What will Canon bring to the table with the EOS R1?

expatinasia

EOS 5D Mark IV
Aug 18, 2011
1,720
12
Asia Pacific
I agree about the form factor. I love the 1D series. One has to wonder whether it is wise to bring a new pro camera to market right now. So many events were cancelled last year, and this year looks to be the same. I think Canon should work on firmware upgrades for 1DX I, II and III and release the EOS 1R or 1DX V (jump IV, why not) in 2022 or even 2023.
 

Traveler

EOS R
Oct 6, 2019
83
107
I wish Canon makes an overpriced packed R3 (R2) that has everything we wish if money is no object. Just for marketing purposes. Give it to the influencers for free. And it's better marketing and cheaper than paying ads and exhibitions.
 

Ale_F

6D - 7D
Nov 22, 2018
77
52
User don't buy Defender/Renegade for their power.

So pro users don't buy 1D for MPs
 

HarryFilm

EOS RP
Jun 6, 2016
705
166
It's interesting to see your thoughtful post, Harry. But I don't think that you can rely on any camera to be put on a tripod in order to disapate enough heat to make it a needed element to cool an otherwise too-warm camera. The reason is that it will often not be put on a tripod and then you are back to square 1. Canon could have routed their inner R5 heat sink metal strips to the tripod socket, but to my recollection the lensrentals teardown indicated that they did not bother to do so.

I previously suggested that Canon consider a small portion of one or more camera sides to contain a small hollow channel or channels through a stainless metal heat pipe to allow air to rise from the bottom to the top of the camera, dissipating heat naturally without need of a fan. It would be designed to allow moisture, or rain, to enter into it which would further cool the camera and there would be no way that moisture/water could enter any other region of the camera as is it totally enclosed within the heat pipe(s). The hole(s) on bottom & top could be quite small and almost unnoticeable.

Canon could even take this one step further and design the outer side walls to be a stainless metal design with continuous columns of small hollow channels allowing air to rise from small holes on the bottom to small holes in the top of the metal sides, almost unnoticeable. Of course the metal sides could still have a normal rubberized skin attached for normal ergonomic in-hand feel.

What do you think of this? If it has merit, then I'd be interested in your thoughts of how a possible design could be created and submitted to Canon. I don't have the ability to do this, but you probably do if you're interested.

---

WOW !!!! You just described our cooling system patent documents on our 16K camera !!!!!!!

Where did you get these ideas! We thought along the same path! We'll be releasing the docs next week and you will see a BIG SIMILARITY in our cooling system to what YOU just described!

Great Minds Think Alike!

SWEET!

V
 
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Antono Refa

EOS R
Mar 26, 2014
1,259
413
If the R1 has a quad-pixel FF sensor with 8K video, that will be a lot to pack into a single 40+ MP sensor (probably ~45 MP with IBIS). I could see that being a possibility.

8K requires 33MP, which I think is plausible. Quad pixel AF requires 4 photo sites per pixel, which requires >130 million photo sites. I don't see that happening. Even two photo sites, alternating between vertically and horizontally, seems too much to me.
 

Sporgon

5% of gear used 95% of the time
CR Pro
There's inherent differences in the sensor size and the images it can generate as well as pixel density. Furthermore, the GFX line is really "cropped" medium format. It's only marginally bigger than a full frame 35mm sensor, and doesn't come close to reaching the sensor size that's equivalent to the old Hasselblad 6x6 or Mamiya 6x7 format.
As a 'cropped' MF sensor and having 100mp the pixel pitch is, unfortunately, not much different to your asp and FF digital format now, being about 3.6um. A 50mp FF sensor has a pixel pitch of 4.1um. Personally I'd rather have 50mp (1.7 x FF) DMF sensor.
 

Joules

doom
CR Pro
Jul 16, 2017
1,581
1,897
Hamburg, Germany
8K requires 33MP, which I think is plausible. Quad pixel AF requires 4 photo sites per pixel, which requires >130 million photo sites. I don't see that happening. Even two photo sites, alternating between vertically and horizontally, seems too much to me.
Today, Canon is fitting 32.5 M pixels with 2 photosites each into an APS-C sized area with the 90D and M6 II sensor. That's 2*32.5 = 65 M photosites on an APS-C sized area, and could be scaled up to 1.6^2*65 M = 166.4 M photosites on a FF sensor. With 4 photosites per pixel, that would result in 41.6 MP. So purely in terms of manufacturing the photosites, it seems Canon has the technology to pull off QPAF already.

Also, with regards to 33 MP being enough for 8K, it is worth noting that you need 45 MP if the sensor is also supposed to be able to output 3:2 stills.
 

Mr Majestyk

EOS RP
Feb 20, 2016
355
206
Australia
So apparently after keeping the resolution of the 1D series ridiculously low to pacify pro's, now 8K is a thing apparently 45MP+ is going to perfectly acceptable for them.

I find it hard to believe they'll go beyond even 30MP. They could offer 6K but I guess it's 4K or 8K with Canon. I hope they do offer 45MP+ however. I don't really care about global shutter as stacked sensor already is good enough IMO and no doubt easier to implement and has less issues with DR.

I wonder what the Nikon Z8/Z9 will bring to the table and we already know Nikon is working on D6 replacement too.
 

Tremotino

EOS M6 Mark II
Jan 23, 2018
90
45
Munich
AND please ALSO NOTE Fuji's introduction of the GFX-100s camera for $5999 USD which offers a full 100 megapixel MF sensor!

See review:

Comparing the Sony A1 to the Canon R5 and the Fuji GFX-100s, I feel soooooo sorry for Sony that showed an UNDERWHELMING CAMERA when compared to the $3899 proper DCI-8K Hollywood Cinema/Netflix/Amazon/Apple-play production friendly 8129 x 4320 pixel Canon R5 camera and the 100 megapixel Medium Format Fuji GFX-100 for $5999 US.

