Interview With Canon's Masaya Maeda

[emko]

The answer regarding concentrating on "On-Chip A/D design going forward" is pretty significant...

Yes, indeed.

And it basically makes the DR talk needless at this point. We already know from current and past discussions what the story is for everything out already and we know now there is no need to keep getting on about it to pressure them to do it since they have finally announced that they are now going forward with it.

on sensor ADC won't solve canon's DR issue at low ISO's.

really?? what?

 

[unfocused]

The fact that he still makes consumer-level 4k sound like some fanciful pipe dream for the year 3000 or something was pretty messed up. And he goes on about how they are afraid it would hurt their profit too much to give consumers 4k any time soon? Wow.

Better read what he said:

For the consumer models, I think that we still need to work a little bit more on the balance between the cost and the sensor sensitivity before we can come out in the market.

The statement hinges on what Canon considers to be a consumer model. If you believe Canon considers the 5D to be consumer grade, then the pessimism is justified. But, I seriously doubt that Canon considers either the 5D or the 7D to be consumer grade cameras. If you are looking at the 5DIV, I would say it is too early to assume it won't have 4K.

 

[unfocused]

Lots of stuff here for people wanting to read tea leaves. But, that's really all there is to it.

My take (which has no more or less validity than anyone else's):

Canon is a business and they are in business to turn a profit, just like other manufacturers. Except they tend to be better at it than others.

There is no shortage of innovation in the company, just a need to balance the costs of innovation with the benefits.

Nothing in this interview would cause me to change my prediction that a full frame mirrorless camera is not in the cards in the near term. At some point, they may move to EVF for their DSLR-Style cameras, but the lens mount is not going to change and this will only occur when the savings and benefits of an EVF outweigh those of mirror boxes. Check back in 5-6 years.

Looks like they will be putting more emphasis on the APS-C sized Canon M series. Sounds like they have some things up their sleeve and it will be fun to see what that is.

Canon expects to compete with mirrorless using a two-front strategy -- a revitalized M series and more compact DSLRs. The SL2 could be very interesting.

Autofocus is going to get better and better and improvements will likely be pushed downstream as costs permit. Canon has figured out that one way to compete on the consumer front is to help consumers capture pictures that are in focus.

After years of converging stills and video, we may start to see the two diverge again. That doesn't mean a stills only camera or Canon ceding the DSLR video front, but it might mean more models optimized for one or the other.

Lots of other things to speculate about, but those are just a few thoughts.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

The answer regarding concentrating on "On-Chip A/D design going forward" is pretty significant...

Yes, indeed.

And it basically makes the DR talk needless at this point. We already know from current and past discussions what the story is for everything out already and we know now there is no need to keep getting on about it to pressure them to do it since they have finally announced that they are now going forward with it.

on sensor ADC won't solve canon's DR issue at low ISO's, canon's doing it because it's more cost effective and faster readout.

this is where a little knowledge is dangerous and quite possibly wrong.

however on sensor ADC even on exmor wasn't the reason they had a competitive advantage in DR the past 3 years. Other technologies such as the double correlated NR at the pixel level elevated it much more.

First, without the on-chip ADC none of the other stuff could be done.

Second, he specifically said it is less cost effective, not more.

And the low ISO DR is all hurt by late stage noise. The sensor itself delivers tons of DR at low ISO.
Even just shooting your shadows at high ISO setting and the rest at low ISO setting and then combining gets you lots more stops out of it exactly as it is even now on a current Canon.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

The fact that he still makes consumer-level 4k sound like some fanciful pipe dream for the year 3000 or something was pretty messed up. And he goes on about how they are afraid it would hurt their profit too much to give consumers 4k any time soon? Wow.

Better read what he said:

For the consumer models, I think that we still need to work a little bit more on the balance between the cost and the sensor sensitivity before we can come out in the market.

