Getting sharp pictures with 7DII - need advice please

[arbitrage]

My 7D2 has also had inconsistent focusing issues. It has been to Canon service once and they found no problems. Some days it seems really good, other days it hardly hits. Mostly I've narrowed it down to a very "nervous" AI Servo drive. Even shooting a static subject in AI Servo you can visually see the focus racking back and forth by the smallest amounts and that seems to lead to a very inconsistent tack sharp hit rate.

Anyways, in the past 2 months I've found two excellent solutions to the 7D2 issues:

1) I bought a 5DSR....the focus system works (just like my 5D3 and 1DX)...only problem is the slow FPS for birds and wildlife action.

2) I bought a D500 and 200-500 lens. I've never experienced the focus consistency that I get from this camera in any Canon camera...only my 1DX is close. Having 20 shot bursts all in focus handholding from a kayak for BIF is something even the 1DX couldn't pull off. And this is with a fairly cheap Nikon lens compared to all the exotic Canon lenses I own and use regularly.

So those are my two newest solutions to my 7D2 headaches. My kit is now 5DSR, 1DX and D500. 7D2 will be sold soon.

 

[AlanF]

My 7D2 has also had inconsistent focusing issues. It has been to Canon service once and they found no problems. Some days it seems really good, other days it hardly hits. Mostly I've narrowed it down to a very "nervous" AI Servo drive. Even shooting a static subject in AI Servo you can visually see the focus racking back and forth by the smallest amounts and that seems to lead to a very inconsistent tack sharp hit rate.

Anyways, in the past 2 months I've found two excellent solutions to the 7D2 issues:

1) I bought a 5DSR....the focus system works (just like my 5D3 and 1DX)...only problem is the slow FPS for birds and wildlife action.

2) I bought a D500 and 200-500 lens. I've never experienced the focus consistency that I get from this camera in any Canon camera...only my 1DX is close. Having 20 shot bursts all in focus handholding from a kayak for BIF is something even the 1DX couldn't pull off. And this is with a fairly cheap Nikon lens compared to all the exotic Canon lenses I own and use regularly.

So those are my two newest solutions to my 7D2 headaches. My kit is now 5DSR, 1DX and D500. 7D2 will be sold soon.

What's the 200-500mm like? Some reviews have it very sharp from 200-500mm but I have met a guide whose lens was soft above 350mm and have found several reviews complaining that copies were soft. Also the AF is variously claimed to be fast or slow.

 

[norb]

Same problem with soft pictures and the 7d II. In my case it looks like it is a vibration-problem specially at high-frame-rates.

The 7dII has the same pixel-density as a 5Ds, so the 20 MP at APS are the same as 50 MP at fullframe. I think there is a reason, why they redesigned the mirror-box in the 5Ds.

If I shoot my 7D II in silent-mode , all my picures are sharp. It is annoying, but it helps.

 

[pwp]

This makes me feel like one of the lucky ones, I consistently get absolutely cracking sharp shots with the 7DII which I mostly use with the 70-200 f/2.8isII with IS on and never using live view, mostly hand held and sometimes with monopod. If I'm not getting nice sharp shots either in one-shot or servo focus the likely reason tends to be that my shutter speed is too slow. OP you haven't mentioned what shutter speed at what focal length you're using. That will have a huge bearing on analyzing your issue.

-pw

 

[YuengLinger]

My 7D2 has also had inconsistent focusing issues. It has been to Canon service once and they found no problems. Some days it seems really good, other days it hardly hits. Mostly I've narrowed it down to a very "nervous" AI Servo drive. Even shooting a static subject in AI Servo you can visually see the focus racking back and forth by the smallest amounts and that seems to lead to a very inconsistent tack sharp hit rate.

Anyways, in the past 2 months I've found two excellent solutions to the 7D2 issues:

1) I bought a 5DSR....the focus system works (just like my 5D3 and 1DX)...only problem is the slow FPS for birds and wildlife action.

