Canon's Full Frame Future [CR2]

[Mancubus]

I really don't think that Canon would go backwards in resolution on the 5d4 just for a few improvements on low light.

Maybe the 1dX2 will remain at 18mp to allow ultra fast shooting and huge buffer that wouldn't be viable with large files, but the 5d4 doesn't need to be that fast.

Something within the 24-28mp range would be more realistic I think. By the time the 5d4 gets released, they've had 4 years to improve the sensor and I really hope they can make something at least as good as the Nikon D750 (which does just fine with 24mp) in terms of low light performance.

 

[M_S]

Rumors. Rumors. And more RUMORS. Someone said (and I think it's perfectly plausible) that the 18MP figure may be a leak test for Canon. I'd be shocked out my mind if they went backwards 20% on resolution. If they want a lower MP/High ISO performer like the a7S, rest assured they aren't going to Megapixel hijack the cash cow centerpiece of the vaunted 5D line to do it.

I'd predict we see an excellent FF version of the new 24MP APS-C sensor found in the Rebel t6. That seems to make the most sense for a 5D4 given a Digic 7 chip (or 6+, or whatever) with a small step up in FPS (7-8) and a notable jump in being able to cleanly pull up shadows (like the 5DS) with a stop or two better high ISO than the 5D3

Could be. But lets say it this way. Canon rumours should be seen as an excellent vehicle to promote upcoming gear. In the advent of new technology of other competing companies, tech that is by far more advanced than what Canon at the moment has to offer in some areas, is very tempting. I would be very cautious to spread a rumour which such statements (18MP ?????) just to get to a source in the company. This rumour might as well tick people off and take what's out there right now, making them lost for the next product of the company and perhaps lost forever if they are satisfied with what the have then. From a marketing standpoint this would definitly and totally be the wrong approach.

 

[Hjalmarg1]

Is it probable that the 5DIV will have an 18mp sensor?
Even considering better DR and low light IQ, isn't that a step backwards compared to the competitors??.....or do I sound like one of the Sonikon fanboys ;D

It might be but the 5DIV would be more like the A7S and hopefully will have better ISO performance and dinamic range than the current model.

 

[RobPan]

First of all, I think we are so far away from Canon finalizing the specs on a new 5DIV that it's crazy to get worked up over rumors of the number of megapixels.

That said, I don't know of too many 1DX owners complaining about low resolution. I'm not sure the difference between 18 mp and 22 mp would be that noticeable and if it improved low-light performance, I'd probably opt for the fewer megapixels.

But, as others have pointed out, it really comes down to trade-offs. A quarter of a stop improvement in noise, would not be worth the loss of resolution. On the other hand, there is no reason to assume that an 18 mp sensor in 2016 would have the same limitations as an 18 mp sensor from 2012. If dynamic range and noise can be improved from one generation to the next, I'm not sure we should assume that an 18 mp sensor from 2016 could not withstand more cropping than an 18 mp sensor from 2012.

Everyone sees things from their own perspective. For my personal use, I'd like to see the resolution remain at 22 mp and have some slight improvement in noise. For my work, I often need to squeeze every bit of ISO sensitivity out of the sensor, so an 18 mp sensor could be quite tempting if the already amazing low-light performance of the current 5DIII gets even better. There are lots of times when the 5DIII's low light performance has saved my bacon, so I certainly can't dismiss a camera that might give even better low light performance.

Could not agree more. I hate flash. Artificial lighting is unthinkable in the situations where I take my pictures. (Never in a studio.) High ISO performance to me is much more important than high resolution. 18 MP is enough for most good lenses. Just compare Plus-X and Panatomic-X resolution. For me in most situations, Plus-X is good enough, no need for Panatomic-X. (I used Tri-X most of the time.) I don't have the figures, but I suppose 18MP is more or less comparable to Plus-X is resolution, perhaps even better.
Kind regards from grandpa Rob.

 

[zim]

I want to be able to print to 36" without stitching and have 7fps also need to be able to afford to loss around 15-20% of the frame in crop.
As unfocused said 'Everyone sees things from their own perspective'
It will be interesting to see what the specs actually end up, the months of speculation I suspect will be painful though!