The statement hinges on what Canon considers to be a consumer model. If you believe Canon considers the 5D to be consumer grade, then the pessimism is justified. But, I seriously doubt that Canon considers either the 5D or the 7D to be consumer grade cameras. If you are looking at the 5DIV, I would say it is too early to assume it won't have 4K.

Well, that wasn't the impression I got, but I sure hope you are correct. If so then this is some through and through fantastic news. They should really clarify that a bit. When it comes to video talk they tended to refer to non-Cxx and non 1DC as consumer stuff. But if all he meant was Rebels and xxD that is another story entirely!

Anyway yeah it does call my assumption into some question though. Good point.

And reading it yet again, yeah it very hard to tell exactly what he meant since they were talking about both consumer and pro of various levels and it's all mixed together. Maybe he did really did mean only Rebels and perhaps xxD and he wasn't referring to 5D level stuff at that point.

 

[LukasS]

canon's doing it because it's more cost effective and faster readout.

WHAT? He literally said it costs MORE not less. Have you read the interview?

 

[LukasS]

people buy MILCs partly because they are small and thin and light.

"partly"... I would say that these reasons are down the line, I think (and from seeing reaction of all the ppl I've had handed my DSLR to) small cameras mostly have the appeal of simple device that can be used with little knowledge of the equipment.

 

[unfocused]

The fact that he still makes consumer-level 4k sound like some fanciful pipe dream for the year 3000 or something was pretty messed up. And he goes on about how they are afraid it would hurt their profit too much to give consumers 4k any time soon? Wow.

Better read what he said:

For the consumer models, I think that we still need to work a little bit more on the balance between the cost and the sensor sensitivity before we can come out in the market.

The statement hinges on what Canon considers to be a consumer model. If you believe Canon considers the 5D to be consumer grade, then the pessimism is justified. But, I seriously doubt that Canon considers either the 5D or the 7D to be consumer grade cameras. If you are looking at the 5DIV, I would say it is too early to assume it won't have 4K.

Well I'm not sure sure about that, that wasn't the impression I got. But I sure hope you are correct. If so then this is some through and through fantastic news. They should really clarify that a bit. When it comes to video talk they tended to refer to non-Cxx and non 1DC as consumer stuff. But if all he meant was Rebels and xxD that is another story entirely!

Anyway yeah it does call my assumption into some question though. Good point.

And reading it yet again, yeah it very hard to tell exactly what he meant since they were talking about both consumer and pro of various levels and it's all mixed together. Maybe he did mean only Rebels and xxD might still have it some time off but not 5D-type stuff.

Absolutely agree that it was too vague to know for sure what he meant. I just have a hard time believing they will hold off for another generation before including 4K. I'm a video neophyte so for me personally, it's not a big deal, but from what I can tell, 4K is very important for cropping down to HD. I've got to believe that the competitive pressures are such that Canon will want to make sure they check off that box with the next generation of DSLRs, at least with the 5D.

 

[hoodlum]

I thought this interview sounded familiar.

http://www.canonrumors.com/a-new-eos-m-with-evf-second-half-of-2014/

- A new EOS M3 camera could arrive in the 2nd half of 2014 with an EVF
- New EF-M lenses are coming, though worldwide availability isn’t mentioned.
- Canon is considering a prosumer/professional mirrorless camera
- Video performance will be a key feature of future EOS M development.

 

[Mitch.Conner]

When he says that the current lens lineup can handle 50mp, and he's specifically responding to whether they can handle 120 and/or 250... how do you all interpret that?

I'm not sure what to think.


I'm psyched about a lot of what I read in this interview though.

 

[StudentOfLight]

The fact that he still makes consumer-level 4k sound like some fanciful pipe dream for the year 3000 or something was pretty messed up. And he goes on about how they are afraid it would hurt their profit too much to give consumers 4k any time soon? Wow.

Better read what he said:

For the consumer models, I think that we still need to work a little bit more on the balance between the cost and the sensor sensitivity before we can come out in the market.

