A Shake-up Coming to the APS-C DSLR Lineup? [CR2]

[unfocused]

I would agree that there doesn't seem to be much room between the 80D and 7D for another model. In fact, there isn't much room at all between the 80D and 7D.

So, I would also agree that if this rumor is true, the third body is likely to be something quite different.

In my fantasy world, we would see a 7DIII of about 22 mp with significantly improved noise and low light performance. But probably more likely would be a 7DIII and a 90 D sharing a 28 mp sensor, coupled with a 90Ds with something in the 40-50 mp range.

I could also see a video-centric XXD with flip screen, 4K, and whatever other goodies the video crowd desires. Something for the young aspiring DSLR filmmakers. Students who can't afford the cinema line, but will be out there making movies and documentaries. Get the next generation of filmmakers locked into the Canon system.

From my personal, selfish perspective, I find this encouraging whatever Canon decides to release, because it will likely further narrow the small feature gap between the 7DIII and the 1Dx line.

 

[SkynetTX]

With Sony at its tail Canon is darting around directionless. My predictions for the next four models -

77.5D, 83.6D, 90.4D and the next APS-C king, queen and prince to be released simultaneously - 7D Mark 2.8, Mark 3.5, Mark 4.1. Each of these 7D's will best each other by 15 ISO points.

+1! But a real shake-up should be Digic 6 processor for entry level and Digic 7 for mid level cameras with a bit more AF-points and higher resolution.

 

[unfocused]

exactly what the market wants ... even more marginally different mirrorslappers.

Yes, that does seem to be exactly what the market wants. The real market...not the 'millions and millions of people' in your imagination.

The consumers in the "market" actually dont know EXACTLY what they want, that is why Canon can flood the lower end with weak and marginally different cameras and apparently they sell.

Only people in the top 1% of income levels would consider the XXD and 7D lines to be "the lower end." For most people these are the high end. Or are you just trying to throw this thread off the rails by injecting your personal opinion about the Rebel lineup?

you dont have to be wealthy to know that the rebels are lower(not lowest) end of the professional camera scale and there are a ton of rebels/X0Ds. They are the cheapest and have the least controllable functions. Saying they are lower end is a fact, Me commenting on their usefulness or quality would be an opinion. And in my opinion I personally don't find them useful in many of the jobs i get.

I am not objecting to your having an opinion on the Rebel line. I just don't see its relevance to this rumor about the XXD and 7D lines. Perhaps those buying Rebels don't know exactly what they want. More likely, they know exactly what they can afford and Canon tries to accommodate them by offering a variety of price points.

But, this thread is about the higher end of the APS-C line and I believe most people who are in that market certainly do know what they want. If you read the comments from AvTvM and Neuro, they were disagreeing as to whether or not the market wants more upper-level APS-C models. Your comments regarding the Rebel line struck me as off topic and not related to the discussion at hand.

 

[Talys]

A year ago, I would have said that I thought a camera between 90D and 7D3 was a bad idea -- just like I thought that the 77D wasn't a good idea.

However, my position has evolved -- I must admit that I was flat out wrong, as the 77D has actually done pretty well, and I've run into quite a lot of people who are happy with it, not the least of which are the stores that are selling them. I'm not exactly sure why, because I'd still buy an 80D if I had to choose today, but the product segmentation wizards at Canon had it right.

So what could be the difference between them?

1. Maybe the highest end 7D3 will retain a non-articulating screen to be more rugged, while the model just under it will be a little less bulletproof and have an articulating screen?

2. Perhaps the highest end version will be 5D sized, and the next version down will be 6D sized, and the xxD will retain 80D size.

3. Hopefully at least the two top-end versions will have a joystick and dial; the 90D will probably have 80D/77D controls.

4. Maybe maximum frames per second; the top end version is probably going to be at least a little faster.

 

[RayValdez360]

exactly what the market wants ... even more marginally different mirrorslappers.

Yes, that does seem to be exactly what the market wants. The real market...not the 'millions and millions of people' in your imagination.

The consumers in the "market" actually dont know EXACTLY what they want, that is why Canon can flood the lower end with weak and marginally different cameras and apparently they sell.

Only people in the top 1% of income levels would consider the XXD and 7D lines to be "the lower end." For most people these are the high end. Or are you just trying to throw this thread off the rails by injecting your personal opinion about the Rebel lineup?

you dont have to be wealthy to know that the rebels are lower(not lowest) end of the professional camera scale and there are a ton of rebels/X0Ds. They are the cheapest and have the least controllable functions. Saying they are lower end is a fact, Me commenting on their usefulness or quality would be an opinion. And in my opinion I personally don't find them useful in many of the jobs i get.

I am not objecting to your having an opinion on the Rebel line. I just don't see its relevance to this rumor about the XXD and 7D lines. Perhaps those buying Rebels don't know exactly what they want. More likely, they know exactly what they can afford and Canon tries to accommodate them by offering a variety of price points.

But, this thread is about the higher end of the APS-C line and I believe most people who are in that market certainly do know what they want. If you read the comments from AvTvM and Neuro, they were disagreeing as to whether or not the market wants more upper-level APS-C models. Your comments regarding the Rebel line struck me as off topic and not related to the discussion at hand.

I was replying to someone else replying before you jumped in to make your reply so you understand that might lead to a deviation from the original topic.

 

[kkamena]

I could also see a video-centric XXD with flip screen, 4K, and whatever other goodies the video crowd desires. Something for the young aspiring DSLR filmmakers. Students who can't afford the cinema line, but will be out there making movies and documentaries. Get the next generation of filmmakers locked into the Canon system.

I was thinking the same thing. Canon has appeared to not have sought after the Vlogger/video market as much as the other manufactures have. A decent video-centric APS-C camera would fill in a gap as Canon continues to develop it's M lineup.

