Canon not going global shutter with next round of EOS R camera bodies

[Toamelicious]

Here we go again. Just like with the R3, same old story. Sony is outsmarting Canon in many ways. The R3 would have been named the R1. But Canon could not do it after Sony came up with a 50mp camera a few weeks before launch. So Canon named it R3. I am 100% sure about that. Now they fail again. Sony releases an insane camera with global shutter, just a few months before Canon is launching the R1 without global shutter. So what will canon do? Name it R2 and keep pro users ignorant for another 4 years? Hahahaha. So sad. But I’ll stick to my R6 mark II bodies for a another year or two. Canon, come on! Step up your game!
And second reason not to buy this R1 or R2 is because I am sure Canon will charge an astronomic price for it. Like we know Canon.
7000-8000 euro’s will be the price range.
For a camera that is already outdated the moment it hits the market. So sad.

And go ahead, call me a troll, that’s fine.
The truth is, that I am just a very disappointed Canon pro user for many many years.
Give us the R1 with global shutter and 50mp for 4990 and I will buy two of them. But I am affraid they cannot keep up with their competitors.

This might be the funniest canonisdoomed message I have ever seen in here.
But if we go absolutely crazy with demands, why stay so conservative?
I'd say canon give us the R1 for free with a magic sensor that can not only go 200mp but also cure cancer and solve the energy crisis. Only then will I buy two of them, which will save canon from getting absolutely demolished by Sony.

 

[bbasiaga]

Should be some good deals on used canon gear as everyone jumps ship to Sony!

On another forum a guy put it well. I'll put in quotes but its really a paraphrase. "Sony has managed to raise the price $1500 on a body that has less DR and more noise".

Imagine if Canon had done that! These forums would be ablaze. Probably worse than they are now.

The R3 effectively has no rolling shutter at all. So the main thing the A9III has over it, which isn't nothing, is the 120FPS with AF.

Brian

 

[Tony5787]

For many years now Sony have made better sensors, and perhaps they always will. They are the largest camera sensor manufacturer in the world and have more $ to invest in research and factories. In terms of sensor research & production they are kind of to Canon, what for decades Canon was to Nikon. More research, more patents, more $ to invest helped by Canon's profits from their other product divsions. Now Sony can do it to them for the same reasons.
Meanwhile, Canon make better exotic stills lenses. Take your pick.

And that’s why Sony just released a 24MP sensor that maxes out at ISO 25,600 two years after the R3 was released and had better low light performance than any camera Sony has released. The R3 is still the highest rated FF sensor for low light on DXO Mark and as someone who’s owned the a9, a9 II, and the R3 I can honestly say it’s not even close. With the a9 I wouldn’t go over ISO 10k but with the R3 I won’t hesitate to go 25,600 or 32,000 if there’s any available light left.

 

[vangelismm]

We can expect it to be faster than Z9?

 

[mpmark]

No thank you, glad canon is sticking with the well more advanced dynamic range and iso of the stacked sensor.

There is a reason Sony is shying away from bragging about the ISO and Dynamic range performance of this, it's not good enough yet.

Sony loves to show you sparkly colors and distract.

 

[Tony5787]

Here we go again. Just like with the R3, same old story. Sony is outsmarting Canon in many ways. The R3 would have been named the R1. But Canon could not do it after Sony came up with a 50mp camera a few weeks before launch. So Canon named it R3. I am 100% sure about that. Now they fail again. Sony releases an insane camera with global shutter, just a few months before Canon is launching the R1 without global shutter. So what will canon do? Name it R2 and keep pro users ignorant for another 4 years? Hahahaha. So sad. But I’ll stick to my R6 mark II bodies for a another year or two. Canon, come on! Step up your game!
And second reason not to buy this R1 or R2 is because I am sure Canon will charge an astronomic price for it. Like we know Canon.
7000-8000 euro’s will be the price range.
For a camera that is already outdated the moment it hits the market. So sad.

And go ahead, call me a troll, that’s fine.
The truth is, that I am just a very disappointed Canon pro user for many many years.
Give us the R1 with global shutter and 50mp for 4990 and I will buy two of them. But I am affraid they cannot keep up with their competitors.

Switch to Sony if you want global shutter then, unless you shoot high speed flash or indoor sports though you’ll see very little advantage with the global shutter over a stacked sensor with fast readout. Sony purposefully didn’t disclose dynamic range or ISO range when they announced the a9 III when they always do that, seems a little suspect to me (and based on the high ISO samples that have been coming out you can see why they didn’t talk about low-light performance at all).

 

[Nathan Phillips]

Here we go again. Just like with the R3, same old story. Sony is outsmarting Canon in many ways. The R3 would have been named the R1. But Canon could not do it after Sony came up with a 50mp camera a few weeks before launch. So Canon named it R3. I am 100% sure about that. Now they fail again. Sony releases an insane camera with global shutter, just a few months before Canon is launching the R1 without global shutter. So what will canon do? Name it R2 and keep pro users ignorant for another 4 years? Hahahaha. So sad. But I’ll stick to my R6 mark II bodies for a another year or two. Canon, come on! Step up your game!
And second reason not to buy this R1 or R2 is because I am sure Canon will charge an astronomic price for it. Like we know Canon.
7000-8000 euro’s will be the price range.
For a camera that is already outdated the moment it hits the market. So sad.

