We were wrong, all of your Canon mirrorless dreams are likely coming true soon

[scyrene]

(a) Not a terrible misinformation idea, but it would need to be a detailed spec list that everyone on the internet started circulating, buying into, etc. However, with this, we haven't had any rumors of any significant lifespan with this new platform. This thing is a ghost -- we still don't even know the mount decision.

(b) You may be giving Sony too much credit. (The Borg didn't scheme. It just moved ahead with its plan.)

- A

Is the Borg an 'it' or a 'they'? Now there's a ten-page thread!

 

[ahsanford]

What if DSLRs had already honed their ergonomics and couldn't easily be improved in that regard? It's up for debate, but surely a compelling reason the look of these cameras has barely changed in decades is because it works ergonomically, not as an aesthetic choice? In which case, you are indeed asking for that sacrifice to be made.

This. All day. I appreciate there is a market for something cool/interesting/pretty looking, but:

1. Canon doesn't want to take anything away from the current form factors they offer because they work so damn well. They fit the hand, they have buttons in great locations, and user experience is delightful. To add some 'form pizazz' to the design will interrupt or diminish that.
   
   
2. To introduced multiple colors to the design (don't think crazy stuff, think Fuji -- gun metal and black, black and chrome, etc.) means different materials and seams between them. That could undermine durability depending on how they do it.
   
   
3. We can not all agree on what is attractive in camera. Some love retro, some love concept car, some love quiet and unassuming. So getting brave with design could be applauded or it could be a Hasselblad Lunar. Canon doesn't take subjective fickle-market-reception sort of risks like that.

Put this all together and the best we can hope for is an altogether new color body (an interesting dark gray?) or possibly some interesting accent colors on the metal hardware (eyelets, hotshoe, etc.). And coloring metal (esp. steel) can look nice on day one and look horrible on day 100, introduce durability challenges, etc.

I'm down with it looking better. I really am. But Canon's design language is overwhelmingly clear: ergonomics/performance/intuitiveness first, how it looks is a distant second. They might do something unique and interesting with the product line badging or put a cool [insert stylistic element here], but by and large it will look like it is related to the other Canon bodies we use today.

- A

 

[herion]

Surely, it comes down to the tradeoffs involved in introducing a new mount. Where are the benefits from bringing out a new mount and are they worth it? The EF adapter may not be a big deal, but needing to use an adapter could be quite annoying to someone who sees no benefit from the new mount, maybe annoying enough to avoid buying a new camera. From Canon's point of view the question is whether the introduction of a camera with a new mount will bring in more money than a new camera with the EF mount.

Potentially - and I am the first one to admit I do not have a Karnak turban and crystal ball - but Canon makes extension tubes, correct? Which are *exactly* the same as the EF/EF-M adapter except it's the same mount on both sides.

BOOM. Problem solved. No need to manufacture a new adapter since it's out there already.

New lenses that can benefit from a thin mount (and no dixie cup endcaps) go directly onto the camera. Not every lens benefits, so not every lens gets a thin mount.

How's that for a "sexy solution" ???

 

[Quackator]

How's that for a "sexy solution" ???

As sexy as canned horse manure, because it makes
the same mistake Sony made, which gives them so
much flack for their ergonomics.

They should know better, though. Their FS700 is basically
an empty cube that needs to be there to fit all the knobs
and buttons. A tool, no toy.

 

[Don Haines]

In Canon land, ergonomics ranges from the M to the 1DX2.... if that does not convince you that there are different opinions, nothing will.....

 

[transpo1]

I am really looking forward to this new camera. I just hope Canon is willing to sacrifice sales on the 5D4, because if they cripple this camera to be worse in some way than the 5D4, I do not see it being competitive (okay, it will probably have only one card slot, but that is ok).

If its essentially a 5D4 without a mirror and with the same weather sealing, Canon will get my money.

Without weather sealing, it will be DOA for many professionals. That would be a huge mistake.

 

[transpo1]

I think I woke up on the wrong side of bed this morning. All I can see is:

1. Absolutely nothing has changed. Either Canon is going to release a FF mirrorless this year or it isn't. And no one outside of Canon seems to know any detail about it. So reading these rumors is not productive, other than to know "something might be coming. Hold off on major purchase decisions." Meh. I've known that for quite awhile now.

2. Whoever started abbreviating mirrorless as ML... you have done this forum a disservice.

Sorry. Maybe I just need more coffee.

Yes, it's laughable how many times and "on again / off again" posts this story has had. Makes me think there is purposeful misinformation by Canon out there and / or internal Canon debates have only recently been concluded in order to respond to Nikon's announcement and products.

 

[Lurker]

Lurker said:


If someone can buy their significant other a Benz/Audi/Acura/BMW/Cadi or Yugo, then a camera body isn't so unreasonable.

Do they?? People must be a lot richer than I realised! (Although I get the impression most brand new cars are bought on credit, rather than paying the full price outright - you can do this with a camera too of course, but I don't know how common it is).

According to all the TV commercials at Christmas time they do.

 

[Loswr]

Potentially - and I am the first one to admit I do not have a Karnak turban and crystal ball - but Canon makes extension tubes, correct? Which are *exactly* the same as the EF/EF-M adapter except it's the same mount on both sides.

BOOM. Problem solved. No need to manufacture a new adapter since it's out there already.

New lenses that can benefit from a thin mount (and no dixie cup endcaps) go directly onto the camera. Not every lens benefits, so not every lens gets a thin mount.

How's that for a "sexy solution" ???

As sexy as the Grinch in a bathing suit next to ET after he got burned by acid or something.