2) I bought a D500 and 200-500 lens. I've never experienced the focus consistency that I get from this camera in any Canon camera...only my 1DX is close. Having 20 shot bursts all in focus handholding from a kayak for BIF is something even the 1DX couldn't pull off. And this is with a fairly cheap Nikon lens compared to all the exotic Canon lenses I own and use regularly.

So those are my two newest solutions to my 7D2 headaches. My kit is now 5DSR, 1DX and D500. 7D2 will be sold soon.

Why are you shooting STATIC subjects with AI Servo?

 

[East Wind Photography]

My 7D2 has also had inconsistent focusing issues. It has been to Canon service once and they found no problems. Some days it seems really good, other days it hardly hits. Mostly I've narrowed it down to a very "nervous" AI Servo drive. Even shooting a static subject in AI Servo you can visually see the focus racking back and forth by the smallest amounts and that seems to lead to a very inconsistent tack sharp hit rate.

Anyways, in the past 2 months I've found two excellent solutions to the 7D2 issues:

1) I bought a 5DSR....the focus system works (just like my 5D3 and 1DX)...only problem is the slow FPS for birds and wildlife action.

2) I bought a D500 and 200-500 lens. I've never experienced the focus consistency that I get from this camera in any Canon camera...only my 1DX is close. Having 20 shot bursts all in focus handholding from a kayak for BIF is something even the 1DX couldn't pull off. And this is with a fairly cheap Nikon lens compared to all the exotic Canon lenses I own and use regularly.

So those are my two newest solutions to my 7D2 headaches. My kit is now 5DSR, 1DX and D500. 7D2 will be sold soon.

Why are you shooting STATIC subjects with AI Servo?

Exactly. I set the DOF preview button to toggle ai servo and one shot. Makes that transition seamless.

 

[Valvebounce]

Hi Arbitrage.
I'm no expert, but I'd say that would be expected behaviour from a tracking setting, trying to work out which way the target is moving (going to start moving). Despite your knowledge that it is a fixed static target, the camera doesn't know things, it has to calculate them.
To me this is a bit like saying my camera is not tracking the leaves swaying in a gentle breeze when set to one shot, it is expected behaviour.
I'm sorry you had issues, I find my 7DII focus system far more reliable than my 7D, however I'm finding that my improving technique and understanding have led to better shots from both cameras! That is not meant to suggest that it is your technique causing your issues, just my technique was causing some of mine.
Glad you have found a solution to your problem.

Cheers, Graham.

Even shooting a static subject in AI Servo you can visually see the focus racking back and forth by the smallest amounts and that seems to lead to a very inconsistent tack sharp hit rate.

 

[dpc]

Now I'm a bit nervous. I don't have a 7DMII, but I do have a 7D. I note some people have problems with soft images using that camera. I've had the 7D for four years and have had absolutely no auto focus issues with it. The only soft images it's produced have been the result of user error on my part. I was planning to buy a MII this summer. I bought a lens instead but was hoping to get the MII sometime within the coming year. Now I'm having second thoughts. I guess the question is how ubiquitous the soft picture problem is. You can't necessarily tell from internet forums. Still, I'm wondering what I should do. I don't think the 80D is quite the camera I want, although I remain open. I use my 7D for wildlife, including BIF and for macro work. I use a 5DMII for everything else. I certainly have no plans to look for a camera from another manufacturer, although the Nikon D500 looks interesting. I suppose I may just hang onto the 7D until it implodes. Why change horses while the original is running well?

 

[East Wind Photography]

One thing to note is that unless you are using a tripod, a hand held static shot will still move forward or backward a bit due to body movement. A similar shot in one shot mode will end up being OOF due to the same motion. Servo af still tries to compensate for that and will appear to be hunting.

My 7d2 on a tripod does not hunt on static subjects in servo mode.