And go ahead, call me a troll, that’s fine.
The truth is, that I am just a very disappointed Canon pro user for many many years.
Give us the R1 with global shutter and 50mp for 4990 and I will buy two of them. But I am affraid they cannot keep up with their competitors.

Canon in the past has definitely been a greedy company, but canon has changed their ways more than less. And with what you’ve said, I don’t think is the case for a few reasons.

1.) Canon had the EOS 3 back in the day that fits right in line with the R3 and both having eye control. Works well with most with the R3. I think the R3 was meant to test the market, but also be better than the 1DX III until the R1 was truly ready.

2.) Canon has patents that relate to an R1 level body before the first EOS R was even released. That sensor will hopefully be in the R1 and R5 II. This will be the answer to a global shutter. Too many down sides for a global shutter that is geared towards fast action. Much rather have a rolling shutter with fast readout. You keep image quality, dynamic range, and low light performance at a much higher level. If anything, put a global shutter in the R3 II since it’s aimed at fast action.

Canon is late to the mirrorless game, but they’ve already outperformed the market with no overheating 8K (just took them a minute and bad marketing). Either way, they still achieved it.

The only things that canon is lacking that truly matters is Dynmaic Range on their non cinema line and then autofocus. I sadly think that Sony has this crown at the moment.

And going on a hunch here… but if Canon teams up with RED like I think they will, then the R1 will dominate the market.

 

[mpmark]

Here we go again. Just like with the R3, same old story. Sony is outsmarting Canon in many ways. The R3 would have been named the R1. But Canon could not do it after Sony came up with a 50mp camera a few weeks before launch. So Canon named it R3. I am 100% sure about that. Now they fail again. Sony releases an insane camera with global shutter, just a few months before Canon is launching the R1 without global shutter. So what will canon do? Name it R2 and keep pro users ignorant for another 4 years? Hahahaha. So sad. But I’ll stick to my R6 mark II bodies for a another year or two. Canon, come on! Step up your game!
And second reason not to buy this R1 or R2 is because I am sure Canon will charge an astronomic price for it. Like we know Canon.
7000-8000 euro’s will be the price range.
For a camera that is already outdated the moment it hits the market. So sad.

And go ahead, call me a troll, that’s fine.
The truth is, that I am just a very disappointed Canon pro user for many many years.
Give us the R1 with global shutter and 50mp for 4990 and I will buy two of them. But I am affraid they cannot keep up with their competitors.

The level of immaturity and lack of understanding in this post is incredible

 

[Del Paso]

"Sony reported a 29% drop in operating profit for its second quarter as the company suffered from weakness in its imaging sensor business."

Sony profit slumps 29% on chip weakness but maintains 25 million unit PlayStation 5 target

Sony reported a 29% drop in operating profit for its second quarter as the company suffered from weakness in its imaging sensor business.

www.nbcbayarea.com

You make me sooo sad!

 

[shadowsports]

While Sony does (occasionally) do things first, Canon always does it better. Global shutter is not the end all be all, if Canon's offerings can rival or exceed the MP and readout speeds. They could do this with a stacked sensor, or more processing horsepower. Threatening to jump ship means nothing.

 

[Vilacom]

Totally fine with me as I am not a professional sports shooter which is basically the only place such an expensive piece of kit is going to be used, and even then I have my doubts until Sony has an answer to the 100-300 2.8, global shutter is a fantastic piece of technology but having the extra versatility with such an incredible lens seems like overall it tops what minimal issues the stacked sensors of today have with warping.

Bodies will come and go, glass is forever. It’s why if I had to do it all over again I’d still be buying my canon kit right now, and I’m gonna have an amazing time with the 10-20 F4 just as soon as it ships out to me…stupid pre orders.

 

[Del Paso]

Here we go again. Just like with the R3, same old story. Sony is outsmarting Canon in many ways. The R3 would have been named the R1. But Canon could not do it after Sony came up with a 50mp camera a few weeks before launch. So Canon named it R3. I am 100% sure about that. Now they fail again. Sony releases an insane camera with global shutter, just a few months before Canon is launching the R1 without global shutter. So what will canon do? Name it R2 and keep pro users ignorant for another 4 years? Hahahaha. So sad. But I’ll stick to my R6 mark II bodies for a another year or two. Canon, come on! Step up your game!
And second reason not to buy this R1 or R2 is because I am sure Canon will charge an astronomic price for it. Like we know Canon.
7000-8000 euro’s will be the price range.
For a camera that is already outdated the moment it hits the market. So sad.

And go ahead, call me a troll, that’s fine.
The truth is, that I am just a very disappointed Canon pro user for many many years.
Give us the R1 with global shutter and 50mp for 4990 and I will buy two of them. But I am affraid they cannot keep up with their competitors.

