D810!!!

[eninja]

I feel sorry for Nikon owners.
It doesn't matter what model they buy, even when first released, as a few months down the track, Nikon will bring out a new and improved version of it making your current model obsolete and now worth substantially less than it cost you. Remember the D600 then the 610?
Canon does hang onto models much longer, and hence they have better re-sale value later on as say, after 3 years, your Canon may be just superseded, but if you had an equivalent Nikon, it would be 3 models old and practically worthless.

I'm not saying that Nikon cameras are no good, in fact, they are very good indeed, but constant model updates is not how you keep up the perceived and resale value of products.
It also makes it more difficult regarding spare parts too, as many models mean lots of parts and distributors only have so much space and money for parts.

True, i got a 6D, bought it when it came out. Honestly I would not be happy if Canon came out with a Mark II this year, with more low light cross type AF points and a touch screen (when I ask someone take picture of us/me, its surely OOF most of the time.)

1 more year should be ok..

 

[arcanej]

I post here mainly because I enjoy helping people, sharing knowledge (I enjoyed teaching medical and graduate students, and I rather miss teaching), and good technical discussions in which I can both contribute and learn from others. I'm not sure why you post here, other than trolling and posting incorrect facts and misinformation.

Apparently you're unwilling to put your reputation on the line. Interesting, although I can't say I'm surprised.

Sometimes poster / long-time lurker: I find Neuroanatomist's posts enlightening and, often, funny. Not that this relates to the D810, although not much in this thread really does.

 

[sagittariansrock]

Can someone (I am thinking of you, jrista) explain why no low-pass filter is better than a non anti-aliasing one (except to Nikon, who can probably save some money).
Thanks

 

[weixing]

I feel sorry for Nikon owners.
It doesn't matter what model they buy, even when first released, as a few months down the track, Nikon will bring out a new and improved version of it making your current model obsolete and now worth substantially less than it cost you. Remember the D600 then the 610?
Canon does hang onto models much longer, and hence they have better re-sale value later on as say, after 3 years, your Canon may be just superseded, but if you had an equivalent Nikon, it would be 3 models old and practically worthless.

I'm not saying that Nikon cameras are no good, in fact, they are very good indeed, but constant model updates is not how you keep up the perceived and resale value of products.
It also makes it more difficult regarding spare parts too, as many models mean lots of parts and distributors only have so much space and money for parts.

I feel sorry for people who buy cameras based on how much they can sell them for.

If your camera is in good enough condition to be sold as "mint" or "near mint" condition then you obviously haven't used it very much.

While I can understand this for lenses....for camera bodies, they are a depreciating asset. Every camera body I have bought has dropped in resale value over the three years I have owned them. The lenses i have bought have generally been worth more over time due to inflation and increasing prices year on year. My 16-35IIL cost me £850 new, it's still worth close to that S/H and new they are nearly £1200. My 85 f1.2 II L cost me £1200, it's worth nearly that S/H and it's new price is between £1500 and £1800 depending where you buy it.

Camera bodies are electronic devices like your iPad, iPhone, iMac and depreciate accordingly as their function degrades.

I sometimes wonder if the people that care most about the resale value are those that are always running with a month to month non-$0 debt on their credit card and thus see the resale value as being a way to gain back that lost debt, so to speak.

Hi,
Some of us (me included) always sell the old camera to fund the new camera, so that we don't need to pay the full price for it when we upgrade our camera. In the idea scenario, when a new model come out, we should have save enough $$ to pay for the difference after we sell the old model.

If the new camera "refresh" too fast, we might not save enough $$ to perform the "sell old, buy new" upgrade especially for a mid range full frame DSLR like D800 which is not cheap, so we wait... By the time, we ready to perform the upgrade, a new model launched (may be D900) and the value of our old camera drop even further...

Hmm... may be this is the reason why Nikon don't sell as many camera as Canon as their model "refresh" too fast which make the resale value of their camera drop so fast that it's make no sense to perform upgrade, so Nikon user will just use the camera longer until they save enough $$ to buy a new one at full price.

Have a nice day.

