EOS 5D Mark III Replacement Talk [CR2]

[K-amps]

If Canon Changed Sensor tech in the 7d2, then expect only minor bump in DR/IQ/Noise for any 5D variant. Don't get your hopes high... Stay close to reality. :-X

I hope Canon can change the Sensor processing and RAW file algorithms to 18 or 20 bit....

I will probably choose the high MP, low FPS, less AF point model since I am primarily Marco/landscape/portraits. I do not expect them to price it above $4k given that the D810 is out there.

I do hope they extend the spread of the AF points, it's relatively clumped in the 5D3, although still quite usable.

 

[lintoni]

I don't expect them to take place until the competition makes significant and consistent market gains against Canon. It's a mistake to think of the DSLR business as anything other than a business.

I'll agree with the second sentence but not the first. After all, isn't it better to make the changes before losing market share rather than after? Mismanaging major technological transitions drove Kodak into bankruptcy.

The managements of Olympus, Panasonic, Sony, Fuji and Samsung all decided, more or less simultaneously, that the case for MILCs over DSLRs was compelling enough to make major investments to overcome serious barriers to entry, the biggest of which seems to be getting stores to carry not-Canon/not-Nikon cameras so that consumers can look at them and buy them. It very much remains to be seen whether Canon and Nikon can leverage their installed base and very extensive DSLR lens lineups in the transition to MILCs.

The biggest of which seem to be getting people to actually buy MILCs instead of DSLRs...

If there was sufficient market demand, stores would stock them.

 

[Loswr]

It very much remains to be seen whether Canon and Nikon can leverage their installed base and very extensive DSLR lens lineups in the transition to MILCs.

Given the global market penetrance of MILCs (or rather, the lack thereof), the first question is not whether they can, but whether they should…

Lots of people like to talk and write the about death of dSLRs due to the rise of MILCs. However, that rise is certainly not taking place with a slope consistent killing dSLRs, and it's important to keep in mind the same people saying these things now predicted that demise of the dSLR was to have occurred by ~5 years ago.

 

[Maiaibing]

I don't expect them to take place until the competition makes significant and consistent market gains against Canon. It's a mistake to think of the DSLR business as anything other than a business.

Business is business as you say.

That's why I expect Canon's board members are seriously unhappy with the fact that Canon suffered double digit falling DSLR sales in 2012/13 and again in 2013/14.

I also think Canon board members are calling on Mr. Maeda and the camera division to take action to turn that trajectory around - fast. Very fast. Like in 2015 fast.

Overall the DSLR market is a real dog these years so I do not know how Canon is doing measured on market share. And indeed maybe there just no longer is the same market space for DSLRs anymore. But Nikon at least had a great sales boost 2012/13 (50%+ on interchangable lens bodies) even if 2014 also seems to have been quite a bad year for them.

Regardless. Business is business. And there is a very strong business case for Mr Maeda to do everything he can to set a grand Canon rebound in motion by stunning us all.

I for one will be voting with my money this year. And I think I'm far from the only one.

 

[Maiaibing]

It's getting to the point where everyone I know who shoots Canon has now switched over, or seriously thinking about switching over to Sony (who apparently has more dynamic range and IQ to offer at a cheaper cost right now than Canon).. That sucks.

Now in my head, the 5D Mark IV needs to set the bar for the next 3 years or so and if that doesn't include 4K, More Dynamic Range, Faster Frame Rates.. At a cheaper price.. Then I'm just not sure how they're going to answer back to all the competition that's out there today. It kinda worries me a bit that some people aren't expecting those changes to take place.

+1.000

 

[sdsr]

Neuro or anyone else who knows more than I, Why could Canon not just create an AA filter build that could be turned ON or OFF at will? If Canon could install a sensor design with a non-functional low-pass to save manufacturing variance costs.... why couldn't we have just ONE high res 5Ds with an on/off switch??

This is akin to asking for an ND filter that can be switched on/off. AA is an optical filter, not something done electronically.

Perhaps they could do something like what Pentax has done with the K3, where you can switch the filter on/off:

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/pentax-k3/pentax-k3SELECTIVE_LPF.HTM

 

[Loswr]

There seems to be an expectation or underlying current of knowing that Canon will deliver a DSLR that has a "more" of something this year however it remains to be seen if that "more" translates into a good enough IQ increase that it will distract people from Sony.

