Official: Canon EOS 7D Mark II

[Steve]

That last bit about automatically switching the AF point...that sounds like the new tracking feature from Sony's AF system. If it does the same thing, then I'm impressed. You would then be able to manually choose a single AF point for getting the initial lock...but the sensor will still use all the AF points to track the subject. THAT is pretty kick-ass...and it's a key feature I would really like to have.

This is how it works on the 1DIV so its not really new, just new to the 7D line. Which is pretty awesome.

 

[Loswr]

That last bit about automatically switching the AF point...that sounds like the new tracking feature from Sony's AF system. If it does the same thing, then I'm impressed. You would then be able to manually choose a single AF point for getting the initial lock...but the sensor will still use all the AF points to track the subject. THAT is pretty kick-ass...

How is that not what the 5DIII can do now, albeit without tracking data input from the metering sensor? The way the feature is described is exactly how it works on my 1D X.

 

[Lee Jay]

That last bit about automatically switching the AF point...that sounds like the new tracking feature from Sony's AF system. If it does the same thing, then I'm impressed. You would then be able to manually choose a single AF point for getting the initial lock...but the sensor will still use all the AF points to track the subject. THAT is pretty kick-ass...

How is that not what the 5DIII can do now, albeit without tracking data input from the metering sensor?

From what I understand, that's a fairly key difference between the 5DIII and the 1DX.

 

[Loswr]

That last bit about automatically switching the AF point...that sounds like the new tracking feature from Sony's AF system. If it does the same thing, then I'm impressed. You would then be able to manually choose a single AF point for getting the initial lock...but the sensor will still use all the AF points to track the subject. THAT is pretty kick-ass...

How is that not what the 5DIII can do now, albeit without tracking data input from the metering sensor?

From what I understand, that's a fairly key difference between the 5DIII and the 1DX.

The input from the metering sensor is a key difference for the 1D X and 7DII...but not the manual selection of starting point with automatic switching of AF points to follow the subject that jrista describes as impressive and kick-ass, and which a camera he owns can already do.

 

[Loswr]

That last bit about automatically switching the AF point...that sounds like the new tracking feature from Sony's AF system. If it does the same thing, then I'm impressed. You would then be able to manually choose a single AF point for getting the initial lock...but the sensor will still use all the AF points to track the subject. THAT is pretty kick-ass...

How is that not what the 5DIII can do now, albeit without tracking data input from the metering sensor? The way the feature is described is exactly how it works on my 1D X.

That isn't how the 1D X or 5D III work. If you use a single AF point, it will only track with the one AF point. You have to use a zone or all points mode to have it use more than one point. I'm making an assumption that what I'm reading is referring to the same functionality of the Sony AF system, where in SINGLE POINT mode, you can lock onto a target, then if the target moves off that point, the AF system will still track with all other AF points.

When I use the 5D III for BIF, if I stray too far from the selected single AF point, the camera will then try to find another subject (which usually fails...as it's usually sky that I'm tracking the bird against.) Maybe the 1D X works differently...I haven't used a 1D X out in the field for more than a few minutes, so I don't know...but it certainly is not a feature that the 5D III has.

In that case, I think you're making an incorrect assumption about the 7DII. The 7DII will behave just like the 1D X (and 5DIII minus metering input). Can you give a Sony model that has the feature you're talking about?

But TBH, I'm still not sure what you're really talking about here. On the 1D X (and 5DIII is the same), in 61-pt auto select and AI Servo mode (both must be set), you can manually select any single AF point you want (I actually have different ones preset for landscape vs. portrait orientation), and that's the point that will lock onto the subject. If the subject moves off that point, the AF system will track the subject across the array of AF points, switching points as the subject moves. No, you're not in single point selection mode, but it works like you describe: "manually choose a single AF point for getting the initial lock...but the sensor will still use all the AF points to track the subject."

Other than what mode you start in (auto vs. single), how does the Sony system differ? Both let you select the starting point, both automatically switch AF points to track the moving subject.