One way to avoid such issues for hand held shots is to stop your lens down to increase dof.

I suspect that nikons af may not be as sensitive as canons and therefore the motion from body movement is ignored...but does little to improve the image quality.

Only dof can improve the error due to that.

 

[picturefan]

Now I got some pics to show to you, it´s a bullfinch, not a polar bear, but it shows (imho) the same thing: some softness and it is nowhere sharp. It´s 100-400II at tele, f5.6, using a sandbag, liveview.

As another one wrote, for me this is not worth 1300bugs (cam) and 1900bugs (lens). Get the same quality when using the old 70-300 on 450D.

Looking forward to your expertise.

 

[picturefan]

This is another sample-pic:
100-400II @ 400mm, f5.6, iso 400, tripod, is-off, liveview (10x magnify), shutterspeed 1/125-1/250 more or less
"Focus" on the fruit in the middle.

 

[picturefan]

Same problem with soft pictures and the 7d II. In my case it looks like it is a vibration-problem specially at high-frame-rates.

The 7dII has the same pixel-density as a 5Ds, so the 20 MP at APS are the same as 50 MP at fullframe. I think there is a reason, why they redesigned the mirror-box in the 5Ds.

If I shoot my 7D II in silent-mode , all my picures are sharp. It is annoying, but it helps.

Will also try to shoot in silent mode to find out if it is a shaking because of shutter(speed).
Do you have the softness in MF or liveview also?

 

[monsieur_elegante]

Same problem with soft pictures and the 7d II. In my case it looks like it is a vibration-problem specially at high-frame-rates.

The 7dII has the same pixel-density as a 5Ds, so the 20 MP at APS are the same as 50 MP at fullframe. I think there is a reason, why they redesigned the mirror-box in the 5Ds.

If I shoot my 7D II in silent-mode , all my picures are sharp. It is annoying, but it helps.

Will also try to shoot in silent mode to find out if it is a shaking because of shutter(speed).
Do you have the softness in MF or liveview also?

I thought about this in the past and personally believes I get a higher percentage of sharp pictures with silent mode -- but have not tested this theory to a sufficient extent, so I will be testing this out more in the next couple of days as well. However, this still wouldn't explain why I get perfectly sharp pictures at close distances regardless of shooting mode (I usually leave it on high speed continuous @ 10fps).

If we document this well and arrive at some consensus as to the exact symptom of our 7DII problems, I wonder if people would be interested in drafting a group letter to Canon. Granted, I understand that not everyone here is CanonUSA/NorthAmerica. I just wonder if Canon Services will take 7DII service requests a bit more seriously when they see that there is some kind of trend exhibited among a large group of 7DII users.

 

[picturefan]

Same problem with soft pictures and the 7d II. In my case it looks like it is a vibration-problem specially at high-frame-rates.

The 7dII has the same pixel-density as a 5Ds, so the 20 MP at APS are the same as 50 MP at fullframe. I think there is a reason, why they redesigned the mirror-box in the 5Ds.

If I shoot my 7D II in silent-mode , all my picures are sharp. It is annoying, but it helps.

Will also try to shoot in silent mode to find out if it is a shaking because of shutter(speed).
Do you have the softness in MF or liveview also?

I thought about this in the past and personally believes I get a higher percentage of sharp pictures with silent mode -- but have not tested this theory to a sufficient extent, so I will be testing this out more in the next couple of days as well. However, this still wouldn't explain why I get perfectly sharp pictures at close distances regardless of shooting mode (I usually leave it on high speed continuous @ 10fps).

If we document this well and arrive at some consensus as to the exact symptom of our 7DII problems, I wonder if people would be interested in drafting a group letter to Canon. Granted, I understand that not everyone here is CanonUSA/NorthAmerica. I just wonder if Canon Services will take 7DII service requests a bit more seriously when they see that there is some kind of trend exhibited among a large group of 7DII users.

