So I really stepped into it....

[Sporgon]

Well, here's my response Joe. These action figure images are an embarrassment and if I were you wouldn't hold them up as an example of anything even remotely related to good photography. This page represents the local (sic) Camera Club and I think we can do better than this.

;D. ;D



Well you know what to do there then: give that lot a wide berth

I thought your last picture was a very good example of how to make a picture more pleasing to the eye.

 

[Maximilian]

and finally...

And here is the comment about being an embarrassment to all things photography.

[...]
This page represents the local (sic) Camera Club and I think we can do better than this.

JD, I think, my initial response to them would be: “Stop yelling! Prove it!”
And I think, can understand your emotions and anger about this. You put energy and passion in you explanations. And this is what you got…
But with a little more distance I would say, it’s just a waste of oxygen and energy.
So let it go.

IMHO you did quite a good job in teaching and showing your way to improve the pictures and I really enjoyed your representative example pictures.
I suppose I wouldn’t have done this in the same situation, although I also like sharing knowledge.
Maybe you should have asked a few more questions to know which way to go, as dcm explained before.
Now take a deep breath, take all the other good advices here into account, when it comes to a similar situation and try to make it better or more pleasing for you the next time.
But please, if someone else is asking you again, still feel your passion of sharing your knowledge, because this time he or she is surely more willing to learn.

 

[jdramirez]

local photo clubs are often the worst place to get innovative, thought provoking and open minded discussion about progressing photographic technique.

they are often run by long time amateurs who's skill and experience plateau well below an advanced, well versed professional. i have found that they tend to exist only to slap each others backs and boost the egos of whoever is running the show.

i've run across a number of them in my area and i avoid them like the plague...

not to be overly harsh, i'm sure there may be some good ones out there...but as a rule of thumb i wouldn't put too much stock in them at all.

this community far exceeds the experience one can get from a local camera club imo.

Much of what you say rings true. Most of what is put up there is wide angle landscape... which isn't my favorite so I don't bother commenting. If you don't have anything nice to say... and I pretty much do the same here. But if someone ASKS, what would you do or what did I do wrong... I have thoughts that I'm willing to share. It doesn't mean that I'm right, but I have thoughts... do with them what you will.

They do have meeting, that I never attend, and they do have group outings, that I never attend. Paying $100 to go see the inside of a ghost house doesn't really appeal to me. I can see the inside of my house for FREE. And unless I have guaranteed a 1 on 1 sit down interview with the ghost... it really seems like a stupid waste of time. But I digress.

I think I am going to opt out. I had a whole mess of unwritten rules placed upon me:

...a place to encourage and gently direct someone by posting one (not many) comment about how you think a photo can be improved. Then let the rest of your ideas go.

But even before you do that, please begin to post some of your own photos (not of toys for examples) to show you are serious about being a productive member of our FB page. We have many members who do not post photos but neither do they pontificate about knowing more than the rest of us.

So the rules are simple:
1-Post your own photos (no flooding) and be accepting of others comments even if you don't agree- or get booted
2-Be encouraging and not a know-it-all, or get booted
3-Feel free to comment, but if someone has another thought then fine don't start a tit-for-tat war: let it go! Or get booted

So evidently answering someone's question in detail is being a know it all. And only one suggestions... ok... how about get stuff in focus because blurry images are bad images... but no. Deep breath...

It's my own fault really. I suggested the foreground background thing... and I posted examples... and they said they didn't like them... which is fine because I wasn't in love with them either... but then I posted pro examples from Getty that showed basically what I was showing and evidently the 6 images I put up are 5 too many. Ugh. Stupid unwritten rules.

 

[mackguyver]

Those are the worst photos I've ever seen and you should give up photography AND mail me all of your gear, immediately

Obviously, I'm kidding and as the saying goes, no good deed goes unpunished. You tried to be helpful by posting conceptual photos and the thanks you got was a bunch of crap in return.

