Canon Cinema EOS C300 Mark II Will be 4K [CR2]

[Canon Rumors Guy]

<p>We’ve been told by a couple of people that the Cinema EOS C300 will be replaced in time for NAB 2015 in Las Vegas this coming April. The Mark II version of the C300 will indeed be 4K, which I think would have been assumed, though you never know with Canon. We’re told there will also be a “bunch of other improvements”, but what those additional improvements would be wasn’t specified. I suspect the C300 Mark II is going to be a bigger upgrade than the C100 Mark II was to the original C100.</p>
<p>We’re also told there will be some kind of an announcement for an over the shoulder style Cinema EOS camera to compete directly with Alexa. The hope is for that camera to be ready for NAB, but it could come after.</p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong></p>

 

[transpo1]

Thank god. They're finally doing it. Here's hoping for a new sensor with the dynamic range and high ISO to rival Sony's chips.

 

[Tugela]

Don't hold your breath. Most likely it will be the same camera, except with DPAF and the processor upgraded to a DIGIC DV4. Those are the sorts of upgrades that Canon thinks are "revolutionary" (even though both have been around for quite some time now).

 

[Policar]

It'll be 4k. Hopefully 10 bit codec. Probably the same sensor.

 

[cliffwang]

I care only if 5D IV will have 4K video or not.

 

[peederj]

I would assume C300Mk2 will be a smaller and far more ergonomic C500 (with external RAW 4K120 available etc.) with internal 4K to CFast. Not sure what the codec will be, or whether this and the over-the-shoulder cam are actually the same cam. Because I imagine the EVF will be moved forward for balance reasons and the screen will be on the back like C100s are. They may also have a C500Mk2 with the internal 4K to CFast and possibly 4K240 if the new chips can deal. All will get DPAF standard and probably a new fast servo zoom as a kit option for ENG/docs/events. There may be a new Canon Log 2 and 4 or 8 channel audio onboard as well.

I'm purely speculating, CR0.

 

[that1guyy]

Woopdie doo. A 20k camera does 4k. Should have done 4k in the first model.

 

[Khnnielsen]

This rumor make me worried for two reasons.

1) If they introduce 4K with the C300 Mark II, then it seem doubtful that 4k will find its way to the relatively cheaper models. I don't desperately need 4k, but it would nice see it in a Canon body that doesn't cost $12,000. So for example I wouldn't expect them to give the 5d Mark IV 4k, in order to not cannibalize the C300.

2) The idea of a shoulder mounted production camera is very interesting, but if they are targeting the same marked as the Arri Alexis, then it's not something that would be relevant to everyone here, if you don't work with high budget productions. And I think that is a damn shame. I love the idea of big sensor camera for documentaries that I just can take out of the box and on my shoulders, and then go out shooting.

It the same thing Sony are trying to do with the FS7, but I would love to see Canon do the same. But of course this is just rumors, so I can still be pleasantly surprised.

 

[Bob Howland]

After seeing this rumor the first time, I re-read the DPReview writeup about the Panasonic GH4, especially the part dealing with video. Very refreshing.

 

[dgatwood]

1) If they introduce 4K with the C300 Mark II, then it seem doubtful that 4k will find its way to the relatively cheaper models. I don't desperately need 4k, but it would nice see it in a Canon body that doesn't cost $12,000. So for example I wouldn't expect them to give the 5d Mark IV 4k, in order to not cannibalize the C300.

That's fine. They can let the Sony A7S (with an external recorder) and (to some extent) the Panasonic GH4 cannibalize its sales instead. I think Steve Jobs put it best when he said, "If you don't cannibalize yourself, someone else will."

Right now, 4K is way, way, waaaaay too expensive in Canon-land when compared with the rest of the industry. At this point, if they want to be competitive, they should be releasing a 4K/4:2:2 version of the C300 at a sub-$4,000 price point, and probably sub-$3000. To be blunt, when you compare Canon's offerings with what Sony and Panasonic bring to the table at the same price point, a $13,000 camera would need to be gold-plated and be able to cook lunch for the entire cast and crew during the downtime between scenes. Either that or it would have to be a five-pack for that price.