The statement hinges on what Canon considers to be a consumer model. If you believe Canon considers the 5D to be consumer grade, then the pessimism is justified. But, I seriously doubt that Canon considers either the 5D or the 7D to be consumer grade cameras. If you are looking at the 5DIV, I would say it is too early to assume it won't have 4K.

Well, that wasn't the impression I got, but I sure hope you are correct. If so then this is some through and through fantastic news. They should really clarify that a bit. When it comes to video talk they tended to refer to non-Cxx and non 1DC as consumer stuff. But if all he meant was Rebels and xxD that is another story entirely!

Anyway yeah it does call my assumption into some question though. Good point.

And reading it yet again, yeah it very hard to tell exactly what he meant since they were talking about both consumer and pro of various levels and it's all mixed together. Maybe he did really did mean only Rebels and perhaps xxD and he wasn't referring to 5D level stuff at that point.

B2B is Direct Business to Business. So one corporate negotiating and selling to another.

B2C is Indirect Business to Consumer. Canon does not sell directly to pro photographers. It uses Indirect business partners like B&H (in USA), ORMs (in South Africa) etc... Pro photographers are still served through the B2C channel. So pros would be considered consumers when speaking on a corporate level.

Market segmentation is dividing B2C into subgroups. In the case of the B2C, it appears to follow this grouping structure:
xxxxD - Entry Tier (e.g. 1100D) Focus is on Low cost
xxxD - Mainstream (e.g. 650D) Has main specs needed by most people
xxD - Advanced (e.g. 70D) Contains some unique IP
xD - Premium (e.g. 5Ds) Significant innovation and unique IP
1D - Top Tier (e.g. 1D-X) Many innovations and unique IP

When speaking casually, we might apply the label of "consumer" to lower tier products like the xxxxD or xxxD or xxD or 6D but who is to stop a professional from using any one of those tools to create a usable image.

 

[Bob Howland]

I thought this interview sounded familiar.

http://www.canonrumors.com/a-new-eos-m-with-evf-second-half-of-2014/

- A new EOS M3 camera could arrive in the 2nd half of 2014 with an EVF
- New EF-M lenses are coming, though worldwide availability isn’t mentioned.
- Canon is considering a prosumer/professional mirrorless camera
- Video performance will be a key feature of future EOS M development.

Canon keeps moving the very near future into the very distant future.

 

[PureClassA]

Bingo. It's been discussed here at nauseating length how Canon's main sensor issue is its read noise. The sensor itself delivers far more Dynamic Range than it ultimately yields once read and put through the ADC because it has to traverse a very noisy signal path to get there. You could take the 5D3 or 6D sensor right now and re-make it with an ON-chip ADC and DR would improve instantly and significantly.

The answer regarding concentrating on "On-Chip A/D design going forward" is pretty significant...

Yes, indeed.

And it basically makes the DR talk needless at this point. We already know from current and past discussions what the story is for everything out already and we know now there is no need to keep getting on about it to pressure them to do it since they have finally announced that they are now going forward with it.

on sensor ADC won't solve canon's DR issue at low ISO's, canon's doing it because it's more cost effective and faster readout.

this is where a little knowledge is dangerous and quite possibly wrong.

however on sensor ADC even on exmor wasn't the reason they had a competitive advantage in DR the past 3 years. Other technologies such as the double correlated NR at the pixel level elevated it much more.

First, without the on-chip ADC none of the other stuff could be done.

Second, he specifically said it is less cost effective, not more.

And the low ISO DR is all hurt by late stage noise. The sensor itself delivers tons of DR at low ISO.
Even just shooting your shadows at high ISO setting and the rest at low ISO setting and then combining gets you lots more stops out of it exactly as it is even now on a current Canon.

 

[Luds34]

Nothing in this interview would cause me to change my prediction that a full frame mirrorless camera is not in the cards in the near term. At some point, they may move to EVF for their DSLR-Style cameras, but the lens mount is not going to change and this will only occur when the savings and benefits of an EVF outweigh those of mirror boxes. Check back in 5-6 years.