 

[9VIII]

How about a 7Dsr, 50 MP on a APS-C sensor?

YES!!!

 

[KeithBreazeal]

I'll bite.
I think the 7D Mark III will be split into two options- one having the optical viewfinder, the other LCD. I think a much higher fps is in order now. I also think it's time for adding the capability to do audio annotations.
Many pro sports shooters use the 7D series as a second body. It would make a lot of the sports shooters happy to see the 7D Mark III become the crop sensor version of the 1D X Mark II. Canon would absolutely kill it with the addition of stunning 4K video, but that would eat into their video camera line, so maybe not.
Maybe throw in a flippy LCD just to keep everybody happy.

 

[kellymjones]

The funny thing is that I really like the SL2 / 200D because it has very good IQ, a very good live view + DPAF for macro and is ergonomically at least good. It is light and small hence very portable. My beloved EF-S 60 macro works extremely well with the 24MPix sensor. So at the moment tired of choosing between 10...20 options at partly much higher prices!

I hear you on the SL2, it's a great little camera. I wish Canon sold an upscale version of the SL2 that retained the same size and weight but with back button focus and the improved firmware/software from their high end models. It would be killer to have the flexibility of their high end cameras in a small form factor.

 

[RayValdez360]

I could also see a video-centric XXD with flip screen, 4K, and whatever other goodies the video crowd desires. Something for the young aspiring DSLR filmmakers. Students who can't afford the cinema line, but will be out there making movies and documentaries. Get the next generation of filmmakers locked into the Canon system.

I was thinking the same thing. Canon has appeared to not have sought after the Vlogger/video market as much as the other manufactures have. A decent video-centric APS-C camera would fill in a gap as Canon continues to develop it's M lineup.

they seem like the dont want to up the features to compete with other brands. this why people get gh4 a6300 etc. all those cameras are kinda crappy when it comes to photos but cheap and more crispy for video than canon. the m50 was kinda a move in the right direction but the extreme 4k crop factor will have rookies scratching their head.

 

[NancyP]

There's a market for 1. a small and very inexpensive basic APS-C DSLR with kit lens (students, others buying first controllable ILC) 2. slightly less basic APS-C DSLR with flip screen, fairly basic video, faster processor, kit lens (people buying first video DSLR) 3. full-featured APS-C DSLR with flip screen, video oriented, 4 K, not necessarily weatherized 4. 7D3 sports/wildlife suitable fast-frame-rate APS-C, fully weatherized, no flip screen (video users at this level probably want their own monitors anyway), 4K

 

[transpo1]

Canon will further divide its lineup by creating more DSLR models? Shocking!

 

[pvalpha]

I just got everything perfect about my 7D2 after years of effort. I'm good for a while, even though I keep on hoping for a 7D3 soon. Although in my heart I know that I won't see one until 2020-2022. Canon. The C stands for Conservative.

 

[Talys]

I just got everything perfect about my 7D2 after years of effort. I'm good for a while, even though I keep on hoping for a 7D3 soon. Although in my heart I know that I won't see one until 2020-2022. Canon. The C stands for Conservative.

Canon is trying to give you time to enjoy your 7D2, now that you finally got it perfect

 

[Talys]

4. 7D3 sports/wildlife suitable fast-frame-rate APS-C, fully weatherized, no flip screen (video users at this level probably want their own monitors anyway), 4K

I don't think these are necessarily the same camera, because a camera that is great for general-purpose video should focus on different things than a camera that is designed for wildlife.

A perfect video-purposed camera will have lower resolution/pixel density, because that's how you get less noise and better low light performance. It should have an electronic viewfinder, because you can't see the display screen in the sun (and monitors with shades are often not appropriate). Factors like drive speed (fps) and autofocus modes don't matter much. Instead, in the consumer-ish market, you're looking for features like dual pixel autofocus, subject tracking, and facial recognition.

A perfect wildlife camera for enthusiast types will have higher resolution, because we're forever too short on reach and are forced to crop. We want optical viewfinders, because they don't have refresh issues, autofocus modes and precision are very important, more fps is always welcome, and things like subject tracking don't matter at all. Plus, we're looking at how big the buffer is and how quick it can empty out, something that video people don't care about, because what they want is the ability to constantly write data at a speed fast enough for whatever resolution they're recording.

 

[Cochese]

The only possible thing I can think of is if we get a high megapixel APS-C camera slotted between the two. A 7DS, if you will. Other than that, I can't even imagine.

 

[Velo Steve]

What I'm learning (or confirming) here is that I don't understand product marketing. When I saw the front page teaser for the article, I immediately expected to hear that the recent profusion of models was going to be organized into a few distinct lines which could be marketed clearly and manufactured cost-effectively. Guess not.

As an amateur, I have the luxury and curse of time. The next time I want (not need) a camera I'll want to figure out which camera is the best fit to my rather diverse interests. I'll probably end up with a spreadsheet full of specs. A confusing list of models with mix-and-match feature sets is more likely to delay the decision than to make me buy quickly.

Apparently I'm not the target market for Canon's marketing approach. I shouldn't be surprised. I don't seem to be in anyone's target market.

 

[rbr]

I still like and use my 1D Mark4.

 

[jolyonralph]

Maybe

90D 24mpx sensor

7D Mark III 24mpx sensor

7Dr (same as 7D Mark III but 30 mpx sensor and no low pass filter)

 

[crashpc]

How about a 7Dsr, 50 MP on a APS-C sensor?

YES!!!

When I asked this months and months ago here and elsewhere, I got mostly negative comments.
Now we´re four in one thread. I´m excited!
M6 with 22mm f/2 for EDC, and 7DSr for portraits, stills, and even some static birding. That would be golden ages for me too.