Canon EOS 5D Mark IV Talk [CR2]

[Canon Rumors]

<p>There’s not a lot of information coming in about the replacement to the EOS 5D Mark III, which we expect to be announced no earlier than the spring of 2016. All signs point to it coming after the successor to the EOS-1D X.</p>
<p>The latest thing we’ve been told is that the camera would have a higher resolution than the EOS-1D X Mark II, which at last count would be in the area of 24mp. While the camera would remain a good videography DSLR, again we’re told that 4K is not part of the plans for the EOS 5D Mark IV.</p>
<p>We do wonder if we’re going to see another split in the EOS 5D line, with a lower megapixel option for ISO performance and something in the high 20mp’s in resolution for the masses. We’re seeing nothing that suggests we’ll get a cinema version of the EOS 5D Mark IV, but there continues to be hints of multiple cameras coming.</p>
<p>More to come…</p>

 

[Chaitanya]

So even in 2016 stupid arse Canon will not add 4k support to their camera that might be priced north of 2500$.

 

[expatinasia]

There’s not a lot of information coming in about the replacement to the EOS 5D Mark III, which we expect to be announced no earlier than the spring of 2016. All signs point to it coming after the successor to the EOS-1D X.

The latest thing we’ve been told is that the camera would have a higher resolution than the EOS-1D X Mark II, which at last count would be in the area of 24mp. While the camera would remain a good videography DSLR, again we’re told that 4K is not part of the plans for the EOS 5D Mark IV

This makes a lot of sense to me, the 5D Mark III has a higher res than the 1D X so no surprise that will continue.

The no 4K may well ruffle some feathers though.

 

[Canon Rumors]

So even in 2016 stupid arse Canon will not add 4k support to their camera that might be priced north of 2500$.

The vast majority of 5D buyers don't care about 4K video.

 

[Hardwire]

The vast majority of 5D buyers don't care about 4K video.

Ironically, as a 5D buyer (1x 5d2, 2x 5d3) I am disturbed by the lack of 4k....which is odd considering I have never shot video even once on any of these cameras.

I think it is a case of an expected level of technology, given this is a feature on consumer mobile/cell phones these days it seems counter intuitive that it is lacking from a £3000 camera....and therein is the issue.

 

[clarksbrother]

The vast majority of 5D buyers don't care about 4K video.

Based on what evidence?

I think it's more accurate to say that MAYBE and I emphasize MAYBE, the majority of 5D buyers don't care about video at all (but I would bet you it's pretty close to a 50/50 split).

Of those that do care about video, most certainly a majority will care about 4K, especially given the 4 year refresh cycle Canon is on. 4K is almost a necessity now. In 4 years, you'll be hard pressed to buy displays that aren't 4K. (Whether the delivery infrastructure is in place is another story entirely.) To not include 4K would likely cause many to turn away from the Canon ecosystem altogether. I've already got one foot out the door with a Panasonic GH4 (using a metabones speedbooster) since Canon has been so slow to come out with a successor with 4K.

Credentials: I work for one of the largest producers of TV content in the United States and work with much of the Canon ecosystem and the entire production process to air.

 

[Canon Rumors]

The vast majority of 5D buyers don't care about 4K video.

Based on what evidence?

I think it's more accurate to say that MAYBE and I emphasize MAYBE, the majority of 5D buyers don't care about video at all (but I would bet you it's pretty close to a 50/50 split).

Of those that do care about video, most certainly a majority will care about 4K, especially given the 4 year refresh cycle Canon is on. 4K is almost a necessity now. In 4 years, you'll be hard pressed to buy displays that aren't 4K. (Whether the delivery infrastructure is in place is another story entirely.) To not include 4K would likely cause many to turn away from the Canon ecosystem altogether. I've already got one foot out the door with a Panasonic GH4 (using a metabones speedbooster) since Canon has been so slow to come out with a successor with 4K.

Credentials: I work for one of the largest producers of TV content in the United States and work with much of the Canon ecosystem and the entire production process to air.

It's absolutely not a 50/50 split. There's plenty of market research that says 5D buyers don't care about 4K on DSLRs and that the % of sales of "5D" cameras for the primary purpose of video is single digits.

I don't understand why people want Canon to make a stills camera for videographers, the ergonomic hassles and additional cost to make it "usable". Let someone else make the 4K camera, most people are sticking Canon lenses on them anyway.

That said, I think we'll see more 4K oriented video products from Canon at NAB this year.