+1 and well said. That is my feeling on the subject as well. Canon's mirrorless efforts will be at a more consumer level, behind the M line. I don't see them abandoning the EF mount anytime soon. If they were they would not have come out with so many new EF lenses the past couple years.

 

[tvexecutive]

Re: Interview With Canon's Masaya Maeda - Blah blah blah

As a multi body 1DX owner (2) with about $50,000 invested in Canon glass, I'm disappointed.

I spent over $7,000 on each of my 1DX's and had to go through (4) four additional bodies before I even had two 1DX's that could meet my demands as a sports shooter. The mirror box issues are a "joke" in basic engineering design.

The color issues with Canon's most expensive lenses are unacceptable in "my opinion". If I just wanted "Pink", "Purple", Magenta" shots I'd could have got a box of crayons. How does a $7,000 body with a $8,000 lens have "color issues"???? NOW Canon CLAIMS they have NEW coatings to deal with these issues.... How can we beleive anything Canon says anymore???

My $7,000 bodies less than 2 years later are selling for $3,900.00 - Where is the VALUE?

Canon's technology is SO FAR behind others as a compilation. The KEY WORD here is "COMPILATION". Canon's flagship 1DX should have been a MUCH better camera from a design, manufacturing, firmware and operational perspective. The "service advisories" for the mirror box issues was a CRIME. The PCB failures were horrific. The color issues could be OK for a $50.00 disposable, not a $7,000 body.

No doubt Canon will eventually release a 1DX MKII and in 6 months it will be obsolete and in 12 months lose 1/2 it's value if Canon's history with the 1DX holds true.

I'm mad as heck with poor quality equipment, service that STINKS from CPS and a company that can't even tell it's BEST customers the truth. I'm tired of my equipment being shipped back to CPS 2-3 times to get things fixed. I'm tired of sending in my equipment to CPS and no one even cleaning and checking it... they just send it back with dirty sensors and the SAME issues the equipment was sent in for. THIS IS DISGUSTING!!!

Canon is scrambling now to understand WHY their sales are down. It's no great secret to me.

Imaging Resource sat down with Masaya Maeda, Canon’s Senior Managing Director and Chief Executive of Canon Inc’s Image Communication Products Operations. A lot of topics of interest were covered, including EOS M, EF-S and EF-M lenses, printers and more.</p>
<p>Maeda says Canon will be releasing new printers soon, first up will be the <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/new-pixma-pro-printer-coming-cr2/" target="_blank">ImagePROGRAF Pro-1000</a> which will be coming next month for PhotoPlus last we heard. This is the 12 ink, 17″ printer they showed last week at the Canon EXPO in New York City.</p>
<p>When asked about EOS M:</p>
<blockquote><p>Going forward, and this would be a repeat of what I said before, but we will put more effort into mirrorless, and also, naturally, we will continue to expand the EF-M lens group. In the very near future, I think that Canon will come out with a mirrorless camera that you would really like.</p></blockquote>
<p>We can also expect new EF-S and EF-M lenses in the near future, unfortunately there was no mention of the EOS-1D X Mark II or EOS 5D Mark IV, probably the two most anticipated products by Canon users.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2015/09/16/canon-maeda-promises-eos-m-enthusiasts-more-aps-c-lenses-new-printers" target="_blank">Head over the Imaging Resource</a> for the rest of the interview.</p>

 

[unfocused]

Re: Interview With Canon's Masaya Maeda - Blah blah blah

Canon's technology is SO FAR behind others as a compilation. The KEY WORD here is "COMPILATION".

I'm not sure that word means what you think it does.

 

[distant.star]

.
I tried to read it, but got bored.

All I see is an old, gray man in gray clothing talking about an old, gray company. Looks to me like Canon will keep driving that old Rolls Royce until the wheels fall off.

As I'm out and about these days, the only people I see using Canons & Nikons are older people.