You upgrade your camera when there is a significant functionality boost over the old camera, not because of minor changes. A three year old camera is a three year old camera, the loss of value over that time will reflect that. As with any product, there is premium to be paid for something that is new out of the box rather than used, and resale will lose you that premium. If you upgrade every 12 months for some minor improvement, then yes, you are going to be losing a lot more money than if you upgraded every three years because you are giving up that premium three times instead of once. It is not Nikon's fault that you choose to do this.

Yes, a 3 year old camera is a 3 year old camera, but as long as your camera is the still current model, your resale value will not drop as quickly as a model that has a replacement model on the market... When a new model is launch, the price of the older model will drop even if the different between the new model and the old model is just the colour of the camera... A model with a replacement model in the market will sound older than it really is.

Have a nice day.

 

[wtlloyd]

Forum members playing Wack-a-Mole with each other aside, I am savoring the rich irony of reading (in paraphrase) "poor Nikon owners, Nikon refreshes their camera line too often".

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

The camera can do ISO 32 and 64??!! WHAAAAAT?!

When DxO gets their copy of the D810, it will be interesting to see where ISO32 and ISO64 fit onto the ISO sensitivity graph.

It may be that ISO32 and ISO64 are achieved in software or...

It may be that Nikon have looked at the ISO response graph that DxO produce and decided that since their claim of ISO 100 is actually ISO64 that they may as well provide an ISO64 option. What this will mean for the rest of the ISO values remains to be seen.

And yes, if you look at the ISO sensitivity graph for most DLSRs, you will see points on the graph not aligning with the "ISO100", "ISO200", etc, graph lines but somewhere below (or above) them.

But, if you read the fine print in DXO, they say that the ISO matches exactly. Their numbers are something they dreamed up for trying to get exact measurements of what the sensor actually is, but its not possible, since they measure things after the processor has done its work modifying the sensor output. Unfortunately, there is no practical way to actually measure sensor output, you must take your measurements after any modifications done in firmware. That's not a bad thing, but some are misled into thinking its a pure sensor measurement.

 

[Loswr]

Can someone (I am thinking of you, jrista) explain why no low-pass filter is better than a non anti-aliasing one (except to Nikon, who can probably save some money).
Thanks

No OLPF is better in that there are fewer layers of material over the photodiodes (the OLPF is two layers of lithium niobate plus a 1/4-wave plate, not sure of the material, maybe quartz?). Same idea as using a top quality UV/clear filter vs. no filter – probably not much of an IQ hit, but maybe some under certain circumstances. With the D800/E, the 'inactive' OLPF was in there so everything else could be the same (image sensor mounting, piezo drive for the self-cleaning sensor, etc). Standardizing on one model means they can eliminate the OLPF entirely.

There's still the IR cut filter over the sensor to protect from dust and to vibrate for the self-clean.

 

[kennephoto]

Can someone (I am thinking of you, jrista) explain why no low-pass filter is better than a non anti-aliasing one (except to Nikon, who can probably save some money).
Thanks

Anyone bueller... bueller. Back on topic lol?

 

[kennephoto]

Rats I was too slow but thanks for the answer neuro I too was curius

 

[ishdakuteb]

I feel sorry for Nikon owners.
It doesn't matter what model they buy, even when first released, as a few months down the track, Nikon will bring out a new and improved version of it making your current model obsolete and now worth substantially less than it cost you. Remember the D600 then the 610?
Canon does hang onto models much longer, and hence they have better re-sale value later on as say, after 3 years, your Canon may be just superseded, but if you had an equivalent Nikon, it would be 3 models old and practically worthless.

I'm not saying that Nikon cameras are no good, in fact, they are very good indeed, but constant model updates is not how you keep up the perceived and resale value of products.
It also makes it more difficult regarding spare parts too, as many models mean lots of parts and distributors only have so much space and money for parts.

I feel sorry for people who buy cameras based on how much they can sell them for.

