Here are more images of the Canon EOS R3

[SteveC]

We weren't talking about 'objects' we were talking about specific people in the context of the camera not only knowing how many people are in a frame but using AF to track a pre specified individual that it recognizes automatically from the various people within that frame.

If people freak out about being tracked by GPS that is turned off and doesn't transmit anyway goodness only knows what they will make of AF that recognizes and tracks specific individuals automatically.

We already know that; facial recognition technology for security cams, etc., has been freaked out about already.

 

[AEWest]

A fixed screen and a tilting viewfinder or a second fixed one on top would be better for me

Doubt we will ever see a fixed screen again.

 

[dcm]

We weren't talking about 'objects' we were talking about specific people in the context of the camera not only knowing how many people are in a frame but using AF to track a pre specified individual that it recognizes automatically from the various people within that frame.

If people freak out about being tracked by GPS that is turned off and doesn't transmit anyway goodness only knows what they will make of AF that recognizes and tracks specific individuals automatically.

I understood that. In camera training is still a ways off.

I was just offering the half step that should be more reachable from current technology. Facial recognition requires a bit more processing, unless you have a limited set of faces to recognise. Then it comes down to training, possibly not in the camera, and downloading the trained elements to the camera. If you have it trained to multiple faces, you would still need a selection method. It would also require enough pixels on the face to do the recognition in camera - more pixels, higher confidence.

 

[pedroesteban]

Object identification has improved a lot as we see with the people/animal and eye tracking options. The camera may already detect mutiple objects like the smartphones, but only shows you the one selected for AF based on its current rules. What's missing is a method to let you select which object(s) you would like to maintain in focus when multiple objects exist. A joystick approach may work for this. Paired with eye-controlled focus on the M3 to select an object, this might be kind of interesting. Instead of moving from focus zone to focus zone, the AF would simply move object to object - the objects become the AF zones. And this might make the R3 much more interesting.

The R5 already does that. If the camera detects both eyes, for instance, it chooses one to focus and shows an arrow next to the focus box to let you know that you can change eyes by tapping the joystick.

 

[polaris8030]

I have this idea that the R3 will be able to track a specific subject, e.g. a dedicated person ('s face) like the bride on a wedding. This (from Canon USA) sounds a bit like it (last sentence):

The EOS R5 and R6 were only the beginning.
Using Deep Learning technology,
the upcoming EOS R3 will offer enhanced AF performance
and tracking capabilities, with even better face-, eye-,
head- and body-detection.
And, the EOS R3 will add a new type of subject recognition, for its AF system.

the deep learning label has been applied to so many things from low cost surveillance cameras that track faces to self driving cars - I feel Canon's DNN will do as they claim above -- tracking not just eye and face (front) but body (back) - but I do hope they build it with a hardware that can continue to 'learn' in the field. new type of subject recognition ?? -- no clue, maybe distinguishing between children faces versus adult face ??

 

[usern4cr]

Don’t think canon will have a mechanical shutter on a camera that is global shutter. It seems redundant.

When they come out with a global shutter R... body, I doubt they'd also need a mechanical shutter as well. But they still might want to protect the sensor when the lens is removed. They could do this by having a pop down neutral density filter. That would be a nice user controlled option for photo use as well as an auto pop-down when the lens is removed.

 

[Chig]

I'm a bit disappointed with the controls on the vertical grip being in different positions particularly the 3rd control dial being slightly proud of the body in normal position and then set about 1 cm lower on the vertical grip.
I would prefer a square screen too so that it's the same in either horizontal or vertical even if it's a bit smaller

 

[EOS 4 Life]

the deep learning label has been applied to so many things from low cost surveillance cameras that track faces to self driving cars - I feel Canon's DNN will do as they claim above -- tracking not just eye and face (front) but body (back) - but I do hope they build it with a hardware that can continue to 'learn' in the field. new type of subject recognition ?? -- no clue, maybe distinguishing between children faces versus adult face ??

