5D Mark III/X Information [CR1]

[DzPhotography]

Given what Canon has released in the last 3 years, it's becoming more apparent that they are depending more on brand loyalty than worrying about what the competition is doing.

I expected all along that the 5d2 replacement would be a very minor upgrade with slightly better AF, video, and sensor performance. It's the same thing they did when they released the 1d4, which many 1d3 owners including myself skipped over because it wasn't worth spending the money for a slight upgrade. If the 5d3 is a 22mpx sensor with only slight improvements elsewhere, there will be almost no point in upgrading for about 90% of 5d2 users unless they either need a 2nd body or just want to upgrade for the fun of it.

Slightly better AF? Holy crap, if this rumor is true it's worlds apart.... :

 

[Ekefe]

Finally Canon has definitely got the message! (I hope so).... not two specific bodies for two specific purposes but one body for all the seasons. With not an huge number of Mpx (how many times you have to print an image 2X3 mt, but FF fast and reactive. Hoping that the leak will be confirmed! Let's leave the 30+ Mpx to the medium format ultra pro bodies!

 

[Axilrod]

I'd buy a 22MP 5D-family camera with pro-AF and 6.9 FPS in a heartbeat. It's exactly what we dreamed the 5D Mark II could have been in an ideal world. at the end of the day, 22 MP is a decent all-around useful number, although I'd prefer a push to 24 MP or 28 MP (even if that brought shooting speed down fractionally to 6.3 FPS to match the former 50D). can't wait for this to drop, even though I'll be shooting my 5D Mark II until the shutter dies before I upgrade.

You obviously didn't jump from a 5D to a 5DII, it was a HUGE improvement. Almost double the megapixels, big jump in ISO performance, video, etc. You make it sound like you were disappointed with the 5DII, it's one of the most celebrated DSLR's of all time!

 

[kubelik]

I'd buy a 22MP 5D-family camera with pro-AF and 6.9 FPS in a heartbeat. It's exactly what we dreamed the 5D Mark II could have been in an ideal world. at the end of the day, 22 MP is a decent all-around useful number, although I'd prefer a push to 24 MP or 28 MP (even if that brought shooting speed down fractionally to 6.3 FPS to match the former 50D). can't wait for this to drop, even though I'll be shooting my 5D Mark II until the shutter dies before I upgrade.

You obviously didn't jump from a 5D to a 5DII, it was a HUGE improvement. Almost double the megapixels, big jump in ISO performance, video, etc. You make it sound like you were disappointed with the 5DII, it's one of the most celebrated DSLR's of all time!

axilrod, quite the opposite. I went from a 30D to the 5D Mark II, and I absolutely love my 5D Mark II. My point was, I can't really ask for much to be improved on the 5D Mark II, except the AF and fps rate. give me improvements in those two areas and I'm really quite set for life 8)

 

[Loswr]

My point was, I can't really ask for much to be improved on the 5D Mark II, except the AF and fps rate. give me improvements in those two areas and I'm really quite set for life

Indeed. That and the joystick on the battery grip as icing on the cake, and I begin to rethink my decision to get a 1D X.

 

[DzPhotography]

Hate to break it to you, Tuggen, but you are simply wrong. What reports are you hearing? And there is absolutely no chance that the D800 beats or ties the 1DX in high iso performance!

How do you know that is it wrong. I'm just telling what I have read and also saying we need to wait for final confirmation. However to my ears the information seems very resonable.
I have heard no information that D800 beats 1DX but that they have similar high ISO performance. I hope it's wrong and that 1Dx is in pair with D3s and D4 or even slighly better.
That the D800 is about 0.5 stop better than D700 and 5Dmk2 and about 0.5 stop worse than D3s was very expected from the beginning based on the D7000 sensor.

I can't believe that a 36MP with a native ISO of max. 6400 will ever beat a 18MP with native 51,200 : Even better, should they even have the same ISO-range the 18MP has the advantage due to lower pixel density... :

 

[DzPhotography]

My point was, I can't really ask for much to be improved on the 5D Mark II, except the AF and fps rate. give me improvements in those two areas and I'm really quite set for life

Indeed. That and the joystick on the battery grip as icing on the cake, and I begin to rethink my decision to get a 1D X.

