PocketWizard FlexTT5 and 580exII RF Issues?

[kennykodak]

Master of Photography PPA
Master of Electronic Imaging PPA
Photographic Craftsman PPA
international Print Juror, PPA
Lecturer on Photography & Photoshop, University of Cincinnati
24 features articles published "Professional Photographer"
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i know how to read and i know what is unreliable.

my comments were directed at equipment and not a person...

 

[Viggo]

While I agree that ETTL for light setup isn't the most reliable, with the Phottix Odinb you just use the ETTL connection to remotely control the power-setting on the remote-flashes. Means, you don't have to run those 100 meters over to the flash to adjust it up one stop, you can do that from the transmitter on the camera, which is fantastic.

Also you have A, B, C groups to control, so if the subject is moving you can use a M-set flash output for background, and ETTL for the subject moving. And the ETTL output is actually pretty good. The mix and match makes it all the more versatile. And still, NO misfire, NO adjusting and tuning in software, NO trial and error. They just work.... Cannot stress enough what it means to have them work every time at every setting at any distance.

 

[briansquibb]

my comments were directed at equipment and not a person...

You are right - I am sorry

So:
- the best speedlite is rubbish
- the most used radio transmitter/receiver is rubbish
- the combination of 580EXII and PocketWizzard only work line of sight
- the combination works for me and others

The only way to find out what is wrong is to go down the Sherlock Holmes route of elimination

Why do you say the 580EXII is junk?
Why do you say the PocketWizzards are junk?
Why do you think your opinion is contrary to most other people?
Why do you think your combination only works line of sight like the Canon system when everyone elses work on radio?

 

[xROELOFx]

Master of Photography PPA
Master of Electronic Imaging PPA
Photographic Craftsman PPA
international Print Juror, PPA

what does all that stuff mean?

 

[kennykodak]

my comments were directed at equipment and not a person...

You are right - I am sorry

So:
- the best speedlite is rubbish
- the most used radio transmitter/receiver is rubbish
- the combination of 580EXII and PocketWizzard only work line of sight
- the combination works for me and others

The only way to find out what is wrong is to go down the Sherlock Holmes route of elimination

Why do you say the 580EXII is junk?
Why do you say the PocketWizzards are junk?
Why do you think your opinion is contrary to most other people?
Why do you think your combination only works line of sight like the Canon system when everyone elses work on radio?

i was one of the first to get my hands on the pw's. i was thrilled. i went through many upgrades in firmware and long discussions with PW and Canon. neither party was particularly helpful as they don't have control of the other party's parts. i was sent some socks from PW to shield the RF on the 580's. the PW's dropped shots at random even when used with Elinchrom in a fixed setting. they will drop a shot when a lens is zoomed. a back lit aisle shot is a sporting event to get it to fire repeatedly. my frustration with the Canon 580 EX2 comes from many things. starting trying to make work in the beginning with a Quantum twin turbo. again the two sides don't talk to each other. later it was determined that a custom function had to be set, and there was a correct sequence that had to be followed in start up between the flash and the turbo. question, the original 580EX had slave and master on the on-off switch. the current one has it removed and one must wade through settings using the zoom button. not progress. the new Nikon has it on the switch like the old Canon. the auxiliary outlet for a power cord is lightly glued inside the unit and has a poor connection, it is prone to break loose inside the unit and become useless. i really wanted the PW to be a success but haven't been able to come to trust them yet. the only thing i miss about my Nikon days is the flash units.
about the PPA titles:
Master of Photography; 13 national award winning print merits, 12 service.
Master of Electronic Imaging; 13 national award winning digital enhanced print merits, 12 service.
Photographic Craftsman, 13 speaking merits (either national, regional or state platforms) or articles published, 12 service.
International Print Juror, completing a week long course in Atlanta on judging international professional images.

Not trying to be an arrogant jerk, only trying to demostrate that i have some photographic background.

