RF 85/1.2 L vs RF 85/1.2 L DS (new video w/ comparisons)

[navastronia]

I found this video entertaining and informative.

Comparisons from Barrera:

RF 85/1.2 L



RF 85/1.2 L DS:



Observations:

1) The DS improves the appearance of bokeh in busy scenes (leaves on the left side of the frame, a couple feet behind the model.

2) The DS produces artificial-looking bokeh in less busy scenes (background some distance behind the model)

3) The DS for some reason intensifies the color of bokeh balls.

4) The 1.5-2 stops of light lost not only produces a deeper DoF, but also (practically speaking) generated blurry images for Barrera in some scenes due to hand-holding at a low shutter speed, probably trying to ensure images captured with each lens were at the same aperture and ISO.

5) The lenses seem to perform the same in all other regards, including sharpness and AF, due to having basically the same design.

I'm leaning 80/20 on getting the standard version someday because I value those 1.5-2 stops of light the DS loses, but it's not out of the question. I would be curious to shoot with the DS myself and see if the BG bokeh still looks weird to me after shooting some of my own work rather than watching how others use it.

 

[Viggo]

He shoots Silent LV mode 1, so unfair comparison imo. The regular 85 looks much better when shooting fully mechanical.

 

[navastronia]

He shoots Silent LV mode 1, so unfair comparison imo. The regular 85 looks much better when shooting fully mechanical.

In that case, if you wouldn't mind, it would be terrific to see a comparison of silent LV vs. mechanical on the 85/1.2 L.

 

[Viggo]

In that case, if you wouldn't mind, it would be terrific to see a comparison of silent LV vs. mechanical on the 85/1.2 L.

Just the first I found, but others have written more about this.

 

[navastronia]

Just the first I found, but others have written more about this.

It's an interesting phenomenon, but I just watched the video I posted again, and Barrera never says he's shooting in EFCS. Where did you read that he does?

 

[Viggo]

It's an interesting phenomenon, but I just watched the video I posted again, and Barrera never says he's shooting in EFCS. Where did you read that he does?

I asked him, check the comments

 

[navastronia]

I asked him, check the comments

Wow, that was good. Great eye!!

 

[mkamelg]

This is currently the best written review of the Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS lens. In this review the lens was also compared to the Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM lens.

Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS review

With Defocus Smoothing, the Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS turns the stock RF 85mm bokeh beast into a bokeh behemoth

www.digitalcameraworld.com

The guy who made it also has a YouTube channel. This video can be seen as a supplement to this written review.

Comparative photos with models were taken at shutter speeds of 1/80 sec and 1/200 sec, so EFCS had no effect on bokeh.

Do I have any thoughts on this topic?

When taking photos with a Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS lens, be very careful what is in the background. Most of the time the background will unfortunately be too cute, and will distract attention from the model. Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM lens has a bit uglier bokeh, but thanks to that the viewer's eyes are automatically directed at the model.

Some member of our Polish forum for Canon equipment users wrote (slightly maliciously) about this (Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS) lens "lens with bokeh effect in the style of Photoshop Gaussian Blur". Some guy by the name of Owen Hall, wrote in the commentary below the video I posted above "It gives me the feel of the new iPhones 11 pro background bluring software? The iphone blurs the background all the same with little character bokeh just like if you took a blur tool to the back ground?".

 

[navastronia]

This is currently the best written review of the Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS lens. In this review the lens was also compared to the Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM lens.

Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS review

With Defocus Smoothing, the Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS turns the stock RF 85mm bokeh beast into a bokeh behemoth

www.digitalcameraworld.com

The guy who made it also has a YouTube channel. This video can be seen as a supplement to this written review.

Comparative photos with models were taken at shutter speeds of 1/80 sec and 1/200 sec, so EFCS had no effect on bokeh.

Do I have any thoughts on this topic?

When taking photos with a Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS lens, be very careful what is in the background. Most of the time the background will unfortunately be too cute, and will distract attention from the model. Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM lens has a bit uglier bokeh, but thanks to that the viewer's eyes are automatically directed at the model.

Some member of our Polish forum for Canon equipment users wrote (slightly maliciously) about this (Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS) lens "lens with bokeh effect in the style of Photoshop Gaussian Blur". Some guy by the name of Owen Hall, wrote in the commentary below the video I posted above "It gives me the feel of the new iPhones 11 pro background bluring software? The iphone blurs the background all the same with little character bokeh just like if you took a blur tool to the back ground?".

I agree. Especially in a fair, head-to-head comparison like that one, it becomes obvious that photographers don’t ~need~ the DS to produce great bokeh.

 

[Larsskv]

This is currently the best written review of the Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS lens. In this review the lens was also compared to the Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM lens.

Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS review

With Defocus Smoothing, the Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS turns the stock RF 85mm bokeh beast into a bokeh behemoth

www.digitalcameraworld.com

The guy who made it also has a YouTube channel. This video can be seen as a supplement to this written review.

Comparative photos with models were taken at shutter speeds of 1/80 sec and 1/200 sec, so EFCS had no effect on bokeh.

Do I have any thoughts on this topic?

When taking photos with a Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS lens, be very careful what is in the background. Most of the time the background will unfortunately be too cute, and will distract attention from the model. Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM lens has a bit uglier bokeh, but thanks to that the viewer's eyes are automatically directed at the model.

Some member of our Polish forum for Canon equipment users wrote (slightly maliciously) about this (Canon RF 85mm f/1.2L USM DS) lens "lens with bokeh effect in the style of Photoshop Gaussian Blur". Some guy by the name of Owen Hall, wrote in the commentary below the video I posted above "It gives me the feel of the new iPhones 11 pro background bluring software? The iphone blurs the background all the same with little character bokeh just like if you took a blur tool to the back ground?".

I agree with you, I think the DS lens bokeh looks too refined. It lacks personality and character, and almost look artificial. I own the RF 85L non DS, so it might be bias, but I am not tempted to replace it with the DS lens.

 

[Larsskv]

Just the first I found, but others have written more about this.

Wow! Interesting! Can anyone explain this? Could it be as simple as a difference in exposure?

 

[Viggo]

Wow! Interesting! Can anyone explain this? Could it be as simple as a difference in exposure?

I believe the reason is the fact that the mechanical shutter sits some mm’s in front of the sensor while the EFCS is on the sensor, so when they form the slit that normally is just a gap between front and rear curtain they are at different distances. I think it’s how they interact since neither fully electronic or fully mechanical shows this flaw.

 

[Larsskv]

I believe the reason is the fact that the mechanical shutter sits some mm’s in front of the sensor while the EFCS is on the sensor, so when they form the slit that normally is just a gap between front and rear curtain they are at different distances. I think it’s how they interact since neither fully electronic or fully mechanical shows this flaw.

It has to be something, and this theory seems plausible...

 

[stevelee]

It is a matter of taste. I don't much care for extremely unfocused backgrounds. I think they look unnatural and distract from the subject. Sometimes the subject looks more like a cardboard cutout than a 3-dimensional person. For me the goal would be to approximate the look of the background in real life when your eyes focus on something in the foreground. That is tricky for a variety of reasons. In real life if you look at the background, your eyes focus on it. With a picture, your eyes can focus on the blurry background, and you can admire or hate or whatever the background bokeh as such. If there is much difference in distance the parallax becomes part of the perception, and that is not really simulated in a 2-D photo, that I know of.

So while you can't do a real equivalent (that word again!), you can be judicious enough in trying to make it look right. If you are going after an extreme of close subject, distant background, f/1.2 on a telephoto or small telephoto, that's fine with me. It's just that I see that as a special effect, like using a TS lens to make a miniature effect. It can be fun or just a cliché, or likely both.

 

[privatebydesign]

4) The 1.5-2 stops of light lost not only produces a deeper DoF, but also (practically speaking) generated blurry images for Barrera in some scenes due to hand-holding at a low shutter speed, probably trying to ensure images captured with each lens were at the same aperture and ISO.

No it doesn't, how does T stop impact depth of field? It doesn't.

 

[privatebydesign]

So while you can't do a real equivalent (that word again!),

Equivalence is a relatively simple concept that ends up with answers people don't really like because it goes against their initial intuition and they normally miss one or two of the basic criteria,

But as a concept in photography it is well understood and defined, it has been written about at length and explained in very great detail and is very easy to test for yourself even if you only have one camera and a zoom lens.

 

[navastronia]

No it doesn't, how does T stop impact depth of field? It doesn't.

look at the sample images at 100% and you’ll see greater DoF in every DS image, at the same aperture. Those images are available to download in the video’s description.

 

[koenkooi]

No it doesn't, how does T stop impact depth of field? It doesn't.

T-stops in themselves don't affect DoF, but the DS coating is basically a gradient aperture, so it does affect DoF.

 

[privatebydesign]

look at the sample images at 100% and you’ll see greater DoF in every DS image, at the same aperture. Those images are available to download in the video’s description.

I don't know what you are seeing in the files but I'm not seeing the same as you. Many of his comparison images are not sharp anyway but here is the best comparison I could see and the earrings don't look different to me.

 

[privatebydesign]

T-stops in themselves don't affect DoF, but the DS coating is basically a gradient aperture, so it does affect DoF.

Bullshit. What's a gradient aperture? Now show me a good comparison image with differences in the DoF. How that DoF is rendered yes, the character is going to look different but that is the whole point, but not the actual DoF as in "acceptably sharp".