 

[Eldar]

I think you´re referring to the same thing. On the 1DX/5DIII you use a single point to lock focus, which can be any available point, then the camera will use those focus points, single or multiple, required to keep the subject locked thereafter. With fast moving objects, BIF etc. it works very well. Only downside is with the 5DIII, where exposure metering does not follow the focus point.

See description here: http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canon-eos-7d-mark-ii/6

 

[Chuck Alaimo]

oh boy...i think i am going to skip the reading of all these pages and just jump out on a limb and say a few things.

This camera does look to be badass, that is if your shooting action. If your not shooting action, or are reach limited then FF sensors are just better for the obvious reasons. So I won't be buying this - but - I do like what I see for specs.

As to the constant DR drumbeat I hear...I am sick of that and sick of all the claims that this isn't an upgrade and canon doesn't innovate. I mean, tell me seriously what other than using someone else's sensor has nikon done? Take that sensor out and what have they done? Not much, other than release 7 FF bodies over the past 3 years (more if you count the DF, and the d4 and the d4s) in order to end up with 2 decent ones....

Anyway you hack it though...all this talk of innovation and really, how can nikon take any of the credit for it...or...how can camera users give nikon credit for that? Especially when apparently they couldn't even get that right without releasing 7 bodies to get 2 that may stick....

 

[Lee Jay]

If your not shooting action, or are reach limited then FF sensors are just better for the obvious reasons.

Better, but costlier. But, yeah, if you don't need all this power, a 6D is probably better at just flat producing images.

 

[paumm2006]

Just letting you guys know, the B&H preview video explicitly says that the sensor is not the same as the one in the 70D.

Here is the video in question:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stY7CC2GOE4

 

[Loswr]

That last bit about automatically switching the AF point...that sounds like the new tracking feature from Sony's AF system. If it does the same thing, then I'm impressed. You would then be able to manually choose a single AF point for getting the initial lock...but the sensor will still use all the AF points to track the subject. THAT is pretty kick-ass...

How is that not what the 5DIII can do now, albeit without tracking data input from the metering sensor? The way the feature is described is exactly how it works on my 1D X.

That isn't how the 1D X or 5D III work. If you use a single AF point, it will only track with the one AF point. You have to use a zone or all points mode to have it use more than one point. I'm making an assumption that what I'm reading is referring to the same functionality of the Sony AF system, where in SINGLE POINT mode, you can lock onto a target, then if the target moves off that point, the AF system will still track with all other AF points.

When I use the 5D III for BIF, if I stray too far from the selected single AF point, the camera will then try to find another subject (which usually fails...as it's usually sky that I'm tracking the bird against.) Maybe the 1D X works differently...I haven't used a 1D X out in the field for more than a few minutes, so I don't know...but it certainly is not a feature that the 5D III has.

In that case, I think you're making an incorrect assumption about the 7DII. The 7DII will behave just like the 1D X (and 5DIII minus metering input). Can you give a Sony model that has the feature you're talking about?

But TBH, I'm still not sure what you're really talking about here. On the 1D X (and 5DIII is the same), in 61-pt auto select and AI Servo mode (both must be set), you can manually select any single AF point you want (I actually have different ones preset for landscape vs. portrait orientation), and that's the point that will lock onto the subject. If the subject moves off that point, the AF system will track the subject across the array of AF points, switching points as the subject moves. No, you're not in single point selection mode, but it works like you describe: "manually choose a single AF point for getting the initial lock...but the sensor will still use all the AF points to track the subject."

Other than what mode you start in (auto vs. single), how does the Sony system differ? Both let you select the starting point, both automatically switch AF points to track the moving subject.

The Sony model that I know has the feature is the A77ii. The technology, IIRC, is he Lock On AF's "Flexible Spot" mode. You use a single AF point, move it to any one of the selectable points, and lock onto your subject. So long as you continue actively focusing, the A77ii system will keep tracking the subject...off that original single AF point selection, using any of the AF points out of all available. It's this flexible spot mode specifically that I'd love to have in a Canon AF system.