 

[Viggo]

I don't think KennyKodak's opinion is contrary to most people using the PW's Flex-system. Searching around the web reveals that sooooo many people have all kinds of issues with the Flex-system. And this isn't the 580's fault at all. Try them on camera or with any other trigger, only the Flex have all this issues. And that's one of the biggest issues, it's nothing consistent, it's 20.000 different faults that, at random, appear at the worst of times. Ranging from full dump blinding the subject to absolutely no rigging at all. Or worse, some speeds will work others don't, not the same speed every time. Some power settings through the AC3 controller gave no power. Not syncing.

If you read the PocketWizard blog through facebook, you can even see that the poor sponsored pro's give you tips like that STUPID sock and also use the OC-e3 cable from canon to get distance from the trigger to the flash, come ooooon!! Those cables are expensive and it makes things a hassle to set up, you bought the PW's to get rid of the damn cables, no?

They even told me I needed to switch the pw's on in a specific order, for them to work, really?? I've done 30 firmwares, including BETA, I have had two sets of MATCHING hardware, still nothing works.

The only fantastic thing about Pocket Wizard is their customer service, they have been waaay kinder than I would have expected. Got a complete refund after three years of struggling.

 

[briansquibb]

I don't think KennyKodak's opinion is contrary to most people using the PW's Flex-system. Searching around the web reveals that sooooo many people have all kinds of issues with the Flex-system. And this isn't the 580's fault at all.

I must be very lucky then - run with 1 x 580EXII and 4 x 580EX without any issues at all, including using them out of line of site.

 

[Viggo]

Yes, you are, and good for you! I'm also glad I don't have to deal with them anymore. And that I can now adjust power in "normal" values 1/1- 1/128 instead of plus minus 3.

What range do you get and where are you located?..be honest

 

[briansquibb]

I am in UK

I only do about 40feet (the distance from the hide to the feeder)

 

[Viggo]

Good to know it works at least somewhere, you should send your stuff in and say to them that they need to make EVERY unit like yours that work.

With the Phottix I get full eTTL-communication at LEAST at 200 meters. I ran out of road when I was testing... I had maybe 20 meters with the pw's both with the OC-e3 cable and not... Even indoors... The very few times they triggered properly.

 

[justsomedude]

Thanks for the input, everyone. After doing some thorough reading/research, I opted for (3) FlexTT5s to complement my (2) 580exIIs. Based on information available, and some DIY testing done by photogs about the internet, the FlexTT5 had much better range as the primary transmitter than did the MiniTT.

I got the units last week, and had some great results doing indoor testing. See sample of my dad below...

The units were no more than 20' from my camera body during my in-home tests, and everything fired fine. I decided to implement them on a wedding gig yesterday (church allows flash), and for the first 15 minutes, all worked well. Even shooting 100' plus away from the back of the balcony with the FlexTT5s on stands behind concrete columns at the floor level (full soft shield + shoe were implemented), I got consistent triggering/ETTL.

Then - catastrophe hit. I was struck with the total failure documented here on both of my 580's. They started doing the full power dumps, with no regulated output whatsoever. I was able to finish the ceremony with natural light without issue, and my assistant had two 580's that worked flawlessly for the portrait shoot and reception. We worked them just as strenuously as my two 580's for the rest of the night, yet no failures occurred. I found that to be a little odd.

I immediately called PocketWizard this morning to find out more about this failure of my 580's. Based on the research done in the link previously provided, PocketWizard claims the 580's design is the fault of this failure. The CS rep I spoke with did say that Canon typically covers the IGBT repair under warranty, and that the repair should basically eliminate the problem from ever occurring again. It's still frustrating being without some of my primary portable lighting gear for a few weeks as I move into boudoir/Valentine's shoot season.

grrrr.

 

[Viggo]

I hate to say, I told you so, but I told you so....