If your camera is in good enough condition to be sold as "mint" or "near mint" condition then you obviously haven't used it very much.

dilbert, i am one of those who like to keep my camera near mint, including my test camera (not for resale value, but i have been trained to use stuff that way since i was a kid). i have been used dslr not too long ago, about a little more than 2 years and half, but all of them are not near mint, but MINT. and i am, here in this topic, to let you have a chance to prove that your images are better than my images. and i will prove you wrong...

 

[ishdakuteb]

Yes, a 3 year old camera is a 3 year old camera, but as long as your camera is the still current model, your resale value will not drop as quickly as a model that has a replacement model on the market... When a new model is launch, the price of the older model will drop even if the different between the new model and the old model is just the colour of the camera... A model with a replacement model in the market will sound older than it really is.

Have a nice day.

exactly... however, if new model release earlier than 2 years, i would suspect its performance comparing to previous one since r&d is not a quick process, it is required to have both entry criteria and exit criteria for each phrase or milestone, like the following:

note: i do not expect any private industries using above process, but at least some sort of similar since they are all ISO and CMMI certified... to ensure appropriate quality products and products with new performance and features to customers...

 

[sagittariansrock]

Can someone (I am thinking of you, jrista) explain why no low-pass filter is better than a non anti-aliasing one (except to Nikon, who can probably save some money).
Thanks

No OLPF is better in that there are fewer layers of material over the photodiodes (the OLPF is two layers of lithium niobate plus a 1/4-wave plate, not sure of the material, maybe quartz?). Same idea as using a top quality UV/clear filter vs. no filter – probably not much of an IQ hit, but maybe some under certain circumstances. With the D800/E, the 'inactive' OLPF was in there so everything else could be the same (image sensor mounting, piezo drive for the self-cleaning sensor, etc). Standardizing on one model means they can eliminate the OLPF entirely.

There's still the IR cut filter over the sensor to protect from dust and to vibrate for the self-clean.

Thanks, Neuro.
I was also under the erroneous impression that it is the OLPF that does the dance.

 

[scokar]

D810 samples

I like how the eyelashes aren't "melted"

 

[jrista]

Nikonian linguistic analysis: the -10 suffix translates to 'fixing a problem'. The SB910 fixed the thermal issues of the SB900. The D610 fixed the oil spatter and banned-from-sale-in-China-debacle of the D600. The D810 fixes the problem Nikon had of producing both the D800 and D800E.

I wonder if there is a neuroanatomist-10 in the nikon forums...

*Sigh*

Do you ever do anything other than antagonize everyone here? Every post of yours in this entire topic comes off as purposely antagonistic. We call people like that trolls, you know...

???

 

[jrista]

So, why is not having a low-pass filter (810) better than having one that doesn't anti-alias (800E)? I thought the low-pass filter is useful for protecting the sensor from dust... ???

A low pass filter (optical low pass filter, or OLPF) and AA filter are the same thing. Just different names. Its a layer (or really, two layers) within the IR/UV/OLPF stack above the sensor that separates frequencies of light that are equal to or very close to the frequency of the pixels in the sensor. That "separating", in both horizontal and vertical, effectively causes blurring within a very specific, narrow range of high frequencies, eliminating "aliasing".

The D810 is the same thing as the D800E, with a few minor upgrades.

 

[ishdakuteb]

I propose a poll to see who among the CR members neuroanatomist, dilbert, or Aglet has provided the most helpful/useful/beneficial information to the other members of the forum. The one with the most votes earns a pat on the back, the other two are permanently banned from CR forums. I'll abide by the results if you two agree to do so as well. What do you say, gentlemen...are you ready to put your reputations on the line?

It would seem that you post here for a completely different reason than I do, namely your ego needs stroking.

I post here mainly because I enjoy helping people, sharing knowledge (I enjoyed teaching medical and graduate students, and I rather miss teaching), and good technical discussions in which I can both contribute and learn from others.