My homework for the weekend will be: check 7DII with different optics and shutter modes to prove the thesis: picture softness - also in liveview (not only a af-problem) - in greater distances shots (more than 10m) - and affected lens-combos 100-400 and 70-200.
Any supplements?
Aim should be to do a "diagnosis by exclusion" and then check with the service compartment.

 

[monsieur_elegante]

Same problem with soft pictures and the 7d II. In my case it looks like it is a vibration-problem specially at high-frame-rates.

The 7dII has the same pixel-density as a 5Ds, so the 20 MP at APS are the same as 50 MP at fullframe. I think there is a reason, why they redesigned the mirror-box in the 5Ds.

If I shoot my 7D II in silent-mode , all my picures are sharp. It is annoying, but it helps.

Will also try to shoot in silent mode to find out if it is a shaking because of shutter(speed).
Do you have the softness in MF or liveview also?

I thought about this in the past and personally believes I get a higher percentage of sharp pictures with silent mode -- but have not tested this theory to a sufficient extent, so I will be testing this out more in the next couple of days as well. However, this still wouldn't explain why I get perfectly sharp pictures at close distances regardless of shooting mode (I usually leave it on high speed continuous @ 10fps).

If we document this well and arrive at some consensus as to the exact symptom of our 7DII problems, I wonder if people would be interested in drafting a group letter to Canon. Granted, I understand that not everyone here is CanonUSA/NorthAmerica. I just wonder if Canon Services will take 7DII service requests a bit more seriously when they see that there is some kind of trend exhibited among a large group of 7DII users.

My homework for the weekend will be: check 7DII with different optics and shutter modes to prove the thesis: picture softness - also in liveview (not only a af-problem) - in greater distances shots (more than 10m) - and affected lens-combos 100-400 and 70-200.
Any supplements?
Aim should be to do a "diagnosis by exclusion" and then check with the service compartment.

Sounds good; I will been (and have been) testing the same.

I would also add the following:
- Make sure shutter release for one-shot and AI servo is set to "focus priority" instead of "shutter priority." In my experience, I have not seen any improvement to AF consistency even by setting shutter release to "focus priority," but I think it's still worth eliminating as a potential cause.
- Play around with the different AF cases and AF modes (spot AF, single point, expanded single point, etc). Also play around with the different AF sensor points to see if all of them are affected by the inconsistency problem.

 

[Travelintrevor]

Now I'm a bit nervous. I don't have a 7DMII, but I do have a 7D. I note some people have problems with soft images using that camera. I've had the 7D for four years and have had absolutely no auto focus issues with it. The only soft images it's produced have been the result of user error on my part. I was planning to buy a MII this summer. I bought a lens instead but was hoping to get the MII sometime within the coming year. Now I'm having second thoughts. I guess the question is how ubiquitous the soft picture problem is. You can't necessarily tell from internet forums. Still, I'm wondering what I should do. I don't think the 80D is quite the camera I want, although I remain open. I use my 7D for wildlife, including BIF and for macro work. I use a 5DMII for everything else. I certainly have no plans to look for a camera from another manufacturer, although the Nikon D500 looks interesting. I suppose I may just hang onto the 7D until it implodes. Why change horses while the original is running well?

Jump on one. You are seeing some reports of soft photos but who knows why? Diffraction? Bad camera? Bad technique?

Who knows but I can also tell you there are more people that don't have problems with the camera.

I won't dismiss the reported problems because I have been there but I can also tell you that I LOVE my 7D MK II. It is easily the best camera I have ever used. Easily beats my 5D MK III in everything except high ISO and shallow DoF.

I recently posted an example of how well the 7D MK II can track a high speed roller coaster and yet none of the happy 7D MK II owners chimed saying that they are happy with their results as well. Negative reports are more readily available....because it's in our nature to report the bad "stuff."