 

[Loswr]

​

I want to be able to print to 36" without stitching and have 7fps also need to be able to afford to loss around 15-20% of the frame in crop.

Nothing about DR? Gir would be angry, nobody wants that.

 

[mark99]

How about a 1dxNV
NO Bloody Video

Putting video in to press cameras is causing rights issues at football grounds where moving images are rights reserved.
Then it adds at least £1000+ to the body price.
The video is a gimmick, we are not all film makers with a team of focus pulling experts on hand, a small compact like a Sony hx50 will win hands down anyway.
What we want is lower price and a good stills camera, at present if you see a tog with a 1DX they are either from one of the main agencies or a weekend warrior.
They have priced themselves out of the freelance tog market.
By knocking out the video, it saves VAT as well, in we could see nearly a £2000 drop in cost.
We dont want it, we dont need it.
Just make a bloody camera !

 

[pedro]

As per the new sensor technology of the C300 Mk II that does, which will be turned over to the 1DX2 and perhaps the 5D4 as well.

Will an HDR mode even be necessary with the 15 stops in the new sensor? (HDR will still be in firmware either way).

Who rumored there would be 15 stops of DR?

If this isn't included in a 5DIV it will be quite a let down to many pro's using the 5D as an alloround/event cam...my two cents.

 

[pedro]

"...a few stops of ISO performance boost."

I thought we were in the range where we should only expect increments of a single stop of ISO performance? "A few" to me means ~3 stops. I'll take 18 MP if I get noise equivalent to ISO 3200 on my 5diii at ISO 25,600 on the 5DIV.

But, seriously, I am not expecting that.

Out of what I am expecting, I'd be interested in ~26-28MP and 0.5-1 stop High ISO improvement.

+1

 

[x-vision]

My take on the lineup (based on what makes the most sense to me; I'm only speculating, of course):
1DX2 - announced at the end of 2015 with 22-24mp, shipping in 2016
5DIV - announced in the spring of 2016 with 28-30mp, shipping mid-2016
6DII - announced in the fall of 2016 with 28-30mp

The 1DX2 doesn't need to have 4K video. High-speed 1080p, though, makes a lot of sense for this camera.
I'm expecting 22mp on the 1DX2, since this resolution is optimized for full-frame 1080p - through either pixel binning or full-capture downsizing.

For the 5DIV to make a splash, it needs to have 28-30mp and 4K video.
Anything below that will be considered a disappointment by many - and I don't think Canon is stupid to not realize it.
28-30p is a good increase in resolution vs the 5DIII.
It's also good for 4K video through downsizing of full-capture images.
So, that's what I'm expecting from the 5DIV.

The 6DII is the wildcard, basically.
I personally think that it should be a D750 competitor but who knows what Canon has in store for it.
Do they want to sell a sub-$2000 (and under-spec'd) FF camera - or do they want to sell a reasonably spec'd $2000 camera.
We'll find out when they announce it.

To me, it makes the most sense that the 5DIV and 6DII use the same sensor but who knows what Canon is thinking.
And I'm fully expecting that all three FF cameras will finally catch up with Sony in terms of dynamic range.

 

[bdunbar79]

Don't know about S/N but the 1Dx has over 1 stop more DR than the 5D3 at ISO 6400.

 

[gunship01]

1DX Mark II
Price: $5,000

This may help awaken you from your dream.

LOL! I know...

Can't hurt...

