I guess the other regions figured this update was pretty weak and they'd rather just wait for the real deal with the 70D sensor and bumped up specs to make trying to give it a real go worthwhile.
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Canon EOS M2 Gets Official in Asia, Not Coming to the USA or Europe?
- Thread starter Canon Rumors
- Start date
Re: Canon EOS M2 Gets Official
not everyone always runs around with a flash, in particular when you are trying to be more compact as in this case, and having it for the odd shot where you suddenly could use a little fill or whatnot is a nice thing to have
Zv said:
not everyone always runs around with a flash, in particular when you are trying to be more compact as in this case, and having it for the odd shot where you suddenly could use a little fill or whatnot is a nice thing to have
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justsomedude said:
It'll be fun to put these comments in a forum "time capsule" and then read them back in a few years. From the sound of them, Canon will be smoldering wreckage by then.
More than likely (in my opinion), Canon is making strategic, market-driven decisions that will help maintain its dominant position as an imaging solutions company. Such decisions will never please all segments of the market alike. It seems more probable to me that we're missing some key pieces of information that are driving Canon's product decisions than that management suddenly became drunk on profits and market share and are driving the company into the ground.
To those who think otherwise, you might consider A) Applying for a management position at Canon, or B) Buying stock in Nikon and Sony (should be a bargain right now). For the latter, you make your money on the "buy", right? Right?
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Re: Canon EOS M2 Gets Official
At first, it looked like there's a USB symbol on it, so my guess would have been a flap to cover the USB port. I've never seen one on the top before, though, so on closer look, I think that's a focal plane symbol and the rectangle is just from assembly of that part of the body.
Any other guesses?
Zlyden said:
At first, it looked like there's a USB symbol on it, so my guess would have been a flap to cover the USB port. I've never seen one on the top before, though, so on closer look, I think that's a focal plane symbol and the rectangle is just from assembly of that part of the body.
Any other guesses?
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Woody said:
I don't think your posts are contradictory, despite your opening word - Canon arrived late with an overpriced, inferior product which didn't sell until they improved the focus speed and slashed the price dramatically. How many here would have bought it without the price drop? I certainly wouldn't have. The new M won't have that price advantage any more.
Do you (or anyone else) know how the M sells in Asia relative to other mirrorless cameras before vs after the price drop (assuming there was a comparable price drop there)? It's unclear what its appeal would be to anyone relative to the competition (M43, Fuji, Sony etc.), unless you're someone with Canon lenses who doesn't want to jump ship, doesn't mind the extra bulk of using them on the M, and thinks the SL1 is too big.
Canon, of course, can say there's no point selling small mirrorless cameras in the West if it can make more money from selling dslrs there. Those of us who like mirrorless (regardless of size) are lucky that several of the companies who specialize in them don't have that choice and, instead of retreating, seem instead (perhaps foolishly) to be trying even harder (much harder than Canon and Nikon, it seems) to make their mirrorless bodies even more appealing. They're the only new cameras released this year that have grabbed my interest, at any rate. (If one of Canon's rumored new FF cameras happened to be mirrorless (big would be fine with me) and with in-body IS, I would happily buy one, but it doesn't seem likely.)
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:'(
This is so photographically depressing... I'm going to go home today and stare at my little M and the 2 lenses and filters I have and think, 'What could have been..'
Then I'll file my divorce papers from a 10 year Canon relationship, and start flirting with Olympus, Panasonic and Fuji..
I just don't get it?! How do people not realize how freaking cool the mirrorless system is?! Why the heck would you WANT to walk around with a half ass DSLR (Rebel) that is big and bulky compared to an M or EP5, or GX7? I hike/Mtn bike A LOT and that M has gone EVERYWHERE with me! My 40D just sat at home, collecting dust for like 5 years until I sold it.
SO STUPID CANON!!!!! (smashes things in office and cries like a spoiled baby...)
This is so photographically depressing... I'm going to go home today and stare at my little M and the 2 lenses and filters I have and think, 'What could have been..'
Then I'll file my divorce papers from a 10 year Canon relationship, and start flirting with Olympus, Panasonic and Fuji..
I just don't get it?! How do people not realize how freaking cool the mirrorless system is?! Why the heck would you WANT to walk around with a half ass DSLR (Rebel) that is big and bulky compared to an M or EP5, or GX7? I hike/Mtn bike A LOT and that M has gone EVERYWHERE with me! My 40D just sat at home, collecting dust for like 5 years until I sold it.
SO STUPID CANON!!!!! (smashes things in office and cries like a spoiled baby...)
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PerfectSavage
Shoot more, read blogs less...Just keep shooting.
I wouldn't be surprised, they've sold a TON of the SL-1s, but the original M was a bust here and pretty much everywhere except Asia. What would sell MUCH better here in the US would be 2 more prime pancakes, perhaps a 24mm, 20mm or 35mm to sell alongside the SL-1. Give me that SL-1 DSLR feature set and smaller EF mounts any day over purchasing an entirely separate system and lenses.