And that will only be the beginning. If there was something seriously wrong with the 580's, how come they didn't fail until the Flex-system hit the market? Mine worked flawlessly from -05 until I bought the PW's, then it all went to hell. Not only didn't they work on the Flex, but they started to fail when I mounted them on my camera as well. And this hasn't happened with ANY of the super-cheap trigger's I bought off ebay when starting out, and the Phottix Odin have STILL not had ONE misfire of ANY sort. Why don't people listen?

 

[Freshprince08]

I hate to say, I told you so, but I told you so....

And that will only be the beginning. If there was something seriously wrong with the 580's, how come they didn't fail until the Flex-system hit the market? Mine worked flawlessly from -05 until I bought the PW's, then it all went to hell. Not only didn't they work on the Flex, but they started to fail when I mounted them on my camera as well. And this hasn't happened with ANY of the super-cheap trigger's I bought off ebay when starting out, and the Phottix Odin have STILL not had ONE misfire of ANY sort. Why don't people listen?

Still can't find a UK source for the Odins

They sound perfect for what I need!

 

[Viggo]

You find them on ebay ;D

I bought my set from HongKong, they're the fastest and cheapest when it comes to shipping. Everything in order, they mark down the value so I pay less taxes. Never had anything trouble and I buy ALL my accesories from HK. I'm located in Norway (which is pretty far from HK) and it usually take 5-6 days from them to my mailbox, which is crazy, it takes waaaay longer shipping inside of Norway, ironically...

 

[justsomedude]

Why don't people listen?

Because nobody likes you.




Just kidding.

Honestly, I have to say that after this experience I'd still prefer to stay with PocketWizard. Their support for numerous brands of flash, including AlienBees, provides a tremendous amount of versatility and flexibility to photographers - and most importantly - me. I've yet to find another ETTL radio trigger that is equaled in that regard. Furthermore, in all their history, the 580exII is the only flash they've encountered repeated problems with. To me, this information (in conjunction with their white paper) points more to the 580 as the culprit than the PW Flex.

I'll probably be hanging around with them for a while, and more than likely just switching the make or model of flash units I choose to employ for off-camera use.

 

[Viggo]

Why don't people listen?

Because nobody likes you.




Just kidding.

Honestly, I have to say that after this experience I'd still prefer to stay with PocketWizard. Their support for numerous brands of flash, including AlienBees, provides a tremendous amount of versatility and flexibility to photographers - and most importantly - me. I've yet to find another ETTL radio trigger that is equaled in that regard. Furthermore, in all their history, the 580exII is the only flash they've encountered repeated problems with. To me, this information (in conjunction with their white paper) points more to the 580 as the culprit than the PW Flex.

I'll probably be hanging around with them for a while, and more than likely just switching the make or model of flash units I choose to employ for off-camera use.

Haha, funny stuff ;D Yeah, well, they only reason I tell things like they are, is because I know how insanely mad I get when things don't frikkin' work like they suppose to! And really, me saying that is just to give others a different opinion than what you get from a commercial for a product. Not all things are as good as they claim to be, just saying.

And what do you mean "supporting Alien Bees" ? I haven't used them, but are they ETTL? I didn't think so? The Odin supports ALL studio-flashes, and ETTL is restricted to Canon, JUST like PW's, so I don't get that point. The Odin is the only trigger that works straight out of the box down to 1/8000s with my Elinchromes and other studio-flashes. Did you find those sync-cables in your PW box? nope! That was extra. And you need soft shield, blocking the display, and af-assist, oh wait, pw don't support that : and I see people hanging their PW's from a Canon OC-e3 cable to get distance from the flash, wtf... I mean, I'm an Apple fan, but this seems much like the Iphone-diciples, they want an Iphone4 no matter what it doesn't do. Android does everything better, but I want an Iphone, why? because it's an iphone... I choose stability over a brand name, just me I guess.....

