play devil's advocate for your idea, the 400mm 2.8 would probably be one of the better fits for a DO lens. I say this because it would be a lens that is less likely to be put in a specular highlight situation where these lenses have a little trouble. Being a 2.8, it is expected to be used in lower light levels fairly often, which would suit the DO optics to an extent. But overall, I think the expense to create it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense.

I agree that the market probably can't support two 400mm f2.8 lenses in Canon's line up. Thr original 400mm f2.8 mk1 was designed for sports and action. However, I use mine mostly in a wildlife context. I find it very versatile with or witout teleconverters. When ever looking at a S/H model, I usually find that the chrome lens mount takes a pounding with these lenses...far more than any other big white. So it's safe to assume that teleconverter use with these lenses is very common. You effectively get a 400/2.8, 600/f4 and a 800/f5.6 with the one lens.
In a wild life context, I find that I am backlighting on a fairly regular basis. So a DO lens (assuming the same issues with the mkII 400mm DO) for me isnt something that i would look for in a lens. I currently use a EF 400mm f2.8 LIS mk II and I can't see any reason to side grade currently.
I get the max frame rate that my R6ii is capable of. I get the best sharpness and IQ that I've ever got from a 400/2.8 and it's a lot lighter than the mk1. This lens is very portable compared to the mk1.
The RF version is just a mkIII EF version with an integrated EF to RF adapter and the difference between the EF mkIII and the EF mkII seems to be slight. I'm finding the mkII to be light and portable enough. Maybe that'll change for me when I'm another 10 eyars older!
A Do lens would be a lot smaller and lighter for sure, but will it be enough over the current RF version? It's possible that the DO prime would sit along side a more expensive zoom version. Say a DO option and a 100-400/f2.8 option.
Who know's except behind the closed doors of Canon lens design HQ.