 

[arbitrage]

My 7D2 has also had inconsistent focusing issues. It has been to Canon service once and they found no problems. Some days it seems really good, other days it hardly hits. Mostly I've narrowed it down to a very "nervous" AI Servo drive. Even shooting a static subject in AI Servo you can visually see the focus racking back and forth by the smallest amounts and that seems to lead to a very inconsistent tack sharp hit rate.

Anyways, in the past 2 months I've found two excellent solutions to the 7D2 issues:

1) I bought a 5DSR....the focus system works (just like my 5D3 and 1DX)...only problem is the slow FPS for birds and wildlife action.

2) I bought a D500 and 200-500 lens. I've never experienced the focus consistency that I get from this camera in any Canon camera...only my 1DX is close. Having 20 shot bursts all in focus handholding from a kayak for BIF is something even the 1DX couldn't pull off. And this is with a fairly cheap Nikon lens compared to all the exotic Canon lenses I own and use regularly.

So those are my two newest solutions to my 7D2 headaches. My kit is now 5DSR, 1DX and D500. 7D2 will be sold soon.

What's the 200-500mm like? Some reviews have it very sharp from 200-500mm but I have met a guide whose lens was soft above 350mm and have found several reviews complaining that copies were soft. Also the AF is variously claimed to be fast or slow.

Sharpness is excellent. I shot some comparisons between 5DSR and 100-400II vs 7D2 and 100-400II vs D500 and 200-500 all at 400 at f/5.6 and really couldn't tell any difference. These were shot from same distance so pixels on subject were effectively equal. Yes my 7D2 can produce beautifully sharp images when it wants to.

If you want to see some of my pictures head over to FM Forums and check out this recent thread: http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1437945
Also looking through the 200-500 thread over there http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1379476 will show you the lens is sharp even at 500 and wide open. Even with the 1.4TC on it it did very well. One of the oystercatcher shots is with the 1.4TC...look for the 700mm in the EXIF.
As for AF, the AF feels a bit slower than the snappy Canon AF I'm used to. It feels a little smoother and deliberate.
Most of my reading before purchase showed that people that owned the 200-500 before the D500 and D5 were released reported a fairly slow AF. Many of those users after trying the D500 noticed remarkable improvement in the Af speed. I don't own any other nikon bodies like D810 so can't say myself but many users reported the D500 and D5's new AF system made the lens shine.

 

[arbitrage]

My 7D2 has also had inconsistent focusing issues. It has been to Canon service once and they found no problems. Some days it seems really good, other days it hardly hits. Mostly I've narrowed it down to a very "nervous" AI Servo drive. Even shooting a static subject in AI Servo you can visually see the focus racking back and forth by the smallest amounts and that seems to lead to a very inconsistent tack sharp hit rate.

Anyways, in the past 2 months I've found two excellent solutions to the 7D2 issues:

1) I bought a 5DSR....the focus system works (just like my 5D3 and 1DX)...only problem is the slow FPS for birds and wildlife action.

2) I bought a D500 and 200-500 lens. I've never experienced the focus consistency that I get from this camera in any Canon camera...only my 1DX is close. Having 20 shot bursts all in focus handholding from a kayak for BIF is something even the 1DX couldn't pull off. And this is with a fairly cheap Nikon lens compared to all the exotic Canon lenses I own and use regularly.

So those are my two newest solutions to my 7D2 headaches. My kit is now 5DSR, 1DX and D500. 7D2 will be sold soon.

Why are you shooting STATIC subjects with AI Servo?

Always have, always will. I'm handholding 90% of the time, even static things like birds on a perch are always moving somewhat, trees are moving. I've never used one shot except for a few trials to prove to myself Servo always gave equal or better results.

I've owned 7D, 5D2, 5D3, 1D4, 1DX, 7D2, 5DSR and 80D. I know the Canon system inside and out. Out of all those bodies the 7D2 has been the only real headache with in-consistent AF. I've watched the AF response in the same way on the 1DX and 5DSR, there is no noticeable jitter in the AF system when focused on a fairly static subject. It is visible through the VF on the 7D2. I'm convinced this is the main reason on my 7D2 copy that I can't get a consistent in focus hit rate.

