Teardown: The Canon EOS R5 gets an autopsy
- Thread starter Canon Rumors Guy
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Similar reason to why so many are sure of it, just the flip side.
If limiting it was the primary goal, it seems like quite the oversight to allow unlimited external recording. Not to mention even making 8K RAW available in the first place.
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There's a difference between what the display may support and what the camera can actually drive... It's not enough that the display can refresh at 240fps, you have to be able to sample the sensor that often and process/push pixels to the display
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True but thermal paste can dry and loose its transfer ability over time. Not good to build in a maintenance item that would require a trip to the service facility in 5 years. High content silver paste requires many heat/cool down cycles before it becomes most effective. Head pads are the least invasive method to allow a good contact medium inside a camera.
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I don't have any issue with the record limits. I am disappointed that shooting stills can impact that limit significantly. I doubt I would shoot more than 5 minutes of video at any one time, but if you give me an 8K record facility which I can't use once I've been shooting stills for a couple of hours, then yes, I am disappointed at that.
If it then takes tens of minutes to cool down before I could use any video, well then for wildlife, you've likely lost that opportunity.
Mine arrives today. Yes I ordered it knowing these limits. I just find it out of character for Canon on the stills to video impact, and hope they can adjust through firmware that a little bit, so I can just use the 8K video after shooting stills, and the cool-down period is reduced... And yes, I will test it to see where the truth is. I would be more than happy to come back here and report I can still do both.
Could a vent not be weather sealed, if you only had to use it to cool down the camera, and at all other times it was sealed. Are not the ports on the camera the same situation? Could a vent not take a similar approach (open it if conditions allow, else shoot till hot, then vent briefly)? It would not help with the heat build up, but maybe Canon decided the body is ok to dissipate some heat, but too much and you'd likely impact stills shooters holding it all day?
Re CFExpress - based on a Delkin Engineering PDF I posted a link to in another thread here, their cards support power management, but not clear if everyone (anyone?) implements this - which could explain why idle in a PC or R5 is still generates heat. You could power down at the link (PHY) if you are ok to accept a small delay when you need to write to it (for stills I guess that might reduce the number of shots you can shoot before the buffer fills).
Also the Delkin cards have power modes (4). The default does not throttle I/O, there is a "Light" mode but alas no details as to whether this would maintain the 325MBps required for the higher video modes.
The Delikin has a temp sensor on the card and will throttle i/o itself, so the card will protect itself.
HDMI is uncompressed. The HQ modes over HDMI to the Atomos still do downsampling from higher resolutions and thus require Digic.
Internal use H264 or H265 which requires HW support to do it in real time. Interestingly, the H265 doesnt appear to change that heat envelope much (8 bit is 264, 10bit 265 and those modes don't seem to change the record times much), so well done Canon, your Digic implementation is very good.
By the time you have the Ninja, the additional batteries, the cables, the cage, the SSD card, probably another 700-800 bucks onto the total. Not a dealbreaker for some, but a bit cumbersome if you just want to take small clips and otherwise continue to take stills (and more weight consideration if you are flying).
The Atomos Ninja cannot support 8K nor likely 4K120 - neither the Canon nor Ninja have HDMI 2.1, so that's internal or nothing. There is an 8K modules coming for their Neon range.
If it then takes tens of minutes to cool down before I could use any video, well then for wildlife, you've likely lost that opportunity.
Mine arrives today. Yes I ordered it knowing these limits. I just find it out of character for Canon on the stills to video impact, and hope they can adjust through firmware that a little bit, so I can just use the 8K video after shooting stills, and the cool-down period is reduced... And yes, I will test it to see where the truth is. I would be more than happy to come back here and report I can still do both.
Could a vent not be weather sealed, if you only had to use it to cool down the camera, and at all other times it was sealed. Are not the ports on the camera the same situation? Could a vent not take a similar approach (open it if conditions allow, else shoot till hot, then vent briefly)? It would not help with the heat build up, but maybe Canon decided the body is ok to dissipate some heat, but too much and you'd likely impact stills shooters holding it all day?
