How does Canon respond to the D800?

[WarStreet]

I have faith in Canon rumors guy. He was often right, and his CR2 rumor of the 5DIII being a mini/crippled 1DX seems a good possibility. I really don't expect anything less than those rumored specs, so I vote for the minority, the mini/crippled 1DX.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

First off, I don't think Canon is going to be responding to anything. They are likely not surprised and have known about what the D800 was going to be long before we did. But they are probably planning to release a high MP DSLR in the coming year anyway regardless of what the D800 turned out to be. I don't think Canon is jumping to their feet trying to figure out what to do about a 36mp SLR ......

Even though 30+mp doesn't appeal to me in the slightest I recognize that some people need or want it.

I agree completely, it's funny how some people on the forum think that they know something that a multi-billion dollar, international corporation doesn't know.

And I agree about some people wanting 30+ megapixels, it's the same type of people that lift their trucks 2 feet and put 4 foot tires on it.......it's not going to make your Wang bigger no matter how many megapixels it is.

You assume that no big corporation has ever made disastrous decisions or been too afraid of hurting internal market segmentation (Kodak) or failed hah. Companies, even big ones fail all the time. That said, don't read too much into that, I don't exactly foresee Canon closing shop later this year ;D.

 

[Edwin Herdman]

Silly poll options.

I'm almost concerned that the new G1-X seems to have a sensor merely in line with 2009 APS-C cameras, but maybe they're just stretching the lifespan of tech on that one (doesn't really make sense unless they're purposely starting out modestly since the market is pretty much wide open there).

Not really worried about the high-end. The D800/D800E look okay - resolution is better than the Sony 24MP sensor pics I've seen, as it should, but if the 7D's sensor is more closely packed, I think this camera is merely a small step ahead of the 7D, per-pixel (and yes, this is probably a more reasonable time to use that comparison, even though it won't be exact because of the differences between a larger and smaller sensor with respect to heat generation, power use, readout times, and so on).

Nikon's EXPEED III processor seems pretty capable here - frame rates nearly in line with the 7D, which is already very quick.

If Nikon goes with $6000 for the body, that would seem to give Canon a lot of wiggle room to update the 5D. It would be interesting to see how much improvement Canon could put into a new 5D while keeping the same price; the $6000 body option seems covered by the 1D X.

 

[psolberg]

I think the poll speaks to the majority that want what would be a modern version of what nikon shooters got in 2008. arguments will off course be made, as they were made in 2008 that the lower resolution of the two cameras is not suited for some type of application. But the reality is that they are better than anything before them and plenty of people were making a living with far less, thus renders all said arguments bogus.

I agree the right choice is for a low MP body, and I still think 20MP or less is where canon should land to keep things interesting. Canon needs to take things in a new direction to attract people. The days where video was unique to canon are over and with increasing competition in the real high end video segment, the free lunch is over. dslrs can go back to taking stills seriously and dynamic range remains an area to improve dramatically now that ISO and MP are enough for all but the obsessed.

Silly poll options.


If Nikon goes with $6000 for the body, that would seem to give Canon a lot of wiggle room to update the 5D. It would be interesting to see how much improvement Canon could put into a new 5D while keeping the same price; the $6000 body option seems covered by the 1D X.

where are you getting 6K from? the D800 is a mere $2999 bucks.

 

[Mr.Magic]

It's an extremely usefull feature, excellent for outdoor portraits, wedding photography, etc.
If you look at the results Cliff Matuner reached with it (http://cliffmautner.typepad.com/), it's really awesome, getting this without exposure compensation.

I am mystified why you think that face recognition is vital to take pictures like this without exposure compensation

It's not vital, it's handy. You can switch from one shot to another without having to over/under expose manually for different situations, or to zoom in or use spot metering to meter on the face/subject. With this feature you can keep your framing and it automatically takes the exposure on the face = easier + faster + more flexible

Today I just read in the specific details of the camera Face recognition AF would only be able in Live view, well, that's kind of a bummer Still, it's nice!

 

[briansquibb]

Today I just read in the specific details of the camera Face recognition AF would only be able in Live view, well, that's kind of a bummer Still, it's nice!