The ONLY THING that gets me going for the $6498 USD Sony A1 is the 30 fps Burst Rate at the full 3:2 still photo size image frame and the 120 fps 4K video!

---

For the Best-Bang-For-The-Buck race, the winner is the Canon R5 for being $1500 cheaper than the Sony A1 and having full DCI 8K Hollywood Cinema production friendly video capture.

For the megapixel and light sensitivity race, the Fuji GFX 100s with 100 megapixels for $5999 WINS HANDS DOWN!

For compactness and toughness, the it's-a-steal for $349 GoPro Hero-8 Black with 60 fps 4K and 240 fps 1080p video is clipped to my helmet!

The Sony has 30 fps full-size still photos as 3:2 and 120 fps 4K video -- That's it!
Is that worth the $1500 Price Premium over the Canon R5?

If you're a TRUE Sony fan, then YES it's MUCH better camera than the Sony A92 but that $6499 price just kills me!

I someone gave be $6500 today, which camera would I buy of the above?

The answer is the Fuji GFX-100s cuz I want a truly LIGHT SENSITIVE MF sensor AND I WANT 100 megapixels!

V
R5 is $2500 less than sony a1 not $1500.
Your can buy one of the marvelous RF lenses with that money.
 

Treyarnon

EOS 90D
Jan 11, 2018
103
133
Cornwall, UK
Visit site
I'll admit, I would be slightly disappointed if the R1 is higher than 40 megapixels. I already have 45 megapixels on my R5, so I would far prefer 60-120 FPS still photographs at 30 megapixels than 30 FPS stills at 50 megapixels. That said, if the market is truly changing so drastically in this way(24 megapixels has not caused any issue on the 1D or A9), I guess I would appreciate both of my cameras being similar in resolution like the 5D3 and 1DX2 were.

I was surprised by Sony's decision to put 50MP into the A1 - but I think they are on the right track here.

Think about it - a 50 (or 45) MP camera CAN shoot at 20MP, and do so at the same speed as a '20MP' camera.

However a 20MP camera cannot shoot at 45/50MP [and 8k].

The old notion that you could have 'High Speed' OR 'High resolution' is not true any more.
 

DBounce

EOS RP
May 3, 2016
278
312
Exciting! I am glad this actually gives them time to work out all the details which would result of a more fine-tuned product in the end. Hope R1 will solve some of R5's pains in that it will have a bigger body, but given the weathering sealing, one might not expect magic when it comes to heat dissipation.
A camera can be weather sealed without being thermally sealed.
 
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DBounce

EOS RP
May 3, 2016
278
312
how theyre making the sony a1 without flip screen is stupid.

Sony have clearly positioned the A1 as a stills camera first and foremost. That’s why they removed the articulated screen from the A7S III body that it utilizes.

The real question is: Why does the “stills focused” A1 get S-Cinetone, while the “video focused” A7S III does not?
 
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Pape

EOS RP
Dec 31, 2018
603
364
All rumours about 1200mm Do lense and from other big ones ,why 1 serie needs more megapixels?
Where reporters need 8k videos anyway?
And maybe that global shutter is so insanely fast that it can make pixel shift 8k video ?
 
Feb 7, 2013
103
29
Exciting! I am glad this actually gives them time to work out all the details which would result of a more fine-tuned product in the end. Hope R1 will solve some of R5's pains in that it will have a bigger body, but given the weathering sealing, one might not expect magic when it comes to heat dissipation.

Waiting with popcorn in 2021 to see what Sony, Canon and Nikon brings to the table.
 

usern4cr

R5
CR Pro
Sep 2, 2018
989
1,391
Kentucky, USA
8K requires 33MP, which I think is plausible. Quad pixel AF requires 4 photo sites per pixel, which requires >130 million photo sites. I don't see that happening. Even two photo sites, alternating between vertically and horizontally, seems too much to me.
8K on a FF sensor requires around 8192 x 5461 min. sensor, or 44.7MP. With IBIS I could see this approaching 50MP. With a quad pixel technology per pixel it will take so much detail that I don't really think it will happen, but it might.
6K on a FF sensor requires around 6144 x 4096 min. sensor, or 25.2 MP. With IBIS I could see this more like 28-30MP. I could definitely see this happening with quad pixels.

I don't think that there will be a sensor with continuous alternating (every other one) horizontal DP and vertical DP as it would make make the layout too difficult & inefficient (too much wasted area) to be done efficiently. If it was that easy then Canon would have done it already, or done it as an inbetween chip before the qual pixel one is done.
 
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usern4cr

R5
CR Pro
Sep 2, 2018
989
1,391
Kentucky, USA
---

WOW !!!! You just described our cooling system patent documents on our 16K camera !!!!!!!

Where did you get these ideas! We thought along the same path! We'll be releasing the docs next week and you will see a BIG SIMILARITY in our cooling system to what YOU just described!

Great Minds Think Alike!

SWEET!

V
OK - very funny! :ROFLMAO:

But on the off chance that you're serious (yes, a verrrrrry far-off chance), I'll be looking forward to your release next week! ;)
 
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EOS 4 Life

EOS RP
Sep 20, 2020
457
309
Exciting! I am glad this actually gives them time to work out all the details which would result of a more fine-tuned product in the end. Hope R1 will solve some of R5's pains in that it will have a bigger body, but given the weathering sealing, one might not expect magic when it comes to heat dissipation.
Canon could potentially obsolete the A1 in one R5 firmware update.
On that note, has anyone heard from Tilta about the R5 cooling module?
a few people have made homemade versions but they look kind of grotesque.
 
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