I might get both

 

[torger]

No, I'm not saying anything about 5D3. I'm just thowing out a question of what Canon may have to do to make 5D3 competive if anything in the rumored specification is true. By the few specification points on paper it seems to have nothing compared to D800 so 0.5 stop better in high ISO performace could have been something to compete with.

As I said earlier I don't think that the masses care about detail differences in image quality. Less than 1 stop in ISO performance is details to the general user, they just conclude "it's about the same, as it has always been".

Having a lower MP number regardless of actual performance will be competitive towards a large group of users. I think many are turned off by having to deal with 36 megapixel files. In other words, lower MP can be a feature in itself, especially since D800 lacks sRAW and mRAW modes.

 

[Neeneko]

Slightly better AF? Holy crap, if this rumor is true it's worlds apart.... :

Depends on your use-case. The rumored AF improvements will help some, but have minimal impact on others.
Personally, AF improvement is petty low on my list, and any fancy new setup will produce only marginal real life difference for me. Thus I would also describe it as a 'slightly better' AF since the domains where it is 'much' better do not really apply.

Crow, if they offered a MF only body for cheaper I would probably by that ^_^. I can not remember the last time I used AF in the first place.

 

[DzPhotography]

No, I'm not saying anything about 5D3. I'm just thowing out a question of what Canon may have to do to make 5D3 competive if anything in the rumored specification is true. By the few specification points on paper it seems to have nothing compared to D800 so 0.5 stop better in high ISO performace could have been something to compete with.

As I said earlier I don't think that the masses care about detail differences in image quality. Less than 1 stop in ISO performance is details to the general user, they just conclude "it's about the same, as it has always been".

Having a lower MP number regardless of actual performance will be competitive towards a large group of users. I think many are turned off by having to deal with 36 megapixel files. In other words, lower MP can be a feature in itself, especially since D800 lacks sRAW and mRAW modes.

I agree. Buying a D800 also means investing in HDD's or NAS...

 

[almograve]

This is good news! That would also mean PREORDER for me.
However, I'm really scarred about the pricing.

I'd thought that I would be getting a 24-70 II for the same price or maybe with IS and I've been prove 1000$ wrong and no IS!!!

What if they price it a good 1000$ more than the mkII!? This is even scarier when the rumors says that they might keep the mkII! I do not see them lowering the price of the mkII in order to place the mkIII at the original price......

This could kill our dreams very very quickly....

 

[almograve]

It seems clear to me that Canon is going with the "X" nomenclature for some new models. I expect a 5D3 with the rumored 22mp and a 5DX or possibly 3DX with huge mp count to match or surpass the Nikon D800. Or maybe the 22mp 5D replacement will be 5DX and then there will be another camera... like 5DXs or something with the big mp count. Anyway, I expect another "X"!

I don't understand how do you guys see the X has high MP when the 1DX is NOT.
X could mean low DEF high ISO
and I/II/III would be kept for high MP

Don't you think?

 

[DzPhotography]

It seems clear to me that Canon is going with the "X" nomenclature for some new models. I expect a 5D3 with the rumored 22mp and a 5DX or possibly 3DX with huge mp count to match or surpass the Nikon D800. Or maybe the 22mp 5D replacement will be 5DX and then there will be another camera... like 5DXs or something with the big mp count. Anyway, I expect another "X"!

I don't understand how do you guys see the X has high MP when the 1DX is NOT.
X could mean low DEF high ISO
and I/II/III would be kept for high MP

Don't you think?

+1 I agree

 

[Picsfor]

I do not see them lowering the price of the mkII in order to place the mkIII at the original price......

No, i see the price of the 5D2 being lowered to below £1500, maybe as low as £1300.
Why? Well, the 5D2 production line owes Canon absolutely nothing. Anything it is getting now is pure profit over and above. So, if it is still a crowd pleaser, why get rid of it?
How many times have we read people say 'they'd like a 5D2 but can only afford a 7d?'
And if the 5D3 sits around the £2200 mark on release, that is a huge extra outlay over a £1300 5D2. A win win all round for Canon. And once Canon get people onto FF, they then encourage the purchase of L lenses (even if it is the cheaper end of 17-40 f4L, 24-105 f4 ISL and 70-200 f4 ISL), not to mention external flash guns!