Are we now pretending that cameras detecting eyes in real-time is not amazing?

 

[SereneSpeed]

That is 'an object' not a self determined specific subject. What was proposed is a scenario where, for instance, a bride and father were walking down an aisle and the camera 'knew' the bride from the father. Nothing in the regular camera scene can do that yet, so far the camera knows there are two subjects walking towards it but it prioritizes those two subjects due to pre determined and dumb criteria. Normally the closest subject gets priority.

I think we are years away from a point where regular cameras can face detect, that is, you could take a scan of the bride while getting dressed and then for the rest of the day the camera will scan any face in the frame and prioritize AF to her. I can see it happening it time, but we are years away from it being commercially available or affordable.

When it does happen it will happen in phones first because they can already recognize individual faces.

I've read what you've written twice and to me, you are describing Face Registration. A feature Sony has had available for years... Is this not what you are referring to:

You 'scan' the brides face and then give it a priority, above the other faces you've registered. Then, throughout the day, the camera prioritizes her. That's what you're saying isn't available, right?

 

[privatebydesign]

I've read what you've written twice and to me, you are describing Face Registration. A feature Sony has had available for years... Is this not what you are referring to:

You 'scan' the brides face and then give it a priority, above the other faces you've registered. Then, throughout the day, the camera prioritizes her. That's what you're saying isn't available, right?

Indeed it is! I thought I was pretty familiar with most developments but that is new to me. Two questions, one, why isn’t it talked about more, and two, why haven’t they refined it to need a scan of a face? From the demos I have just watched it uses a straight on single image not a ‘face id’ style 3D scan and because of this relative simplicity it seems to lose priority when the head is turned a relatively small amount.

 

[H. Jones]

I do wish we would have had a better look at the port-side of the R3.

My best guess:



It's barely legible but I do believe looking at the side that Canon will have chosen to put the Mic and Headphone jacks in the same format as on the R5, to prevent them from being hit by the flip screen when in use. That would also explain why the 3-pin intervalometer was forced onto the front of the camera.

After that, it's all a toss-up. I don't really see space for the WFT, but the very large rear port cover looks like it could fit the WFT, HDMI, and USB-C ports in one space, since we know from the 1DX3 that USB-c saves a lot of room in the port areas over the older USB ports.

In the R5, Canon also chose to isolate the PC sync from headphones/mics so I wouldn't be surprised if that was in the same place. There's another, isolated, large port to the rear of that one that appears to have a pretty square look to it, and I think that would likely be the ethernet port.

Another option, which I really hadn't thought about, is, what if Canon integrates the WFT into the camera? The WFT-R10 was a battery grip with full wi-fi features, perhaps Canon could just include top-of-the-line WIFI connectivity within the battery grip area? I could imagine they could make a "window" of plastic under the rubber grips within the metal shell of the battery grip to give it better range/connection. Total speculation, though, and I doubt Canon would want to lose the sales of the $600 WFT adapters.

 

[Bahrd]

If you want more detail, there is a recent paper in the IEEE Transactions on Computational Imaging entitled Deep Learning for Camera Autofocus.

An interesting paper. Are you working in this field?

 

[dcm]

An interesting paper. Are you working in this field?

Machine Learning research yes. Camera Autofocus no.

 

[Cyborx]

It’s gonna cost a fortune, like all Canon gear this will also be heavily overpriced. Whilst Sony is playing A-game in the mirrorless segment, Canon finally has developed a mirrorless pro body, after how many years? Good lord, they must have been sleeping for the past 10 years. Just updating the 1DX with more pixels and a few more fps. I think Canon should make this R3 around 4000 euro’s. Just to make a statement, we care about you clients. We don’t want you to go bankrupt on gear. This cam is for everyone. And you know what, I am pretty sure the profit for Canon will be higher in the end too!
But don’t worry, it is always short term income an Canon... they will make it expensive... trust me.

