Magic Lantern Improves 5D Mark III Dynamic Range to 14 Stops

[Loswr]

keep your self to the subject and look at the specs

Ok. When I look at the 5DIII vs. the D800, I see a faster frame rate, better AF, better ergonomics and UI, much better Live View, and compatibility with better lenses (including those from Nikon, if one is willing to control them manually). Oh, and a bit less DR. Therefore, overall I see a better camera in the 5DIII. But then again, when I look at the specs, I'm not DRunk on DR and wearing DxOMark blinDRs.

 

[dlleno]

Lol drunk on DR that's classic!

 

[CarlTN]

How come nobody else is hacking cameras? Why is it always magic lantern?

 

[Drizzt321]

How come nobody else is hacking cameras? Why is it always magic lantern?

Why duplicate what someone else has already done? Join in and work on something that interests you or make an existing feature work better.

Now, occasionally it can make sense to have multiple projects that put out stuff that fundamentally does the same thing, but has a different interface or way of operating that enough other people find useful. But when it comes to cameras, something that's quite difficult to work on and are relatively expensive (mostly) to get even 1 to develop for, it makes a lot of sense to only have 1 main project and maybe if you really need something special just for you, a branch that you keep up to date with the mainline.

 

[jrista]

How come nobody else is hacking cameras? Why is it always magic lantern?

Why duplicate what someone else has already done? Join in and work on something that interests you or make an existing feature work better.

Well...duplication happens all the time! Just look at the OSS community...throughout its history, it's been riddled with people starting projects that have already been done, because someone thinks they can do better. In one sense, that's a great thing...you often do get better products than whatever may have come before. On the other hand...good projects that came before sometimes don't get the help or talent they need to become even better... Guess its one of those unwinnable scenarios...you can't have both...new projects that are better or existing projects that are the best they can possibly be...

Now, occasionally it can make sense to have multiple projects that put out stuff that fundamentally does the same thing, but has a different interface or way of operating that enough other people find useful. But when it comes to cameras, something that's quite difficult to work on and are relatively expensive (mostly) to get even 1 to develop for, it makes a lot of sense to only have 1 main project and maybe if you really need something special just for you, a branch that you keep up to date with the mainline.

I think you nailed it here...the cost of purchasing cameras in order to have the hardware to test with is probably the major barrier to entry. The good thing is that ML is a great product, and they are likely to attract any other talent willing to contribute, making it that much better in the long run.

 

[Drizzt321]

keep your self to the subject and look at the specs

Ok. When I look at the 5DIII vs. the D800, I see a faster frame rate, better AF, better ergonomics and UI, much better Live View, and compatibility with better lenses (including those from Nikon, if one is willing to control them manually). Oh, and a bit less DR. Therefore, overall I see a better camera in the 5DIII. But then again, when I look at the specs, I'm not DRunk on DR and wearing DxOMark blinDRs.

a bit less DR ?, 3 stops are a lot
better color rendering
higher resolution
no banding
shorter exposure time, no need for ETTR


how can you measure the ergonomics aspects?

I think you're talking about workflow, not ergonomics. The ergonomics of the camera don't change appreciably (other than menu settings to enable/disable it), but the workflow after you download it changes for better or worse.

 

[poias]

Oh, and a bit less DR. Therefore, overall I see a better camera in the 5DIII.

2.5 stops of less DR is "a bit less"? And on top of amazing DR, you get more than 50% detail with D800. I know you have to make excuses but this is just sad.

 

[Skulker]

If Canon has a 75Mp camera there will be about one stop more DR compared to the low res cameras as 1dx, 5dmk3

Canon's problems with DR is the pixel DR, so the only way to get more DR (if they not have changed the read out in the new 75mp sensor) is to have more pixels.

At least even you put some "if"s into your total guesses that you are making without any knowledge of the camera you now denigrate in typical ankorwatt fashion.

I find it difficult to believe that you really think you know what is in a camera that no one who has seen it is giving any technical details about. If it even exists . Surely even you are not that misguided.