Sunday I did an event, took three cameras. The 5D3 with a 70-200 stayed in the trunk of my car while two Fuji bodies and three small lenses got the job done very nicely.

As poet Leonard Cohen wrote...

Sail on, sail on
O mighty Ship of State!
To the Shores of Need
Past the Reefs of Greed
Through the Squalls of Hate
Sail on, sail on, sail on, sail on.​

 

[dpc]

.
I tried to read it, but got bored.

All I see is an old, gray man in gray clothing talking about an old, gray company. Looks to me like Canon will keep driving that old Rolls Royce until the wheels fall off.

As I'm out and about these days, the only people I see using Canons & Nikons are older people.

Sunday I did an event, took three cameras. The 5D3 with a 70-200 stayed in the trunk of my car while two Fuji bodies and three small lenses got the job done very nicely.

As poet Leonard Cohen wrote...

Sail on, sail on
O mighty Ship of State!
To the Shores of Need
Past the Reefs of Greed
Through the Squalls of Hate
Sail on, sail on, sail on, sail on.​

I see your comment here is well in sync with your 'signature line'. I would suggest, however, that you can make your point, such as it is, without egregiously insulting a significant portion of the population. Which would include, I assume, members of your own family. I take your point, but oldness and grayness have nothing to do with anything anymore than youth and idiocy would. Yes, I have a Fuji, too. A nice camera but it hardly blows me away. I can't honestly say that I've observed that only the old, benighted and decrepit are using Canikon while all the hipsters are using the cool cameras...

 

[tvexecutive]

Re: Interview With Canon's Masaya Maeda - Blah blah blah

Canon's technology is SO FAR behind others as a compilation. The KEY WORD here is "COMPILATION".

I'm not sure that word means what you think it does.

You BET I do but Canon fanboys will never admit it. Modality is worthless if a proper outcome can't be brought to fruition. The sum of Canon's technology in the 1DX does not equal the results. It is a flawed, poorly engineered, sloppily manufactured camera. There is no relevant synergy of the working parts that make it a greater tool than many cameras costing less today. The relevance of the camera was fleeting and the "work product" and "work flow" that should have been incorporated by Canon was NOT... and it was a LOST opportunity for Canon to embrace the market share they are losing. When I go to shoots I see many older photographers like me.... trapped by huge investments in GLASS and accessories. Investing almost $100,000 to replace everything is tough for some of us. The flawed "parts" or "pieces" that make Canon LESS than could be are from human error. There is NO reason why Canon can not come up with end-to-end quality and workflow solutions. I don't own professional SONY equipment but it seems SONY does get workflow. So does Grass Valley and firms like WideOrbit. For a Canon or any company to put out a product like the 1DX, call it their flagship with "pride" while the camera has flaws is just beyond me. The color renditioning of the camera is flawed with Canon's best lenses. The mirror box is a MESS. The manufacturing of the PCB was a JOKE. To add insult to injury Canon puts out service advisories, blames users, slaps a lot of lube in the camera and eventually the same defects appear. The end-to-end quality of the camera is FLAWED. To have color correction issues with $7,000 to $12,000 lenses is a JOKE.... but NOW Canon says they have NEW technology to deal with it!!!!???? Adobe is a prime example of another part of the food chain that Canon just shrugs off. Why not at least admit there are issues and help with the post-production process even if they are with other vendors? Why is there not a PERFECT correction for Purple, Magenta issues with a user opts for Adobe Standards in post with a 1DX and a simple f/2.8 300 IS USM II? Go into Lightroom or Photoshop and see WHAT A MESS the lens distortion and colors are. How does Canon allow that to happen?? The de facto tools for pros and Canon does not even address the issue with Adobe??? Again it the "Compilation" of the issues, the flaws, the lack of a "standard" of excellence that should be placed on ANY manufactures flagship product. How is it that "workflow" is not a mandatory part of the manufacturing design process today? Canon COULD BE MONETIZING THIS and making multiples beyond their current margins. The WRONG people are being defensive. The RIGHT people are NOT in charge. Until Canon embraces a more holistic approach to workflow they will continue to lose market share. Digital Photo Professional is not an excuse, nor a solution here... CPS is not building Canon loyalty... How about a TRUE professional workflow solution from the Camera to the printer with Canon making huge sums of money from owning the workflow chain because it's GREAT!!!????? It's time someone who's a photographer who is frustrated with the flaws is brought so engineering teams are NOT developing technology for technology's sake but for the professional who needs REAL WORKFLOW SOLUTIONS that INCLUDE PRODUCTION AND POST PRODUCTION.