 

[Bahrd]

Machine Learning research yes. Camera Autofocus no.

I work on the latter but appreciate the former too...

 

[ildyria]

I'm a bit disappointed with the controls on the vertical grip being in different positions particularly the 3rd control dial being slightly proud of the body in normal position and then set about 1 cm lower on the vertical grip.
I would prefer a square screen too so that it's the same in either horizontal or vertical even if it's a bit smaller

Actually it is NOT that bad. Using the Battery Grip with the R5 is way more unusable in that regard as distance between the joystick to move the focus point and the AF-button is just terrible and require a change of the hand placement.

Here is it pretty manageable and very similar.

I superposed the rotation, matching the star & focus point buttons. You see that the upper wheel is very slightly differently placed, and likewise for the "1Dx III af button" and joystick, but the difference is not that significant. So for me, this is a big thumbs up.

 

[Bengt Nyman]

Just hope they did not forget to bring back a touch of slow and accurate contrast focus for the situations where fast AI contrast detect AF gets confused and does not know what to do.

 

[Chig]

It’s gonna cost a fortune, like all Canon gear this will also be heavily overpriced. Whilst Sony is playing A-game in the mirrorless segment, Canon finally has developed a mirrorless pro body, after how many years? Good lord, they must have been sleeping for the past 10 years. Just updating the 1DX with more pixels and a few more fps. I think Canon should make this R3 around 4000 euro’s. Just to make a statement, we care about you clients. We don’t want you to go bankrupt on gear. This cam is for everyone. And you know what, I am pretty sure the profit for Canon will be higher in the end too!
But don’t worry, it is always short term income an Canon... they will make it expensive... trust me.

So you don't think Sony's Alpha 1 is overpriced when it's specs are pretty much identical to the much cheaper R5 ?
Canon must be doing something right I guess when they sell more cameras than Sony and Nikon combined.
Sony has very expensive lenses too.
All decent camera gear will continue to get more and more expensive as the budget market has disappeared with smartphones so the only market left for camera companies is high end gear for professionals and enthusiasts so with the short production runs and huge R&D costs these companies need to make high margins on their gear.
Every photographer would like these miraculous new cameras to be cheaper but it's not realistic and we'll be lucky if the companies other than Sony and Canon survive and compete

 

[Chig]

I do wish we would have had a better look at the port-side of the R3.

My best guess:

View attachment 197932

It's barely legible but I do believe looking at the side that Canon will have chosen to put the Mic and Headphone jacks in the same format as on the R5, to prevent them from being hit by the flip screen when in use. That would also explain why the 3-pin intervalometer was forced onto the front of the camera.

After that, it's all a toss-up. I don't really see space for the WFT, but the very large rear port cover looks like it could fit the WFT, HDMI, and USB-C ports in one space, since we know from the 1DX3 that USB-c saves a lot of room in the port areas over the older USB ports.

In the R5, Canon also chose to isolate the PC sync from headphones/mics so I wouldn't be surprised if that was in the same place. There's another, isolated, large port to the rear of that one that appears to have a pretty square look to it, and I think that would likely be the ethernet port.

Another option, which I really hadn't thought about, is, what if Canon integrates the WFT into the camera? The WFT-R10 was a battery grip with full wi-fi features, perhaps Canon could just include top-of-the-line WIFI connectivity within the battery grip area? I could imagine they could make a "window" of plastic under the rubber grips within the metal shell of the battery grip to give it better range/connection. Total speculation, though, and I doubt Canon would want to lose the sales of the $600 WFT adapters.

I'd imagine the magnesium body acts as a Faraday cage blocking WiFi signals , even with a plastic window as this would only let the signal out in one direction so an external WFT would be more reliable.

 

[freejay]

...
I think we are years away from a point where regular cameras can face detect...

Lightroom can find similar faces. Why shouldn't a camera be able to do that?