People that don't shoot in manual...

[LewisShermer]

Next time I'm outside in varying light conditions, I'm actually going to shoot Tv just to see if it makes life any easier.

actually no, I've just had a play and it's Av. I can set the f-stop and it'll work out the shutter speed... Just having a play now... does this mean I'm going to actually have to read the manual? oh man, how am I going to work out what it's exposing for? whole scene or focus point? This is a headache. what if conditions drop at 100ISO below 125th/sec?? there has to be a way to set a minimum shutter-speed then up the ISO to compensate?

 

[cayenne]

traveling at 30+ mph (50+ kph for you non-yanks)

A: Most non-yanks know the conversion, although I also tend to include both units to help the readers.

B: The correct would have been km/h, not kph. Just saying.

A: Well, that's just because y'all are more globally intelligent. I continue to remain baffled at the American (or is it "United Statesian" since everyone across 2 continents are "American") inability to grasp killermeters.

B: Well, yeah, if you want to be SI compliant, but kph was first (per the source of all truth, wiki): ;D

1889: "k. p. h."
1895: "km:h"
1898: "km/h"
1899: "km./hr."
1911: "K.P.H."
1914 "km. hr."
1915: "km/hour"
1915: "km.-hr."
1916: "km. per hour"
1933: "KPH"

I can settle one part for you quite easily.

You can refer to those of us residing the the United States of America, as Americans.<P>
We've been going by that moniker for a bit over 200yrs and we're quite happy with it.

Yes, we're a part of North America, but we're the only country that has America in its name. Mexico has Mexicans, Canada has Canadians....etc.

I dunno where this recent trend to try to rename us has come from, but please stop it. We are not Usian's, we are Americans, and prefer that for the most part.

As for the metric system, well, honestly, at this point, it would cause more turmoil and cost more money that would likely be beneficial to us.

Most Americans never leave the country and have very little interaction with the rest of the world where measurement would be required. So, at the very least the cost/benefits can't really be seen to favor the change. And just so ingrained...I know how fast I'm going at 80mph, I have no idea what I'd be doing (without sitting down with a calculator or Googling it) at 30kmph. I have no concept on how to dress if the weather said it was 20C or 40C....but I know 32F and 98F without thinking.

It doesn't seem to be impeding that much on trade (although it did lead to one space snafu) so, why change? And it isn't like the US is well known to have much an inclination to "follow the rest of the world because they do x this way". We not only like doing things our own way, we relish the independent thought and action mentality.

But I'm just rambling at this point...

 

[weixing]

Hi,
Just wonder when there will be a thread on:
1) Why use calculator when you can count manually?
2) Why use accounting software when you can do the book manually?
3) Why use word processing software when you can write?
4) Why travel in vehicle when you can walk?
5) Why take the lift when you can climb up the stairs?
6) Why take photograph when you can draw?

I think I must be too free to post on this thread...

Have a nice day.

 

[HoodlessShooter]

Forgive me for annoying you; I have committed the following sins…

-I shoot Av 90% of the time
-I use Auto ISO
-I never use a lens hood
-Worst of all I am satisfied with my photos and have no shame whatsoever.

As penance I shall recite the exposure triangle 40 times, and read from the book of Kelby.

 

[BoneDoc]

Just don't read McNally's book, since he said that he shoots in Av 90% of the time .

If it's good enough for Joe, I guess it's good enough for me ;D. I do agree though, that in a theater-type of situation, Manual is probably better, since the spotlight will mess with your exposure in general.

 

[KyleSTL]

Next time I'm outside in varying light conditions, I'm actually going to shoot Tv just to see if it makes life any easier.

actually no, I've just had a play and it's Av. I can set the f-stop and it'll work out the shutter speed... Just having a play now... does this mean I'm going to actually have to read the manual? oh man, how am I going to work out what it's exposing for? whole scene or focus point? This is a headache. what if conditions drop at 100ISO below 125th/sec?? there has to be a way to set a minimum shutter-speed then up the ISO to compensate?