Some people posting on Internet forums do certainly seem 'distracted by Sony'. However, that sort of thing doesn't seem to be having a big impact on people actually buying cameras. Which group do you think matters to Canon? :

 

[LukasS]

A 5DmkIV evolved from the mkIII..24-26Mpx with 8FPS
A 53MP 5Ds would make a great complementary camera for studio, large groups, architecture and landscapes.
I like the idea that not one camera does all and that cameras are more dedicated to a specific genre. (Sony and Nikon are going that way and it seems Canon started this with the 1Dx and 7Dmk2

Expensive duo but will probably satisfy me for a while commercially and in my hobby

I agree completely, I'm not a very interested in other manufacturers but from what I can see there is a clear distinction ie. in Nikon body line - they have main purpose and each model has its advantages.

I like that and gladly welcome it. I've updated my old body for 7D mkII (aviation photography is my main outdoor activity, but also sport, wildlife and of course press) and would gladly update my classic 5D for new high megapixel for studio work and landscape.

Can't wait for news about this line .

 

[Orangutan]

I'll agree with the second sentence but not the first. After all, isn't it better to make the changes before losing market share rather than after? Mismanaging major technological transitions drove Kodak into bankruptcy.

I respect what you're saying, but the difference is that Canon knows it's coming, and likely has the tech on the shelf to compete very quickly.

 

[LukasS]

It'd have to be a really awesome camera to make me spend more monies from my mk3.

Hey, weren't you the one saying the same thing about the 5d1 until just before you upgraded ?

Yup. 5d1----> 5D3(held out on buying a 5d2 for along time) and it's very likely it will be 5d3---> 5D5 if it doesn't have those things.

I'm still holding on to my 5D classic, I've had said that I won't update until it will be significant jump, and from this news it seems that time is coming soon.

 

[Orangutan]

the fact that Canon suffered double digit falling DSLR sales in 2012/13 and again in 2013/14.

How did that compare to their competitors? Remember the joke about two hunters and a bear.

 

[unfocused]

It very much remains to be seen whether Canon and Nikon can leverage their installed base and very extensive DSLR lens lineups in the transition to MILCs.

Given the global market penetrance of MILCs (or rather, the lack thereof), the first question is not whether they can, but whether they should…

Lots of people like to talk and write the about death of dSLRs due to the rise of MILCs. However, that rise is certainly not taking place with a slope consistent killing dSLRs, and it's important to keep in mind the same people saying these things now predicted that demise of the dSLR was to have occurred by ~5 years ago.

I repeat (for about the 100th time) no one knows if MILCs are a leading-edge or trailing-edge product. Too many people assume that just because they have been popular in some Asian markets, that means that they are the wave of the future. But, that is not necessarily the case.

It is equally likely that in the Chinese market at least (which is the market that probably counts the most), the early adoption of MILCs is simply a predecessor to the eventual adoption of DSLRs. Once Chinese customers become familiar with the relative benefits of DSLRs vs. MILCs, they may make the same decision that most customers in Europe and the Americas have made: the traditional DSLR is far more flexible and better suited for many enthusiasts.

 

[unfocused]

There seems to be an expectation or underlying current of knowing that Canon will deliver a DSLR that has a "more" of something this year however it remains to be seen if that "more" translates into a good enough IQ increase that it will distract people from Sony.

Some people posting on Internet forums do certainly seem 'distracted by Sony'. However, that sort of thing doesn't seem to be having a big impact on people actually buying cameras. Which group do you think matters to Canon? :

Neuro, I continue to applaud your valiant efforts to inject reason and rationality into the debate. Unfortunately, many of those posting on this site are of the philosophy best summarized as "don't try to confuse me with the facts."

 

[unfocused]

This rumor fits almost exactly what I've been predicting: A 5D high definition camera (I thought it might actually be called 5D HD, but if the rumor is correct, Canon seems to prefer 5Ds) and a general purpose 5DIV that will be a more true successor to the 5DIII.

Good news for those of us who would rather see other improvements before increased megapixels.

My wish list:

Some variation of 7DII/1DX autofocus;
Touch Screen with a sensible user interface;
Basic on-screen photo editing, similar to what can be found on iPads and iPhones (Ideally Lightroom or Photoshop for Canon);
Easy to use Wi-Fi to allow images to be transferred to the cloud and shared with clients quickly once a few edits have been made;
Dual-Pixel autofocus (especially for video)

In other words, let's hope they focus on bringing cameras into the 21st century in terms of usability and cloud connectivity. It's embarrassing that some guy with an iPhone can upload an image and share it with clients faster than photographers can with a $3,000 camera.

I don't need more dynamic range or more megapixels. Give me something that will actually help me make money.