My 7D2 however is not exactly as the OP describes his to be as I have 1000s of tack sharp shots at all different subject distances over the past 15 months. I just can't trust it to nail the shot I want.

Someday I may just purchase another 7D2 and try it again. But most likely will wait for the 7D3. I'm not selling off any of my Canon gear as I love my big lenses. The D500/200-500 is a stop gap to give me a high FPS crop body that produces the results I need.

 

[arbitrage]

Same problem with soft pictures and the 7d II. In my case it looks like it is a vibration-problem specially at high-frame-rates.

The 7dII has the same pixel-density as a 5Ds, so the 20 MP at APS are the same as 50 MP at fullframe. I think there is a reason, why they redesigned the mirror-box in the 5Ds.

If I shoot my 7D II in silent-mode , all my picures are sharp. It is annoying, but it helps.

Will also try to shoot in silent mode to find out if it is a shaking because of shutter(speed).
Do you have the softness in MF or liveview also?

I thought about this in the past and personally believes I get a higher percentage of sharp pictures with silent mode -- but have not tested this theory to a sufficient extent, so I will be testing this out more in the next couple of days as well. However, this still wouldn't explain why I get perfectly sharp pictures at close distances regardless of shooting mode (I usually leave it on high speed continuous @ 10fps).

If we document this well and arrive at some consensus as to the exact symptom of our 7DII problems, I wonder if people would be interested in drafting a group letter to Canon. Granted, I understand that not everyone here is CanonUSA/NorthAmerica. I just wonder if Canon Services will take 7DII service requests a bit more seriously when they see that there is some kind of trend exhibited among a large group of 7DII users.

My homework for the weekend will be: check 7DII with different optics and shutter modes to prove the thesis: picture softness - also in liveview (not only a af-problem) - in greater distances shots (more than 10m) - and affected lens-combos 100-400 and 70-200.
Any supplements?
Aim should be to do a "diagnosis by exclusion" and then check with the service compartment.

Sounds good; I will been (and have been) testing the same.

I would also add the following:
- Make sure shutter release for one-shot and AI servo is set to "focus priority" instead of "shutter priority." In my experience, I have not seen any improvement to AF consistency even by setting shutter release to "focus priority," but I think it's still worth eliminating as a potential cause.
- Play around with the different AF cases and AF modes (spot AF, single point, expanded single point, etc). Also play around with the different AF sensor points to see if all of them are affected by the inconsistency problem.

In my testing, using focus or shutter priority made no noticeable difference. Canon's "Focus priority" is unlike Nikons where with Nikon it literally won't fire the shutter till it gets a in focus confirmation....Canon fires when things are well out of focus. Nikon's can be used as a focus trap, Canon's not so.

In my testing the most inconsistent modes on my 7D2 were the 4 and 8 point expansion modes. I found that the small zone mode improved AF consistency by a noticeable amount but had to be used in certain situations where no foreground distractions would grab the focus. Single point was okay. In contrast on my 1DX the expansion modes worked amazingly.

I also have tried all sorts of fiddling with the AF case settings. I just can never quantify a noticeable difference. In the end I reset everything to default and do the same on my 1DX and 5DSR.

 

[quod]

How do you all manage to get these sharp pics I´ve seen?

You are not alone. I've gotten a lot of sharp shots with my 7D2, but I have gotten a lot of clunkers too. Generally, I have had good results with the 100-400 version 2. I noticed that I could not get a sharp shot, no matter the circumstance, when the 7D2 was paired with my 500/4 version 1. With the 500/4 version 2, the shots are often sharp. If it matters, I have gotten consistently better results with my 5D3, and even better results with my Sony A7R2. You may be better served by changing out the camera for a different model.