I'm with agierke on his comments about local photo clubs. There's one where I shoot the most and they snob me like you wouldn't believe. I entered their photo contest, thinking it was for the National Wildlife Refuge (NWR), not their club, several years ago and a bunch of crappy photos beat mine. The funny thing is that the same 3 or 4 people "win" the contest every year. Then, I publish a photo book of the NWR and offer to give the NWR book store copies at cost to help them raise money, and after following up about 5 times, they finally say that it's "not suited for their demographic" and then I realize the "photo club" runs the book store, too.

When you cross a "club" with "social" media, I guess this is the unfortunate result.

 

[jdramirez]

I'm going to need a young priest and an old priest to exercise these demons that occupy space in my photos.

The worst part of it is that Shipwreck hasn't been played with in about five years... And he asks how his photos went and I just don't have the heart to tell him...

 

[jdramirez]

If this all happened on Facebook, I'd just completely forget it. I think your demonstration images with the figurine were excellent and very explanatory. The advice you gave was solid. The problem with people these days is more often than not, they already think they are experts at whatever it is they think they are experts at...when they ask for advice, they aren't looking for advice...they are simply looking for someone to reinforce their already-formulated and overly inflated opinion of themselves and their skill. I think you got sucked into one of those inverted vortices where yes means no and "Help me" really means "Assert my own opinion of myself...verify me, so I can feel good!"

Bleh. Facebook. BARF.

I'm my own biggest critic. I know when, why, and how badly I screw up. The wife usually says not to worry about it... but I take the error so much to heart that I'll never forget that circumstance. Learn from your mistakes... And as with all things photo related, only show the good images.

 

[RustyTheGeek]

Sounds like you are trying to achieve the impossible... get accepted into the "cool kids club" in Junior High. 8)

From what I've read here so far, you should just bow out gracefully and forget they ever existed. They are legends in their own minds. You stand to gain very little from that association and they don't appreciate your input anyway.

Whenever I join something like this, I never want to be the smartest guy, in fact I want to be just a few steps above the dumbest guy. That way I will be able to learn a lot from others. In your case, you are so far ahead of the others that you'll never learn anything and they obviously don't want to learn from you. So, no point in staying with that club, eh?

Oh, and thanks for sharing!! It helps remind us of the pitfalls of some situations like this. :

 

[jdramirez]

Sounds like you are trying to achieve the impossible... get accepted into the "cool kids club" in Junior High. 8)

From what I've read here so far, you should just bow out gracefully and forget they ever existed. They are legends in their own minds. You stand to gain very little from that association and they don't appreciate your input anyway.

Whenever I join something like this, I never want to be the smartest guy, in fact I want to be just a few steps above the dumbest guy. That way I will be able to learn a lot from others. In your case, you are so far ahead of the others that you'll never learn anything and they obviously don't want to learn from you. So, no point in staying with that club, eh?

Oh, and thanks for sharing!! It helps remind us of the pitfalls of some situations like this. :

I think my issue with the group is I was never WOWED by what they shared... so I didn't... I don't way to say respect... because that is wrong... but I didn't defer to them the way they would expect me to. And I don't really share that many images because they are mostly of my kids or other people's kids (portraiture/action/sports)... so they didn't have any reason to hold me in high regard... So there's that.

I'm going to let the smoke blow over... I'm going to be snarky which is my default mode anyway... and then I'm going to excuse myself... without much fanfare.

Like you... I really like not being the smartest person in the room... though at times it feels as though I'm looking for my bachelor's while the people talking are working on the 3rd phd... which is fine... but maybe I get lost in the translation to undergrad speak.

And thanks for listening... it is good to vent.

 

[Menace]

Like you... I really like not being the smartest person in the room... though at times it feels as though I'm looking for my bachelor's while the people talking are working on the 3rd phd... which is fine... but maybe I get lost in the translation to undergrad speak.

Remember just cos someone has a lot to say on a specific matter (photography in this instance) it doesn't make them an expert in reality. I tend to stay away from any 'know it all' photographers cos they are unable to be objective.