Up until the point where you mentioned that you wanted/expected a pat on the back, I might have believed you (that your goals weren't ego driven.)
[/quote]

here my vote:

- neuro: have shared knowledge via discussion and have contributed times to provide good examples.
- aglet: nothing but trying to bash canon, talk crap and take crap images (A2BArt.com - moving your imagination )
- dilber: ditto (same exact the next previous one, aglet, except link to website)...

note: beside canon, i also like nikon, fuji, pentax... but NOT sony and hp

 

[xps]

Nikon D810: What You Need to Know @ Dpreview

http://www.dpreview.com/articles/3735622860/nikon-d810-what-you-need-to-know

Summary of new functions

 

[hemanthforcanonrumors]

I dont understand why Nikon comes with these minor upgrades, they have the same boring products with 2-3 features added.. D4 to D4s or D800 to D810.. In this case they seem to have just combined the D800 and 800E and come out with 810. Agree with the point that Nikon user's face this model extinction issue often.. by looking at the fact that Nikon keeps releasing DSLR's almost every 2-3 months. They need to look to hang-on to a camera model for sometime at least.

And on the contrary Canon never releases any products !!! 7D2 in this case. Everyone have been waiting for ages.. its a 5 year old electronic gadget.. and high time that its replaced.

 

[ishdakuteb]

[and i am, here in this topic, to let you have a chance to prove that your images are better than my images. and i will prove you wrong...

Are you referring to the images that show up in your posts already on CR?

none of those, including yours (since any of my posted images are not better than anyone else, but certainly better than yours, also posted on cr forum)... those are just quick shots for practicing and learning. have your chance to take new images. i am going to post my new images, including raw... take wppi 16x20 rules as this rule of play. how about that and fair enough...

do not go out there and steal since i know most of famous people images and keep in mind that raw file should be include in this play...

note: play rules has been recently mentioned again, "to be clear, dodging and burning, vignetting is ok but not a graduated filter or texture etc"

 

[R1-7D]

Nikonian linguistic analysis: the -10 suffix translates to 'fixing a problem'. The SB910 fixed the thermal issues of the SB900. The D610 fixed the oil spatter and banned-from-sale-in-China-debacle of the D600. The D810 fixes the problem Nikon had of producing both the D800 and D800E.

I wonder if there is a neuroanatomist-10 in the nikon forums...

+1
perhaps we can start a poll for the most requested/needed feature changes and improvements

I propose a poll to see who among the CR members neuroanatomist, dilbert, or Aglet has provided the most helpful/useful/beneficial information to the other members of the forum. The one with the most votes earns a pat on the back, the other two are permanently banned from CR forums. I'll abide by the results if you two agree to do so as well. What do you say, gentlemen...are you ready to put your reputations on the line?

It would seem that you post here for a completely different reason than I do, namely your ego needs stroking.

I post here mainly because I enjoy helping people, sharing knowledge (I enjoyed teaching medical and graduate students, and I rather miss teaching), and good technical discussions in which I can both contribute and learn from others.

Up until the point where you mentioned that you wanted/expected a pat on the back, I might have believed you (that your goals weren't ego driven.)

No, Neuro is right in all this. You're the biggest troll on this forum. Obviously Canon isn't making a camera and a sensor that meets your so-called needs. Bummer, dude. Nikon, or even Sony, seem like a better fit for you.

You approach every thread relating to sensors with your DxO "score book" and you rattle on and on about dynamic range. We all get it -- the Sony sensors DO have better dynamic range; but I can list off a bunch of things the Canons still do better than competing brands, including Nikon. If your Canon isn't meeting your needs, and you need all the DR you claim, and print the size of a school bus then why don't you switch already? Nikon seems the most reliable for delivering what YOU want. Canon will continue to make all-round "meet-most-of-consumer-demands" style cameras and be very successful until the market indicates they need to change. So far, their approach is winning and Nikon's recent updates show they aren't. Bummer.

Also, just to defend Neuro a bit here: he has spent countless hours posting on this forum, and his technical knowledge is second to none. To be honest, I don't know how he does it sometimes, because watching you argue with him is a bit like watching someone hit their head against a brick wall; he refutes your claims and your so-called "facts" and then you either misinterpret or ignore a point he has made and continue to prater on with Aglet in-tow. Neuro does deserve a pat on the back if for only having the patience to politely continuing to respond to you.