Canon’s Retro Camera is Coming as the EOS R8 Mark II

[Canon Rumors]

I was thinking of much more than a passive ‘extension tube’ FD to RF lens adapter.

It’s all predicated on the RF lens/body electrical contact interfaces and their capabilities, which I have no knowledge of. My thoughts might not be possible to implement.

The Canon FD lens mount has 4 mechanical interfaces when mounted to a compatible camera body:

• A cylindrical ‘boss’ pin which indicates the lens’ maximum aperture and compensates for the small difference between a f-stop and T-stop.
• A ‘tab’ lever which moves in a semi-circular ‘race’ which follows the lens’ aperture selection ring. This moves a small ‘circle’ in the camera viewfinder for ‘match needle’ light metering. (On old mechanical FD lens cameras.) This tab lever could be coupled to a mechanical encoder followed by an analog-to-digital converter to transmit the lens’ aperture setting back to the camera.
• A very small pin which pops up when the lens’ aperture ring is moved past its minimum (smallest) setting by depressing a button on the ring to either a green circle (old) or green ‘A’ (new) index. This was used on the ‘electronic’ FD mount cameras (AE-1 etc.) to allow shutter-priority Automatic Exposure. More on this in (4)
• A much larger tab lever which stops the lens down to its selected aperture when the camera shutter button is pressed. This allows both focusing and light metering with the lens wide open (how quaint!) An electromechanical solenoid could be incorporated into the FD/RF adapter to provide the same function. For shutter priority AE, the position of the stop down lever at shutter release needs to follow what the camera decides is the correct exposure aperture.

If all these features can be incorporated into a ‘smart’ FD to RF lens adapter, that would make a world of difference when using existing vintage Canon FD lenses.

Lens correction profiles for vintage Canon FD lenses – a whole different topic!!!

Oh I see. Sorry about that. There'd be no way for any sort of communication with the lens itself. I guess it could be done with the adapter if you could select the lens and the adapter would do the work. There is a company that makes lens adapters that turn manual focus lenses into autofocus. I don't know off the top of my head if they do FD.

 

[blackcoffee17]

Disclaimer: video is just not my thing, so I'd rather not to pay for all this unused (by me at least) functionality.

This again.. Tell me how removing some video features would make the camera cheaper. The sensor still need to have fast readout to support 30FPS (the current R8), dual pixel AF, the EVF, etc. If they separate the R8 line into 2, that just means extra development and R&D cost and sales split between 2 models = higher cost per model. Removing some video codecs won't make the camera cheaper. Making an R8V only makes sense because of different ergonomics and the EVF can be dropped.

 

[blackcoffee17]

I wonder what improvements it would have over the original?

I have the R8 and the sensor is wonderful, no need to change that. I would love to see a joystick on the R8 II, the screen-touch AF point selection is slow and annoying sometimes.

 

[Old Man FL/FD]

Oh I see. Sorry about that. There'd be no way for any sort of communication with the lens itself. I guess it could be done with the adapter if you could select the lens and the adapter would do the work. There is a company that makes lens adapters that turn manual focus lenses into autofocus. I don't know off the top of my head if they do FD.

I very humbly suggest you’re not getting my main point regarding a conceptual ‘smart’ FD to RF lens adapter.

The 4 mechanical FD lens interfaces I discussed in my long post completely identify that particular lens to a FD lens compatible camera body, whether purely mechanical (F-1 (old), FTb, TLb) or ‘electronic’ (AE-1 and successors).

Of course, RF lens mount bodies do not have the corresponding mechanical FD lens interface on their side. I suggested adding both an encoder and positional solenoid to the smart FD to RF lens adapter to bridge the gap. This is basic electromechanical engineering.

The only thing in the way is the RF electrical body/lens contacts interface and their use specifications. Maybe yes, maybe no.

FD lens autofocus I won’t touch on.

 

[Del Paso]

Maybe strange...for many.
But for me, the R8 is the least tempting camera in Canon's FF range.
No IBIS, no dual SD/CF, very low definition EVF and a size requiring a body prosthesis if you have normal sized hands (like the EOS R and RP).
Sure, the sensor is excellent, the size appeals to many (me excluded), the price is very reasonable. As a backup, in case (very improbable!) my EOS R fails, ok!