 

[expatinasia]

There's plenty of market research that says 5D buyers don't care about 4K on DSLRs and that the % of sales of "5D" cameras for the primary purpose of video is single digits.

We have to be careful here. Market research does not mean much unless it is substantiated, and even then can easily be manipulated.

If you ask me whether I bought the 1D X "for the primary purpose of video", then I would say no. However I have shot well over 800 videos on it. And 4K in the 1D X II is an absolute must.

I did not buy the 1D X for its video strengths, I bought it as it is the best sport camera on the market, but it also helps and can do my other business interests.

I doubt 5D users are that dissimilar. It's nice to have options, and considering we are hearing more and more about 8K, then 4K is a minimum.

 

[Canon Rumors]

There's plenty of market research that says 5D buyers don't care about 4K on DSLRs and that the % of sales of "5D" cameras for the primary purpose of video is single digits.

We have to be careful here. Market research does not mean much unless it is substantiated, and even then can easily be manipulated.

If you ask me whether I bought the 1D X "for the primary purpose of video", then I would say no. However I have shot well over 800 videos on it. And 4K in the 1D X II is an absolute must.

I did not buy the 1D X for its video strengths, I bought it as it is the best sport camera on the market, but it also helps and can do my other business interests.

I doubt 5D users are that dissimilar. It's nice to have options, and considering we are hearing more and more about 8K, then 4K is a minimum.

All points here are true, and 4K will be on the 1D X II because there's space for inputs and outputs.

Of my friends that shoot video for a living, not a single one of them uses a DSLR anymore, they've all moved on to Sony video stuff or Cinema EOS. Obviously this isn't a large sample size, but even talking to friends in the rental business, the growth has been in video gear and they don't see anywhere near as many DSLRs going out for video productions.

 

[Sabaki]

Can somebody throw a poll up simply asking who has shot more than 5 hours of video on any of their DSLRs?

Speaking strictly for myself: I shoot still images. What do I want from a new model? The ability to shoot better still images with a higher rate of keepers. So give me better base ISO performance, an AF system that increases my keeper rate by a few percent.

Sure, I want the menus to be intuitive, I want the ergonomics to be comfortable and practical and I really want durability of the highest order.

The guys shooting 4k more than likely already have a 4k rig. Or am I wrong?

 

[Maximilian]

Don't like that rumor esp. because it's [CR2].

Too many MP, again different sensors between 1DX2 and 5D4 ==> makes fab more expensive, could mean different DR and S/N behaviour and people whine about it (of course a flagship must stay something special...)

I can understand those yelling for 4K, although I'm not on that ship.
Remember what was one important reason that made the 5D2 so famous? Video?
And if the market share % (edit: between stills and video) are at single digits for the 5D3 could there be any other reason but those people just moving the upgrade path to Cine EOS. Could it be, that the other way and there are cheaper, better solutions, e.g. Sony and Panasonic?

Not sure what to think about it but "Hope, it won't come true..." :-\

 

[ajfotofilmagem]

I see that many would NOT USE 4K in a future 5D Mark IV.But I would feel inferior people when someone says:

"My cell phone can record 4K, and your camera can not do ..." 8)

It is a kind of small dick complex.

 

[clarksbrother]

There's plenty of market research that says 5D buyers don't care about 4K on DSLRs and that the % of sales of "5D" cameras for the primary purpose of video is single digits.

I think you misread; note that I said, video, not 4K. I also said that somewhere around 50% of users CARE about video, I said nothing of primary purpose. I would agree that the primary purpose of probably 9 out of 10 5D buyers is still. But video most certainly plays a role. For many people, 4K is a bit of a litmus test for manufacturers. It's a clear indication that they are willing to innovate and provide the end user with the best feature set it can. Think of it like purchasing an expensive car. If you're spending $60,000 on a new car, and it doesn't have heated seats, LED headlights and satellite navigation, no matter how good the engine/transmission are, you're going to ask yourself what the heck the manufacturer was thinking. That car manufacturer, just like Canon, is not a market provider of one. Yes, their product may in fact serve the needs of the consumer quite well. The problem is, someone else may do it better, for the same price. (With heated seats...)

I don't understand why people want Canon to make a stills camera for videographers, the ergonomic hassles and additional cost to make it "usable". Let someone else make the 4K camera, most people are sticking Canon lenses on them anyway.

That said, I think we'll see more 4K oriented video products from Canon at NAB this year.