 

[jrista]

If Canon has a 75Mp camera there will be about one stop more DR compared to the low res cameras as 1dx, 5dmk3

Canon's problems with DR is the pixel DR, so the only way to get more DR (if they not have changed the read out in the new 75mp sensor) is to have more pixels.

At least even you put some "if"s into your total guesses that you are making without any knowledge of the camera you now denigrate in typical ankorwatt fashion.

I find it difficult to believe that you really think you know what is in a camera that no one who has seen it is giving any technical details about. If it even exists . Surely even you are not that misguided.

Surely!

 

[Loswr]

keep your self to the subject and look at the specs

Ok. When I look at the 5DIII vs. the D800, I see a faster frame rate, better AF, better ergonomics and UI, much better Live View, and compatibility with better lenses (including those from Nikon, if one is willing to control them manually). Oh, and a bit less DR. Therefore, overall I see a better camera in the 5DIII. But then again, when I look at the specs, I'm not DRunk on DR and wearing DxOMark blinDRs.

a bit less DR ?, 3 stops are a lot
better color rendering
higher resolution
no banding
using shorter exposure time, no need for the same ETTR exposure as in Canon to keep noise down and increase the risk of clipping in the highlight

how can you measure the ergonomics aspects??

Only matters if there are more than 11 stops of DR in your scene.

Regardless, every "feature" you listed derives from the sensor. You and the others who DRone on about DR and DRag every thread down into the dolDRums seem unable to grasp the fact that there is more to a camera than the sensor inside of it.

 

[Loswr]

You Neuro said, I thought my camera 5dmk3 had good AF until I got my 1DX. (I can find the exact text somewhere)
This is the big problem here , several of you lacks comparisons between system but you declare always Canon as better, regardless it is lenses or camera bodies.

Yes, please find the exact text. I have never owned a 5DIII, so it seems pretty unliklely that I made such a statement. I made such a statement concerning the 7D, so I believe your faulty memory is the big problem here.

Perseverating on one single aspect of camera performance is another problem here. We're discussing photography. There are breathtaking, inspiring photographs with 6 stops of DR...just as there are crappy, boring photographs with 13.2 stops of DR (many of them right here on these forums, imagine that : ). While DR can easily be quantified, there's a lot more to making a picture. But go ahead and DRone on...who knows, maybe one day you'll get as tired of writing it as the rest of us are of reading it (other DR addicts notwithstanding).

 

[shulya]

Can moderator please get rid of the crap about Canon vs D800..
Somebody please post some image results before and after the firmware hack, is it worth installing it and what are the visible drawbacks?

 

[jrista]

Can moderator please get rid of the crap about Canon vs D800..
Somebody please post some image results before and after the firmware hack, is it worth installing it and what are the visible drawbacks?

Wow, first post and your asking mods to delete content?

As for comparisons, the ML team provided that in their PDF document that explains how they did what they did. There is a batman comparison and a juice carton comparison, both of which seem to demonstrate the benefits quite well.

 

[Marsu42]

Can moderator please get rid of the crap about Canon vs D800..

Please don't, I'm very grateful the mods in this forum don't "clean up" threads according to their perception of the topic, elsewhere I find this is ultra-annoying. Even with the good ok' Karma gone, CR posters seem to be able to steer a thread in meaningful bounds, or abandon it if it degrades to silliness after a long time which is also ok.

 

[Loswr]

Can moderator please get rid of the crap about Canon vs D800..

If they did that, the number of posts on this forum would be cut in half.

 

[Zv]

I swear every thread turns into the same thing!

What exactly is ankorwatt trying to say? That we should all immediately go out and buy a D800? While we're at it should we all have the same hairstyles and wear the same clothes?

Haven't you heard of choice? We choose to shoot Canon because we like it.

Now, do you actually take any pictures with the D800 or what? Can you show us an example of when you needed the extra 2 or 3 stops? No really, I want to see. I have no clue what it looks like. I thought shadows were meant to be black, doesn't it look fake if they're not?

 

[rpt]

I swear every thread turns into the same thing!

What exactly is ankorwatt trying to say? That we should all immediately go out and buy a D800? While we're at it should we all have the same hairstyles and wear the same clothes?