 

[PureClassA]

Based on speculation and rumors, Canon should really

...have quit making dSLRs a couple of years ago, because based on speculation and rumors mirrorless was to have killed the dSLR by then. :

LOL! Nice.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

They made the 5D4 low MP

I missed the press release, do you have a link?

it's too late once it's real

possibly marketing feelers though might occur before it's completely too late

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

How about a 1dxNV
NO Bloody Video

Putting video in to press cameras is causing rights issues at football grounds where moving images are rights reserved.
Then it adds at least £1000+ to the body price.
The video is a gimmick, we are not all film makers with a team of focus pulling experts on hand, a small compact like a Sony hx50 will win hands down anyway.
What we want is lower price and a good stills camera, at present if you see a tog with a 1DX they are either from one of the main agencies or a weekend warrior.
They have priced themselves out of the freelance tog market.
By knocking out the video, it saves VAT as well, in we could see nearly a £2000 drop in cost.
We dont want it, we dont need it.
Just make a bloody camera !

there is no way adding video adds 1000 pounds, if anything it might slightly reduce the cost due to higher sales

and i doubt an hx50's video will touch a7rii quality (nor even, for 1080p, 5D3 ML RAW)

 

[zim]

​

I want to be able to print to 36" without stitching and have 7fps also need to be able to afford to loss around 15-20% of the frame in crop.

Nothing about DR? Gir would be angry, nobody wants that.

Nope my tall one nothing about DR, quite deliberately.

 

[TominNJ]

my take for what it's worth:

My 5D3 is a great camera. As an older person who cut my teeth on manual focus, screw mount average weighted metering I am astonished at the progress that has been made in these things. It is so easy to take pictures that were impossible when I started. My eyesight isn't near what it was and I am eternally grateful for the autofocus. With that being said:

autofocus could still use some improvement. I've missed some bird in flight pictures because the AF locked onto the background and it missed the focus on my granddaughter in a swing.

less noise in timed exposures would be great. I dabble in astrophotography and the dark sky areas at high ISO settings are pretty bad.

higher resolution would be awesome. I shoot songbirds and it's impossible to fill the frame sometimes no matter how big my glass. I have to crop those shots quite a bit and I could always use more detail.

more DR would be great for my landscapes. The HDR function helps with this but there is still room for improvement.

Something no one has mentioned (that I've seen anyway) but would be pretty cool if it was technically feasible:
how about a focus stacking function built into the camera?

I don't use the video much but will probably start using it more as my grandkids get older. I definitely would like to see it retained but I don't care too much if it's 4k.

 

[ChristopherMarkPerez]

Checking with a local camera shop that sells to professionals and avid hobbyists I am surprised to learn the new 5Ds are not selling well.

According to the sale droids the new Sony A7rII seems to really have caught folks attention.

If this holds true across the larger market (and not just this isolated instance) then Canon might very well have missed the mark with their new Wonder Device.

As is sometimes said: Stay Tuned

 

[docsmith]

Checking with a local camera shop that sells to professionals and avid hobbyists I am surprised to learn the new 5Ds are not selling well.

According to the sale droids the new Sony A7rII seems to really have caught folks attention.

If this holds true across the larger market (and not just this isolated instance) then Canon might very well have missed the mark with their new Wonder Device.

As is sometimes said: Stay Tuned

While Canon wouldn't put something out on the market that they didn't expect to sell, I never had the impression that the 5Ds /sR were aimed at a mass market, but rather a niche of the market. That said, the 5Ds is available at Amazon, B&H and Adorama...where the 5Ds R is on backorder at all three locations. So it could be that the niche going for the high MP is skipping over the 5Ds and going straight to the 5Ds R.

Which is what I would do as well.

 

[massive]

How about a 1dxNV
NO Bloody Video

Putting video in to press cameras is causing rights issues at football grounds where moving images are rights reserved.
Then it adds at least £1000+ to the body price.
The video is a gimmick, we are not all film makers with a team of focus pulling experts on hand, a small compact like a Sony hx50 will win hands down anyway.
What we want is lower price and a good stills camera, at present if you see a tog with a 1DX they are either from one of the main agencies or a weekend warrior.
They have priced themselves out of the freelance tog market.
By knocking out the video, it saves VAT as well, in we could see nearly a £2000 drop in cost.
We dont want it, we dont need it.
Just make a bloody camera !

there is no way adding video adds 1000 pounds, if anything it might slightly reduce the cost due to higher sales

and i doubt an hx50's video will touch a7rii quality (nor even, for 1080p, 5D3 ML RAW)

having video means its taxed a lot more.