I would guess it would be used more by video shooters rather than stills then 8) 8) 8)

 

[KeithR]

With this feature you can keep your framing and it automatically takes the exposure on the face = easier + faster + more flexible

And this helps wildlife/architecture/macro/motor sport/plant/landscape/product photographers how, exactly?

There's a whole world of photography out there that doesn't involve shoving a camera in someone's face - I imagine that Canon's decision to regard face recognition as a low priority reflects its Real World value...

And yes, it's a gimmick (I've always found that Nikon users like gimmicks). If a given photographer "needs" the "benefits" described above, perhaps they're in the wrong game.

 

[Mr.Magic]

With this feature you can keep your framing and it automatically takes the exposure on the face = easier + faster + more flexible

And this helps wildlife/architecture/macro/motor sport/plant/landscape/product photographers how, exactly?

There's a whole world of photography out there that doesn't involve shoving a camera in someone's face - I imagine that Canon's decision to regard face recognition as a low priority reflects its Real World value...

And yes, it's a gimmick (I've always found that Nikon users like gimmicks). If a given photographer "needs" the "benefits" described above, perhaps they're in the wrong game.

The wildlife/architecture/macro/motor sport/plant/landscape/product photographers can use another AF mode
Come on, as if a high fps, or spot metering, or 61 af points, or high iso's are useful for every type of photographer. It's just an extra option that's nice

 

[funkboy]

Not that this is particularly relevant to the parent topic, but personally I'd be happy with 10-12 1Dx pixels in an APS-C camera with a viewfinder a little better than the 7D (if that's is possible).

I think the yearning for FF is mostly based on:

- very low noise floor at high ISO
- great viewfinder image
- shallow DoF

If the first two could be done as well as the 5D in a crop camera, then I think the DoF available at APS-C focal lengths is an acceptable compromise for a whole lot of people.

 

[Astro]

I can imagine the D800 causing a fair amount of angst at Canon.

yeah sure.. they are completely suprised by the new nikon model. lol
canon knows what nikon is doing and vice versa.

canon could produce a 100 MP sensor if they wanted. they have proven that years ago.
unlike nikon who has to rely on other sensor manufacturers.

 

[Maui5150]

The price ranges are wrong. Anything under 30MP will need to be no more than $2500, probably closer to $2000. Look at the flack Canon has received for the 1DX's pricing because of Nikon's D4, even though it has more megapixels.

I can imagine the D800 causing a fair amount of angst at Canon.

How many MP does the 1DX have? How about the D4?

Hmmm... Those are TWO cameras, one from each manufacturer, and BOTH are DOUBLE your $2500 target and triple your "closer to $2000" range.

Geee... How can BOTH Canon and Nikon even think of selling $6000 cameras that are LESS than 20 MP when a $3000 36.3 MP has just been announced.

Maybe... Just maybe... there is something more to these cameras than size of MP...

 

[CJRodgers]

What is a likely improvement to DR?

 

[Astro]

Maybe... Just maybe... there is something more to these cameras than size of MP...

nah... MP are the most important thing .. we all know that.

 

[torger]

What is a likely improvement to DR?

I don't think one should as a RAW shooter expect too much in terms of DR. I think most improvements have been made in the built-in noise-reduction algorithms for making JPEGs, and only a minor improvement will be seen in RAW measurements (Dxomark style), say ~1/3 - ~1/2 stop or so. Problem is I don't think Canon has the technology to match the best low noise sensors, not on low or high ISOs. But when you are shooting noisy pictures -- at ISO6400+ everything is noisy -- a little bit more or less noise probably does not matter much to most, so Canon don't need to be best.

We'll see when actual measurements on the 1DX appears what we can expect.

 

[altenae]

Wel they respond with nice clean images.....instead of NOISE in ISO 320...yeah...

Nice url here

http://fakechuckwestfall.wordpress.com/author/fcwestfall/

 

[KeithR]

Nice url here
<snip>

More like "another example of an internet muppet who thinks that comparing a 36mp sensor against an 18mp sensor using 100% crops from each is s fair comparison"...

Don't get me wrong - I have no interest whatsoever in the D800 or "what it means for Canon", and I'm less than impressed from the IQ I've seen from it so far (although it's a preview model, so things may well change) but I strongly suspect that this particular internet muppet is clueless, or dishonest, or both (imagine that!)