Glad you are branching out a bit (unless of course I'm missing sarcasm). With your 5DIII, there are plenty of controls for the Auto ISO function including a minimum shutter speed.

 

[LewisShermer]

Next time I'm outside in varying light conditions, I'm actually going to shoot Tv just to see if it makes life any easier.

actually no, I've just had a play and it's Av. I can set the f-stop and it'll work out the shutter speed... Just having a play now... does this mean I'm going to actually have to read the manual? oh man, how am I going to work out what it's exposing for? whole scene or focus point? This is a headache. what if conditions drop at 100ISO below 125th/sec?? there has to be a way to set a minimum shutter-speed then up the ISO to compensate?

Glad you are branching out a bit (unless of course I'm missing sarcasm). With your 5DIII, there are plenty of controls for the Auto ISO function including a minimum shutter speed.

Bloody hell, this thread really has got peoples backs up and on the defence hasn't it?

No sarcasm in that last post, I'm genuinely going to try it, even though I don't understand how it's going to work letting the camera decide on my exposure. I believe there are different estimating modes and a number of things I can do regarding minimum shutter speeds and maximum ISO's... I just have to read up on how to do it

 

[sdsr]

You guys seriously need to get out more and meet people..... Preferably of the opposite sex!!

The people they meet might wish they hadn't.

 

[crasher8]

You guys seriously need to get out more and meet people..... Preferably of the opposite sex!!

The people they meet might wish they hadn't.

Why push heterosexuality? They might just like to meet someone with another cannon (Canon)

 

[The_Arsonist]

I'm surprised to see everyone saying they only use flash in M mode. While I am normally in M for flash work, I sometimes shoot flash in Av mode with a locked ISO so that the changes in ambient light will be picked up automatically by the shutter changes. Of course, I guess that is assuming manual flash; many people probably stick to E-TTL?

Using Av for flash and with a locked ISO will affect the one thing flash photographers need to control the most... shutter speed. If we can't control our shutter speed, we can't control how much ambient is mixed with our flash.

IE: Bounced flash mixing with ambient at a reception, event or mixed lighting situation.

Yes, that's my point, let the camera choose the ambient via the shutter speed. You can control the ratio of ambient to flash with exposure compensation, and control the flash power with aperture. That way, when the ambient changes, the camera compensates while keeping the same flash ratio/power/etc.

 

[SiliconVoid]

Yeah, sorry.. this just sounds like a 'fishing for attention thread' - like people do in online games where they pop off in chat what they feel will be the most offensive, provoking, or controversial statement they can make and then enjoy the aftermath of attention..

The reality, is that it does not matter what mode someone else chooses to shot in - and even if they are asking for assistance it should not cause anyone any emotional distress over it.

A large percentage of people I know shoot manual just so they can saw they shoot in manual - very similar to 'announcing' to someone you only shoot in raw - who the heck cares if the final image meets your (or your clients) requirements.

Each mode has its usefulness and drawbacks:
In a scenario where your subject, lighting, and distance changes for each shot, and not under your control, you are missing shots fiddling with full manual settings.
If you are shooting action (where shutter speed is your first priority) and the sun is not always lighting what you want then shutter priority allows you to focus on your subject and the next shot - instead of the next setting.
More concerned with depth of field in a changing scene, then aperture priority etc..

When I shoot in the studio I am almost always in manual because what I see isn't always what I want the camera to see so I push and pull exposure intentionally - and have the time to make any decision I want.. in the field I am almost always in shutter priority because I am almost always shooting at a subject-camera range where depth of field does not matter much and lighting (sunlight) are not a concern - but stopping the action is.

To the OP, yeah you should probably seek some counseling if you are actually getting emotionally distressed over someone else's personal choices regarding their personal activity.. =)

 

[CarlTN]

...annoy me even more than those that don't shoot in raw.