I just can't imagine a pro posting such nonsense...

 

[neuroanatomist]

Hey I guys, made this account to join the discussion troll CR

Fixed that for you.

It just feels like Canon has no idea at all about what customers actually want. It's just another example after still having the RF mount closed to third party manufacturers. I mean Canon lenses are still top notch but when it comes to cameras I think that Canon is merely a shadow of of its former glory and this gives me confidence in sticking with Sony for the next couple of years.

It just feels like you have no idea at all about the camera market. It's just another example of armchair experts showing their lack of actual knowledge. I mean how does Canon keep dominating the market, selling nearly twice as many cameras as Sony last year?

 

[Brikna]

The only things that canon is lacking that truly matters is Dynmaic Range on their non cinema line and then autofocus. I sadly think that Sony has this crown at the moment.

I don't know on what basis you drew the conclusion that Sony holds the crown in terms of DR and AF, but you can see very nicely in the graph from www.photonstophotos.net that you are wrong.
Unfortunately, I can't show you the chart for AF operation, but even if it existed, it would look very similar.

 

[Brikna]

So the main thing the A9III has over it, which isn't nothing, is the 120FPS with AF.

Yes, it has 120 fps with AF, and it also has a buffer of an incredible 1.6 seconds.
It should not be forgotten that even that 120 fps is very questionable because Sony mentions some kind of dynamic control of that 120 fps. Very likely, if the aperture of the lens is not wide open, if the AF algorithm fails to track the subject perfectly, all this talk about 120 fps will not survive. A similar situation has already been seen on numerous Sony specifications, which on paper are one thing, but in reality something completely different - for example, the EVF resolution that corresponds to the specification only when viewing photos in the EVF, and during actual photography is not nearly as declared .

 

[neuroanatomist]

I don't know on what basis you drew the conclusion that Sony holds the crown in terms of DR and AF, but you can see very nicely in the graph from www.photonstophotos.net that you are wrong.

How dare you bring data to a discussion on opinions? I say, how dare you, Sir?!?

 

[Brikna]

How dare you...

Greta, is that you? Sorry, I didn't recognize you right away!

 

[neuroanatomist]

It should not be forgotten that even that 120 fps is very questionable because Sony mentions some kind of dynamic control of that 120 fps. Very likely, if the aperture of the lens is not wide open, if the AF algorithm fails to track the subject perfectly, all this talk about 120 fps will not survive. A similar situation has already been seen on numerous Sony specifications, which on paper are one thing, but in reality something completely different - for example, the EVF resolution that corresponds to the specification only when viewing photos in the EVF, and during actual photography is not nearly as declared .

I don't disagree, but I do recall that there were caveats around my 1D X shooting 12 fps. The shutter speed had to be 1/1000 s (which is much faster than 12 fps really requires), aperture wide open, ISO at 25,600 or less, and it 'may be slower depending on subject conditions, brightness, blah blah blah. Sony isn't really innovating there, lol.

 

[Brikna]

I don't disagree, but I do recall that there were caveats around my 1D X shooting 12 fps. The shutter speed had to be 1/1000 s (which is much faster than 12 fps really requires), aperture wide open, ISO at 25,600 or less, and it 'may be slower depending on subject conditions, brightness, blah blah blah. Sony isn't really innovating there, lol.

Absolutely, Sony is not the first to emphasize the top capabilities of its devices, but, it seems to me, it is the absolute winner (holds the crown ) in creating specifications that are achievable only theoretically and on paper, but unattainable in reality.

 

[melgross]

Here we go again. Just like with the R3, same old story. Sony is outsmarting Canon in many ways. The R3 would have been named the R1. But Canon could not do it after Sony came up with a 50mp camera a few weeks before launch. So Canon named it R3. I am 100% sure about that. Now they fail again. Sony releases an insane camera with global shutter, just a few months before Canon is launching the R1 without global shutter. So what will canon do? Name it R2 and keep pro users ignorant for another 4 years? Hahahaha. So sad. But I’ll stick to my R6 mark II bodies for a another year or two. Canon, come on! Step up your game!
And second reason not to buy this R1 or R2 is because I am sure Canon will charge an astronomic price for it. Like we know Canon.
7000-8000 euro’s will be the price range.
For a camera that is already outdated the moment it hits the market. So sad.

And go ahead, call me a troll, that’s fine.
The truth is, that I am just a very disappointed Canon pro user for many many years.
Give us the R1 with global shutter and 50mp for 4990 and I will buy two of them. But I am affraid they cannot keep up with their competitors.

Well, your post is certainly troll-like. These are business decisions more than technology ones. Sony sees its sales lead in mirrorless slipping away, so they come up with this. Is it nice to have? Sure. Is it necessary for the large majority of users? No. If the limitations for it that we see reported are true, it may even be a slight step back in a number of ways.

before you cry and scream, wait until Canon’s new cameras come out a few months from now. If it’s true the sensors have taken a bigger quality step than normally expected, we could be saying that Sony’s new sensor is lagging behind.