Re CFExpress - based on a Delkin Engineering PDF I posted a link to in another thread here, their cards support power management, but not clear if everyone (anyone?) implements this - which could explain why idle in a PC or R5 is still generates heat. You could power down at the link (PHY) if you are ok to accept a small delay when you need to write to it (for stills I guess that might reduce the number of shots you can shoot before the buffer fills).
Also the Delkin cards have power modes (4). The default does not throttle I/O, there is a "Light" mode but alas no details as to whether this would maintain the 325MBps required for the higher video modes.
The Delikin has a temp sensor on the card and will throttle i/o itself, so the card will protect itself.
HDMI is uncompressed. The HQ modes over HDMI to the Atomos still do downsampling from higher resolutions and thus require Digic.
Internal use H264 or H265 which requires HW support to do it in real time. Interestingly, the H265 doesnt appear to change that heat envelope much (8 bit is 264, 10bit 265 and those modes don't seem to change the record times much), so well done Canon, your Digic implementation is very good.
By the time you have the Ninja, the additional batteries, the cables, the cage, the SSD card, probably another 700-800 bucks onto the total. Not a dealbreaker for some, but a bit cumbersome if you just want to take small clips and otherwise continue to take stills (and more weight consideration if you are flying).
The Atomos Ninja cannot support 8K nor likely 4K120 - neither the Canon nor Ninja have HDMI 2.1, so that's internal or nothing. There is an 8K modules coming for their Neon range.
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CFexpress cards, SD cards all get extremely hot. Even in a card reader. CFexpress cards and SD cards do not have a sleep mode. This is why electronic equipment with card readers and memory devices have FANS. Heat disipation. Canon and Sony have both repeatedly said this. I don't know why people continuosly expect engineering miracles.
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Every single CFexpress card and SD card I've ever had has always gotten hot. Along with the card readers. Nothing new. Pay close attention to your operating limits 32 - 104 F. Once the device reaches 104 F a cool down timer is initialized. My suggestion if you're going to do long recording is to measure your R5 temp with the LCD open with a FLIR or infrared thermometeras some are begining to do. Don't wait until you get an alert. By that time you're probably at 95 F. You can't use your hand as a thermometer as some have done.
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The recording limits are in the manual still. And the operating temperature also. The operating temperature limit is 104 F. The device can get well over that temperature. And the Cards have already been measured reaching at least 104 F in an couple of online Youtube videos already. At one time Dan Watson measured both Canon and Sony cameras reaching well over 129 F in the sunlight however. Still thats way over the operating limits without a Fan. I've ordered 2 IC fansink cooling fans for mine. I will do some measurements with a FLUKE IR thermal imaging device to determine precisely the temps before the alert comes on and what temperature it comes on.
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you saw what I did there.Right now the only bloody cripple hamper is the low stock preventing me from buying one of these buggers
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I'm getting to the manual from below where the link text is worded as :here" (CR)
"
The Canon EOS R5 manual is available for download
By Canon Rumors | July 28, 2020 | Canon EOS R
Canon Europe has made the manual for the Canon EOS R5 available for download.
You can grab it here."
"
The Canon EOS R5 manual is available for download
By Canon Rumors | July 28, 2020 | Canon EOS R
Canon Europe has made the manual for the Canon EOS R5 available for download.
You can grab it here."
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Because EOSHD never actually measured the device temperature. They are merely speculating. And have actually errored in their speculation. The device can get extremely hot. Period. And CFexpress cards and SD cards don't have sleep modes. They get hot still when not in use if merely sitting in a card slot. The cards have been pulled out and measured in several Youtube videos already. Reaching well over 104 F when not in use. Most all electronic devices get hot. That's why CPUs and ICs have cooling, fansinks, and FANS. Oh and yes smartphones too. They've been known to catch fire and banned from airlines at one time.
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What page number was it in the original? I ask because I don’t ever remember seeing a red table in a Canon manual, lots of black ones but never a red one.that's not what I am talking about. the table similar to this DPR table is what is now gone:
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