What is it that folk find so difficult about choosing an appropriate shutter speed, the DOF they desire and then selecting the necessary ISO?

Obviously you then make off's where necessary...

I actually tried Tv & Av once, what a palava. settings all over the place, complete lack of control of anything. I have a friend that only shoots in fully auto (a Nikon user) and to look at his exif data is painful... he is a beginner and his composure nor his focussing is spot on yet but he refuses to learn even the simplest things about taking control of his own photography and not letting a daft camera take control.

The only non-manual thing I'll accept is the EX580's ETTL and that's only because it's a right bastard to operate.

so yeah, sell me the other options I've got to work with...

I have no problem shooting in manual, except when I want to use exposure compensation, which is most of the time!

There's plently of control available shooting in Tv or Av modes, and leaving ISO in auto...so your premise is wrong. I used to not use ISO auto, before I bought the 6D. Now I'm not afraid of letting it choose whatever ISO it desires.

 

[RLPhoto]

I'm surprised to see everyone saying they only use flash in M mode. While I am normally in M for flash work, I sometimes shoot flash in Av mode with a locked ISO so that the changes in ambient light will be picked up automatically by the shutter changes. Of course, I guess that is assuming manual flash; many people probably stick to E-TTL?

Using Av for flash and with a locked ISO will affect the one thing flash photographers need to control the most... shutter speed. If we can't control our shutter speed, we can't control how much ambient is mixed with our flash.

IE: Bounced flash mixing with ambient at a reception, event or mixed lighting situation.

Yes, that's my point, let the camera choose the ambient via the shutter speed. You can control the ratio of ambient to flash with exposure compensation, and control the flash power with aperture. That way, when the ambient changes, the camera compensates while keeping the same flash ratio/power/etc.

Yeah that's great but you'll still have wildly different exposures if the meter catches a bright light, and guess what? You have to dial in expo comp, then flash expo comp. then again when the light goes away... It's great if you like to fiddle a lot with that.

I find it easier to just set my settings in M mode, then simply control the flash exposure comp of the guests with ETTL. Then I have control of the ambient and the flash will be variable to changing light to get a good exposure on the guests. This works way better and I can concentrate on composition more than twiddling dials all night.

 

[weixing]

I'm surprised to see everyone saying they only use flash in M mode. While I am normally in M for flash work, I sometimes shoot flash in Av mode with a locked ISO so that the changes in ambient light will be picked up automatically by the shutter changes. Of course, I guess that is assuming manual flash; many people probably stick to E-TTL?

Using Av for flash and with a locked ISO will affect the one thing flash photographers need to control the most... shutter speed. If we can't control our shutter speed, we can't control how much ambient is mixed with our flash.

IE: Bounced flash mixing with ambient at a reception, event or mixed lighting situation.

Yes, that's my point, let the camera choose the ambient via the shutter speed. You can control the ratio of ambient to flash with exposure compensation, and control the flash power with aperture. That way, when the ambient changes, the camera compensates while keeping the same flash ratio/power/etc.

Yeah that's great but you'll still have wildly different exposures if the meter catches a bright light, and guess what? You have to dial in expo comp, then flash expo comp. then again when the light goes away... It's great if you like to fiddle a lot with that.

I find it easier to just set my settings in M mode, then simply control the flash exposure comp of the guests with ETTL. Then I have control of the ambient and the flash will be variable to changing light to get a good exposure on the guests. This works way better and I can concentrate on composition more than twiddling dials all night.

Hi,
Although I'm not using flash, but I thought it's the other way round?? The Av/Tv mode will automatically adjust the exposure to get the correct exposure due to the additional light in the scene, but in M mode, you need to adjust manually to get the right exposure, right? If you don't adjust your exposure in M mode, won't you get an overexpose image?

Have a nice day.