IMO, if Canon needs to either fold high-quality video into their DSLR line and abandon the cinema line or dramatically slash the prices on their cinema line. If they don't do one of those things pretty soon, they can pretty much kiss the video market goodbye. They just aren't competitive anymore. At all.

 

[Policar]

This rumor make me worried for two reasons.

1) If they introduce 4K with the C300 Mark II, then it seem doubtful that 4k will find its way to the relatively cheaper models. I don't desperately need 4k, but it would nice see it in a Canon body that doesn't cost $12,000. So for example I wouldn't expect them to give the 5d Mark IV 4k, in order to not cannibalize the C300.

2) The idea of a shoulder mounted production camera is very interesting, but if they are targeting the same marked as the Arri Alexis, then it's not something that would be relevant to everyone here, if you don't work with high budget productions. And I think that is a damn shame. I love the idea of big sensor camera for documentaries that I just can take out of the box and on my shoulders, and then go out shooting.

It the same thing Sony are trying to do with the FS7, but I would love to see Canon do the same. But of course this is just rumors, so I can still be pleasantly surprised.

Canon is trying to position itself like Arri (and Red... sort of) as an "industry leader" that doesn't need to compete with specs so much on image, trust among producers and DPs, and not on the basis of specs. Arri doesn't offer 4k (even at 60k); red doesn't offer it for under 15k realistically for 4k-ready package. Canon is at the low end of the industry in terms of specs, but also prices for a well-liked professional solution. The F5 didn't catch on great, but it's as expensive as the C300.

The C300 rents very well. I find the IQ from the camera awesome, I far prefer it to the F5 despite the F5's better specs.

The A7S and GH4 are not gaining traction among serious shooters due to reliability issues (even the F5 has poor timecode sync); the IQ is there and if all you're after is IQ just buy one! Canon won't cater to you, the same as Arri won't. Stop waiting. Canon is after the professional market, which demands less in terms of image quality and more in terms of reliability and conventional workflow (which is where Red stumbles and Arri does best, despite... only 2k on the body).

 

[Khnnielsen]

This rumor make me worried for two reasons.

1) If they introduce 4K with the C300 Mark II, then it seem doubtful that 4k will find its way to the relatively cheaper models. I don't desperately need 4k, but it would nice see it in a Canon body that doesn't cost $12,000. So for example I wouldn't expect them to give the 5d Mark IV 4k, in order to not cannibalize the C300.

2) The idea of a shoulder mounted production camera is very interesting, but if they are targeting the same marked as the Arri Alexis, then it's not something that would be relevant to everyone here, if you don't work with high budget productions. And I think that is a damn shame. I love the idea of big sensor camera for documentaries that I just can take out of the box and on my shoulders, and then go out shooting.

It the same thing Sony are trying to do with the FS7, but I would love to see Canon do the same. But of course this is just rumors, so I can still be pleasantly surprised.

Canon is trying to position itself like Arri (and Red... sort of) as an "industry leader" that doesn't need to compete with specs so much on image, trust among producers and DPs, and not on the basis of specs. Arri doesn't offer 4k (even at 60k); red doesn't offer it for under 15k realistically for 4k-ready package. Canon is at the low end of the industry in terms of specs, but also prices for a well-liked professional solution. The F5 didn't catch on great, but it's as expensive as the C300.

The C300 rents very well. I find the IQ from the camera awesome, I far prefer it to the F5 despite the F5's better specs.

The A7S and GH4 are not gaining traction among serious shooters due to reliability issues (even the F5 has poor timecode sync); the IQ is there and if all you're after is IQ just buy one! Canon won't cater to you, the same as Arri won't. Stop waiting. Canon is after the professional market, which demands less in terms of image quality and more in terms of reliability and conventional workflow (which is where Red stumbles and Arri does best, despite... only 2k on the body).