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I was going to purchase EF-M 11-22 IS STM soon, but if the Canon don't want to make more lenses and leave the system with small enhancements just for Asian market I'm not quite sure...
Maybe it's time to look for another mirrorless system before I got too deep in hopeless system.
Maybe it's time to look for another mirrorless system before I got too deep in hopeless system.
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noncho said:
Don't cut your nose off to spite your face. You'll not find a better UWA zoom than the 11-22, especially given the price. In fact, for most, the lens plus camera is cheaper than competing lenses alone.
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dilbert said:
Well, (without being a racist) I suppose that:
1) Asian people are more fascinated by 'latest hi-tech things' and change/buy them more frequently than European and American consumers who prefer 'reliable long-time investments'.
2) Asian people like to travel abroad and use 'package' vacation type with a lot of organized excursions (e.g. a big bus full of tourists from Japan is a usual thing anywhere in the world), so they like light travel cameras.
3) Americans and Europeans, on the other side, either prefer to work in their sweatshop offices all year round (without going to other countries until they are 65 and too old to work) making only pictures of their barbecues, dogs and kids, or travel by car to places nearby, or have sea & beach family type vacations -- in all these cases camera size and weight do not matter that much.
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dilbert said:Zv said:Proffarm said:
Why DSLR over ML? Let me spell it out for you.
E.R.G.O.N.O.M.I.C.S
So why the big difference between Asia and the USA/Europe?
Because (without being racist), people from Asia are generally more petite than those from Europe and especially those from the USA. Or at least that's how I reconcile it. So it isn't that the EOS-M or M2 or mirrorless are necessarily worse in ergonomics but that (for example) the hand size of people is not the same the world over and that determines how usable a camera is or isn't for many.
When you use a 7D compared to an EOS M or any other ML body you notice that some things are just way easier to do without thinking on the 7D. For example - changing ISO on the fly. Can you do that on a M? Meh not really. Holding a DSLR is more stable than the M no matter what the hand size.
Japanese men have same size of hands as rest of the world. Some of them have bigger hands than me. It's a myth that they have small hands. I think the reason for the small camera is space. Pure and simple. Space is a commodity here. If you live in Tokyo every square inch of your apartment is precious. Trains and buses are packed, especially during peak seasons like Obon, and Golden Week and the Sakura blossoms. People want to travel light and save space. A camera that fits in the pocket means no extra camera bag.
There could also be a cultural thing about not wanting to stand out and blending in etc. I see that a lot. However, I have only seen two other people with EOS Ms in Japan over the last year. I've seen a hundred thousand Nikon, Canon and Sony DSLRs though! (Big camera must take good pictures!) Holy hell during festivals and stuff everyone has a DSLR round their neck. They love their cameras as do I! And no ones going to steal it either!
So I think that making the camera smaller isn't just because they're Asian.
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If there is one clear, unbroken trend in the history of "photon-capturing imaging" then it is "ever higher image quality with ever smaller, lighter, more portable, less obtrusive, less complicated gear".
This has been going on all the time since its very invention. And it is still ongoing. Nothing will stop or reverse it. Every step there were hold-outs and earlier generation/larger gear remained in use by a few and/or for small, specialized niches and imaging tasks.
In a few years time we will look back at today's "pro" DSLRs the same way we look at those brick-sized "mobile" phones from only 15-20 years ago. "Did we really use these cludgy devices?"
Recently we passed one major "size category" transition point - the move from dedicated "compact" cameras to multi-tasking mobile devices for "consumer grade" image quality and "consumer image-capturing tasks" ... although both "artists" and "working pro's" have demonstrated that much more can also be achieved using mobile imaging devices.
Next transition point immediately ahead is the the move from the previous-generation concept of mechanical-analogue mirrorslapping SLRs to fully digital mirrorless cameras that will soon deliver superior image capture and image quality, also at the professional" level. Plus native, unobstructed "convergence" of stils and moving images.
It is still a relatively "MINOR" point in development ... while camera bodies will shrink considerably in size, only lenses in the (overall) most frequently used diagonal angle of view range ... from about 84° [24mm focal length on "FF" 24x36 image area] to about 23° [approx. 90mm FL] can be made (somewhat) smaller for mirrorless cameras with shorter flange distance. High image quality, reasonably fast zoom lenses and "longer" tele lenses [with less than about 23° diag. angle of view] will remain as large as they currently are. On the other hand, only a minority of all photographic tasks absolutely dmeand those lenses! ;-) For many situations and photogs, they are infrequently used but still "nice to have" tools for a few specific situations and/or creative effects.
The next MAJOR revolution in size of imaging gear will occur, if/once glass optics are replaced by new technologies yielding even better image quality with smaller gear. Whatever it may be [e.g. improved "liquid-filled variable lenses", lightfield or holographic concepts, ... ] and whenever it may occur. That will yield "implantable-size imaging gear". No matter whether we'd ever want this or not. ;D
This has been going on all the time since its very invention. And it is still ongoing. Nothing will stop or reverse it. Every step there were hold-outs and earlier generation/larger gear remained in use by a few and/or for small, specialized niches and imaging tasks.