 

[Don Haines]

There seems to be an expectation or underlying current of knowing that Canon will deliver a DSLR that has a "more" of something this year however it remains to be seen if that "more" translates into a good enough IQ increase that it will distract people from Sony.

Some people posting on Internet forums do certainly seem 'distracted by Sony'. However, that sort of thing doesn't seem to be having a big impact on people actually buying cameras. Which group do you think matters to Canon? :

Neuro, I continue to applaud your valiant efforts to inject reason and rationality into the debate. Unfortunately, many of those posting on this site are of the philosophy best summarized as "don't try to confuse me with the facts."

I still don't understand the rabid fascination with sensors and the almost complete neglect for every other part of the camera system.... If you want a great picture the two most important factors are the lens and the AF system. As I am fond of saying, who cares what the DR is (or number of megapixels) of a blurry picture.

People have to think systems, not components.....

 

[Orangutan]

There seems to be an expectation or underlying current of knowing that Canon will deliver a DSLR that has a "more" of something this year however it remains to be seen if that "more" translates into a good enough IQ increase that it will distract people from Sony.

Some people posting on Internet forums do certainly seem 'distracted by Sony'. However, that sort of thing doesn't seem to be having a big impact on people actually buying cameras. Which group do you think matters to Canon? :

It is only a matter of time before Sony turns the "distracted by Sony" into "buying Sony."

How much time? In the long run, we're all dead.

 

[Orangutan]

There seems to be an expectation or underlying current of knowing that Canon will deliver a DSLR that has a "more" of something this year however it remains to be seen if that "more" translates into a good enough IQ increase that it will distract people from Sony.

Some people posting on Internet forums do certainly seem 'distracted by Sony'. However, that sort of thing doesn't seem to be having a big impact on people actually buying cameras. Which group do you think matters to Canon? :

It is only a matter of time before Sony turns the "distracted by Sony" into "buying Sony."

How much time? In the long run, we're all dead.

What, are you a vogon or something?

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

What do you mean by that?

 

[JonAustin]

... Im just waiting for the 5DIV to come out. So I can get a second 5DIII when the prices go hit 2k.

Bingo!

It's very entertaining reading all these posts by forum members about which variant they should buy of a camera model that hasn't even been announced yet!

Banner ad on CR this morning. Don't know if it's legit, but it was on CR... 5D III body only- $1,899.
http://www.digitaloutlets.net/canon/can5dm3/

That the banner ad appeared on CR lends it no credibility whatsoever, and that is by no means a knock on CR. Most of the banner / side column ads that pop up in my browser tend to reflect more on my browsing history than on which site I'm currently visiting.

I've never heard of Digital Outlets, so I'd be leery of running my credit card numbers by them. (IF this is a legit offer, however, and indicative of a trend, there may be a second 5DIII in my bag before the year is out.)

 

[mkabi]

Indeed and if Sony can put 5 axis IBIS into the A9 like they did the A7II then all of my lenses without IS become IS lenses even with a metabones adapter. What's not to love about that boost of usability in my lens investment?! Sony recognise AF as being a key issue for them to address so it will be interesting to see what they deliver! On top of which I won't have to wait half a century for improvements to be delivered with Sony.

I recommended an A7II to my cousin...
Tried it out last weekend as he brought it to a birthday party, and initial impression is that its user interface... compared to Canon's is terrible. I heard that you can customize it, but navigating and trying various things to gain access to ISO, WB, focus peaking, and to switch to 1080/60p and back to 1080/24p, ... I concluded that there is a huge learning curve behind it. And, that I might have to borrow it for a weekend before I make a decision to buy an a7s.

So my recommendation, rent one out... try it and then make your decision.
Don't just go after specs... specs won't get you the pictures and/or the video you want...

 

[Orangutan]

Indeed and if Sony can put 5 axis IBIS into the A9 like they did the A7II then all of my lenses without IS become IS lenses even with a metabones adapter. What's not to love about that boost of usability in my lens investment?!

Does IBIS work as well as lens-based IS? It was my understanding that it introduced significantly more distortion.

On top of which I won't have to wait half a century for improvements to be delivered with Sony.

They will probably introduce many improvements in multiple different products, but not all of the best improvements in a single product.

In truth, I'm rooting for Sony to pull its **** together and build a solid product line because that increases competition regardless of which brand I have. So far, however, I'm not encouraged: they know how to make individual pieces of tech work well, but they seem to have trouble putting it all together into a coherent product or line-up.