The wording for the 7D II makes it sound the same...although I very well could be misunderstanding. I honestly do not believe any Canon or Nikon system currently has anything like flexible spot. I know there are the zone and all points modes, but when you pick a single AF point, as far as I know (and maybe the 1D X is different), only that one point will be used, regardless.

Here's what Sony has to say about their Lock-on flexible spot mode: "Lock-on AF mode lets users select one of four AF area modes (Wide, Zone, Flexible Spot or Expanded Flexible Spot), and can recognize and track a subject’s form based on its color and its position within the frame, automatically selecting the appropriate AF point from the 79 available.:

So, you enable the Lock-on mode, manually select an AF point, and it will track a subject through the frame, automatically selecting the appropriate AF point as the subject moves.

With the 5DIII, 1D X, and 7DII, you enable AI Servo mode and 61-pt auto selection, manually select an AF point, and it will track a subject through the frame, automatically selecting the appropriate AF point as the subject moves.

Other than the difference I already mentioned (the 1D X, 7DII, and Sony a77-II use color information, the 5DIII does not because it doesn't get input from the metering system), how do those two differ?

Sorry, I just really don't get it.

I honestly do not believe any Canon or Nikon system currently has anything like flexible spot. I know there are the zone and all points modes, but when you pick a single AF point, as far as I know (and maybe the 1D X is different), only that one point will be used, regardless.

I think you are mistaken. Just to make sure we're on the same page here regarding the 5DIII (that page is p.77 from the 5DIII manual), with 61-pt auto selection in AI Servo, you manually select any single AF (1), and the AF system will track the subject across the array of AF points, switching points (2).

So again, can you please explain what is different about the Sony system?

 

[Camerakik]

Does anyone know if the 7D mark II has the silent shutter mode like the 5D mark III? My apologies if this has already been covered. Thanks.

 

[fragilesi]

Just letting you guys know, the B&H preview video explicitly says that the sensor is not the same as the one in the 70D.

Here is the video in question:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stY7CC2GOE4

Yes but some people are still disappointed with it ;D

 

[zlatko]

oh boy...i think i am going to skip the reading of all these pages and just jump out on a limb and say a few things.

This camera does look to be badass, that is if your shooting action. If your not shooting action, or are reach limited then FF sensors are just better for the obvious reasons. So I won't be buying this - but - I do like what I see for specs.

As to the constant DR drumbeat I hear...I am sick of that and sick of all the claims that this isn't an upgrade and canon doesn't innovate. I mean, tell me seriously what other than using someone else's sensor has nikon done? Take that sensor out and what have they done? Not much, other than release 7 FF bodies over the past 3 years (more if you count the DF, and the d4 and the d4s) in order to end up with 2 decent ones....

Anyway you hack it though...all this talk of innovation and really, how can nikon take any of the credit for it...or...how can camera users give nikon credit for that? Especially when apparently they couldn't even get that right without releasing 7 bodies to get 2 that may stick....

I agree. DR is not even on my list of things to check before buying a new camera. Canon have met my DR requirements for a very long time now. (Improving DR is good, but I'm not missing any in current cameras.) I'm much more interested in other camera details like high ISO, AF speed & accuracy, size & weight, ergonomics, durability, dual cards, etc., etc.

 

[Don Haines]

Just letting you guys know, the B&H preview video explicitly says that the sensor is not the same as the one in the 70D.

Here is the video in question:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stY7CC2GOE4

Yes but some people are still disappointed with it ;D

"It is a new sensor"

"cleanest images yet from a crop camera"

and somehow people can not accept that it is NOT the same sensor as the 70D....

not worth the trouble to argue about.....

 

[Khalai]

I honestly do not believe any Canon or Nikon system currently has anything like flexible spot. I know there are the zone and all points modes, but when you pick a single AF point, as far as I know (and maybe the 1D X is different), only that one point will be used, regardless.