He clearly has an agenda where an increase in megapixels is concerned though, which (along with the entire rest of his site - anyone who talks up the Darwin Wiggett review of the 7D, is a cretin) displays his ignorance.

In any event, without a clear statement of his comparison methodology, that site is a useless reference point, I'm afraid.

 

[kenraw]

I think their are a lot of photographers in the situation were they want to move to full frame but the dilema is that the 5dmk2 is a bit long in the tooth and has sub par AF, The 1Dx looks amazing but the price is going to be way too much for many people, plus I dont actually think the sample images so far do the 1Dx much justice. The 5dm3 or whatever it will be called seems to be taking for ever to be announced so now nikon have announced the D800 at a reasonable price with a pretty impressive spec I'm not surprised there are a lot of people interested in it. I would like to change but for me I prefer the layout and handling of the canons, but I do prefer the nikons perfomance. My friend has 2 D700's and I can tell you that they knock the socks of the 7D and are better than the 5dmk2 in almost every aspect. I'm always blown away when I use his cameras compared to my 7D's
I'm sure I speak for a lot of people when all I ask for is a 7D with a full frame sensor and twin CF slots. Thats all I desire. I dont like the nikon menu system or button layout or I would switch tomorrow as I couldnt care less about brand loyalty, I just want a reliable FF camera so I can get on with shooting!

So please canon lets have this new FF announcement.......

 

[RuneL]

I think their are a lot of photographers in the situation were they want to move to full frame but the dilema is that the 5dmk2 is a bit long in the tooth and has sub par AF, The 1Dx looks amazing but the price is going to be way too much for many people, plus I dont actually think the sample images so far do the 1Dx much justice. The 5dm3 or whatever it will be called seems to be taking for ever to be announced so now nikon have announced the D800 at a reasonable price with a pretty impressive spec I'm not surprised there are a lot of people interested in it. I would like to change but for me I prefer the layout and handling of the canons, but I do prefer the nikons perfomance. My friend has 2 D700's and I can tell you that they knock the socks of the 7D and are better than the 5dmk2 in almost every aspect. I'm always blown away when I use his cameras compared to my 7D's
I'm sure I speak for a lot of people when all I ask for is a 7D with a full frame sensor and twin CF slots. Thats all I desire. I dont like the nikon menu system or button layout or I would switch tomorrow as I couldnt care less about brand loyalty, I just want a reliable FF camera so I can get on with shooting!

So please canon lets have this new FF announcement.......

In my opinion the D700 is pretty incomparable to anything in Canons lineup but the 1D. The 7D and 5D are just too bad regarding many areas in comparison to that.

And Canon has a fast, reliable, dual CF-slot, full frame camera, it is the 1D X. Get that, save up, get a used one 1Ds?

 

[KeithR]

My friend has 2 D700's and I can tell you that they knock the socks of the 7D

That's not remotely true if you're cropping, if you have a well-sorted 7D conversion/pp workflow sorted out (I have) and if you appreciate/want/need lots of detail.

I've done umpteen IQ comparisons between my 7D and D700 files, and - at the image level - the 7D lacks for very little, if anything, assuming an effective workflow.

I'm afraid that I have little time in any walk of life for people who assume that because they can't do something, it can't be done - the 7D seems to attract a lot of folk like that.

 

[thepancakeman]

My friend has 2 D700's and I can tell you that they knock the socks of the 7D

That's not remotely true if you're cropping, if you have a well-sorted 7D conversion/pp workflow sorted out (I have) and if you appreciate/want/need lots of detail.

I've done umpteen IQ comparisons between my 7D and D700 files, and - at the image level - the 7D lacks for very little, if anything, assuming an effective workflow.

I'm afraid that I have little time in any walk of life for people who assume that because they can't do something, it can't be done - the 7D seems to attract a lot of folk like that.

Trying to understand exactly what you're saying. Does "effective workflow" mean that there are certain "pre-set" post-processing things that need to be done to illicit this result? If indeed that's what you're saying, it would seem to favor the D700: press button="good picture", vs. press button, download to <software>, make x+y+z manipulations="good picture". But perhaps I'm missing part of what you mean? ???