Haven't you heard of choice? We choose to shoot Canon because we like it.

Now, do you actually take any pictures with the D800 or what? Can you show us an example of when you needed the extra 2 or 3 stops? No really, I want to see. I have no clue what it looks like. I thought shadows were meant to be black, doesn't it look fake if they're not?

yes and I shoot also Canon because I like it, but as you all can se there are answers like above, when the benefits of 3 more stops of DR are useful ?????
It is always useful
WHY do YOU think Magic Lantern are trying to squeeze out a larger dynamic range

Mikael, are you a photographer?

If yes, more pictures and less talk. And by pictures I mean other things than DRab stuff. I mean artistically or technically great stuff.

If no, its ok. I mean just talk from you is ok. I'll understand.

 

[Drizzt321]

WHY do YOU think Magic Lantern are trying to squeeze out a larger dynamic range

Because they're hackers (see original definition), it's there, and because they can. Side benefits are it's a crazy idea, but it can work and likely provide some practical benefits to some photographers. But mostly because it's there.

 

[Marsu42]

Can you show us an example of when you needed the extra 2 or 3 stops? No really, I want to see. I have no clue what it looks like.

Constantly promoting specific Nikon products in a Canon forum might not be necessary, but I don't get the recent witchhunt for people wishing for more dynamic range ... of course it's useful in high contrast situations, even though even 2-3 stops more isn't enough to pull back all clipped highlights, but it sure would help.

Attached is some shot I recently wished for more dynamic range as it was a noon shot with clipped whites.

I thought shadows were meant to be black, doesn't it look fake if they're not?

If you really don't know the problem you're lucky and seem to be shooting completely different stuff to what I do. There's a difference between clipped shadows because of limited dr and deep shadows where *you* want them in postprocessing - or you should be happy with a mobile phone and half the dr of a current dslr because then images are destined to look natural, aren't they? No, of course not, +100 contrast is as unnatural as raising shadows until there is the distinct fake "hdr" look.

 

[Loswr]

You Neuro said, I thought my camera 5dmk3 had good AF until I got my 1DX. (I can find the exact text somewhere)
This is the big problem here , several of you lacks comparisons between system but you declare always Canon as better, regardless it is lenses or camera bodies.

Yes, please find the exact text. I have never owned a 5DIII, so it seems pretty unliklely that I made such a statement. I made such a statement concerning the 7D, so I believe your faulty memory is the big problem here.

Perseverating on one single aspect of camera performance is another problem here. We're discussing photography. There are breathtaking, inspiring photographs with 6 stops of DR...just as there are crappy, boring photographs with 13.2 stops of DR (many of them right here on these forums, imagine that : ). While DR can easily be quantified, there's a lot more to making a picture. But go ahead and DRone on...who knows, maybe one day you'll get as tired of writing it as the rest of us are of reading it (other DR addicts notwithstanding).

well I know all that, but aren't we discussing 14 stops DR or not ?

and then the text would be , I thought 7d AF was good ( or similar word ) until I got my 1DX
What this means is that you now have a wider knowledge about 2 cameras AF

You are discussing 14 stops of DR. You seem incapable of discussing anything else.

Mikael, where's the exact text you told us you'd provide?

What it means is that you quoted me and even offered to provide the exact text, but you were wrong. Why can't you just admit that?

Constantly promoting specific Nikon products in a Canon forum might not be necessary, but I don't get the recent witchhunt for people wishing for more dynamic range ... of course it's useful in high contrast situations, even though even 2-3 stops more isn't enough to pull back all clipped highlights, but it sure would help.

That's not really the issue...I don't think anyone here believes that more DR is a bad thing. The issue is really this:

Q: Which has better DR, the 5DIII or the D800?
A: The D800 has better DR, Canon's sensor sucks.

Q: Which allows better shadow recovery, the 5DIII or the D800?
A: The D800 has better DR, Canon's sensor sucks.

Q: How can I improve this bird picture?
A: The D800 has better DR, Canon's sensor sucks.

Q: What time is it in Stockholm?
A: The D800 has better DR, Canon's sensor sucks.