I think you are mistaken. Just to make sure we're on the same page here regarding the 5DIII (that page is p.77 from the 5DIII manual), with 61-pt auto selection in AI Servo, you manually select any single AF (1), and the AF system will track the subject across the array of AF points, switching points (2).

So again, can you please explain what is different about the Sony system?

Well, maybe it's just something up with my 5D III. It's currently in my hands. I'm looking at the top LCD, and it says "AI SERVO". When I look through the viewfinder, I see the AF display for One-Shot AF. I don't see any AF points displayed...I only see the brackets. If I move the joystick around, no AF point shows up or is selected. If I activate AF...THEN I see AF points.

Manual, p. 74:

With 61-point automatic selection AF, you can set the starting AF point for AI Servo AF

 

[Eldar]

I honestly do not believe any Canon or Nikon system currently has anything like flexible spot. I know there are the zone and all points modes, but when you pick a single AF point, as far as I know (and maybe the 1D X is different), only that one point will be used, regardless.

I think you are mistaken. Just to make sure we're on the same page here regarding the 5DIII (that page is p.77 from the 5DIII manual), with 61-pt auto selection in AI Servo, you manually select any single AF (1), and the AF system will track the subject across the array of AF points, switching points (2).

So again, can you please explain what is different about the Sony system?

Well, maybe it's just something up with my 5D III. It's currently in my hands. I'm looking at the top LCD, and it says "AI SERVO". When I look through the viewfinder, I see the AF display for One-Shot AF. I don't see any AF points displayed...I only see the brackets. If I move the joystick around, no AF point shows up or is selected. If I activate AF...THEN I see AF points.

So, your telling me that my 5D III isn't behaving properly....that sucks. :\ I guess I need to figure out what's wrong, because I haven't been using the all points mode because it doesn't always initially lock onto my subject properly, and I often miss shots. On the other hand, using single point selection mode is a PITA for BIF.

A tip worth trying is to toggle through the AF modes and try again when you get to the all-points mode. A couple of times and don´t ask me how it happens, I have seen what you describe. But for me it has been sufficient to toggle through the modes and try again.

 

[paumm2006]

Just letting you guys know, the B&H preview video explicitly says that the sensor is not the same as the one in the 70D.

Here is the video in question:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stY7CC2GOE4

Yes but some people are still disappointed with it ;D

"It is a new sensor"

"cleanest images yet from a crop camera"

and somehow people can not accept that it is NOT the same sensor as the 70D....

not worth the trouble to argue about.....

Totally agree. I understand being disappointed about the rumors, as it seemed as if were the same, but now that the information is out there... ??? I guess some people like to ignore the facts and continue arguing their case.

 

[Lee Jay]

Totally agree. I understand being disappointed about the rumors, as it seemed as if were the same, but now that the information is out there... ??? I guess some people like to ignore the facts and continue arguing their case.

People are complaining that it probably isn't different enough. They want on-sensor A-to-D and dramatically (factor of 4-8 or so) reduced low-ISO read noise which would provide up to 2-3 stops more base ISO dynamic range.

Personally, I don't care that much about low ISO DR, but reduced noise from any source is always a good thing.

It's likely that this sensor has similar base ISO DR to all previous Canon sensors. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I think that's unlikely.

 

[raptor3x]

I reset the camera, and tried that, and it still did not work. Then, I just hit the AF mode button (the one on the back, which you press first, before pressing M-Fn to actually switch modes), and moved the joystick. That worked. So, in most AF modes, you can just move the joystick, and the selected AF point moves. But in all points mode, you have to first hit mode, then use the joystick to move the AF point? Seems very tedious...

But, it does seem to work...mostly. It does initially lock onto the subject under my selected point...but it jumps a lot. As I track, it doesn't seem to really STICK to the originally selected subject...which is kind of annoying. I am not using my 600mm lens, though, so maybe it will work better on that.

What are your tracking sensitivity and AF point switch values?

 

[Twostones]

It would be nice if Canon would make the manual for the 7D2 available for download so we can examine its functions.