If an EF 12/25 tube can mount on the MILC body, so can any EF lens. But they couldn't focus an image on the sensor. Same goes for the short flange lenses on any DSLR. Your basic recipe for a sh!tstorm of confusion.

 

[Don Haines]

According to all the TV commercials at Christmas time they do.

And home appliances..... a lot of guys give their wives vacuum cleaners and kitchen appliances for Christmas.... usually just before the divorce

 

[ethanz]

Ah now it makes sense, always connected EVF.... porn

Is that a lens in your pocket or are you just excited to be photographing?

 

[transpo1]

And then this-

https://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/confirmed-canon-will-soon-announce-the-new-ef-m32-mm-f1-4-stm/

 

[Deleted member 379512]

...6D2.
User: But...
Canon: 6D2.
User: But Sony...
Canon: 6D2.
User: But Nikon...
Canon: 6D2.
User: Ok.

I get that you're saying the 6d is fairly small, but it's still quite a bit bigger than the mirrorless competition (whether that is a good or bad thing to you is another matter)

And given the reception the camera got, telling people to lump or leave it isn't going to win Canon any favour. I don't think they'd be that stubborn

 

[takesome1]

And home appliances..... a lot of guys give their wives vacuum cleaners and kitchen appliances for Christmas.... usually just before the divorce

A good marriage will have communication and can survive such gifts. The wife will explain why you do not buy her these kind of things.
Not necessarily politely though.

 

[ptogel]

I just hope Canon learns from Sony and Nikon. We would love to stay a Canon Shooter Studio. We do weddings, so we need quality, a good lens selection and a great battery.

 

[Frederik_Bo]

I personally like the look and feel of my 5D4, the ergonomics are great. I dislike the clunky look of Nikon DSLR’s and the Sony is unattractive looking and very uncomfortable in the hands, especially larger hands. And the hard edges don’t fit your hands. So I hope Canon sticks to the great ergonomics they always have.

I know there really is no way of arguing taste. Personally I think I like Nikons design language is slightly better than canons though I will grant you that their DSLR’s can be a little clunky looking. I think the z6 and 7 are pretty decent looking.

The Sony’s look really good to me, though people say the ergonomics aren’t great. I have never used one so I will have to take peoples word on that. From what people say, it does seem they have prioritized more in the direction of looks or perhaps size, rather than ergonomics. Maybe if you are a woman, it fits better in your hand.

 

[Frederik_Bo]

scyrene said:
What if DSLRs had already honed their ergonomics and couldn't easily be improved in that regard? It's up for debate, but surely a compelling reason the look of these cameras has barely changed in decades is because it works ergonomically, not as an aesthetic choice? In which case, you are indeed asking for that sacrifice to be made.

This. All day. I appreciate there is a market for something cool/interesting/pretty looking, but:

1. Canon doesn't want to take anything away from the current form factors they offer because they work so damn well. They fit the hand, they have buttons in great locations, and user experience is delightful. To add some 'form pizazz' to the design will interrupt or diminish that.
   
   
2. To introduced multiple colors to the design (don't think crazy stuff, think Fuji -- gun metal and black, black and chrome, etc.) means different materials and seams between them. That could undermine durability depending on how they do it.
   
   
3. We can not all agree on what is attractive in camera. Some love retro, some love concept car, some love quiet and unassuming. So getting brave with design could be applauded or it could be a Hasselblad Lunar. Canon doesn't take subjective fickle-market-reception sort of risks like that.

Put this all together and the best we can hope for is an altogether new color body (an interesting dark gray?) or possibly some interesting accent colors on the metal hardware (eyelets, hotshoe, etc.). And coloring metal (esp. steel) can look nice on day one and look horrible on day 100, introduce durability challenges, etc.

I'm down with it looking better. I really am. But Canon's design language is overwhelmingly clear: ergonomics/performance/intuitiveness first, how it looks is a distant second. They might do something unique and interesting with the product line badging or put a cool [insert stylistic element here], but by and large it will look like it is related to the other Canon bodies we use today.

- A

Well I wasn’t really arguing for a change in the ergonomics of canons cameras. I was arguing for a change in design esthetics. I really do think this can be done without sacrificing ergonomics and usability.

It is not like I am getting my hopes up though. I sadly think it will be the same boring canon look, only smaller and flatter. Something like A M5 on steroids...

That lunar camera really was an abomination of a camera

 

[ahsanford]

Oh snap, CR Guy is getting tapped by other sites to comment on 9/5:

https://petapixel.com/2018/08/28/canon-full-frame-mirrorless-unveil-is-likely-september-5th/

No pressure, dude.

- A

 

[ahsanford]

And then this-

https://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/confirmed-canon-will-soon-announce-the-new-ef-m32-mm-f1-4-stm/

Which, as others have said on this very thread, implies that 9/5 is the M5 II or other higher end crop mirrorless.

Or [wince] someone says that [double wince] the future FF mirrorless mount is EF-M, and that this is one of the lenses Canon is launching the new FF system with.

I kid. 32mm is not a FL prime Canon would make these days. This is surely shaping up to be a crop lens to generate 50 prime FF FOV.

And as we all know, if it actually is an FF lens and they gave it STM, we must kill it with a hammer.

- A

 

[ahsanford]

And then this-

https://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/confirmed-canon-will-soon-announce-the-new-ef-m32-mm-f1-4-stm/

CR Forums had a hot scoop that Mirrorlessrumors posted a screen cap from Nokishita's Twitter feed*.

That's like when my Mom saw a great recipe online, printed it out and mailed it to me.

- A

*P.S. I totally do this all the time, I am making fun of the times we live in and not your post.