 

[Loswr]

Although I'm not using flash, but I thought it's the other way round?? The Av/Tv mode will automatically adjust the exposure to get the correct exposure due to the additional light in the scene, but in M mode, you need to adjust manually to get the right exposure, right? If you don't adjust your exposure in M mode, won't you get an overexpose image?

In Av mode when using flash, the camera will meter and set the shutter speed based on the ambient light, ignoring the contribution from the flash. With E-TTL metering, the preflash will be used to determine the amount of flash needed for the subject, independent of the shutter speed selected by the camera for the background.

In practice, what that means is that if you have the setting for 'Flash sync speed in Av mode' set to Auto (which is the default setting), in situations where you'd often use flash (i.e. low light), the camera will usually select a very slow shutter speed. That setting can also be 1/60 s - Xsync, or fixed at Xsync - in those cases, the metering for background is overridden, meaning you'll get subject properly exposed by the flash (with E-TTL) but in low light, the background will be dark.

 

[RLPhoto]

I'm surprised to see everyone saying they only use flash in M mode. While I am normally in M for flash work, I sometimes shoot flash in Av mode with a locked ISO so that the changes in ambient light will be picked up automatically by the shutter changes. Of course, I guess that is assuming manual flash; many people probably stick to E-TTL?

Using Av for flash and with a locked ISO will affect the one thing flash photographers need to control the most... shutter speed. If we can't control our shutter speed, we can't control how much ambient is mixed with our flash.

IE: Bounced flash mixing with ambient at a reception, event or mixed lighting situation.

Yes, that's my point, let the camera choose the ambient via the shutter speed. You can control the ratio of ambient to flash with exposure compensation, and control the flash power with aperture. That way, when the ambient changes, the camera compensates while keeping the same flash ratio/power/etc.

Yeah that's great but you'll still have wildly different exposures if the meter catches a bright light, and guess what? You have to dial in expo comp, then flash expo comp. then again when the light goes away... It's great if you like to fiddle a lot with that.

I find it easier to just set my settings in M mode, then simply control the flash exposure comp of the guests with ETTL. Then I have control of the ambient and the flash will be variable to changing light to get a good exposure on the guests. This works way better and I can concentrate on composition more than twiddling dials all night.

Hi,
Although I'm not using flash, but I thought it's the other way round?? The Av/Tv mode will automatically adjust the exposure to get the correct exposure due to the additional light in the scene, but in M mode, you need to adjust manually to get the right exposure, right? If you don't adjust your exposure in M mode, won't you get an overexpose image?

Have a nice day.

Av lets the camera pick a shutter speed, which affects the ambient exposure when using flash. So, one instance you could have a coleminers cave @ 1/200 and the next frame it will be light trails @ 1/60 or even slower if you activate 2nd curtain sync. Av doesn't give consistency when using flash with changing ambient light. Its similar to using Av to shoot concerts with flutters in lighting conditions that will ruin the subject with underexposer + the use of flash on top of that.

The rules change alittle bit when using flash because now your exposing for ambient and one for the flash.

Shutter speed = Ambient control (that's why sync speed is so important to a flash photog)

ETTL or M controls on flash = Flash exposure.

 

[LewisShermer]

Hi,
Although I'm not using flash, but I thought it's the other way round?? The Av/Tv mode will automatically adjust the exposure to get the correct exposure due to the additional light in the scene, but in M mode, you need to adjust manually to get the right exposure, right? If you don't adjust your exposure in M mode, won't you get an overexpose image?

Have a nice day.