In a few years time we will look back at today's "pro" DSLRs the same way we look at those brick-sized "mobile" phones from only 15-20 years ago. "Did we really use these cludgy devices?"
Recently we passed one major "size category" transition point - the move from dedicated "compact" cameras to multi-tasking mobile devices for "consumer grade" image quality and "consumer image-capturing tasks" ... although both "artists" and "working pro's" have demonstrated that much more can also be achieved using mobile imaging devices.
Next transition point immediately ahead is the the move from the previous-generation concept of mechanical-analogue mirrorslapping SLRs to fully digital mirrorless cameras that will soon deliver superior image capture and image quality, also at the professional" level. Plus native, unobstructed "convergence" of stils and moving images.
It is still a relatively "MINOR" point in development ... while camera bodies will shrink considerably in size, only lenses in the (overall) most frequently used diagonal angle of view range ... from about 84° [24mm focal length on "FF" 24x36 image area] to about 23° [approx. 90mm FL] can be made (somewhat) smaller for mirrorless cameras with shorter flange distance. High image quality, reasonably fast zoom lenses and "longer" tele lenses [with less than about 23° diag. angle of view] will remain as large as they currently are. On the other hand, only a minority of all photographic tasks absolutely dmeand those lenses! ;-) For many situations and photogs, they are infrequently used but still "nice to have" tools for a few specific situations and/or creative effects.
The next MAJOR revolution in size of imaging gear will occur, if/once glass optics are replaced by new technologies yielding even better image quality with smaller gear. Whatever it may be [e.g. improved "liquid-filled variable lenses", lightfield or holographic concepts, ... ] and whenever it may occur. That will yield "implantable-size imaging gear". No matter whether we'd ever want this or not. ;D
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Zlyden said:
1. may be right, and, for all I know, so is 2. But it's also pretty clear that more than a few Asians don't mind traveling with large dslrs - my office is on Independence Mall in Philadelphia, which receives busloads of tourists every morning. dslrs seem almost as common as smaller cameras/iphones/ipads, and I don't think all that many of the small cameras are anything better than standard point-and-shoots. For whatever that's worth.
As for the ergonomic argument, it may well be that some find any mirrorless camera too small (though one of Panasonics is more-or-less dslr-size and shape), but in other respects they're not all the same - one could easily conclude that some, such as the two Olympus OM-Ds, are even easier to handle than dslrs.
The situation in the West may simply be a matter of price: the best mirrorless cameras cost more than most aps-c cameras and don't really yield better results (in many cases, probably not as good), and just about every review points this out. They may be smaller, and they may, in some cases, focus more accurately and faster and be easier to use, but those differences likely don't matter much to most camera buyers. As far as I'm concerned, the only advantages the M has over a Rebel are its fire-sale price and the cute little 22mm lens. Unless Canon makes more, similarly small lenses, the size advantage is greatly reduced when you attach any other lens (except perhaps the 40mm pancake). All that being so, and given its poor performance, it doesn't seem surprising that people bought dslrs instead of Ms and that Canon seem unwilling to market a marginally updated M that costs $700-800, i.e., more than most Rebels.
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Here in the good old u.s of a, bigger is better and more is better. People like hummers, escalades, and ram trucks with v12 engines baby. A DSLR is bigger and it has more knobs so its better.
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sdsr said:
I looked at EOS M reviews and discussions for more than a year and had some doubts about 'do I really need this camera?'.
The the deal-making points for its final purchase were:
1) My wife's complain (after here trip to some press conference in Vienna) that she needs a small camera with wide angle (much wider than 28 mm of her PowerShot G equivalence) to make pictures of Cathedrals and other European architecture.
2) Review of EF-M 11-22 I saw two days later on DPReview.
3) Opportunity to get 'whole EOS M system' for less than $1500
= EOS M with 18-55 and 90EX flash for ~ $400 (I had some crazy ideas to use this 90EX later on 6D 'for a spark of fill', while 270EX I already had should fit EOS M better) + EF-M 11-22 ~ $450 + EF-M 22 ~ $150 + leather hand strap and 'bottom part' case, blends for 18-55 and 22 (still can't find a blend for 11-22 in our parts), two extra 3rd party batteries, some Kata bag (for camera and extra lens) + other stuff.
4) Ability to mount my existing canon lenses with EF-EOS M adapter (that I still plan to purchase sometime in the future).
5) Curiosity as to what happened to Canon's APS-C cameras and sensors in past 6 years (since the time of 400D/XTi, I still own).
In result: My wife is happy with it. Me too
PS: If the price for EOS M + kit lens was not $400, but $800... I guess that I would purchase it too (but with much less enthusiasm, and probably I would go for 'body only' + EF-M 11-22 option).
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