I don't think anyone is asking that. The advantage of the 5D series is that it takes great stills, and you can still capture some video that will stack up against the best of what's on the market - it may not be nearly as easy to do that, but the capability is there. As for the, "Let someone else make the 4K camera" part, I know many company executives across a broad spectrum of industries that would be HORRIFIED by taking that stance in any market (I'm not referring to 4K, I just mean the ethos of, "Let someone else eat our lunch."

 

[mrsfotografie]

So even in 2016 stupid arse Canon will not add 4k support to their camera that might be priced north of 2500$.

The vast majority of 5D buyers don't care about 4K video.

Speaking for myself, I don't care for video and rather have my DSLR focused on stills photography.

 

[PhotographyFirst]

I think serious video guys who want the 5D4 to do video would rather have pimped-out 1080 and not held-back 4K. I could see Canon going that route. Or maybe Canon has done the math and determined that the loss in 5D4 sales over video would not be as much as the lost sales in their Cinema sales if the cheaper 5D4 did amazing 4K?

I've read many comments from people who say they must have 4K video, but give no mention at all to wanting less compression, more color depth, or higher bit rates. To them, 4K is 4K and none of those other things matter at all.

 

[Loswr]

...the majority of 5D buyers don't care about video at all (but I would bet you it's pretty close to a 50/50 split).

Credentials: I work for one of the largest producers of TV content in the United States and work with much of the Canon ecosystem and the entire production process to air.

I work for one of the largest pharmaceutical companies in the world, so I think most people thinks drugs are good. I suppose my perspective might be a little bit biased, mmmmkay?

 

[expatinasia]

There's plenty of market research that says 5D buyers don't care about 4K on DSLRs and that the % of sales of "5D" cameras for the primary purpose of video is single digits.

We have to be careful here. Market research does not mean much unless it is substantiated, and even then can easily be manipulated.

If you ask me whether I bought the 1D X "for the primary purpose of video", then I would say no. However I have shot well over 800 videos on it. And 4K in the 1D X II is an absolute must.

I did not buy the 1D X for its video strengths, I bought it as it is the best sport camera on the market, but it also helps and can do my other business interests.

I doubt 5D users are that dissimilar. It's nice to have options, and considering we are hearing more and more about 8K, then 4K is a minimum.

All points here are true, and 4K will be on the 1D X II because there's space for inputs and outputs.

Of my friends that shoot video for a living, not a single one of them uses a DSLR anymore, they've all moved on to Sony video stuff or Cinema EOS. Obviously this isn't a large sample size, but even talking to friends in the rental business, the growth has been in video gear and they don't see anywhere near as many DSLRs going out for video productions.

The 1D X is a different beast. I need it for sports, but I have many business interests and use it for video too.

The 5D series is more mainstream, and while many may not use the video functions, at least they are there. I would be astounded if Canon left out 4K in the 5D Mark IV. In fact, I could almost see Sony paying them to do so.

Is it Rio Olympics or the next FIFA World Cup which will be shot in 8k?

 

[clarksbrother]

I've read many comments from people who say they must have 4K video, but give no mention at all to wanting less compression, more color depth, or higher bit rates. To them, 4K is 4K and none of those other things matter at all.

The thing is, those things are not mutually exclusive. Much of what you mention is contingent on a faster processor. The question is, will/is Canon spending the time to develop the hardware necessary to do that. Honestly, if there is no 4K, that may be why. Panasonic offers V-Log and 200mb bit rates in a camera a third of the price - but I am guessing (I have no info on this, so please correct me if I'm wrong), that they are using an "off the shelf" processor to handle video/photo whereas Canon develops their own from scratch with the Digic.

The thing is, with the features that the Magic Lantern firmware was able to construct with a small team of part time developers doing this in their free time, makes you question what Canon is doing when it comes to developing features/processing capabilities.

 

[clarksbrother]

...the majority of 5D buyers don't care about video at all (but I would bet you it's pretty close to a 50/50 split).

Credentials: I work for one of the largest producers of TV content in the United States and work with much of the Canon ecosystem and the entire production process to air.

I work for one of the largest pharmaceutical companies in the world, so I think most people thinks drugs are good. I suppose my perspective might be a little bit biased, mmmmkay?

Haha, fair enough - that said, I feel it's important people post a little background otherwise it's tough to see the perspective/angle people are coming from.

 

[CanoKnight]

The vast majority of 5D buyers don't care about 4K video.

The real purpose of 4k video is not for producing video in 4k but for producing video in 2k (1080p) that looks much better than video shot in 2k.