This is the bit that winds me up "The Av/Tv mode will automatically adjust the exposure to get the correct exposure". The camera should never decide the "correct" exposure. That is for YOU as a photographer/artist to decide through experience and defining your own shooting style. I couldn't give a toss if you like my shots or not or the way I post-process, these are decisions I've made from the instant of picking up a camera, choosing a focal length and attaching a lens, deciding on how shallow I want the DoF to be, the composition, how much light the shutter speed should let in and how I need to control them using ISO or if I'd like fill in flash. Or 2 flashes or 3 flashes or rim lighting or shot into the sun for flare or exposing for the light and getting a silhouette. If I need to plan in advance to get "the shot" then I plan in advance and set up my camera in preparation. If a scene is constantly changing then I'm constantly aware that I need to be constantly in control of what I'm doing and constantly aware of my surroundings. I also need to be in constant control of clients/guests/attendees, backgrounds. some things are easier to control than others and it's quick thinking and experience that makes the best of the worst situations, not the decisions of a processor in a camera. At least if it fucks up then it's my fault and I'm not blaming the camera that has chosen to do something at 30th/sec or f16 thus ruining it that way.

/rant

Note: I do not shoot birds in flight or sports...

 

[weixing]

Av lets the camera pick a shutter speed, which affects the ambient exposure when using flash. So, one instance you could have a coleminers cave @ 1/200 and the next frame it will be light trails @ 1/60 or even slower if you activate 2nd curtain sync. Av doesn't give consistency when using flash with changing ambient light. Its similar to using Av to shoot concerts with flutters in lighting conditions that will ruin the subject with underexposer + the use of flash on top of that.

The rules change alittle bit when using flash because now your exposing for ambient and one for the flash.

Shutter speed = Ambient control (that's why sync speed is so important to a flash photog)

ETTL or M controls on flash = Flash exposure.

Hi,
Since shutter speed control ambient lighting, so if your ambient lighting change, you'll need to adjust your shutter speed to get the correct exposure, right? If that the case, in Av mode you need to set exposure comp if you think it's necessary, but in M mode, you had to set the shutter speed since the flash exposure cannot use to compensate the change of ambient lighting, right?

Have a nice day.

 

[weixing]

This is the bit that winds me up "The Av/Tv mode will automatically adjust the exposure to get the correct exposure". The camera should never decide the "correct" exposure. That is for YOU as a photographer/artist to decide through experience and defining your own shooting style. I couldn't give a toss if you like my shots or not or the way I post-process, these are decisions I've made from the instant of picking up a camera, choosing a focal length and attaching a lens, deciding on how shallow I want the DoF to be, the composition, how much light the shutter speed should let in and how I need to control them using ISO or if I'd like fill in flash. Or 2 flashes or 3 flashes or rim lighting or shot into the sun for flare or exposing for the light and getting a silhouette. If I need to plan in advance to get "the shot" then I plan in advance and set up my camera in preparation. If a scene is constantly changing then I'm constantly aware that I need to be constantly in control of what I'm doing and constantly aware of my surroundings. I also need to be in constant control of clients/guests/attendees, backgrounds. some things are easier to control than others and it's quick thinking and experience that makes the best of the worst situations, not the decisions of a processor in a camera. At least if it fucks up then it's my fault and I'm not blaming the camera that has chosen to do something at 30th/sec or f16 thus ruining it that way.

/rant

Note: I do not shoot birds in flight or sports...

Hi,
Cool down a bit... I understand what you mean... I know that the camera meter won't get you the correct exposure in every situation or the exposure that you want... everyone needs and requirement is different, that's the reason why there is a few metering mode for you to choose, exposure compensation for you to compensate and M mode if you want total control of the exposure... the mode is design to make life easier for most of the people using the camera.

Have a nice day.

 

[schill]

Person A knows how to set manual exposure settings on his/her camera and get the result he/she wants. Person B knows how to set Av exposure settings on his/her camera and get the result he/she wants.

Neither is right or wrong. Both can know what they are doing. Neither has to convince the other that either is right or wrong.

There are technical things that can be discussed and explained. Which mode is the best to shoot in (even in regard to specific situations) is not one of them. It is not black and white. I may make recommendations based on what I like but I certainly won't claim it's the best approach.

I shoot a lot in Av and Tv but also manual. I decide based on the situation. I am familiar enough with my camera (7D right now) and how it behaves to make those decisions and get what I want in any of these modes. Now if only the light would cooperate.