 

[briansquibb]

I dont shoot in a studio

I shoot typically 3 or 4 flash setups

I shoot with the flash some distance from me so as not to scare the wildlife ( about 30/40ft)

I also shoot weddings the usual flash mods

I also shoot macro with 3 or 4 flash for static items ( X layout) , 2 x 580 for on the camera dynamic shots

I shoot exclusively wireless

I have had no problem with the FlexTT5/MiniTT1 so far

 

[Maui5150]

I have never personally used an Odin, so I can't really comment on their abilities. I can say that there is noone locally to me or with 2000 miles that carries them that I can find. I see no authorized dealers or stores that stock them in the Eastern US or Canada.

As for Pocket Wizard and cables, mine cost me $4.99 so not really a big deal

Availability is a large point for me. I may do a lot of buying online, but I also buy brands that I can also get locally or same day if I need a replacement.

Now if Odin starts getting dealerships in the US or Canada, then maybe I will consider them. So far Pocket Wizards have served me well. They are plentiful, I get them cheaper than I can buy Odins, and if I am traveling and have an issue, loss, etc., I can easily purchase a replacement or borrow one.

The only issue that some are getting with the 580 EX IIs is do to Canon and their frequencies, not the Pocket Wizards. I have had no issues with either of my 580s or 430s and working with them and my Photogenics.

The other thing to note about not needing shielding with Odin's, that is because the frequencies that are used. In fact, while you may not have run into problems do to the frequency spread, since the US uses different ranges for other devices, it can be likely that the Odins may suffer from interference from other devices.

Pocket Wizard will have specific frequency ranges based upon location for this exact reason, and from what I have seen, Odin is only a one size fits all. This also may be a reason, why after 4 years, they seem to only be available in Europe, and not carried by North American or Canadian markets.

 

[justsomedude]

Haha, funny stuff ;D Yeah, well, they only reason I tell things like they are, is because I know how insanely mad I get when things don't frikkin' work like they suppose to! And really, me saying that is just to give others a different opinion than what you get from a commercial for a product. Not all things are as good as they claim to be, just saying.

And what do you mean "supporting Alien Bees" ? I haven't used them, but are they ETTL? I didn't think so? The Odin supports ALL studio-flashes, and ETTL is restricted to Canon, JUST like PW's, so I don't get that point. The Odin is the only trigger that works straight out of the box down to 1/8000s with my Elinchromes and other studio-flashes. Did you find those sync-cables in your PW box? nope! That was extra. And you need soft shield, blocking the display, and af-assist, oh wait, pw don't support that : and I see people hanging their PW's from a Canon OC-e3 cable to get distance from the flash, wtf... I mean, I'm an Apple fan, but this seems much like the Iphone-diciples, they want an Iphone4 no matter what it doesn't do. Android does everything better, but I want an Iphone, why? because it's an iphone... I choose stability over a brand name, just me I guess.....

Viggo, I'm just saying that it works with my Alien Bee setup. See the adapter here...

http://www.pocketwizard.com/products/transmitter_receiver/ac9%20alienbees%20adapter/

I didn't mean to offend you, or your choice of Phottix. I'm sure it's a fine product for you.

 

[Viggo]

@ Maui5150

I bought mine from HK so the asian market has it available at least. And the Odin is brand new, so that could be a reason.

For them not to include cables that cost retail 5 bucks isn't annoying and stupid?

Bluetooth is also a VERY common frequency used all over, does it interfere? Nope, because you make your own individual code. Same as when I use my Power point presenter and mouse at the same time, they both run on 2,4 gHz like the Odin, and 400 other people in the same room use the same 2,4, no one is interfering with each other.

I'm glad the Wizards work for a couple of you guys, but if you look around, further than the nose, there are PLENTY of people who can't get them to work. For instance , join their page on Facebook and read the wallposts there a week or so, you see all kinds of different issues.....

I'm not telling you what to buy or no to buy. I just posted this because the OP had issues, and so did I , and they never got sorted, so perhaps people don't have to spend three years getting them to work, but can actually get something that works straight away and always....