Listen, I actually don't care about IQ that much. As a video-journalist I want a new C300 that I can comfortably put on my shoulder without building a rig or the need of a external evf. Mix in broadcast friendly codecs, sell it at $8000, and then I am a happy camper. If this rumor is true, then Canon will not make that camera.

 

[Policar]

This rumor make me worried for two reasons.

1) If they introduce 4K with the C300 Mark II, then it seem doubtful that 4k will find its way to the relatively cheaper models. I don't desperately need 4k, but it would nice see it in a Canon body that doesn't cost $12,000. So for example I wouldn't expect them to give the 5d Mark IV 4k, in order to not cannibalize the C300.

2) The idea of a shoulder mounted production camera is very interesting, but if they are targeting the same marked as the Arri Alexis, then it's not something that would be relevant to everyone here, if you don't work with high budget productions. And I think that is a damn shame. I love the idea of big sensor camera for documentaries that I just can take out of the box and on my shoulders, and then go out shooting.

It the same thing Sony are trying to do with the FS7, but I would love to see Canon do the same. But of course this is just rumors, so I can still be pleasantly surprised.

Canon is trying to position itself like Arri (and Red... sort of) as an "industry leader" that doesn't need to compete with specs so much on image, trust among producers and DPs, and not on the basis of specs. Arri doesn't offer 4k (even at 60k); red doesn't offer it for under 15k realistically for 4k-ready package. Canon is at the low end of the industry in terms of specs, but also prices for a well-liked professional solution. The F5 didn't catch on great, but it's as expensive as the C300.

The C300 rents very well. I find the IQ from the camera awesome, I far prefer it to the F5 despite the F5's better specs.

The A7S and GH4 are not gaining traction among serious shooters due to reliability issues (even the F5 has poor timecode sync); the IQ is there and if all you're after is IQ just buy one! Canon won't cater to you, the same as Arri won't. Stop waiting. Canon is after the professional market, which demands less in terms of image quality and more in terms of reliability and conventional workflow (which is where Red stumbles and Arri does best, despite... only 2k on the body).

Listen, I actually don't care about IQ that much. As a video-journalist I want a new C300 that I can comfortably put on my shoulder without building a rig or the need of a external evf. Mix in broadcast friendly codecs, sell it at $8000, and then I am a happy camper. If this rumor is true, then Canon will not make that camera.

It sounds like they're making that camera, it might just not be the C300.

Would be cool if it were.

 

[skoobey]

Great... just when competition will offer 8K...

Canon makes great camera systems, but this money-grabbing policy will come around to bite them.

 

[jeffa4444]

I love the K wars they make so little sense in most real world situations. Most broadcasters are still coming to terms with 2K and aside from Netflix streaming 4K on very limited output who is actually showing 4K other than a few cinemas? OK I hear to say the message is oversampling for 2K and archiving 4K thats great but look at the storage required which from time to time needs to be re-archived as storage changes.
8K is still a pipe dream at NHK and most likely will be oversampled to 4K, the Alexa 65 at 6.5K will require huge storage to shoot an entire film but in its case cinema needs to stay ahead of home cinema or risk falling box-office.

What is more useful is wider dynamic range & better colour imagery particularly in TV to move from REC709 to REC2020 resolution is only one part of improving images.
As to Canon doing an on the shoulder camera they better take heed not simply of the Alexa but equally the Amira. Arri have been making cameras for professionals since the 1930s and unlike Japan keep the controls simple as time is money on-set.

 

[romedavid90]

It will be 4k

 

[sheedoe]

Not sure where the C300 II will fit in the current lineup. The C500 already does 4K. So why not just lower the price of the C500 and introduce a C500 mark II with better specs, (DR, FPS, Global shutter, low-light performance etc)? Unless they plan to make it a crippled version of C500 that take away many features except 4K recording.