 

[StudentOfLight]

Re: Interview With Canon's Masaya Maeda - Blah blah blah

As a multi body 1DX owner (2) with about $50,000 invested in Canon glass, I'm disappointed.

I spent over $7,000 on each of my 1DX's and had to go through (4) four additional bodies before I even had two 1DX's that could meet my demands as a sports shooter. The mirror box issues are a "joke" in basic engineering design.

The color issues with Canon's most expensive lenses are unacceptable in "my opinion". If I just wanted "Pink", "Purple", Magenta" shots I'd could have got a box of crayons. How does a $7,000 body with a $8,000 lens have "color issues"???? NOW Canon CLAIMS they have NEW coatings to deal with these issues.... How can we beleive anything Canon says anymore???

My $7,000 bodies less than 2 years later are selling for $3,900.00 - Where is the VALUE?

Canon's technology is SO FAR behind others as a compilation. The KEY WORD here is "COMPILATION". Canon's flagship 1DX should have been a MUCH better camera from a design, manufacturing, firmware and operational perspective. The "service advisories" for the mirror box issues was a CRIME. The PCB failures were horrific. The color issues could be OK for a $50.00 disposable, not a $7,000 body.

No doubt Canon will eventually release a 1DX MKII and in 6 months it will be obsolete and in 12 months lose 1/2 it's value if Canon's history with the 1DX holds true.

I'm mad as heck with poor quality equipment, service that STINKS from CPS and a company that can't even tell it's BEST customers the truth. I'm tired of my equipment being shipped back to CPS 2-3 times to get things fixed. I'm tired of sending in my equipment to CPS and no one even cleaning and checking it... they just send it back with dirty sensors and the SAME issues the equipment was sent in for. THIS IS DISGUSTING!!!

Canon is scrambling now to understand WHY their sales are down. It's no great secret to me.

Imaging Resource sat down with Masaya Maeda, Canon’s Senior Managing Director and Chief Executive of Canon Inc’s Image Communication Products Operations. A lot of topics of interest were covered, including EOS M, EF-S and EF-M lenses, printers and more.</p>
<p>Maeda says Canon will be releasing new printers soon, first up will be the <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/new-pixma-pro-printer-coming-cr2/" target="_blank">ImagePROGRAF Pro-1000</a> which will be coming next month for PhotoPlus last we heard. This is the 12 ink, 17″ printer they showed last week at the Canon EXPO in New York City.</p>
<p>When asked about EOS M:</p>
<blockquote><p>Going forward, and this would be a repeat of what I said before, but we will put more effort into mirrorless, and also, naturally, we will continue to expand the EF-M lens group. In the very near future, I think that Canon will come out with a mirrorless camera that you would really like.</p></blockquote>
<p>We can also expect new EF-S and EF-M lenses in the near future, unfortunately there was no mention of the EOS-1D X Mark II or EOS 5D Mark IV, probably the two most anticipated products by Canon users.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2015/09/16/canon-maeda-promises-eos-m-enthusiasts-more-aps-c-lenses-new-printers" target="_blank">Head over the Imaging Resource</a> for the rest of the interview.</p>

Have you tried using custom white balance?

I personally use Kelvin white balance, and WB-shift settings to get accurate color in-camera (for in-camera review purposes) or when shooting JPEG, particularly under artificial lighting.