New information about the upcoming Canon EOS R5C [CR3]

Doug7131

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Jul 21, 2019
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Hint: The title of the graph says "Photographic" dynamic range. DR in video most always takes a hit because the sensors are reading out at different bit depths. In the case of the R5: photo mode with mechanical shutter is 14-bit and video readout modes are 12-bit. Hence the 12-bit RAW output.
Dynamic range does not change with bit depth. The sensor always has the same dynamic range. All changing the bit depth does is change how many descrete levels exist between the brightest and darkest pixel levels.
 
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Jul 21, 2010
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Hint: The title of the graph says "Photographic" dynamic range.
Bill Claff calls it ‘photographic DR’ to reflect the intent of real-world applicability, not to suggest that it applies to only photos and not video. He wants to distinguish his values from ‘engineering DR’, where the denominator is SNR = 1 (IIRC, he uses SNR = 20 as the baseline for photographic DR).
 
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Jan 22, 2012
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I could already see that from the various test footages, but Gordon Laing's tests also confirm this.


The only question mark is the dynamic range, but it certainly won't be any worse than the R5 and it might be better especially at higher ISOs.

All in all, the hardware in the R3 already looks more advanced to me than an actively cooled R5.
Thank you!
 
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Dec 25, 2012
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C70 is super 35 sensor though.

Just giving an R5 active cooling won't make the already excellent R5 a much better video camera.

Canon really needs to stop messing about and give us all what we really want rather than playing around pimping out stills cameras.

A compact RF cine camera, FF sensor with ND, full size HDMI, time code and SDI outputs and it would sell by the boat load. The modularity of C300/C500's are great and their size with large lenses is a big plus but we don't all need that or shoot for TV where stuff like that matters.
Any video camera in the still camera form factor is, by definition, a pimped out stills camera.

If you want a serious video tool then pay up for the form factor that the top video cameras use.
There is a reason that Alexa and Red don't look like a Sony A7.
 
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It was mentioned in multiple reviews and has been a problem. Griffin Conway had to send his c70 back as did a few people I know where the hinge becomes a floppy mess. Terrible for a 5K+ camera.
again, thats all anecdotal. I am in the c70 groups where these things are discussed at great length. And the majority of people when the topic surfaces, chime in with "mine is great", "or nothing is wrong with mine" so on and so forth. You only hear about the bad experiences because they tend to be more vocal about the issue.

Now I will admit, there must be some faulty batches that flew under the radar for canon and landed in the hands of some unfortunate consumers; however, in lieu of a massive recall, I would bet all instances of faulty hinges reflect a very small minority of overall sales. And to completely discredit a camera based off your perception of the issue would be foolhardy.
 
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Jan 22, 2012
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Bill Claff calls it ‘photographic DR’ to reflect the intent of real-world applicability, not to suggest that it applies to only photos and not video. He wants to distinguish his values from ‘engineering DR’, where the denominator is SNR = 1 (IIRC, he uses SNR = 20 as the baseline for photographic DR).
So, the best dynamic range, in RAW video on the R5 is at ISO 100? Thx.
 
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koenkooi

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Feb 25, 2015
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Bill Claff calls it ‘photographic DR’ to reflect the intent of real-world applicability, not to suggest that it applies to only photos and not video. He wants to distinguish his values from ‘engineering DR’, where the denominator is SNR = 1 (IIRC, he uses SNR = 20 as the baseline for photographic DR).
When video people talk about DR they talk about something different. This Cined article shows the measurements they base it on. The crux is that even if the Canon sensor can do 12 stops of DR, the video file it stores on the card only gets the 10.4 stops mentioned earlier. Sony is able to squeeze out some more DR due to their log profile, the R5 firmware update that added more CLOG profiles might have improved the video DR a bit.
This is also how the C300 III gets 16 stops of DR into a 10-bit video file.

(This is all based on watching not one, but three youtube videos on the subject, that means I'm an expert now, right? RIGHT?)
 
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Jan 22, 2012
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When video people talk about DR they talk about something different. This Cined article shows the measurements they base it on. The crux is that even if the Canon sensor can do 12 stops of DR, the video file it stores on the card only gets the 10.4 stops mentioned earlier. Sony is able to squeeze out some more DR due to their log profile, the R5 firmware update that added more CLOG profiles might have improved the video DR a bit.
This is also how the C300 III gets 16 stops of DR into a 10-bit video file.

(This is all based on watching not one, but three youtube videos on the subject, that means I'm an expert now, right? RIGHT?)
So, Log 3 is better in the case of R5? Decision made?
 
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Jul 21, 2010
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When video people talk about DR they talk about something different. This Cined article shows the measurements they base it on. The crux is that even if the Canon sensor can do 12 stops of DR, the video file it stores on the card only gets the 10.4 stops mentioned earlier. Sony is able to squeeze out some more DR due to their log profile, the R5 firmware update that added more CLOG profiles might have improved the video DR a bit.
This is also how the C300 III gets 16 stops of DR into a 10-bit video file.

(This is all based on watching not one, but three youtube videos on the subject, that means I'm an expert now, right? RIGHT?)
Thanks for the clarification. No argument that video DR is different (and I don’t have a horse in the race since I don’t shoot video on my ILCs), just pointing out that Claff didn’t call it ‘photographic’ to distinguish it from ‘video’.
 
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Any video camera in the still camera form factor is, by definition, a pimped out stills camera.

If you want a serious video tool then pay up for the form factor that the top video cameras use.
There is a reason that Alexa and Red don't look like a Sony A7.
Which is what I said…… :)

Putting a fan in an R5 doesn’t make it a brilliant video camera.

However, disagree about we all need Red or Arri cameras and the expense involved with them. A C70 or better still a model between C70 and C300 would be a brilliant canera for 95% of everyone outsite Hollywood and big budget advertising.
 
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koenkooi

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Feb 25, 2015
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Thanks for the clarification. No argument that video DR is different (and I don’t have a horse in the race since I don’t shoot video on my ILCs), just pointing out that Claff didn’t call it ‘photographic’ to distinguish it from ‘video’.
We should come up with some form of 'equivalence' between all the DRs to make it less confusing! </sarcasm>
 
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Yes, it uses this filter mechanism which takes up more space than what's available in an R5 body.

View attachment 201175
If they can put it in the C70, then they can make it work on all RF mount bodies. The distance from the lens to the sensor doesn’t change.
 
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RunAndGun

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Dec 16, 2011
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You have seen the new Ronin 4D, right?
And it was designed from the outset with an internal system. The R5 was not. Where is the extra space that they are going to need to slide the filters to and from? They would have to make the body bigger to accommodate the system.
 
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