 

[neuroanatomist]

Maybe strange...for many.
But for me, the R8 is the least tempting camera in Canon's FF range.
No IBIS, no dual SD/CF, very low definition EVF and a size requiring a body prosthesis if you have normal sized hands (like the EOS R and RP).
Sure, the sensor is excellent, the size appeals to many (me excluded), the price is very reasonable. As a backup, in case (very improbable!) my EOS R fails, ok!

I would not want it as my main camera. But IMO it’s great for travel, where the small size and weight are great benefits. Personally, when traveling I do mainly tripod shooting, and what handheld shooting I do is usually just pulling the camera from a shoulder bag, taking a few shots, then putting it back in the bag. That means ergonomics can take a back seat to portability.

 

[Exploreshootshare]

Before I actually see Canon deviating from their classic form factors, I expect an R8 housing with just a silver top. Remember, they did that with a special edition of the RP, too.

Wouldn't be too bad, tho:

View attachment 228961

I actually like that look

 

[Exploreshootshare]

For me, the R5 is the absolute perfect camera that checks all my boxes, but it leaves one thing to be desired: a small, compact and lightweight design. (I know the R5 I absolutely not designed to be like that). Enter, the R8. It is the greatest camera for hiking, very long walks and a ff camera when you have near to zero space to pack a camera. I don't use is that often, because the R5 mostly gets the call, but I really enjoy the weight when I use it.

What could a R8ii offer to tempt me:
- above all: keep the weight! (well, actually, that´s not a "tempt" but absolutely essential)
- include a joystick
- protective sensor curtain
- 1/8000 first curtain shutter
- an improved battery

I´m really not interested in a retro camera but if Canon manages to keep good ergonomics, add a joystick and improve the R8 with a few slews I might pick it up ALTHOUGH it is a retro camera and not BECAUSE it is a retro camera.

 

[Exploreshootshare]

Maybe strange...for many.
But for me, the R8 is the least tempting camera in Canon's FF range.
No IBIS, no dual SD/CF, very low definition EVF and a size requiring a body prosthesis if you have normal sized hands (like the EOS R and RP).

EOS R had no IBIS or dual cards slots as well. The EVF is better sure.

Sure, the sensor is excellent, the size appeals to many (me excluded), the price is very reasonable. As a backup, in case (very improbable!) my EOS R fails, ok!

I thought about keeping the EOS R as a back-up/ second cam when I got the EOS R5. But, the EOS R offers nothing the R5 doesn't have or do, the R8 does. The R8 has far superior AF compared to the EOS R, therefore I opted for the R8.

 

[Exploreshootshare]

Canon won't put a full mechanical shutter into the 8 series.

I think that wasn't what he had in mind. I believe he meant a "protective shutter curtain", the one that comes down in the EOS R/ R5/R6 when you turn the camera off. I really miss it as well, especially when traveling to the North Sea. It really eliminates switching a lens when being on a watt hike.


I can make to without a mechanical shutter, but I don't like having to switch to "silent mode" when shooting 1/8000 which happens occasionally when shooting with the 50mm F1.4 L VCM in daylight.

 

[m4ndr4ke]

I think that wasn't what he had in mind. I believe he meant a "protective shutter curtain", the one that comes down in the EOS R/ R5/R6 when you turn the camera off. I really miss it as well, especially when traveling to the North Sea. It really eliminates switching a lens when being on a watt hike.

That's not a protective curtain, that's the real shutter, and it's a lot more delicate than the sensor itself. I disable that functionality on every camera.

 

[Bob Howland]

I very humbly suggest you’re not getting my main point regarding a conceptual ‘smart’ FD to RF lens adapter.

The 4 mechanical FD lens interfaces I discussed in my long post completely identify that particular lens to a FD lens compatible camera body, whether purely mechanical (F-1 (old), FTb, TLb) or ‘electronic’ (AE-1 and successors).

Of course, RF lens mount bodies do not have the corresponding mechanical FD lens interface on their side. I suggested adding both an encoder and positional solenoid to the smart FD to RF lens adapter to bridge the gap. This is basic electromechanical engineering.

The only thing in the way is the RF electrical body/lens contacts interface and their use specifications. Maybe yes, maybe no.