Almost every one wins

 

[awinphoto]

I do not see them lowering the price of the mkII in order to place the mkIII at the original price......

No, i see the price of the 5D2 being lowered to below £1500, maybe as low as £1300.
Why? Well, the 5D2 production line owes Canon absolutely nothing. Anything it is getting now is pure profit over and above. So, if it is still a crowd pleaser, why get rid of it?
How many times have we read people say 'they'd like a 5D2 but can only afford a 7d?'
And if the 5D3 sits around the £2200 mark on release, that is a huge extra outlay over a £1300 5D2. A win win all round for Canon. And once Canon get people onto FF, they then encourage the purchase of L lenses (even if it is the cheaper end of 17-40 f4L, 24-105 f4 ISL and 70-200 f4 ISL), not to mention external flash guns!

Almost every one wins

I could see this... finally a full frame is within everyones grasp, but there will be PLENTY of separation between the 2 and 3 in terms of camera quality

 

[unfocused]

A win win all round for Canon.

Unless they actually feel the need to turn a profit.

Well, the 5D2 production line owes Canon absolutely nothing. Anything it is getting now is pure profit over and above.

Unless it actually costs something to produce camera bodies, sensors and electronics.

How many times have we read people say 'they'd like a 5D2 but can only afford a 7d?'

About as often as people say they would like a BMW, but can only afford a Hyundai.

Don't mean to be mean or harsh, but really...products don't come free. If any manufacturer were able to make a 5DII-type camera and sell it for significantly less, why wouldn't they be doing it?

 

[wtlloyd]

5d2 is coming to an end, or Canon would never have dumped inventory the way they did in the USA this last December.

Doesn't matter if the tooling is paid for, it still costs to run production lines.

Consumers aren't total idiots about technology, and crazy house money is spent and gone forever. Don't expect swarms of average people to buy a $3K FF 30+ megapixel camera.

There WILL be massive internet P&M about the new Nikons when it's realized that that sensor resolution is not a playground for the clueless.

 

[Neeneko]

Don't mean to be mean or harsh, but really...products don't come free. If any manufacturer were able to make a 5DII-type camera and sell it for significantly less, why wouldn't they be doing it?

Well, for starters, only Canon has the 5D2.
Partly though we are talking about an oligopoly, not a true free market. The barrier to entry in this industry is so high that there are only a few players, and all of them go by about the same playbook; charge what the market will bare with a combination of low cost entry level equipment and premium priced professional equipment, even though the manufacturing costs are pretty close across the board. They charge based off how much the bodies are worth, not on how much they cost to make.

 

[unfocused]

Don't mean to be mean or harsh, but really...products don't come free. If any manufacturer were able to make a 5DII-type camera and sell it for significantly less, why wouldn't they be doing it?

Well, for starters, only Canon has the 5D2.
Partly though we are talking about an oligopoly, not a true free market. The barrier to entry in this industry is so high that there are only a few players, and all of them go by about the same playbook; charge what the market will bare with a combination of low cost entry level equipment and premium priced professional equipment, even though the manufacturing costs are pretty close across the board. They charge based off how much the bodies are worth, not on how much they cost to make.

Well, that makes my point. You are saying they "could" but "won't" I suggested they "can't," but regardless of the reason, it isn't happening and isn't likely to happen.

 

[wtlloyd]

No.

Production costs aren't the same. There's a scale factor of 100x between the Pro and consumer body production lines. A weather sealed FF pro body and a 1.6 crop consumer body have little in common beyond the nameplate.

Well, for starters, only Canon has the 5D2.
Partly though we are talking about an oligopoly, not a true free market. The barrier to entry in this industry is so high that there are only a few players, and all of them go by about the same playbook; charge what the market will bare with a combination of low cost entry level equipment and premium priced professional equipment, even though the manufacturing costs are pretty close across the board. They charge based off how much the bodies are worth, not on how much they cost to make.