 

[mackguyver]

Like you... I really like not being the smartest person in the room... though at times it feels as though I'm looking for my bachelor's while the people talking are working on the 3rd phd... which is fine... but maybe I get lost in the translation to undergrad speak.

Remember just cos someone has a lot to say on a specific matter (photography in this instance) it doesn't make them an expert in reality. I tend to stay away from any 'know it all' photographers cos they are unable to be objective.

You better stay away from me, then because I know everything, and I've decided to change my username to "Omniscient".

Then again, I might be kidding ;D

I try to pass along my knowledge, but try not to shove anything down people's throats and hopefully I'm successful, but some people just like to talk $h!t to make themselves feel important.

Also, I saw this on FStoppers today and thought of this thread:
Things You MUST Know About Groups on Facebook

 

[Menace]

Like you... I really like not being the smartest person in the room... though at times it feels as though I'm looking for my bachelor's while the people talking are working on the 3rd phd... which is fine... but maybe I get lost in the translation to undergrad speak.

Remember just cos someone has a lot to say on a specific matter (photography in this instance) it doesn't make them an expert in reality. I tend to stay away from any 'know it all' photographers cos they are unable to be objective.

You better stay away from me, then because I know everything, and I've decided to change my username to "Omniscient".

Then again, I might be kidding ;D

I try to pass along my knowledge, but try not to shove anything down people's throats and hopefully I'm successful, but some people just like to talk $h!t to make themselves feel important.

Also, I saw this on FStoppers today and thought of this thread:
Things You MUST Know About Groups on Facebook

Thanks for the link oh Omniscient One - some good tips in there

 

[dcm]

Like you... I really like not being the smartest person in the room... though at times it feels as though I'm looking for my bachelor's while the people talking are working on the 3rd phd... which is fine... but maybe I get lost in the translation to undergrad speak.

Remember just cos someone has a lot to say on a specific matter (photography in this instance) it doesn't make them an expert in reality. I tend to stay away from any 'know it all' photographers cos they are unable to be objective.

You better stay away from me, then because I know everything, and I've decided to change my username to "Omniscient".

Then again, I might be kidding ;D

I try to pass along my knowledge, but try not to shove anything down people's throats and hopefully I'm successful, but some people just like to talk $h!t to make themselves feel important.

Also, I saw this on FStoppers today and thought of this thread:
Things You MUST Know About Groups on Facebook

Thanks for the link oh Omniscient One - some good tips in there

Agreed. Especially the tip "Thanks for the feedback, greatly appreciated." ;-)

 

[scottkinfw]

What you have here is a person who doesn't want a critique. She wants blind acceptance and accolades. Don't sweat it. Take a look at the site "uglyhedghog" same kind of stuff. You give good feedback and get attacked by trolls.

Scott

So I'm a member/participant on Facebook of my local photography club. A woman who is a novice asks what can she do to improve here photos of her daughter who is a comparative weight lifter. The woman said she has a Canon t3.

So I proceed to give an honest critique. Focus looks off here, try using a tripod and live view focus, the guys in the background are distracting, try either slimmer depth of field or move so they aren't as visible, have something in the foreground that is characteristic of the sport and blue it out, maybe do a long exposure with second curtain flash so there is movement...

There was a portrait where the subject was on the left side of the image looking left and I said to frame it differently so the open space of the photo is in the direction she's looking....

And boy oh boy did I start something.

This is what I heard... I can't copy and paste on my phone, but the gist was be positive. I was positive. I was positive that I have good advice.

Then I heard... put some examples... So I did of a basketball shot where the ref was blurry in the foreground, and a softball shot where the catcher was blurry in the foreground... And the response I receive is that it was too distracting. Ok sure... busy foreground aren't someone's cup of tea... but it is a widely used technique.

Then I put up some toy model to explain the concepts about depth of field, live view focus, etc. And the gist of that response is it was an embarrassment to photography.

They aren't just throwing the baby out with the bath water, they are putting the baby in a blender so it goes down the sink easily. Oh my.

So I came here to rant... because while I don't care about the group, just like here, seeing different images do inspire.