FD lens autofocus I won’t touch on.

Well done. The last time I looked at the back of an FD lens was 1997. If you're feeling masochistic, you can explain the "New" FD mount, the bayonet mount that replaced the breech-lock mount.

 

[Del Paso]

EOS R had no IBIS or dual cards slots as well. The EVF is better sure.

I thought about keeping the EOS R as a back-up/ second cam when I got the EOS R5. But, the EOS R offers nothing the R5 doesn't have or do, the R8 does. The R8 has far superior AF compared to the EOS R, therefore I opted for the R8.

Understand!
But since I have 2 R5 II, I only need a backup camera remaining in my suitcase or car should one of these fail or get lost/stolen. It wouldn't make sense for me to buy an R8, offering not much more than the R which I already own. A better AF, that's correct, but, as I known myself, if an R5 II failed, I would, as soon as possible, replace it with an R5 or R5 II. Yodobashi, BIC , WEX, the FNAC, AC Foto, B&H etc... would be happy to help!
One single card is for me too big a risk. Besides, the price difference between an R8 and a used R6 II isn't big, and the R6 has only advantages (still speaking of a pure backup camera!). I don't like small cameras, My R immediately got an accessory body bottom plate (Meike).
Size does matter, a better EVF + top LCD even more!
Tastes and needs are sooo different!

 

[Uneternal]

What could a R8ii offer to tempt me:
- above all: keep the weight! (well, actually, that´s not a "tempt" but absolutely essential)
- include a joystick
- protective sensor curtain
- 1/8000 first curtain shutter
- an improved battery

You might be lucky with the weight, but as this is going to be an entry-level camera, Canon will swing the cripple hammer.

 

[esglord]

Love it

 

[blobmonster]

One retro feature I would love to see is a built in flash.

With a lightweight portable camera such as the R8 successor, I dont want to carry an extra flash. Some snapshots e.g. into a sunset, or to get catchlights/fill without reposing simply require one, and I dont see why there can be no full frame camera with a built in flash when there can also be small pancake lenses like the 16, 28 and perhaps a new 22...I've always had Canon full frame since ~2010 but I miss my 10D flash, and was very jealous of Nikon d700 users .

The video oriented version would work well for those who don't want a flash under any circumstances e.g. because they never learned to dial in minus fec for fill...

 

[esspy2]

I hope they can make the 24mm f/1.8 or the 35mm f/1.8 in retro form. Also I probably wouldn't mind if they made the 24-50mm in retro form, but I'd be happier if they released a 20-50mm f/4 though that was previously mentioned to be a power zoom lens. A smaller lens like the 16mm or the 50mm would also fit very nicely on a body like that

 

[eosuser1234]

I own the RF 28-70 F2L, EF 24-70 F4L, and RF 24-50mm f/4.5-6.3 IS STM. Three different lenses, and 3 very different price points. One is certainly a entry level kit lens, one was a semi pro kit lens, and one is a muscle building beast that I think is best in class among all brands. They all have their use and place. Lets be honest, no one makes a good compact entry level kit zoom for full frame. Step up, or just accept it for what it is.

 

[Dragon]

Also perhaps a lens adapter FD to RF with some feature not in the many currently out there.

Yes, a Canon branded FD adapter would be a nice addition. Also nice to add really good focus peaking with a sharpness (or coarsness) adjustment to make focusing easy with both sharp and not-so-sharp retro lenses. I use the FL 58 f/1.2 (with radioactive glass ) a fair bit and it is easier to focus on the R8 than on the R5, probably due to the larger pixels have better peaking sensitivity to lower lens sharpness.

 

[Dragon]

I hope they can make the 24mm f/1.8 or the 35mm f/1.8 in retro form. Also I probably wouldn't mind if they made the 24-50mm in retro form, but I'd be happier if they released a 20-50mm f/4 though that was previously mentioned to be a power zoom lens. A smaller lens like the 16mm or the 50mm would also fit very nicely on a body like that

I would vote for the 28mm f/2.8 in retro form. It is remarkably sharp across the frame and both small and inexpensive. Image stabilization (in the 24 and 35) is a nice feature, but not very "retro". The current R8 with the 28 attached is a great walk about combo.